The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion Review

By Kristan Reed Published 24 March, 2006

Good grief.

Version tested: Xbox 360

The overwhelming thing about Oblivion isn't knowing where to start, but when to stop. It's an adventure game in the purest sense of the word in its effortless capacity to give the player a seemingly infinite wealth of possibilities - full of intrigue, excitement, risk, reward and this continual sense of the unknown.

Much of this was true of Morrowind, of course, but technically, things have moved on to a breathtaking extent. Stepping out of the game's introductory (and obligatory) dungeon, nothing can prepare you for the genuine sense of awe of entering Tamriel's outside world. The beautiful, sweeping vistas are, without question, the most beautiful game settings achieved to date. Whichever direction you cast your gaze, there are marvellous sights to behold at every turn; lush grass sways over rolling hills, deer bound through dappled woodland, once-proud temples lie crumbling in ruins, while towns of immense, stunning architectural majesty stand proud in the distance, beckoning you to explore their secrets.

Your first dilemma is whether to engage with the plot or not, and whether you stride purposefully towards that red triangle on your compass is your choice. You see, the death of the 87 year-old Emperor of Tamriel and his three sons presents something of a problem for this idyllic land. Without an heir to the throne, several hellish rifts or 'gates' to Oblivion are open, and demons are pouring out of them. As you might expect, they're doing a pretty fine job of doing their evil bidding and laying waste to everything in their path - and for reasons not fully apparent, you've been entrusted with the task of putting a stop to all this.

Losing my heir

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot myst

No, it's not Myst.

Luckily, a secret lost heir to the throne is out there, and it's up to you whether you track him down, close the first gate and usher him to the safety of the Blades hideout in the mountains, or simply carry on with your own agenda, whatever that may be.

Just as it should be, Bethesda lets you chart your own course right from the word go, with a level of character customisation that even EA would be proud of. True to RPG tradition, you select from one of the ten races (Argonian, Breton, Dark Elf, High Elf, Imperial, Khajit, Nord, Orc, Redguard, and Wood Elf) and can then go to town on crafting the exact look of your character. By some freak of slider bar chance, we made ours look exactly like Prince, albeit with blue skin and a greater penchant for eyeliner. Obviously a sign of the times [Fired! - Ed] [But I am the Ed - Ed].

With a further choice over your Birthsign (essentially your special ability) the game will determine how your eight different attributes stack up (in terms of Strength, Intelligence, Willpower, Agility, Speed, Endurance, Personality and Luck) which in turn also have a bearing on your combat, stealth and magic skills. Each of these are further subdivided into a further seven secondary skills (such as block, athletics, restoration, alchemy, sneak and speechcraft), offering an extraordinary number of permutations over how your character ends up.

As complicated as it all sounds, though, Oblivion is thoughtfully designed to keep these layers tucked away unobtrusively. Unlike the RPGs of the past, simply playing the game a specific way influences the stats leaving you to get on with simply being immersed and entertained, rather than bogged down with tedious levelling up and micromanagement. The thing that ultimately dictates how your character ends up is simply the way that you play the game, and it all works in a logical coherent sense.

Alchemholic

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot infernal

ne of those infernal gates. Dress down, it's hot in there.

For example, if you're the type of player that prefers alchemy, and want to learn and create spells, then - naturally - the game works on the principle of practice makes perfect. It sounds silly, but if you don't mind making yourself look like a tit, then you can jump your way through the game and become a better acrobat; sneak around and you'll be a better thief; block your enemies and strike back with a mace and you'll have better block abilities as well as improved blunt weapon skills. Sometimes you might realise the only choice is to chat your way out of situations with persuasion or simply decide to swing your weapon with righteous anger; Oblivion reflects that within your character's abilities, and, naturally, with how the world reacts to you, too.

Perform a good deed, and word spreads as to the kind of person you are. Some people might react to you more favourably and comment on your deeds, or might hold back information until they can trust you. Admittedly, getting them to do this comes via the slightly pointless Persuasion mini-game, in which you have to rotate a wheel with Joke, Coerce, Admire, and Boast categories, and try to work out the emphasis that most aligns with what they appreciate. After a while you work out a preferred order and can increase how much they like you to the point where they might tell you things you need to know - or you might get to sell all your goods at a higher price. It's a slightly out-of-kilter mechanic, but we kind of liked it anyway.

But sod righteousness. Most of us (at some time or other) just want to see what kind of mayhem we can create, and Oblivion's absolutely fantastic in this respect. Killing people's not generally considered the best way to make friends and influence people, nor is robbing them, but there's a place for every approach. Your normal gaming instinct, at first, is just to kill the odd rabid wolf or bandit, and respect everyone else, but eventually you'll probably get a little frustrated at how rubbish your weapons and armour are, and want to find out ways of making some cash.

Deadly shadows

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot picnic

Our picnic spot, yesterday.

It's all very well raiding the odd abandoned cave or dungeon, but that only seems to get you so far, and even nobly following the main quest isn't the most financially beneficial thing in the world. In time, you'll want to test out those sneaking abilities you learned right at the start and begin pickpocketing people while they sleep in their beds. You'll fill your pockets with flawless diamonds, filch all their superior apparel and leg it out of the door in the dead of night... and then get caught and chucked in prison.

And although it might seem like this pinching lark isn't for you, at some point you might find yourself being passed a note from a stranger offering you the chance to join the thieves' guild. Before you know it, you go from being an upstanding, law abiding hero to stealing from the rich to give to the poor - a righteous law-breaking Robin Hood. Elsewhere, you might find yourself joining one of the other guilds - such as the fighter's guild or the magician's - for proving your worth in similar ways.

The brilliant thing about all of this, is that it's all just mindless side-questing that's not even remotely going to save the world. Sod the Emperor - I've got a joint to case.

Yet unlike the most famous sandbox game of them all - Grand Theft Auto - these quests all feel purposeful; like they matter, and that they may have a true consequence somewhere down the line. They're not just idle padding; each and every one of these incidental missions feels alive and full of purpose - and you never quite have a handle on where they're going to lead you, or who you'll meet as a result. Like we said right at the start, it's a true adventure, and it's quite likely no two will ever be quite the same, giving gamers the perfect opportunity to regale and embellish their stories in their own unique way. Like the introductory blurb says, the game really does seem to offer unlimited possibilities.

Spellbound

But all this grand scope for freeform adventuring would mean little if the fundamental combat was broken from the outset, but things have improved massively since the last Elder Scrolls came out almost four years ago. For a start, the game works well in either third- or first-person view, and you'll find that both play an equal part, depending what you're doing at any given time. For most of the combat, you'll probably prefer the up-close-and-personal view that first-person gives you, allowing you to deliver lunging blows and blocks with precision, not to mention casting spells from afar, or, of course, pulling off a tricky headshot with your bow. In a sense, the combat feels every bit as free and fluid as any comparable first-person title, and on the 360 the two-stick control works superbly, with just the right amount of sensitivity meaning you'll slip comfortably into the game right from the start. A simple two trigger system of attack and block fits the game perfectly, and with eight 'hotkeys' mapped to the d-pad, you can quickly assign heal spells, fireballs, specific weapon changes or whatever you like by hitting the pre-determined direction then the right 'bumper'. It's seamless, effective and well-implemented.

Clicking the right thumbstick flicks you out into third-person, giving you a much better view when traversing the sprawling outdoor environments, while also negating the possibility of someone sneaking up to you (which happens, of course). After a few hours you might even find a horse to ride (which really does need a third-person view), and although riding through this incredible world doesn't quite give you the cinematic buzz as something like Shadow of the Colossus, it's by far the best way to travel in Oblivion - plus, you can leave it in the forest to kill all the wildlife, and then go tut tut and play "nature's executioner" by galloping off a cliff. Fumito Ueda never thought of that, did he?

Even on a trusty steed, though, getting around the map is an incredibly time-consuming process, and one that could quickly get quite frustrating if it weren't for the ability to simply call up the map (when outdoors) and point your arrow cursor to where you want to head off to. Although you miss out on the opportunity to stumble across uncharted territory (and all the cool things that accompany that), if you're on a determined questing session, it's a lifesaver. A short loading pause later, you're there, saving yourself often 10, 20 minutes in the process - a design decision that we heartily approve of.

On the tabs

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot lizards

Lizards aren't renowned for their dress sense.

While we're on the subject of the general construction, you can't help but admire the slick tab-based interface that makes browsing through all the different aspects of the game an absolute breeze. With further layers of filtering within each, you can, for example, check out specific parts of your inventory, look up your skills, scan different parts of the map, check out your active, current and completed quests and basically any piece of pertinent information simply by hitting a single button and using the two sticks to navigate the tabs. For what most people would have assumed was a PC game on a console, it's not the case at all - if anything, the interface is tailor-made for the living room, allowing you to finally play a deep, involving RPG on the big telly in the comfort of your living room. Just don't plan to watch any telly for a few weeks, that's all.

Although we've touched on the beauty of Oblivion, it comes at a price, but one well worth paying in every sense. At first, second, third glance, the external views of the game are amazing - almost picture postcard in their quality, and if there's one game worth investing in a big screen HDTV for, it's this. Once you've been through the day-night cycles (and seen the wonderful sunsets and stars - man, the stars) and been through various extremes of weather, you'll swear blind that this next generation lark was well worth waiting for. The interiors, too, are - in their own way - just as impressive, with massively detailed, hugely atmospheric locations above and below ground, filled with fearsome creatures that not only look impressive, but move and act with the kind of intelligence and fluidity that used to be beyond RPGs. Admittedly, they're still not up to the same refined standard as the best of the FPS bunch, but given the vast context, they're way more than adequate.

Even the biggest, most forgiving fan of Oblivion wouldn't claim that it's all perfect, though. On the 360, at least, you'll (eventually, very occasionally) find the already low-ish frame rate heading south into the netherworld of single-figure unacceptability. The fact that this only seems to get really bad when you're a) outside b) it's raining c) around complex rocky environments and d) you're not involved in combat means that it doesn't have any bearing on the gameplay - in our experience at least.

Holes in the fabric

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot tabs

The tab-based interface makes the stat-fest incredibly simple.

Less acceptable is the way the foliage visibly fades into view, and how the sides of entire mountain ranges can appear peculiarly smooth even when you're not actually that far away (notable, for example near the Blades hideout). This is all massively nitpicky for such a marvellous-looking game, admittedly, but just be aware that you will encounter the odd winceworthy moment, but then come to accept them. It's also worth pointing out that none of this is an issue indoors, where the game engine has much less to sweat over. In fact, for the most part, the 360 copes brilliantly with a game that requires a hefty beast of a graphics card to run to the same level on the PC.

Whether you'll like the overall art style is open to question, though. It certainly has an overtly 'western' feel to it that won't be necessarily to everyone's taste. The character models, for instance, still lack a certain something. You can't fault their detail level, but they can look a bit plastic, and animation's not quite up the same standard as the rest of the game's stunning artwork - particularly the lip-synching and expressions, which aren't even in the same league as, say, Half-Life 2. There's also the occasional tendency for the lighting to show them in an unflattering (and actually quite odd) light, but we're being impossibly harsh over what is almost always an amazing visual showpiece.

The actual interactions you have with the NPCs are generally well-handled, though. Using a basic topic/question-based conversation system, you get the chance to grill almost everyone you meet, giving Oblivion the feel of one of those old-school adventures where you end up making progress almost as much by being plain nosey and inquisitive as your actions. This might frustrate the type of gamer that just wants to wade in and kill everything, but for the investigative gamer who admires storytelling, interaction and questing, all of this is instantly intoxicating stuff. The voice acting's of a pretty decent standard, just about managing to veer away from tired stereotypes and amdram inflections, with the occasional exception. In terms of the main characters, it's all sturdily handled by the kind of grizzled actors that wouldn't sound out of place at the RSC (like Patrick Stewart, Sean Bean and Terance Stamp). It's only the lesser NPCs that you meet that invariably let the side down a little, but it is only a little. Alongside that, there's one of the finest game soundtracks imaginable, with seemingly hours of haunting, lilting, uplifting, and dramatic scores from long-time Elder Scrolls composer Jeremy Soules.

A problem shared...

'The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion' Screenshot sunlight

We're big fans of dappled sunlight.

The only slight regret about Oblivion is that you have to go through this majestic experience all on your own. Although it'd probably cripple the frame rate even more, the idea of co-op questing is something that would work perfectly for a game like this. Maybe in the next next-gen?

If you've stuck with us this long and not simply rushed out to buy it (which we suggest you do before the weekend is out), then you should have the distinct impression that it's the kind of must-have game that has Game of the Year contender written all over it. There's so much we haven't even talked about, that's the crazy thing, 3000 words in. The prospect of things like Vampire hunting (or, even being a vampire) is just the stuff of gaming legend, or being the ultimate warrior or assassin for hire. Frankly, there's way too much stuff to talk about in the confines of a review - it's one of those games you've got to experience for yourself.

Oblivion is a staggeringly ambitious game that successfully unites some of the best elements of RPG, adventure and action games and fuses them into a relentlessly immersive and intoxicating whole. If the irresistibly picturesque visuals don't draw you in, then the ability to engage in a massive, unique and above all hugely entertaining adventure ought to tip the balance for anyone doubting how good this game could be. If ever a game was worth the full asking price, Oblivion is it - to miss out on it would be tantamount to a dereliction of duty.

10 / 10

Read the Eurogamer.net scoring policy
Picture of Kristan.

About Kristan Reed

Kristan is a former editor of Eurogamer, dad, Stone Roses bore and Norwich City supporter who sometimes mutters optimistically about Team Silent getting back together.

Read more articles from Kristan by visiting the Kristan Reed archive page.

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Comments (401) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • EGBartonFink #1 6 years ago

    OMFG!!!!

    /now reads review
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 14:27

  • El_MUERkO #2 6 years ago

    10 out of 10, holy shite!

    Then it wasnt a bad idea to buy it in tescos at lunch, now I hope my PC is up to the job.

    /reads review

  • SeesThroughAll #3 6 years ago

    I will check it out on PC... If I choose to buy a X360 later, this will definitely be my first game on that system.

    A rare but always joyful event, when a game exceeds it's hype.

  • Stormflood_UK #4 6 years ago

    Well, I can't ignore it now. I've never been particularly interested in Oblivion, but I'm not so pig-headed to pass up on what could be a terrific game.

  • Darkedge #5 6 years ago

    Good review but i'd like a real PC vs 360 comparison

  • Yossarian #6 6 years ago

    XBOX 360 BIAS

  • Yossarian #7 6 years ago

    oh wait, I just looked at the score

    HUA HUA HUA HUA HUA HUA

    boy am I ever funny

  • Blerk #8 6 years ago

    Wow! Now I have to read the review! :-)

  • yegon #9 6 years ago

    Been playing it for about 3 hrs and achieved absolutely nothing! Meandering has NEVER been so good!

  • Dirtbox #10 6 years ago

    Woohoo!

    Told you it was good!

  • Frogger #11 6 years ago

    Wow ! I guess it's the first time I see a 10/10 here ! That means something !

  • Furbs #12 6 years ago

    Nothing good on the 360, thats the trouble.

  • Yossarian #13 6 years ago

    is there a comprehensive list of EG 10s somewhere?

  • Heartcore_Ninja #14 6 years ago

    woah a 10 from eg? must be good!

  • EGBartonFink #15 6 years ago

    Excellent review guys.

  • Blerk #16 6 years ago

    Nice review! Shame it won't run on my PC really or I might've been tempted to give it a whirl.

  • Yossarian #17 6 years ago

    also, kudos on not getting bogged down in the graphical shortcomings and quibblings about mountainsides, occasionally disappointing AI, etc. and recognising instead the unprecedented scale and quality of freeform gameplay on display here.

  • oceanmotion #18 6 years ago

    Nice review, sounds great.

  • InfiniteFury #19 6 years ago

    They'll downgrade it to a 6 on reflection over the weekend

    Just kidding people - like everyone else, I will now actually read the review :-)

  • ave #20 6 years ago

    10/10? What the hell is going on with review scores.

    Not to mention you thought the interface was great, when everyone on the ESF forums says its horrid(no tooltips?).

    I've been playing this for two days, fun adventure/action game, really really really bad RPG(and combat is still almost as bad as morrowinds) and while it isnt as buggy as Morrowind, it's not far off.

    Radiant AI isnt any superior from a gamers perspective to traditional scripted gameplay and in some circumstances is inferior. Your actions with one faction have no impact on other factions.
    Edited by 3 at 24/03/06 @ 14:50

  • Kay #21 6 years ago

    I always thought this was an MMORPG, which is why I wasn't so bothered about it. But 10? The 360 is looking tempting now...

    K

  • jozz #22 6 years ago

    It just goes to show you how good the EG forumites are at judging quality, even before it's out :p

    Loving it so far. PC or 360- it's an awsome game :)

  • EGBartonFink #23 6 years ago

    @ave who is this everyone else you speak of?

  • ave #24 6 years ago

    Sorry barton, I'll change it to "Everyone on the ESF forums."

  • Furbs #25 6 years ago

    Cracking review Kristan. As I said in the forum, I'd have hated reviewing this as theres so much you can do and to know where to start singing its praises is very tough.

    What I like about is more than any other game I've played 25 odd years or so is right from the first 5 minutes you get the feeling you're playing something VERY special.

    Now someone give them an LotR or Labyrinth licence :)

  • UncleLou #26 6 years ago

    I like the interface, generally, but it has some minor flaws - like ave mentioned, no tooltips. Also, I'd like to have my invenotry open at the same time as the inventory of something I loot, so I can compare if it's worth picikng stuff up. But apart from that, it works great (and I am playing it on the PC), and I am finding it more intuitive than Morrowind's.

  • Furbs #27 6 years ago

    ave - I think the interface is superb. What you have to remember is official forums are home to the most pedantic, nitpicking, sad, whinging muppets on the planet.

  • ave #28 6 years ago

    It's superior to Morrowind in almost every way, but it's still far, far from a perfect game(which according to EG, is whats required for a 10).

    Morrowind I'd give a 5(6 after patches, 7 with mods), Oblivion an 8.

    Furbs, no tooltips, bad inventory management & weird keybinds, probably more things I've forgotten. Also, the ESF forums are even more fanboyish than the bioware ones :p
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 14:55

  • firm3d #29 6 years ago

    I actually ordered a 360 just for this game (I have a Mac) AND paid catalogue premiums. Nice to see every review making me feel good about an otherwise daft choice (I can't stress the word "premiums" enough).
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 14:55

  • krudster #30 6 years ago

    Maybe for the PC player the interface is annoying. I just know it works a charm on the 360 considering what they had to pack in there. Tooltips? I used the manual, personally!

  • krudster #31 6 years ago

    Ave, when this has won multiple GOTYs, come back and justify the 8 :)

  • smoison #32 6 years ago

    Alot of people seem to be reading teh review while saying the picked up the game earlier?
    PLAY IT!
    Don't read about it, then come and comment :D

  • the_dudefather #33 6 years ago

    holy shit! the xbox 360 has a real killer app now :)

  • alimokrane #34 6 years ago

    HOLYYYY SHIT ... a 10/10 here comes the killer App ....

  • squaylor #35 6 years ago

    So it seems the Xbox360 finally has a killer app. I always knew this would be the one possible game that would persuade me to buy a 360 - and so it seems. I can't wait to play it...

  • Yossarian #36 6 years ago

    the manual?? you read the manual??!

  • Scientist #37 6 years ago

    "It's superior to Morrowind in almost every way, but it's still far, far from a perfect game(which according to EG, is whats required for a 10)."

    Erm, have you actually read the scoring criteria? And I quote

    "Let us make absolutely clear that a 10 is not and probably never will be "the perfect game".

    Hardly the "perfect" you are talking about.

  • Huntcjna #38 6 years ago

    Excellent review it however just makes me more and more annoyed that mine hasn't popped through my letterbox yet.

    First class writing though Kristian regardless of the score it was a joy to read.

  • ave #39 6 years ago

    Krudster, since when has EG needed to refer to other games sites to justify it's scores?

    Because if it does, it makes almost all the previous x360 reviews a bad joke on you.

    Scientist, how many 10's have been awarded in EG's history?
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 15:01

  • BremXJones #40 6 years ago

    I must admit, I would have leant towards a Ten myself.

    KG

  • reality_cheque #41 6 years ago

    *checks bank account*

    *wonders if he can survive until 20th Apr on £80*

    *cries*

  • krudster #42 6 years ago

    Shucks. I really should go back to playing it a bit more now. So much to do....

  • ToeWars #43 6 years ago

    I wonder if they'll do a PS3 version. That'll sort out the framerate issues!

    (ducks)

  • krudster #44 6 years ago

    Ave - I'm not specifically using other sites to justify our score. Awards come from all manner of sources, not just mags. I just think this will scoop untold awards, it's that sort of game, and if you don't think so, that's a shame for you, really. I've reviewed over 130 games in the past year, and this tops the lot.

  • UncleLou #45 6 years ago

    In order to not let my nitpicking about the UI be my last comment here, from what I've played so far, the score is deserved. I am really loving it so far, and as I said on the forum, I had more fun in one dungeon I accidentally found than I had in Morrowind in total.

  • squaylor #46 6 years ago

    *wonders if he can survive until 20th Apr on £80*

    Sure you can...buy £80 worth of vitamins and drink lots of water. It's not as if you'll be going out, anyway... ;)

  • Furbs #47 6 years ago

    ave - quite a few - SotC and HL2 immediately spring to mind. Theres at least half a dozen.

  • Dirtbox #48 6 years ago

    lol @ ave

  • EGBartonFink #49 6 years ago

    Jaysus I never thought anybody would think EG refer to other sites for review scores (GR:AW anybody).

    It's been said around here ad infinitum that 10/10 does not mean that the game is absolutely perfect. There is no such thing.

  • Lonestar #50 6 years ago

    I went in Game today to buy this (for the PC) and the normal edition was around £35 and the collectors edition £40. Popped into HMV and both edtions were £30. At first I thought it was a mistake but plumped for the collectors edition - just for that extra booklet thing.

    No mistake.

  • Yossarian #51 6 years ago

    "I wonder if they'll do a PS3 version. That'll sort out the framerate issues!

    (ducks)"

    yawn@u

  • Blerk #52 6 years ago

    Just out of interest, how long did you play for before writing the review, Kristan?

  • lennon #53 6 years ago

    Havent read the review yet but I am about to. The game is awesome. I agree with Furbs after the first few minutes it just felt so special.

    The combat is still iffy but Im finding it more forgiving than morrowind.

  • Eighthours #54 6 years ago

    Obviously a sign of the times [Fired! - Ed] [But I am the Ed - Ed].

    Send for the roflcopter, I thought that was great.

    10/10, eh? Well deserved IMO.

  • Dizzy #55 6 years ago

    10? Wow guys.. impressive. I just got it here sitting on my desk. Now I am even more excited getting home!!!!

  • Scientist #56 6 years ago

    "Scientist, how many 10's have been awarded in EG's history?"

    This has nothing to do with the point I was making. You've exposed yourself on several occasions already in this comments section for missing the point or misunderstanding what others have said.
    Next time count to ten before putting "thoughts" to paper.

  • bionutz #57 6 years ago

    OK, sold!

  • krudster #58 6 years ago

    Blerk - about 30 hours. I wish it could have been 100, but then you'd get the review in April and I'd be fired.

    To be fair, after about 10 hours I'd had enough fun to justify the 10 anyway. It gets better the further you get in my experience.

  • Fubdub #59 6 years ago

    I WANT to play this, but I can't afford a new computer untill summer or beyond. It's torment to read about this game and know it's completely out of your reach.

  • Yossarian #60 6 years ago

    so what are the sanctified EG 10s?

  • Furbs #61 6 years ago

    Sterling work Sir. I admire your dedication to the job. Must be such a hardship :p

  • EGBartonFink #62 6 years ago

    I WANT to play this, but I can't afford a new computer untill summer or beyond. It's torment to read about this game and know it's completely out of your reach.
    Oh just pick up a 360 it will be cheaper ;)

  • jonnyreb #63 6 years ago

    Due to some shady connections at my local game shop I actually picked this up yesterday evening.

    Suffice to say I got about 2 hours sleep last night.....I can't see myself playing WoW for a few months while I'm enjoying this.

    It really is amazing....without descending into pages of features, it simply is just the most amazing game I have played for years - in every sense (graphics, sound, story, AI, interactivity, load times, options).

    You had me at hello :)

  • rauper Verified Managing Director, Eurogamer Network #64 6 years ago

    to see scores in order, click on 'games' and then 'scores'. You can also do this per platform if you like.

  • manic_mouse #65 6 years ago

    Sounds great! And luckily I have the collectors edition waiting for me at home!

    \o/ Hooray!

  • firm3d #66 6 years ago

    You had me at "get lost".

  • Fatfish #67 6 years ago

    Wasn't too sure about this one to be honest - had mixed feelings as to whether I should pick it up or not. The 2 things putting me off were the hype and the time required to dedicate to playing it. However, after reading that review and (almost more importantly for me) other EG's views of the game, I will definately be picking up my pre-ordered copy from GAME on the way home. In fact, I'm even knocking off an hour early to get home before the girlfriend does!

    Can anyone tell me if the 360 CE is worth paying the extra £££ for? Not worried in the slightest about the coin, but is the extra book useful (hints/tips/bestiary etc.), or just background story/history to beef it all up with (if you can be arsed to read it all)??

  • groovychainsaw #68 6 years ago

    This better be waiting for me at home when I get there.... :-)

  • Dizzy #69 6 years ago

    "Can anyone tell me if the 360 CE is worth paying the extra £££ for? Not worried in the slightest about the coin, but is the extra book useful (hints/tips/bestiary etc.), or just background story/history to beef it all up with (if you can be arsed to read it all)?? "

    Extra book is basically just background story fluff.

    The extra DVD is interesting.. making off. A bit like the LotR extras.

    Only 5 euro extra over here.

  • moosebiscuit #70 6 years ago

    Mine still hasn't arrived from Play. :(

  • Furbs #71 6 years ago

    Fatfish - the CE is nice - the 120 page booklet reminds me of the good old days when this was the norm. The map is pretty cheaply printed (very easy to tear I think) and I havent looked at the extras disc.

    Worth an extra tenner? Hmm probably not. Fiver probably (thanks to mail order I paid the same price anyway). If it sways you, the CE packaging fits in nicely with the LotR special edition DVDs :)

  • Stickman #72 6 years ago

    "Morrowind I'd give a 5(6 after patches, 7 with mods), Oblivion an 8"

    Get out.

  • Xerx3s #73 6 years ago

    Spoton. I luv this game! \0/ But a 10/10? I dont want to be nitpicking, but 10/10 scores are bs imo (like i said with SotC or whatever it was that got a 10/10 a while back). Sure, it will be one of the best games of this year, but it has its faults and thus cannot be a perfect score. A 9 would be better.

    Ah crap, i AM nitpicking...

    ;p

  • Fatfish #74 6 years ago

    Thanks for the info folks.

    @ Furbs - I can't wait to hear the story about when you come home pissed one night, put the LotR DVD in by mistake and be yet again amazed at how impressive and lifelike the graphics are in Oblivion!!

    If I owned the LotR special edition DVD's, it might make a difference

    ....................but I don't so it doesn't. ;)

  • Furbs #75 6 years ago

    Xerx3s, since you cant have a perfect game, are you saying then that they should only mark out of 9? Doesnt make sense really does it.

    10 to me means its one of the best games out there, both within, and across the genre. It doesnt imply perfection at all.

  • Fatfish #76 6 years ago

    @ Xerx3s - Just accept it as a NEAR perfect score then and don't get all OCD over it! :p

  • Stickman #77 6 years ago

    10 != Perfect.

    Repeat 10 times.

  • Blerk #78 6 years ago

    I don't suppose there's a demo of the PC version, is there?

  • BremXJones #79 6 years ago

    Always wondered why people think 10/10 scores are bullshit. If you have a scale, you're meant to use all of it. Otherwise, why not just make it a 1-9/9 mark?

    1/10 is just the other end of the scale. Would anyone suggest we shouldn't use 1/10?

    KG

  • ElBurninator #80 6 years ago

    Great to see this and GRAW doin so well after getting the extra time they needed in dev! These will do for me until Alan Wake and Dawn of the dead rising

  • Furbs #81 6 years ago

    KG - Only if they hadnt played Battlecruiser Millenium.

  • Blerk #82 6 years ago

    Would anyone suggest we shouldn't use 1/10?

    I'd like to know why nobody ever uses 0/10!

  • Xerx3s #83 6 years ago

    "ave - I think the interface is superb. What you have to remember is forums are home to the most pedantic, nitpicking, sad, whinging muppets on the planet."

    Surely, not the EG forums? ;p

    Furbs; well, the 10 might be deserved when you view it like that, but i cant help wondering if the reviewer kept an objective mind when giving a 10. Not that it really matters, cause this is one of the best games i played in the past 2 years. \0/

    Oblivion - "Now with new and improved 'doing nothing & bumming around' mode." ^_^

    "Would anyone suggest we shouldn't use 1/10?

    I'd like to know why nobody ever uses 0/10!"

    1 point for spelling their name right. Or atleast, thats what me teacher always said.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 15:48

  • BremXJones #84 6 years ago

    Was thinking that when I wrote my comment actually. Been done a few times, methinks, elsewhere. I suppose it's because 0/10 implies it doesn't even work as a game... of course, it's that same sort of over literal thinking which makes people believe 10/10 means perfect.

    I suppose the reason why no-one gives 0/10 at Eurogamer is that 0/10 isn't actually on the mark scheme.
    http://euroga mer.net/scoring_policy.php

    Er... back to Oblivion!

    KG

  • UncleLou #85 6 years ago

    Always wondered why people think 10/10 scores are bullshit. If you have a scale, you're meant to use all of it. Otherwise, why not just make it a 1-9/9 mark?


    Highest possible score would be an 8 then! :p

  • Furbs #86 6 years ago

    Ad infinitum.

    Or until you end up with a binary scoring system at least :p

  • groovychainsaw #87 6 years ago

    god, people whinging about 10/10. Just accept that for now, in context, it is one of the best games you can play. Call a PERFECT game 11/10, then you'll see that is impossible and therefore cannot be scored as such. Problem solved ;-)

  • UncleLou #88 6 years ago

    @Blerk:

    No demo, I am afraid, and it's probably unlikely they'll release one.

  • BartonFink #89 6 years ago

    I really don't get the whole 10/10 = Perfect thing.

    To me 10/10 means that the game is absolutely outstanding and a must have.

  • The_Aardvark #90 6 years ago

    This sounds amazing (and I loved morrowind) but I see almost no chance of playing this game in the near future.

    A PC upgrade for me is at least two years away and I really can't see me buying a 360.

    ;_;

  • Fatfish #91 6 years ago

    Quote - "1/10 is just the other end of the scale. Would anyone suggest we shouldn't use 1/10?"

    Reminds me of Spinal Tap - the conversation about the volume control on the guitar amp going up to 11! Classic.

    :p

  • kangarootoo #92 6 years ago

    "Mine still hasn't arrived from Play. :("

    WHAAAAAATTTTT!!!!

    I ordered from Play.com and I fully assumed it would be sat on my door mat when I got home today.

    Why, if its not there..... theres nothing I can do about it... GAH!!

  • Machina #93 6 years ago

    Thank god for EG giving average scores to average games; it makes it all the more exciting when something truly special like this appears. If every half-arsed piece of junk got marked an 8 (as they do on some other sites, naming no names), then seeing 10/10 at the bottom of the page wouldn't feel so damn spectacular.

    And I actually managed to read the whole review before scrolling down to see the score... I was trying to guess whether it would be a 9 or a 10, but it became more and more obvious the further I got.

  • pauleyc #94 6 years ago

    Ahem, the composer is Jeremy Soule, not Soules.
    /pedant mode off

    Great review, nice score. Can't wait to play the game.

  • Blerk #95 6 years ago

    No demo, I am afraid, and it's probably unlikely they'll release one.

    Bah! :-(

    Oh well! Back to my other games then. :-)

  • Scientist #96 6 years ago

    "but i can't help wondering if the reviewer kept an objective mind when giving a 10"

    Erm, isn 't a review by its very nature subjective?

  • Bertie Verified Senior Staff Writer, Eurogamer.net #97 6 years ago

    I've looked everywhere and I still can't link Sony to this. Why it's scored so highly then... ;)

    Can't wait to get my greedy mits on this when I get back, I think I'll sprout a suitable beard to accompany me on my adventures.

  • firm3d #98 6 years ago

    I think the most sweeping and grand music I ever heard in a game was in the village with the big tree in Icewind Dale, which was Jeremy Soule. Shame about the game, though, which I found disappointing.

  • Stickman #99 6 years ago

    kanga - I ordered from play (via EG, like a good boy), and it was on my doormat this morning.

  • Perry #100 6 years ago

    Can I assume that if my Laptop is 2 years old it wont handle this?

  • Rambaldi #101 6 years ago

    To all the moaning gits who criticise the 360 for having nothing exciting:

    EAT MY GOAL!!!

    /continues to wander round Oblivion happily staring at grass and chasing deer

  • Furbs #102 6 years ago

    Bertie, who needs a beard when you can look this good?

    And no, I wont stop posting a link to her cos I love her :p

  • BartonFink #103 6 years ago

    @Fatfish I picked up the 360 CE at my local Gamestop over here in Ireland. Very nice little package and strangely enough it was the exact same price as the standard edition. €74.99 I was a little surprised.

  • Bertie Verified Senior Staff Writer, Eurogamer.net #104 6 years ago

    Haha, I just looked at that picture in the forum, Furbs! Mission Vao from Kotor ftw!

    /is inspired

  • Biggles #105 6 years ago

    must ... resist ... buying ... new ... console ... (again)

  • kangarootoo #106 6 years ago

    @Stickman

    Whoohoo!!

    /puts axe back in cupboard, removes gimp hat and powers down postman tracker device

  • UncleLou #107 6 years ago

    think the most sweeping and grand music I ever heard in a game was in the village with the big tree in Icewind Dale, which was Jeremy Soule.

    Yes! Exactly. This particular piece almost brought a tear to my eye everytime I heard it. :)

  • SeesThroughAll #108 6 years ago

    by the way has eurogamer ever rated a game this high before, where is the list of 10's

    Very few games got that score. Advance Wars comes to mind.

  • BartonFink #109 6 years ago

    EG Scores

    Only 18 games have been given 10.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 16:21

  • Furbs #110 6 years ago

    PC owners might want to check this out. Works brilliantly (even from one face on photo - they suggest having three though, at different angles) and lets you import any face you want in to the game (mmm sexy blue elf woman with Angelina Jolies face...).

    You dont need to register it (which costs $500!), just make a note of the slider positions and apply them to your character when you creat him/her (Bethseda used this software so it applies perfectly).

  • Carrybagma #111 6 years ago

    Wow. This really does fit into my idea of what next-gen should look like. I'd love to see what that 'sun-dappled' scene is like when you're actually moving through it. And gameplay to match!

    I hope this and GRAW are the vanguard of a stream of quality 360 titles.

    The fun starts here??

  • tincanrocket #112 6 years ago

    Much as I hate PC World I think it trumps even HMV on the price front for the PC version.

    Only 19.99!

  • Roamer #113 6 years ago

    Add me to the 'I think the Icewind Dale Soule theme was memorable' list.

    As for Oblivion, colour me poor and stick me in the 'Wants Oblivion' barrel.

    Put me on the street and hand me a 'Give me money' sign.

    Oh, and hand me an engineer with a free computer upgrade too.

  • smelly #114 6 years ago

    PC Version 20 quid? Sold!

  • weaselrat #115 6 years ago

    Mne takes about a year to load does anyone else have this problem and it keeps stall during the game All my other games are fine so surely it can't be my 360

  • lennon #116 6 years ago

    I think you have to hold down the a button on the pad as the game loads until it reaches the bethesda screen. Doing that clears the cache. Check teamxbox forums for a more descriptive answer.

  • smelly #117 6 years ago

    I wouldnt worry, im sure a patch will come out soon.

    (Erm, from what ive read on forums.. apparently if you hold A while it's loading it'll sort that problem out for you - but i dont own one, so i woulnt know).

  • rogermellie #118 6 years ago

    Strangely I didn't enjoy Bethesda's previous attempts, but this game is amazing. It combines my favourite RPG games (Ultima VII/Underworld I/II). For me they've finally nailed the 1st person combat and created a world with believable NPCs.

    I'm running the PC version as my system just meets the recommend settings. So far I'd say the cost of an XBox360 is easily worth the entry fee.

  • onyxbox #119 6 years ago

    THIS GAME ROX!

    I was playing it all of last night... nothing like it eva'!

  • onyxbox #120 6 years ago

    Mne takes about a year to load does anyone else have this problem and it keeps stall during the game All my other games are fine so surely it can't be my 360

    Make sure you're running 60Hz

  • weaselrat #121 6 years ago

    I'm running 60 hz on a HD and holding a and the git is still slower than my nan in her walker

  • Xerx3s #122 6 years ago

    "I really don't get the whole 10/10 = Perfect thing.

    To me 10/10 means that the game is absolutely outstanding and a must have."

    I guess it depends on your PoV and what your used to. To me its a perfect score. Oh well, didnt mean to make such a big fuss out of it. Its just that to me it is odd, but i guess im a weirdo then. ;p

    "Erm, isn 't a review by its very nature subjective? "

    True, what i meant was that the reviewer wouldnt be too hyped up.

    "I'm running 60 hz on a HD and holding a and the git is still slower than my nan in her walker"

    pressing a....before the bethesda logo?
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:03

  • kangarootoo #123 6 years ago

    @Carrybagma

    Check the Oblivion trailers on Eurogamer TV. There are a couple that show some lovely woodland scenes. Obviously not as representative as actually playing the game, but lovely all the same.

  • weaselrat #124 6 years ago

    yep. still screwed. maybe i have a duff disc

  • sdvksbhv #125 6 years ago

    EUROGAMER!!!

    The only thing you've done right is write about the bad things, but to say you are being harsh is just wrong.

    The framerate is terrible in outdoor scenes, the characters look very very poor, and the trees popping and transforming just can't get any worse. To say this is "the most beautiful game settings achieved to date" is just so over the top. And "man - the stars". OH MY, the sky and stars are one of the things i hate the most. The stars move across the screen almost as fast as the clouds and you can see them even when the sky is bright. The interior sections are just so boring, gray and flat most of the time it just doesnt interest me in the slightest.

    I am going to give this a proper playing before i make my final judgements, but i believe from what i've seen already that this score is very unjustified.

  • Furbs #126 6 years ago

    The game actually looks way better in motion because your eyes arent drawn to the distance, where it doesnt look so hot. I took some grabs of the opening meadow sequence and it looks 10x better "in the flesh".
    sdvksbhv - are you a professional nitpicker? Like the ones who used to visit my school? I guess every other review on the planet is wrong too? AFAIK its averaging about 95% atm.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:08

  • morriss #127 6 years ago

    I am dreaming, right?

    A 10/10 360 game within 4 months of the consoles release?

    /rubs eyes

  • Calgon #128 6 years ago

    I was going to wind up the Sony Zombies here(pay no attention whoever read that lol I was not being serious) since they are now crying and organising a troll invasion(they do talk utter shite though dont they?, do Sony train some of these fools?... Mr.T and I... we pity them)

    Sounds good I dont know why but no matter how much good I've heard of the TES franchise, I havent got around to playing any of them(I picked up Morrowind Game of the year in a shop once but put it back down again and left with another game). This one actually looks like one for everyone though, they seem to have outdone themselves and alot of the people who did purchaise a 360(seems to be many of them) for this game will be pleased.
    Edited by 3 at 24/03/06 @ 17:27

  • BartonFink #129 6 years ago

    Ah great to see sanity restored. I was starting to lose hope. Well done Calgon.

  • Furbs #130 6 years ago

    Theres always one (or more).

  • space_ace #131 6 years ago

    a medievalboiling point? sounds like fun :)

  • weaselrat #132 6 years ago

    Sorted. for some strange reason there was abit of tape stuck to the disc. Doh

    This game rocks

  • BremXJones #133 6 years ago

    "A 10/10 360 game within 4 months of the consoles release? "

    And the moral is: Release a good fucking game.

    KG

  • roselan #134 6 years ago

    You can play a Breton, like Cantona ???

  • Calgon #135 6 years ago

    Oh come on guys wheres you're sense of humor, they do deserve the odd wind up in return. You know this is going to hurt, they wont beable to comprehend and will not accept it(fanboys are so predictable).

  • El_MUERkO #136 6 years ago

    If their are no flying panthers then it'll never be boiling point!

  • WicKeD #137 6 years ago

    I can only imagine that had Oblivion made launch, then perhaps, superlatives such as best launch ever wouldn't have been met with such blinkered criticism.

    Good work, Bethesda.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:30

  • Furbs #138 6 years ago

    Grow up Calgon, why would it hurt? Last month they got SotC which had the same score and there will be games just as good as this on the PS3.

    Its got nothing to do with Sony anyway since this isnt coming out on it, so why bring them into the thread?

    In summary, stfu.

  • Calgon #139 6 years ago

    That was a nice review there Kristian btw.

  • EGBartonFink #140 6 years ago

    @Calgon - what Furbs said.

  • Mr_Brown #141 6 years ago

    If ever a game deserved 10/10 its this one. Best game I have ever played to date.

  • Teeth #142 6 years ago

    Way to make us look like a bunch of arseholes editing your moronic post into something more readable, Calgon. I've deleted my post now.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:36

  • Calgon #143 6 years ago

    Furbs perhaps because they feel the need to chime in on every review thread telling of how "Im waiting for the PS3, 360 has no games its not next gen". I apologise for nothing and I dont really take EG comments serious for that very reason, there are no mods and trolls and Zombies are in every thread.

  • Calgon #144 6 years ago

    Teeth well Im actually shocked you didnt notice that was a piss take/wind up, good job I edited it.

    edit: well from where Im standing you are bunch of pretentious assholes. You're also wrong Im not American and I dont own a 360.
    Edited by 2 at 24/03/06 @ 17:48

  • Scientist #145 6 years ago

    "wheres you're sense of humor"

    Destroyed by you're (sic) awful grasp of the English language.
    Trolling trolls may be funny in America (I assume you're (sic) American "gray" and "humor";) but it's not welcome in these parts.

  • BartonFink #146 6 years ago

    Actually my original post (after Calgons troll) still makes sense although now in non-sarcastic way.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:41

  • wolfen #147 6 years ago

    I'd be interested in the game (after all, it has gorgeous graphics and probably the best free-roaming experience ever) but the whole "elves and trolls" fantasy stuff is a big turn-off. Ghhnnnnn!

    Any chance of a Mount & Blade with this engine ? Pretty please?

  • redd #148 6 years ago

    with the stupid amount of possibilities this game presents, its incredible how well it executes most every one of them... I can only imagine gigantic gantt charts and uml models, oh the headaches.

  • Calgon #149 6 years ago

    @Scientist: Christ! aren't we the little grammar natzi? ok you are quite right I did misspell a few things there like "humour" which you were so kind to point out and also "your" which you may have missed, forgive me sir!
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 17:45

  • Scientist #150 6 years ago

    "Just spent ages generating a character. That alone I could play and have fun with for hours. Then I started exploring the cave bit where you follow after the Emperor, then I stopped because my 5yrs old daughter was completely ruining the atmosphere."

    Modern parenting in all its glory.

  • MrGrumpy.au #151 6 years ago

    And it looks like the rating trolls have already entered the building, come on who gave it a 1/10?

  • statix101 #152 6 years ago

    Im sorry but single digit frame rates are not what 'Next Gen' consoles were supposed to be about.

  • potatoes #153 6 years ago

    ok, i bought this... am i the only one who cant get passed those fucking rats right at the start... i really cant remember the last time i was this frustrated with a game...

    get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back, get bitten, lurch back....

    i MUST be doing something wrong surely?

    right now this is scoring a 2 from me...
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 18:01

  • JonFE #154 6 years ago

    May I point out to the PTB that a 10/10 x360 review can generate as many comments as a 5/10 one ?

    As for the game I'll probably buy it next week (has to wait for the next paycheck) even tho' RPG's and my free-for-games time don't see eye to eye :)

  • EuroTV #155 6 years ago

    WWWOOOOOHOOO!!!! Most sensible coment.

  • papalazarou #156 6 years ago

    lol potatoes, equip a bloody weapon!!

  • zErOb_cOOl #157 6 years ago

    I would have thought the framerate issues would have bee nconfined to the PC, due to the obviously more system-intensive operating system.

    A 360 has to run a basic OS and, well, games, and that it.

    I mean 3 x 3.2GHz processors and there's still a slow framerate? I know its hard to compare a console to a PC, and it entirely depends on the spec of the PC in question, but all I'm saying is I'm surprised.

    It is early in the X360s life though, so its easily forgivable.

  • Bumbuliuz #158 6 years ago

    Fantastic review and for once I agree with the score ;) 10/10 I have been lost in this game since thursday morning. I really LOVED Morrowind but Oblivion is even better, and that is a hard thing to do. On a side-note played 14 hours and havent even done the first quest after the first dungeon ;)
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 18:29

  • Feanor #159 6 years ago

    "It's superior to Morrowind in almost every way, but it's still far, far from a perfect game(which according to EG, is whats required for a 10)."

    Comedy gold, ave. Back in your box, thanks.

  • tengu #160 6 years ago

    This is pretty damn great from what I've played so far, even though I don't really know what the hell to do when my stats drop after contracting some of the 'illnesses' (Swamp sickness and helljoint or some names like that), my stats seem to have dropped and I have no clue how to restore them yet. Loved one instance where I got off the horse to fight a wolf and the horse kicked the wolf to death before I got near it. Gave me a good laugh :)

    Having said that, the pop up and frame rates on the outside world bits are appalling at times, especially when you're on horseback, sometimes it slows down to a stop. Pretty annoying at times, but ah well.

    Great game on the whole.
    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 19:02

  • Carpathian #161 6 years ago

    Sigh. I've held off grabbing a 360 so far and now this has tipped the scales to a large degree. I won't be out tomorrow buying one but, when I do, this is being picked up with it.

    On the 10/10 thing, as so many people seem confused, a little pointer.

    A 6, for example could be thought of being for titles better than maybe 5.5 and worse than a 6.5. Therefore it's obvious a 10 covers 9.5 (or 95% if you will) upwards and still leaves plenty of scope for the odd mark taken off. It doesn't mean a perfect 10 marks.

    It's a foible of marking with such a small scale, as I see it.

    /climbs off podium.

  • Kiigan #162 6 years ago

    The review said:

    "By some freak of slider bar chance, we made ours look exactly like Prince, albeit with blue skin and a greater penchant for eyeliner. Obviously a sign of the times"

    That's quite fitting, because I am as we speak playing Oblivion on PC with Prince's latest album ("3121" - available in all good record stores now) blaring in the background. It just make it all a bit more... well, funky.

    Owwah!

  • Killerbee #163 6 years ago

    I was really hoping to resist the charms of this one as I really don't have time to get immersed in another massive RPG, what with Star Ocean 3 and Tales of Symphonia still sitting unfinished on my pile of games to play, but a 10/10 means it'd be wrong not to. :/

  • potatoes #164 6 years ago

    no, REALLY... i do have a weapon, but whenever i get hit i cant counter or block or move or anything, then i get hit again which perpetuates the cycle...

    i am litterally dying every time i get hit once, because its just a matter of time before i die...

    this really cant be right, i MUST be missing something somewhere otherwise everyone else would be complaining too...

    the only reason i have got beyond the first rats is because every time i kill ANYTHING i save... that cant be the only way...

  • onyxbox #165 6 years ago

    to 'weaselrat'

    try holding the 'A' button down while the game fires up... this flushes any disk fragmentation that may have happened

  • effinwooly #166 6 years ago

    wow GREAT game !!!! Makes me happy to own a 360 !!!!

  • The-Bodybuilder #167 6 years ago

    Wasn't a big fan of action-rpgs until i bought shenmue. Turned out to be my fav game of all time.

    Wasn't a big fan of clancy-like tactical games (rainbow 6, ghost recon) until I bought GRAW. Turned out to be my fav 360 game so far.

    Not a big fan of western rpg's (or any for that matter). But will I be foolish enough to pass over a game that got 10/10 from (of all people) EG?

  • EGBartonFink #168 6 years ago

    You will not ... get thee to the shops.

  • statix101 #169 6 years ago

    4hrs in (PC version).....and im bored senseless.

    Once you get over the 'wow' factor of the gfx, its just the standard dreary trudge through dungeons,talking, trading etc,etc,etc.

    7/10.


  • tengu #170 6 years ago

    That's RPGs for you I suppose :)

  • statix101 #171 6 years ago

    "That's RPGs for you I suppose :) "

    Oh yeah i accept that, im not the biggest fan of them, but i wanted to see if my Pc could still cut it on a supposedly 'next gen' titile

    Im running it at 1280x1024,2xAA,Bloom and most settings set to max (except shadows) and im getting between 30-40fps depending on location, which i gather is better than what the 360 does.

    Quite happy with that, so still no need to get a 360.




    Edited by 1 at 24/03/06 @ 20:14

  • Calgon #172 6 years ago

    Statix care to post your rig? Just out of interest...

  • petebritish #173 6 years ago

    Great review Great game
    Nough said

  • TheEnd #174 6 years ago

    10/10 is excessive. There's too strong a sense of the game being cobbled together from a bunch of middleware. It's still a great game, but really, it's more an evolution of Morrowind than it is something unique. I'd give it an 8.5

  • bivith #175 6 years ago

    "Im running it at 1280x1024,2xAA,Bloom and most settings set to max (except shadows) and im getting between 30-40fps depending on location, which i gather is better than what the 360 does. "

    The 360 has 4xAA. Try that and see what your framerate is. Then compare the price of your PC with the 360

  • admir #176 6 years ago

    will get it for the PC, no need to buy a x360 if you own a PC

  • Bezzy #177 6 years ago

    Oblivion feels like the archetype of a game that so many people have wanted to make, but haven't had the wit, talent, time or resources.

    Good fucking show Bethesda. 10+ years paid off.

  • statix101 #178 6 years ago

    "Statix care to post your rig? Just out of interest... "

    P4 3Ghz
    2.0GB Ram
    Radeon X850XT PE

    "The 360 has 4xAA. Try that and see what your framerate is. Then compare the price of your PC with the 360 "

    I wasnt having a dig at the 360, i was simply saying that it was unessacary to spend £300 on a new console when my current PC is capable enough...

    By the way 4xAA has minimal effect on the frame rate, 5-10% fps reduction, if anything my CPU is a weak spot.

    Also, theres no way of knowing what settings the 360 is using for all the options i can tweak on the PC version, as there are lots of options for draw distance, details tc,etc,etc.....



  • Ak1ra #179 6 years ago

    10? Well, guess this website isn't so much different from IGN or Gamespot. Sure the game is great, but 10? Is this the perfect game? Better than Zelda? Perfect with so many loadings? You guys really let me down on this review.

  • karstux #180 6 years ago

    Man, I just hope the controls and interface survived the transition from Console to PC. I have yet to see a control scheme that works well for both worlds. Anyone with the PC version care to comment?

    Other than that... damn luck that my copy isn't in the mail yet. I have an exam on monday, and surely not the willpower to abstain from the game 'till then...

  • EGBartonFink #181 6 years ago

    @admir will get it for the PC, no need to buy a x360 if you own a PC
    There is if you want to play it and don't have a PC that is capable of playing the damned thing. What a silly thing to say.

  • JediMasterMalik #182 6 years ago

    The 360 and PC versions are practically identical so shut it :p

  • EGBartonFink #183 6 years ago

    @Ak1ra - it's been said before on countless occasions that a 10 does not mean a perfect game, there is no such thing. It does however mean that the game really stands out and is a definate must have. GotY material and all that jazz.

  • EGBartonFink #184 6 years ago

    The 360 and PC versions are practically identical so shut it :p

    /sniff

  • amorpheus #185 6 years ago

    no demo no play
    too many times I've been scammed by blind-buy
    let's wait to Gothic 3...

  • Hunam85 #186 6 years ago

    omg!!!

  • stoopidgreg #187 6 years ago

    i'll keep it short:

    bought the game today. been playing it ever since. fuxing amazing ^_^

  • The-Bodybuilder #188 6 years ago

    I must stay, I'm still not convinced.
    All these elves and orcs really isn't my "thing".

    And is thier an option for a 3rd person view? Like some of the pics show? Because I CAN'T STAND 1st person sword fighting.

  • Furbs #189 6 years ago

    Just press the right stick in BodyBuilder. And if you hold it in you can change the level of zoom I think.

  • fatbb #190 6 years ago

    Yes, you can play in third person view. I've been using third person view mostly for my first 3 hours in the game. The dungeon/sewer felt too claustrophobic in first person view.
    Targeting fireballs in third person view is a bit difficult though so I've been switching between first/third person during fights. fantastic game though. I sense an all night gaming session in the works.

  • tengu #191 6 years ago

    Bodybuilder, just to let you know, this plays like shit in third person(imo obviously, but trying any kind of combat was a nightmare in that view, plus I really hate the stiff way your character moves), you NEED to play in first person to really enjoy it. I'd say you should try it. I can't stand first personing most of the time myself, but this is well worth making the effort for.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 00:11

  • darkphoenix #192 6 years ago

    hhhmmmm, a X360 for me, it shall be!

  • Stormflood_UK #193 6 years ago

    Well... hmm... not enjoying it so far.

    I may have to concede that these types of RPG are just not my thing. I've been doing my honest best to give Oblivion the benefit of the doubt, and the 10/10 got me heading down to Game after work - I even picked up the CE.

    But I'll keep at it. And not just because I spent 50 frickin quid on the damn game. I will, once and for all, see if it is possible for me to enjoy more than 3 seconds of a western RPG, even if the hammy am-dram voice acting kills my will to live, and the disappointing combination of next-gen graphics with last-gen animation makes my eyes bleed.

    I will not give up so easily godammit...

    p.s. It's crashed on me twice whilst loading back after my death. That really doesn't help my tolerence....

  • miiiguel #194 6 years ago

    The PC vs 360 "issue" is not a question for me. I couldn't stand to upgrade video card, then upgrade something else, then try lowering some detail, then figure out that somewhere near in the future must upgrade the whole damn machine..., just bought the damn 360 version and, here we go!!!

  • The-Bodybuilder #195 6 years ago

    >" you NEED to play in first person to really enjoy it."

    :-(

    ooooh very well.
    /drags himself to his 360 like a spoilt brat.

  • admir #196 6 years ago

    I really dont care how the game looks it will look good on my PC and the graphics will get better every year. havent played it yet but if the gameplay is solid i will have no problems with the game. What you 2 are saying is the game looks good so it most be good. i care about gameplay not how it looks. you 2 care more about the graphics and not the gameplay
    i dont think that there is no big difference between the PC and x360

    EGBartonFink
    "admir will get it for the PC, no need to buy a x360 if you own a PC"
    There is if you want to play it and don't have a PC that is capable of playing the damn"Statix care to post your rig? Just out of interest... "

    Statix101
    P4 3Ghz
    2.0GB Ram
    Radeon X850XT PE

    "The 360 has 4xAA. Try that and see what your framerate is. Then compare the price of your PC with the 360 "

    I wasnt having a dig at the 360, i was simply saying that it was unessacary to spend £300 on a new console when my current PC is capable enough...

    By the way 4xAA has minimal effect on the frame rate, 5-10% fps reduction, if anything my CPU is a weak spot.

    Also, theres no way of knowing what settings the 360 is using for all the options i can tweak on the PC version, as there are lots of options for draw distance, details tc,etc,etc.....

    ed thing. What a silly thing to say.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 00:39

  • Furbs #197 6 years ago

    That would be true had Bethseda not said that the 360 version uses the same settings as the PC version does on high.

    Also the PC version, regardless of graphics card cannot support both HDR lighting and AA. The 360 version does.

    Its swings and roundabouts of course - the PC version has mods for instance, but if you want out and out visual quality, I've seen nothing so far in any comparison shots to suggest the PC version looks any better than the 360 version.

    Especially when faced with the choice of a 32" HDTV or a 19/21" monitor :)

  • Drakron #198 6 years ago

    You miss the point of graphics on PC can be scaled.

    For ever little gadget a console does, the PC will come with a similar effect 1-2 years down the line and HD-TV still does not beat a monitor.

    I am curious about the 10/10 since Eurogamer scores tend to be less inflated that the likes across the Atlantic but still this is on the Xbox 360 version so I am not sure if this is the Xbox 360 review or a general game review.

  • Furbs #199 6 years ago

    Ummm...the games are identical? So its a review of both?

    Why doesnt an HDTV beat a monitor btw? Unless you are refering to the black levels on a CRT, I cant really think of anything beyond the cost element.

    Personally give a more immersive experience via a bigger screen than better levels any day.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 01:10

  • Furbs #200 6 years ago

    Maybe you should upgrade your graphics card? :)

  • Furbs #201 6 years ago

    Interested enough to post though right? :p

  • Furbs #202 6 years ago

    Heh.
    Just read the spoiler thread over the next few weeks, beats the hassle of playing \o/

  • Furbs #203 6 years ago

    Oh it is, but I've been denied my TV all night :(

  • Furbs #204 6 years ago

    Not on my system it doesnt.

  • Pablo2k5 #205 6 years ago

    I got this today from play.com and...

    ...this is one of the worst games I have ever played. Seriously.

    10/10? LOL! 1/10 more like!

    Take it from me, try before you buy ffs! Im floggin' this piece of sh1t ASAP...

    Oh, and this is the last time I get taken by the stupid hype!

  • Furbs #206 6 years ago

    OK then! Thanks!

  • urban #207 6 years ago

    first time ever.?

  • admir #208 6 years ago

    hyped games
    halo, DoA, BF2, FF7, Far Cry,

  • widow88 #209 6 years ago

    I'm a big TES fan. Bought the PC version but wasn't happy that I couldn't run it at at decent detail. That went to ebay after I was in the shop today and saw a 360 sitting there with my name on it. The controller takes a bit getting used to but I kinda like the analog sticks, Oblivion not being a twitch FPS I think I can get used to them. I've read the 360 version runs with 4AA + HDR and almost full detail which my PC couldn't do. Nevermind that it couldn't do 4AA+HDR at the same time. The game is beautiful. Looks better than it did on my PC so I'm happy plus I get to play it on our 34" HDTV. If your're not seeing this game near it's full glory just get a 360. I took the plunge and I'm happy for it.

  • stonedben #210 6 years ago

    It arrived on my doorstep 13 hours ago. WHERE DID THAT TIME GO??

    It crashes. Quite a bit. Most notably when you're killing wolves out in the world. But I don't care. I just sigh, load up and try again.

    <em>/looks at the readers scores</em>
    ONE? FUCKING ONE??? Why do these trolls exist?
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 02:42

  • stonedben #211 6 years ago

    You know what the killer is? In 11 hours I leave for New York, for 6 weeks, without my PC. Talk about bad timing...

    Just in case, I'm taking the game with, and my saves on a usb stick. Fat chance I'll get to play it though - my family over there are almost computer illiterate :(

  • Drakron #212 6 years ago

    Ummm...the games are identical? So its a review of both?

    The PC is not a console, if the contols and GUI are same as the console it suffers, also PC are not the same "harware" as consoles are so what might run "fine" on a console might CTD on a PC every 5 minutes.

    I am hearing many reports of CTD at cell loading (not I am suprised, Bethsoft games are known from being PoS in terms of performance and yes I can say that after playing most TES games and even the more unknown Terminator games) so I like a review of the PC version so I get a grip on how well it actually runs and how the GUI works.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 06:51

  • Pablo2k5 #213 6 years ago

    OK, I gave this game a chance and played it for a few hours last night...
    My opinion is this... slow boring buggy ugly crappy combat buggy, oh did I mention it was buggy?? I mean seriously, why haven't the reviews mentioned to truckload of sloppy bugs to be found in this game? The animation is sooooo bad and textures poor, if this is erm 'Next-gen' then you can stick it up yer arse!
    The AI is pretty suspect too... don't believe the hype!

    PS - Oh look, see that mountain in the distance? You can actually walk there! ...YES, but why would you want to?

    PPS - A quick note on the 'Beautiful Open Vistas', I'd give it a 8/10 for foliage. But, what the f*ck is this? Gardeners World? A decent shrubbery doesn't necessarily mean its a good game now does it?

  • Cosmopolitan #214 6 years ago

    Reading your personal views is much more enlightening than the review itself, thank you guys. Not that I am a Sony or on Xbox fanboy, but I personally think that with 10/10, EG have screwed a bit. I believe they might review the rating in the future.

  • kaosridder #215 6 years ago

    ^^ so we condlude that this is not your type of game? Havent your played any other daggerfall/morrowind games? Then you would have known. They are all pretty identical in gameplay.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 10:33

  • Martin #216 6 years ago

    Crap! With this out and Test Drive on the way I *have* to buy a 360 now. :(

  • Eighthours #217 6 years ago

    Reading your personal views is much more enlightening than the review itself, thank you guys. Not that I am a Sony or on Xbox fanboy, but I personally think that with 10/10, EG have screwed a bit. I believe they might review the rating in the future.

    The words, "No they bloody won't cos this is one of the best games they and I have ever played" spring immediately to mind.

  • Yossarian #218 6 years ago

    it's hard to read the user ratings graph, but it seems like multiple people have given it a 1/10. how strange.

  • Yossarian #219 6 years ago

    for those still complaining about the score, EG are hardly off the curve on this one:

    htt p://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages4/927345.asp

  • Darren #220 6 years ago

    10/10 is absolutely spot on. In fact Oblivion is so damn excellent it should get the first ever 11/10 score!!! I'm 15 hours into the Xbox 360 game and bar some forgiveable framerate stutter/popup outdoors and some very minor bugs this game is near perfect and the best RPG I've played to date on any platform. It just so damn addictive in the same way that World of Warcraft was except this game is more so!!!

    And I didn't like Morrowind (PC) either...

  • Tiger_Walts #221 6 years ago

    If you were to take the EG XBOX 360 score modifier into account that some people will have you believe to exist this game is really 12/10.

  • greenfeld69 #222 6 years ago

    Cracking game, well worth your money.

  • Artemus #223 6 years ago

    it's hard to read the user ratings graph, but it seems like multiple people have given it a 1/10. how strange.

    It happens on every high profile game. The idiots.

    The system needs fixing. So we can see exactly who has voted for what and in what volume.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 14:08

  • Pablo2k5 #224 6 years ago

    Having played the game fairly extensively now and disliking it in almost every way I have voted but I am not one of those idiots giving it 1/10.

    I gave it a 6/10 which is what I think it deserves.

  • Kiigan #225 6 years ago

    Personally I'd have given it a 6 or 7 too, but hey it is all just opinions right?

    As far as I can see, it's still just Morrowind really - every bit as clunky, ugly, awkward, badly-written and impenetrable as ever. I am enjoying it so far, but I'd have been happy with a game a quarter of the size, with a quarter of the amount of features, depth and choices, but with a lot more polish on the UI, controls, combat system, and a better-realised third person mode. What I mean to say is - the staple diet of play in Oblivion is pretty rough around the edges - just like Morrowind. If you can buy into the world and really get into it, you'll make your own fun and get a lot of value from it anyway no doubt. I'm just sore because I haven't managed to make a character I like yet :-)

    Also, having played both versions, I find the PC version much easier to get along with. The menu navigation on the 360 was doing my head in.

  • blahhh #226 6 years ago

    I have to agree I would have to give it 6 or 7 too.
    Is just an OK..RPG game,nothing special.
    But Im sure its a perfect 10 when you playing this game high on something,now that I think about it I have to admit it must be an adventure.
    I played this game for about 7 hours last night,not cuz I was having that much fun but because I didnt have much else to do.I was excited at first tho, just because I thoght it was really that good,but it isnt.
    The fighting in the game is kinder boring all you do is the same thing over and over again,just a basic sword atack.You can use other weapons like a bow but I didnt find it that effective at all,I had a goblin run at me with arrows all over him still very alive,so I just sticked to the sword.
    It is very weird to me that all the human lookin characters look alike,even the woman do,due to the fact that everybody is based on one model,so no matter how hard you try to make your imperial look different you wont succeed without making him look abnormal.
    Pretty much all that I was fighting was the annoying goblins and wolfs,I kinder find it weird that you get atacked by everything for no reason at all,even by the human looking characters.I always end up waiting for them to see how they going to react hoping they wont atack me but they always do.
    Graphics is good but I wish it was better,the best thing about the game is the world size ,it is huge,so you do need a horse to get around if you like to travel.The walking speed is to slow tho, for the human as well the horse,you just cant walk for longer than 5 sec and not get bored,I wish there was a speed in between walking and running.
    Anyway Im not a big RPG fan,never was, so that must be one of the reason I dont like it so much,I just cant make myself go and check out every house,dungon,talk to everybody and so on.I dont see a point really.
    I'll check the game once more but Im not sure Im going to finish it.
    Well I guess is a great game if you like RPG games,and you like leveling up.I dont think I leveld up to much,only visited like 2 dungons..

  • papalazarou #227 6 years ago

    Kiigan wrote "Also, having played both versions, I find the PC version much easier to get along with. The menu navigation on the 360 was doing my head in"

    Bloody hell mate its not that difficult- I cant honestly see how they could have mapped the controls any better!

  • widow88 #228 6 years ago

    To the people giving it "6 or 7", this is fine, it's your opinion. Said that, you don't understand the game and it's depth and have little appreciation for it. TES games take time to appreciate. You really need play for a while before understanding the massive depth of role playing that the game presents. TES fans of which I am one understand this and are very accomodating. Not a problem. The game is not for everyone but unlike Morrowind, Oblivion is much more accessible.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 18:26

  • Ryuken #229 6 years ago

    "you don't understand the game"

    Euhm, you said it yourself; everyone is still entitled to an opinion, that implies you can't really be the judge of that opinion either or always assume that they didn't get 'it'. The player imagining things himself is a TES trademark indeed but I wouldn't exactly call that 'deep roleplaying' or even a standard to which all other Western rpg's should be judged by. It's just different, not really better.

  • Yossarian #230 6 years ago

    I have no problem with people giving it 6, it probably means they don't like RPGs, or have particular issues with this one.

    1 is just ludicrous, and clear fanboyism.

  • Tyronne #231 6 years ago

    I have only only played it for a hour and it is simply beautiful and has got to be one of this years must have titles.
    Edited by 1 at 25/03/06 @ 20:21

  • otto #232 6 years ago

    Gosh, if it's really that good I may have to pick this up for PS3. ;p

  • El_MUERkO #233 6 years ago

    I'm way up in the northen mountains fighting skeltons in a deserted castle, damn near soiled myself a dozen times, this is possibly the best game i've ever played >.

  • EGBartonFink #234 6 years ago

    Hehe dont tease em. It's just as playable with a 2 year old computer.
    But not a Mac ;)

  • ave #235 6 years ago

    Copy/pasted from a <a href=http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=11851&s tart=0>forum I frequent</a>, there are many other posts like this, but this I think eloquates it best(at least, far better than I ever could).
    'Cause I'm too lazy to figure out where else to put it. Some of this is obvious repeatery, but my commentary is always invaluable. Laughing

    Seriously, I haven't posted here in for, like, EVAR, but I figured it would be diverting to drop by and see what everyone's thinking of BethSoft's latest masterpiece. I picked it up the other day, and I was particularly relishing the thought of coming here in full fanboi regalia and telling you all that you missed the second coming of the RPG Christ - that you're all 100% wrong about Oblivion, and that history will not judge kindly your shallow oldsk00l prejudices.

    Only problem is, I'd be full of field-ripe feces.

    Before my mini-review, an apologia: I got a promotion, just cashed a new paycheck, and after finishing Avernum 4 I was itching to try any non-FPS with some extended play time. Besides, I was already in EB buying Metroid Prime: Hunters. So really, if I hadn't purchased Oblivion, the terrorists would have won.

    Also, a caveat: I liked Morrowind. It was a terrible RPG - but even as a combat-heavy adventure game with piss-poor social interaction, it suited part of my gaming style pretty well. I tend to explore every nook and cranny in the game world, and I love finding out-of-the-way caves or dungeons or canyons or mountains or whatever, and Morrowind was actually rewarding for that kind of approach. I hated the walking Wikis, I was bored by the combat, I was irritated by the idiotically-scaled monsters and the insipid quest design . . . but I got a kick out of exploring every square inch of the game world. In Tribunal, in fact, the dungeon crawling was among the best I've ever seen (outside of the ludicrously bad final dungeon).

    Without further ado, my impressions based on the first hours of the game, with the negatives first (since I know that's the only reason you're reading it anyway).

    THE BAD

    1. Draw distance and texture LOD.
    Yes, Virginia, it really and truly sucks. I was floored by the incredibly low texture quality past the LOD horizon, and some vistas which could have been magnificent end up looking laughable: they're low-quality and poorly tiled to boot, which can make that hillside across the river look about as snazzy as a preschooler's scribbles with dun-colored sidewalk chalk. On top of the execrably poor texture quality at a distance, geometry/object pop-in is a real issue. Buildings on the other side of the lake don't even draw in until you've dog-paddled halfway to their shore.

    Keep in mind that my experience is based on playing the game at 1600x1200 with everything except shadows at max. I tried the .ini tweaks mentioned in the Elder Scrolls forum, and I found them to cause a significant framerate hit on my Athlon 64 3500+ and ATI Radeon X850XT (not a bleeding-edge rig anymore, but definitely not a slouch). And they didn't really solve the problem anyway; they only moved the LOD cutoff to about 50% of my view distance, rather than 30%. There's still a lot of ugliness out there before your eyes get to the horizon.

    So, yeah - as bad as all that? Absolutely.

    I'm undecided about whether I prefer Gothic's (or Morrowind's) serious world draw-in to this mess. That draw-in is ugly, but at least you know there's something out there you can't see; in Oblivion, there might be ruins in that clearing, or it might just be another peaceful forest clearing. And it's still just as ugly as Gothic's draw-in, maybe more so. In any case, Oblivion clearly doesn't get a pass here. Moronites at the ES forums seem to like pointing out that this problem is unavoidable for such a messianic game, but c'mon already - Far Cry handled this challenge with aplomb, all of two fucking years ago. Get some real programmers, Beth.


    2. Texture quality
    The textures are disappointing, basically low-res crap wallpapered with lots of normal mapping. It honestly doesn't bother me, but please - I'm supposed to believe this is next-gen?


    3. Animation
    I don't have any complaints about the NPC and monster animations. When viewed in 3rd-person perspective, tho, the PC animations are no better than Morrowind's. And that's really, really awful, placing Oblivion in the lowest tier of premiere titles being released today. I don't get it: with all the capital flowing into a game like Oblivion, can they really not afford better than this?


    4. Automap
    The automap is extremely disappointing. Maybe I just haven't figured it out in my first hours of play, but the default scale is too close to be useful and I haven't divined how to adjust the scale. And to make it even less useful, Beth seems to have decided the automap should only record data in about a 10-foot radius around your character.

    With a scalable map and a larger mapping radius, this would have been perfect. As is, it's almost worthless.


    5. Character interaction
    The only significant improvement over Morrowind seems to be

    Wait, there's absolutely no improvement over Morrowind.

    Within the first hour of play, I'd already seen some glaring recurrences of the worst problems from Morrowind's character interaction mechanics. To whit:

    - When you invade the privacy of someone's home, they yell at you to leave. Try engaging them in conversation, tho, and their facial disposition frequently becomes a smile. Their Wiki-style responses are exactly the same whether you've just picked the lock on their door in the middle of the night or are politely questioning them on the street in broad daylight.

    - Different phrases from the same character sound as if they're voiced by different actors. This could also be a consequence of the fact that some Wiki responses sound angry while others sound exceedingly mellow, even when you've broken into an NPC's home and pocketed all of their cutlery right in front of their eyes.

    - Different responses from the same character actually contradict each other. In one response, Character X will dismissively voice her belief that Gray Fox is simply a rumor; in the very next response, she'll tell you with total credulity that the Thieves Guild is led by Gray Fox, and she'll describe him with what actually sounds like fear.

    Just as moronic are the random interactions between NPCs. Here's a pretty representative sample of the kind of stuff you'll overhear:

    Man: "Good day to you, good citizen!"
    Woman: "Hail to you!"
    Man: "I hear the Fighter's Guild is recruiting."
    Woman: "Oh!"
    Man: "Farewell to you."
    Woman: "Goodbye!"

    I'm not exaggerating the extent of the insipidity; that's an actual paraphrase from the very first inter-NPC conversation I encountered after leaving the tutorial dungeon. In fact, it's a fairly kind example when compared to some of the conversations I've overheard since then - at least it makes sense.

    If anything, Oblivion's system so far seems worse than Morrowind's, just because Beth decided to jack up the font size for the console kiddies. In other words, the character interaction is just as poorly-designed, but the ratio between content and screen real estate is now much worse.


    6. Speechcraft
    Special mention goes to the new Speechcraft minigame. I'm a native English speaker and a pretty decent writer with a few awards to my credit, but I can't even begin to imagine a vocabulary for the extent to which this minigame is utter horseshit. Besides being an incredibly stupid design idea without even a tangential relation to real social interaction (something with which most players probably have at least a modicum of real-world experience), it simply doesn't make sense.

    I think it's probably fair to suggest that the system sucks if I can't grasp it within about 5 seconds. I'm a reasonably intelligent guy, but the more important point is that this is supposed to analogize ordinary human conversation.


    7. Interface
    Oblivion's interface is a huge step backward from Morrowind's, which was already deeply flawed.

    Oblivion's interface is organized around hierarchical nesting of menus, which makes a lot of sense if you're using a console gamepad. Indeed, this is de rigeur for console menu design, and it works fine in, say, Resident Evil 4. The problem here is twofold:

    First, Beth doesn't effectively implement a good hierarchical structure. My biggest complaint is that, tho menus are hierarchically nested, you can't navigate back to the previous menu using the Esc key (or any other key that I've been able to discover); instead, you have to actually choose the "Return" option on the menu. It's frustrating as hell and imposes a totally unnecessary level of interface latency. And I assume it's not structured this way in the XBox 360 version, since the console world is basically standardized on hitting "B" to travel up (back) one menu level.

    Second, Beth is foisting a hierchical scheme on an entire user population whose UI everywhere outside of the game is spatial rather than hierarchical. I'm not saying spatial is necessarily better; I'm just saying it's what everyone uses in the non-console world, and it makes no fucking sense to force your players to use an alien organizational scheme when there's a totally effective model with which your entire fucking user base is already 100% fluent. Grow up.

    The problem is even larger than that, of course. The conflict isn't just between the Oblivion UI and that of the rest of the Windows universe; games frequently deviate from familiar mouse-driven interface, sometimes very effectively. The more significant conflict is between the way you interact with Oblivion's game world and the way you interact with Oblivion's game interface: the first is mouse-and-keyboard-driven, standard FPS fare, while the second is downright inimical to mouse use. I'm thinking of buying a wireless mouse just so I can throw it across the room every time I need to open the goddamn menu.

    It's also worth mentioning that the game offers neither interface tooltips nor the ability to name your saved games; Beth seems to have forgotten about both mice and keyboards. Oh, and they also never learned about scaling UI to higher resolutions (or they forgot that functionality since including it in Morrowind). The level of grade-school bullshit here is downright baffling.


    8. Plot
    I'm not going to get into any significant spoilers here, even tho it probably doesn't matter. But I will happily ruin the tutorial dungeon for you: just before perishing at the hands of shadowy (but laughably low-level) assassins, Emperor Patrick "Uriel" Stewarptim bequeaths to you the sacred amulet of his bloodline, to be conveyed to a secret heir. A few narrative problems become apparent if this scenario is subjected to even minor cognitive rigors:

    First, the Blades - the hand-picked bodyguards of the holy emperor who leads an entire nation - are so low-level that two of them meet their (apparently scripted) deaths at the hands of assassins whom you can dispatch with relative ease. Their equipment also happens to be only marginally better than your starting gear. In other words, the idiocy of levelled monsters is painfully obvious within the first 5 minutes of playing the game. (The only reason you can't easily save the Emperor, and thus obviate the entire fucking storyline, is that the game literally freezes your controls while a new shadowy low-level attacker emerges from a monster closet to kill him. Uh, rofl?)

    Second, the captain of the Blades is alive at the end of the fight which kills the Emperor, but he behaves as if he's just received a massive cranial trauma: he immediately trusts the Emperor's judgment in giving the Amulet of Kings to you, which is odd enough, but he also seems to think it's a good idea to send you - an escaped convict - alone into the world, with instructions to bring the Amulet to a distant town, in a nation where the emperor and all of his known heirs have been brutally assassinated and where the Amulet somehow seems to be the key to this.

    See, he has to stay behind to guard the Emperor's lifeless corpse.

    I'm not exaggerating this plot device. It really is that puerile. What strikes me most is that it didn't need to be puerile. It's not hard to cook up workaday narrative solutions for all of these plot idiocies, so I'm left with the conclusions that Beth's writers and designers are either really stupid, archly cynical about the stupidity of their audience, or simply lazy. None of those alternatives is particularly inspiring.

    One of the few things I enjoyed about Morrowind was the narrative sophistication of some of the text. Hell, the main storyline was predicated on an obscure disagreement of textual interpretation, and the lit crit in me thought that was actually kind of cool (even tho the game was totally unable to deliver an effective overall narrative). The narrative sloppiness in the first 15 minutes of Oblivion is dismaying and really dampened my desire to see how the storyline develops.


    THE GOOD

    1. Loading times
    They're a non-issue, at least on my rig. It's downright puzzling that BS chose to superimpose "Loading New Area" on the screen; if they hadn't announced it, I honestly wouldn't have noticed the loading at all, and I would have been suitably impressed with their area loading. (Contrast this with Morrowind, where even bleeding-edge rigs can stutter when every new outdoor cell is loaded.) And my hard drive setup isn't exactly tomorrow's tech; I'm running a single standard ATA drive, so I'm guessing my disk access should be pretty typical for most PCs running the game.

    Otoh, the loading times will be a major issue on any rig where they're an issue at all, because I run into a loading message on average about every 15-20 seconds in the outdoor areas.


    2. Stability
    Oblivion has been rock-solid for me, except when alt'tabbing and exiting the game.


    BOTTOM LINE: RPG?

    Noes.

    Many of the quests are more interesting than Morrowind's, and Oblivion does a better job than Morrowind at offering the same sort of "role-playing" experience that you can get from, say, Deus Ex: the freedom to approach situations differently with different character types. I'm kind of role-playing a character, and the game doesn't generally force me into situations that don't work for that character. Otoh, it also doesn't present meaningful options for different responses based on character; BG2 had much better role-playing options than this, and that's damning with faint praise. And social interaction is at least as bad as in Morrowind, which sort of pre-emptively forecloses entire role-playing approaches.

    As a stat-based, combat-heavy, exploration-focused adventure game, it's fun within its infuriating technical limitations. I'll probably enjoy it in the same way that I enjoyed Morrowind, and I don't really regret the purchase. But that doesn't mean I don't harbor genuine hatred for the game reviewers salivating over it. The inferior design elements of Oblivion are impossible to miss - they persistently interpose themselves between you and whatever positive experience you might eventually discover in parts of the game - and I can only shake my head and chalk this up as another lesson in the intellectual bankruptcy of game journalism.

    As for BethSoft designers learning lessons from Morrowind...well, turns out they were pulling our leg. Surprise!

  • Furbs #236 6 years ago

    Can I just save people some time and point out it that you've just posted is the sort of typical antifanboy rant that bores me to to tears? :)

    Summary:
    1: Wah! The graphics arent photo real!
    2: Wah! The graphics arent photo real!
    3: Wah! The graphics arent photo real!
    4: Wah! I dont like the map! I cant work out how to use it!
    5: Wah! Not all of the hundreds of NPC characters have fully fleshed out dialogues, even though they are all voiced. Anyone would think they didnt have limited time/resources/storage capacity/infinite probabability speech generator engine.
    6: Wah! I dont like the way the designers have made persuasion a bit more exciting than just relying on stats.
    7: Wah! I dont like the interface, even though most people do! Bonus points for mentioning the lack of tool tips (RTFM?) and "dumbing down for consoles).
    8: Wah! I dont like the storyline! Even though I'll only mention the opening level, which the "plot device" used is perfectly legitimate. Oh and the baddies you meet during the tutorial arent even real baddies!!!

    Conclusion! WAH!! I wanted Morrowind 2, and all I got was a new game. Why couldnt they just repackage Morrowind and sell it again. Wah!
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 02:29

  • thefilthandthefury #237 6 years ago

    That looooong post is awful, just awful. I think I disagree with about 99% of that.

  • squeakyg #238 6 years ago

    Reading the forums on the official Elder Scrolls site was an exercise in masochism.

    Filled with PC snobbery. They call Xbox 360 users "console kiddies". I've never actually heard of anyone under the age of 25 owning a 360; they're too expensive and rare for children to have obtained one.

    They dispise the way Oblivion was designed equally for the Xbox 360. "The text is large, for the console kiddies...", "The menus are designed for the joypads the console kiddies use..." I should point out that this is a 360 review right here - why are disgruntled PC gamers whingeing about the game's console suitability in *this* comments section?

    They seem confused that their average PCs can't reach maximum spec and make the game look as good as the Xbox 360 version. For such technically-minded people, it's odd that they've forgotten the concept of scalability. Perhaps the new generation has confused them - the "kiddie" console version achieving better graphics than their PC spec? Unbelievable!


    They hate the level-matching. They actually *want* to be able to cheat the system by getting hold of weapons they shouldn't have yet, and to kill everything with a single slash by level 20 like in Morrowind.

    They feel conned because the "radiant AI" isn't actually an earth-shattering improvement. One pompous thread: "I demand an official apology from Bethesda on their front page for misleading people about the radiant AI..." Here's a tip: if you actually *believe* the hyperbole of videogame previews, you should probably check your dictionary to see if "gullible" has been removed.

    Then to attack reviewers for scoring too enthusiastically. Heaven forbid a reviewer actually capture *feelings* about the game that these autistic human calculators are unable to feel. Too wrapped up in the graphics, game engine, PC elitism, and the snobbish idea that Bethesda *owes* them an experience beyond what £35 can buy a gamer.

  • UncleLou #239 6 years ago

    Oh please, the official forums are a nightmare, yes, but the 360 people there are just as bad at least. Fanboys of the worst kind that defended the game against even the most justified criticism (while the PC people there tried to discuss the game), generally eager to insult, and trolling in the tech support threads.

    The threads I saw about the UI didn't use the word "kiddy", they just stated the fact that it was designed with consoles in mind, and is not ideal for PCs. Maybe the word kiddy fell after the aforementioned 360 fanboys then stormed the thread.

    If you say "elitist", I say "inferiority complex". ;)

  • ave #240 6 years ago

    Furbs your post is positively puerile.

    Why dont you respond to the criticism(or ignore it and play the game) instead of paraphrasing it into something it isnt, just so you can easily invalidate it.

    Let's sum up this review:

    1)Wah! Oblivion has purty graphics
    2)Wah! Oblivion has big wurld
    3)Wah! Oblivion has many quests
    4)Wah! Oblivion has almost identical combat to Morrowind("Combat itself is fairly clumsy and repetitive. All you have to do is hold down the mouse button to power up your attack and then release it to take a swipe at whatever you're facing." from the Morrowind review)

    Cool, that was so easy Furbs, I'm going to follow your example in the future.

    One part I really liked was "But all this grand scope for freeform adventuring would mean little if the fundamental combat was broken from the outset, but things have improved massively since the last Elder Scrolls came out almost four years ago."
    Yet it doesnt list ANY improvements, it describes the combat/controls, but lists no improvements whatsoever.

    Or how about "Using a basic topic/question-based conversation system, you get the chance to grill almost everyone you meet, giving Oblivion the feel of one of those old-school adventures where you end up making progress almost as much by being plain nosey and inquisitive as your actions. This might frustrate the type of gamer that just wants to wade in and kill everything, but for the investigative gamer who admires storytelling, interaction and questing, all of this is instantly intoxicating stuff."
    Yes, most of the NPC's having a single selectable topic of conversation(rumours) certainly is intoxicating interaction/role playing.


    PS, I'm enjoying the game enough that I'm buying a new motherboard/7900gt mainly for this, but the free handjob Oblivion is getting everywhere pisses me off, and it'll just encourage Bethesda to make Fallout 3 a futuristic Oblivion.
    Edited by 2 at 26/03/06 @ 04:04

  • widow88 #241 6 years ago

    Ryuken, look to the review posted by ave. Some people don't understand or get it as I said earlier. This is a game of massive ambition and scope. To those that pick it apart makes you out for what you really are, someone who is incapable of appreciating 5 years work of a game with massive ambition and of such massive scale and scope that it is easy prey for the fanactics that look to try and chop the legs from under it. Cry me a river and all I will do is hand you a tissue.

  • Zem63 #242 6 years ago

    I've always preferred playing first person games on pc,with keyboard/mouse,so bought the pc version.Enjoyed the tutorial,was disappointed with my first sight of the outside and struggled to get a decent framerate with my setup.

    Decided to buy 360 version to comapre the experience and found that the graphics engine seems to suit a (non-digital) tv screen,the framerate is pretty decent and the game is very playable with the 360 controller.As a diehard pc gamer i'm enjoying the "console" experience,so much so i'm 6 or 7 hours further into the game on 360.

    So i have to decide now,am i a pc fanboy or a console kiddie?

  • karlidog #243 6 years ago

    BOTTOM LINE: RPG?

    Noes.


    OTHER BOTTOM LINE: GAME?

    Erm... yeses.

    You are never going to get a role-playing experience that rivals a good pen-and-paper session in a videogame. Not. Ever. You are never going to get a completely immersive second life in a rich and varied fantasy world in a videogame. You've never had one, and the supposed RPGs you look back on fondly will inevitably seem even more limited than something like Oblivion to someone playing them without the benefit of +1 Rose Tinted Glasses of Self-Delusion. You, and the rest of the people whining for 'realistic RPGs' from the games industry, are likely hoping for something that the majority of gamers would find incredibly tedious, unfair, monolithically slow-paced and generally utterly without merit.

    What videogames can offer you is a relatively immersive, extremely visually appealing adventure with shallow character interaction but involving combat, and with enormous scope for genuine exploration of a carefully-constructed world and kleptomaniacal stuff-gathering. Apparently you don't like that sort of thing, which is fair enough, but criticising something like Oblivion for failing to be your dream immersive RPG is like shouting at your dog for not being enough of a cat.

  • ave #244 6 years ago

    "This is a game of massive ambition and scope. To those that pick it apart makes you out for what you really are, someone who is incapable of appreciating 5 years work of a game with massive ambition and of such massive scale and scope that it is easy prey for the fanactics that look to try and chop the legs from under it. Cry me a river and all I will do is hand you a tissue."

    So because the game is a big scale and been in development a long time, it's automatically good? Great argument there, I bet you'll just love Duke Nukem Forver.

    Karlidog, I'm sorry, compare dialogue/story/interaction/choices and the effects of your choices in Oblivion, with Planescape Torment(Yeah, that game had shit dialogue and roleplaying, its all rose tinted glasses), Arcanum or Fallout, hell even rpg-lites like BG2/Bloodlines/Deus Ex.
    Then come back and repeat that with a straight face.

    Also, go read Pete Hines/Todd Howards hype about the RPG elements, and come back and rant about bastards wanting more roleplaying elements in Oblivion, because apparently even Bethesda employees wanted it too.

    If you only want action/exploration games fine, but dont just plain make up "facts" like "There cant be roleplaying computer games"
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 06:02

  • Drakron #245 6 years ago

    No but we can mimic it to a point.

    PS:T was excellent in pulling emotions of the players and we are talking heavy text based here ... unfortunatly it seens "Next Gen" had the writters replaced by programers so games start to fault because those people are not artists, they have a complete lack of artistic sense.

  • ave #246 6 years ago

    If you want to see how I believe Immersion should be done, read <a href=http://ww w.escapistmagazine.com/issue/37/14>this</a>.

    Immersion for me is in the little details as much as it is in having a world with 36 square miles.

  • PhatCat #247 6 years ago

    I think your opinion of this game is dependent on the hardware used. It runs like a dog on my PC, so I would love to play it on the 360 to get a better perspective, but ,as it is, I find it hard to enjoy due to the wild variation in FPS.
    Edited by 2 at 26/03/06 @ 08:14

  • Genji #248 6 years ago

    ave,

    Hey, at least you can explain why you don't like it all that much. Methinks, however, you should be playing it a little more before coming to any concrete conclusions. Then you could write a reader review or something. Then you might stop getting all the straw man arguments from Furbs and such.

    I haven't played this yet, so could someone explain what the "level-matching" concept is? Is it monsters levelling up as your character levels up? That sounds like a capital idea, I must say.

  • EGBartonFink #249 6 years ago

    As Genji said why not do a reader review, ave?
    Edited by 2 at 26/03/06 @ 10:40

  • Freki #250 6 years ago

    "Special mention goes to the new Speechcraft minigame. I'm a native English speaker and a pretty decent writer with a few awards to my credit, "

    Well, you certainly couldn't tell that from his "review".

    Wasn't a huge fan of Morrowind so I wasn't going to buy Oblivion, however my wife loved Morrowind saw Oblivion and demanded that I get it. At least it gives her something to play while the little one is alseep.

  • EGBartonFink #251 6 years ago

    Yea review probably is stretching it a bit diatribe is probably a better description. Seriously he should do a reader review then we will have one place to pull it apart.

  • Genji #252 6 years ago

    Oh, come on. At least give it a serious read before you call it a "diatribe". Then you might be able to argue against the points in it instead of burning straw men, making fun of his writing style, and whatnot.

    It's refreshing to see different viewpoints on a game, and his has been the best-expressed of them so far. Give him a chance.

    I'll be looking forward to the reader review.

  • EGBartonFink #253 6 years ago

    Soz Genji it's the dictionary definition of the word.
    I did give it a serious read and it's still a diatribe. I look forward to the reader review.

  • widow88 #254 6 years ago

    ave, Post your comments on a hardcore forum like http:/ /www.ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=88649 and see what the reaction is. I'm not going to dignify them. Your talking about immersion which is very subjective and therefore you have no point. From my perspective there's not much for me to argue with you about since I'm enjoying the game and it seems the majority of the people, if not all in that massive thread on the forum on which I like to frequest are also.

    This is a rather unique RPG since it's basically a single player MMORPG. How you develop your skills directly correlates into how you can interact in the game world. You will not find anyone mining experince points.

    If you haven't noticed the reviews for Oblivion have been GTA caliber, another less than perfect game but which has attracted many fans. GTA is the game of which you should be drawing comparisons even though it is not an RPG. Sandbox games of which both are apart are a different breed. They are easy to criticize but their critical success both as recognized achievemnets in design and their success in the marketplace as dictated by the consumer speak volumes. Linking to some innocuous RPG or comparing Oblivion to Planescape:Torment, a wonderful but totally differnt type of game does little.

    About the leveling system:

    The leveling system allows the difficulty of NPCs and monsters to scale as your character levels. In Morrowind people got too powerful too fast and the challenge was none. Not the case here. What's important is that you level by leveling your skills. That is to say you don't level by gaining experience points. By leveling your skills you develop new abilities expanding the ways to which you can approach any situation. So the fact that you may have the same challenge at level 1 and at level 25 is reasonable to keep the combat eventful and so that you don't turn into some superman. At higher levels you now have the skills to deal with a situation in many different ways thus opening up the gameplay probabilities. Since you level by exercising your 7 major skills the chioces that you make at the beginning of the game are of course vitally important and have reprecussions later on.
    Edited by 3 at 26/03/06 @ 10:24

  • Genji #255 6 years ago

    Guys... none of us have a life. I sure as hell don't. Do you have more of a life if you use hundreds of hours of it to play Oblivion?

    Also, ave didn't insult anyone in his post. You're not helping me see your point if you feel the need to call him names to prove it. His only crime is disagreeing with majority opinion.

    And that's really not a crime.

    Enough with the insults, already.

  • EGBartonFink #256 6 years ago

    Who is calling names? Calling it a diatribe I would have thought was fairly accurate. I don't think there is anything wrong with it, it's a subjective view on what ave thinks of the game and he is entitled to his view. That's why I will be looking forward to a reader review

  • Ryuken #257 6 years ago

    "Ryuken, look to the review posted by ave. Some people don't understand or get it as I said earlier. This is a game of massive ambition and scope. To those that pick it apart makes you out for what you really are, someone who is incapable of appreciating 5 years work of a game with massive ambition and of such massive scale and scope that it is easy prey for the fanactics that look to try and chop the legs from under it. Cry me a river and all I will do is hand you a tissue. "

    Hmm, widow88, in your last post you are already contradicting yourself by saying that Oblivion should be compared to GTA rather than to the 'real' golden rpg's of the past decade while you previously say it is a roleplaying game. I think that the 'fantasy GTA'-comparison and the sp mmo'rpg' label is definitely something everyone agrees on, so, that doesn't make it a bad game at all, only a bad traditional rpg. It also doesn't mean that criticisers don't enjoy it, it's only a conflict about what genre Oblivion belongs to.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 19:07

  • Genji #258 6 years ago

    @EGBartonfink

    Wasn't directed at you so much. Sorry if it sounded like that.

  • kangarootoo #259 6 years ago

    My take on Oblivion thus far. Played it for way to many hours yesterday and loved it to bits. Sure its gota few minor issues, but I found I just wanted to keep playing and thats a really good sign.

    To take Black and GTA:SA as examples, I can't play these games ad infinitum as they just do something eventualy to annoy me into switching them off, only returning later when my patience has been restored.

    Oblivion gave me none of that. I would have happily kept going till I starved to death.

    A note for left handers, the controls setup makes no mentioned of southpaw support at all BUT it happily picks up your system stick settings from the 360 dashboard so left hander suport is actually there.

    I'm loath to get into this thread discussion as it seems to have all gone a bit wrong. So can I make a general point. RPG games are sort of a niche thing. Some people love them, some poeple get bored to tears by them. Can we all agree thats its reasonable to say that the 10/10 review score is not realy for people who don't like western RPGs, but for people who love them (like me). I mean, if you don't like cake, Cake Lovers magazine isn't going to rock your boat is it? It seems obviously really, doesn't it?

    Please people, likers and haters of this game, by all means write reader reviews and then we all get to see what worked for you and what didn't. But keep in mind, if it reads like a rant no-one will take it seriously or probably even get to the end.

    EDIT: Typos I can't be bothered to find and correct.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 11:14

  • kangarootoo #260 6 years ago

    "I had a goblin run at me with arrows all over him still very alive,so I just sticked to the sword"

    I love that sort of little detail. After getting properly skewered by an enemy bowman I took a look at my character in the Journal screen and removing his body armour showed two arrows sticking out of his back and one right through his left shoulder. Little details like this aren't important of course, but they make me smile.

  • UncleLou #261 6 years ago

    Many points I don't agree with, but ave (or the one who wrote it originally) certainly is right about the social interaction. Oblivion is very, very weak in that respect, and if this is one of the points very important for you, I can see how Oblivion is a big disappointment. Compare it with Vampire: Bloodlines in that respect, and weep. But that's the price of having 1200 NPCs, probably.

  • Kiigan #262 6 years ago

    Fruit_Salad said: "Certainly not graphically."

    Well, as you know I wasn't talking about graphics. I was talking about play, specifically. However if I was to comment on the visuals, I would simply describe them as "inconsistent". Some areas are quite beautiful and detailed, as people here have noted. On the other hand, some areas are rather unfinished and ugly. Shadow of the Colossus did a better job of creating a consistently beautiful world in my humble opinion.

    Fruit_Salad also said: "But, that wouldn't have been an Elder Scrolls game. I think you're missing the point here abit. From what you've said there you'd be much happier with a smaller, much more condensed third person fighting game, than a stunningly massive realised buzzling sandbox world with an excellent story."

    Generally I'd prefer a better game instead of sacrificing quality for quantity. I'd rather 10 hours of great play than 1000 hours of mediocre play. GTA Vice City was 3 times bigger than GTAIII, but it didn't need to be - it was just more places to put hidden packages. The scale of it means nothing to me - I'm not an MMO player, I don't have unlimited amounts of free time to spend on a videogame, but when I do have time to devote to a game like this, I'd like the game to be entertaining, refined, well-realised, with a good story. Time and time again in this thread, the enthusiasts come back to the word "massive" - but to me the scale of it just isn't that important. Clearly I am not the only one who feels that way - why else would there be the "quick travel" option on the map?

    Anyway. I like the game, I'm enjoying it, and I'm glad so many of you are too. I'm just not as taken with it as many of you. I wasn't a big fan of Morrowind either - I found it equally clunky, unpolished and badly-written.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 12:00

  • ytzulu #263 6 years ago

    no ones gonna read this but hey... i just got to say it....
    BUY THIS FRIKKIN GAME....ITS BRILLIANT.....thast being siad...
    woudnt quite give it a ten. 8 or 9 maybey, the graphic 'flaws'and frame rates killin me (v 360)
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 12:16

  • Pike #264 6 years ago

    So far I have to agree with UncleLou. Character interaction and emotional impact doesen't seem to be Bethesda's strengths. As good as the rest of the game is, atm, that is one area where they lag behind Bioware and Obsidian.

    Maybe they could pick up a few writers who worked at VtM:B, now that Troika has dissapered.
    Edited by 2 at 26/03/06 @ 16:52

  • Pablo2k5 #265 6 years ago

    Quote from Fruit_Salad... "I wonder when people are having a pop at the graphics, its because they are running the PC version on a not so 'up to the task' PC."

    You wish... the graphics SUCK (imo) on my GF 7800 GTX 512 meg running at 1280x1024 with HDR and everything on high. The frame-rate is OK but the game looks ugly (imo) comapred to other PC games.

    Note - The foliage pop-up is only a problem on my machine when running without HDR enabled. With HDR the foliage fades in rather nicely actually.

  • BremXJones #266 6 years ago

    Note that Ave is quoting from *RPGCodex*.

    It's not really a place well known for any form of balanced discussion on a game.

    KG

  • SeesThroughAll #267 6 years ago

    Got it yesterday for my jurassic PC, and am LOVING IT. It is much better than Morrowind, especially in the quests department. Great stuff.

    /goes back at exploring

  • asphaltcowboy #268 6 years ago

    God I want this game so much, but i will fail my degree if I buy it before June! My housemate is already regretting buying it for the same reason - but seeing him play just makes me want to more! The horror!

  • Feanor #269 6 years ago

    FF12 is better!

    For some people, anyway. :)

  • widow88 #270 6 years ago

    This can be GTA like and an RPG at the same time. I'm not contradicting myself. You could make an RPG out of GTA if you really wanted to.

    The graphics are breath taking. Sure there's some issues but damn I was just in this town (starts with an S in the west) and I left the town and went to the neighboring castle. To do this I had to cross a bridge which overlooked the town. Breath taking (360 version). I have trouble understanding how anyone can say the game *is* ugly.

  • widow88 #271 6 years ago

    Some nice panoromic shots.

    http://www.panogam es.com/oblivion/


    edit: you can zoom in and out and rotate the pictures.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 19:05

  • Perrythegreat #272 6 years ago

    People

    Quick question. Have an old PC (2.5 yrs). Thing is that I am PC dumb, and want to know whether my system can handle the game (don't mind if I have turn some features off etc).

    I do not know even how to check my system. All I have is this:

    Display: Radeon IGP 345M
    Chip: ATI RS200M
    DAC type: Internal DAC (350MHz)
    Approx total memory: 64mb

    I'm assuming the answer is no, but I do not know what the above actually means. As its almost 3 years old thinking it is not good enough. Simple yes or no would be fine

    Thanks

  • Rambaldi #273 6 years ago

    This is so funny. The gaming world gets a real gem and all we get is "RPGs are shit and boring" and "It's been dumbed down for consoles, Bethesda have deserted the PC hardcore"

    GET A LIFE GUYS

    Yes it's boring..if you don't like RPGs, but you could apply that logic to EVERYTHING in life, which kind of makes the point redundant to begin with.

    And PC gamers...yes your days are numbered. Why SHOULD developers have to fuck around testing and supporting a game for a plethora of hardware permutations, when one (very powerful one) will do?

    Think about it: new graphics card, motherboard and RAM, or a 360 that will be truly put through it's paces over coming years instead of that new graphcs card being superceeded in 6 months.

    Face it..a PC is tool (and a great one at that) but as far as being a games platfrom, it's selling points are becoming increasingly marginalised.

    EDIT: There's a fine line between trolling (WTF does that MEAN anyways?) and brutal honesty
    Edited by 2 at 26/03/06 @ 19:07

  • UncleLou #274 6 years ago

    And PC gamers...yes your days are numbered.

    /yawn

    Go trolling somewhere else.

  • Ryuken #275 6 years ago

    Rambaldi, your words really don't make much sense. I am not the all powerful forecaster here but I'll eat my shoes if PC gaming gets squashed by the "next-generation" of video consoles.

    I don't want to imply that a game (like Oblivion f.e.) can't be better on a console, it's just that for the PC-platform there are more than enough genres you won't find (as good) on consoles. Now that's honesty (not even being brutal actually ;) ).

    Anyway, is there a PC-review of this game in the works too?

  • Tomo #276 6 years ago

    I'm absolutely loving Oblivion so far. never played an Elder Scrolls and don't play too many beardy RPGs, but that 10/10 made me buy it instantly. I've plunged about 7 hours into it without even realising.

    As for ave's post - I'd say a lot of it is fair cop. The tutorial with the puny Blades was a bit daft and there are niggles with graphics, the map being too zoomed in. But fucking hell, if you are going to nit-pick at those things you really need to get out more!

    It's like finding as many flaws as you can in the Sistine Chapel ceiling or something.

  • Clive_Dunn #277 6 years ago

    I'm a cynical old bastard at times, always worried that games developers and publishers are only ever going to put tons of cash into dumbed down, mass market drivel ( /casts Paddington Bear hard stare at EA et al ).

    I've waited for a game like this for a long time - it's a huge, sprawling, high end, niche market RPG with fantastic production values. In short it's pretty much everything the games industry shies away from - high cost / high risk = stay well clear for most publishers and developers.

    I think this is one of the most daring games released in a long, long time. I'm so happy to see that there are some people out there still willing to take a chance. IMO every gamer should be forced to buy it at gunpoint.

  • Pablo2k5 #278 6 years ago

    As regards the graphics being ugly, well, to PC users with top end systems then of course it does pale in comparison to other PC games (certainly on the texture front)....
    BUT, console users who've had to put up with low res crap have finally got a game that compares to PC graphics.

    Not 'Next Generation' in my opinion JUST 'Current generation'...

    PS - Rambaldi said "PC gamers...yes your days are numbered" LOL. Excuse me while I return to BF2, FEAR and CIV4... LOL!
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 20:23

  • UncleLou #279 6 years ago

    Well, I am a PC gamer and I think Oblivion looks absolutely fantastic. Looks like there's a problem with your rig.



    This thread is beginning to make me sick.

  • madcrazy #280 6 years ago

    Judging by the amount of comments so far, even those complaining seem to like the game and so can only nitpick on the smaller issues. Definitely worthy of a 10 in my opinion, but who are those idiots putting 1 on the Reader's Opinion voting, I bet they haven't even played the game.

  • tengu #281 6 years ago

    The bits inside the Oblivion gates are starting to get a bit dull here. Am I going to be repeating these same bits through the entire game?

  • Asundai #282 6 years ago

    Haven't read this review yet but 10/10 no way, not with the ridiculously bad level scaling system (choose the wrong major skills and you'll prob have to abandon your character eventually), dodgy AI, really poor distance textures and and various other problems.

    It's a good game, but there are quite a few obvious issues that should've been fixed allready.

  • Bitkari #283 6 years ago

    and PC gamers...yes your days are numbered. Why SHOULD developers have to fuck around testing and supporting a game for a plethora of hardware permutations, when one (very powerful one) will do?

    Why? In a nutshell: Lower development costs, fewer politics, more publishing options.

    Sure, consoles benefit from a predetermined hardware platform, support from console licensor, and the implied lounge environment, but PC games have been made as long as PCs have existed and will continue to do so for a while yet, hombre.


  • widow88 #284 6 years ago

    The scaling system is not ridiculously bad and it actually works and keeps the combat interesting. It makes sense. True if you combine the wrong major skills you'll have a problem but the whole point is you can be what you want.

    disc; first time I ever saw anyone advocate fogging.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 23:31

  • widow88 #285 6 years ago

    Oh god, SOTC? You know I registered yesterday but now I'm sorry I did.
    Edited by 1 at 26/03/06 @ 23:44

  • Asundai #286 6 years ago

    Well the way the scaling is at the moment for most people the game actually gets harder as you level up. That shouldn't be happening... i mean, this is an RPG, levelling up should be a *good* thing.

  • ilmaestro #287 6 years ago

    Feanor - having got Oblivion on Thursday but not played it yet because of FFXII, I can definitely say that FFXII is better in every way.

    ;)

  • ToeWars #288 6 years ago

    I made a glib comment about the framerate earlier - gods, much earlier - in this thread because I felt that a game that had essentially been touted on it's screenshots was guilty of an abject betrayal of it's audience when it ultimately realised those images as little more than an interactive slideshow.

    Breath.

    Then I played it.

    It reminded me of why I started playing computer games in the first place and, considering my first system was a Dragon 32, it wasn't the graphics. Not that the graphics on Oblivion are bad, oh no.

    True, there are visual compromises all over the place and I still think that they really REALLY should have gotten it running better on a 360. Also true, just about everything Ave wrote. Remember though, he's upgrading his PC to play it more/better, so perhaps he just likes to complain :-)

    Ultimately, those of us who are into this stuff really don't care.

    It's not perfect. Perhaps it's not the utopia we thought we were getting. Perhaps... But by golly it's bloody good fun. Surely, SHIRLEY, that's the point?

    Borgath. Nord bard, +3 bad hair day.

  • elchuppa #289 6 years ago

    Ok has anybody been playing this game as a Monk?
    I was suggested this class at the end of the tutorial and took it. The game says they should fight with their fists and with a bow, but I've found that I get my ass kicked unless I have a weapon equipped, and the bow will get one shot off (if I'm lucky) before the attacker is right on top of me.
    So in the end I've been fighting with a sword and magic, and I'm wondering what the hell I'm a monk for. Anybody got any clues as to the best way to play as the monk character class?

  • SlackMaster #290 6 years ago

    I wasn't sure what to expect from Oblivion after playing the original game on the XBox but I was hoping for good things. Been holding off getting a 360 but might have to get one now.

  • siro #291 6 years ago

    Perrythegreat: No, not sufficient. (At least not with graphics turned on)

  • Dizzy #292 6 years ago

    "Feanor - having got Oblivion on Thursday but not played it yet because of FFXII, I can definitely say that FFXII is better in every way. "

    It had to happen.. someone had to drag in FF...

    I am not even gonna comment on that... Apples and oranges dude... apples and oranges.

  • oerhoert #293 6 years ago

    <em>Note that Ave is quoting from *RPGCodex*.

    It's not really a place well known for any form of balanced discussion on a game.

    KG</em>

    And this is not really a nice way to answer his arguments, now is it? I think you're being a bit cheap here.

    I've only been playing the game for about three hours myself, but it's already apparent that they should have used more time on optimizing the 360 version, as well as on better animation.

    I don't think it's really convincing to say that Oblivion is such a special kind of game that its writing can't be compared to that of for example Planescape: Torment or for that matter Outcast. It can, and it should. I found the writing in the introductory sequence quite engaging, and that's exactly why the clumsy storytelling during the tutorial grates so much as it does.

    Still quite a good game, of course.
    Edited by 2 at 27/03/06 @ 10:21

  • #294 6 years ago

    "The graphics are breath taking. Sure there's some issues but damn I was just in this town (starts with an S in the west) and I left the town and went to the neighboring castle. To do this I had to cross a bridge which overlooked the town. Breath taking (360 version). I have trouble understanding how anyone can say the game *is* ugly. "

    The exact same thing happened to me - that viw is astonishing!

    20 hours in, after 2 or so days - and that stat alone should be some measure of how good this game is.
    I see no merit in any of the posts on this forum made by (i) people who havent played it at all and (ii) people who have played it less than 5 hours.

    The RPG elements really come into it about 18 hours in, where you start to realise the consequences of your charachter choices (the skill set choice being the most cruicial - which is why you can create one I guess).

    After 20 hours I haven't even done the first core quest, and I've not had a dull moment yet - surely a testrament to a remarkable game. There are things to do anywhere and everywhere - just running around is playing the game.

    I won't focus on the graphics/technology as I believe this has almost not nothing to do with what a game really is - but suffice to say bar some framerate dips and the texture scaling it looks and feels amazing. Can't afford a horse yet, but I can't wait for that. The view described above is perhaps the most beautiful I've ever seen in a game. As for game mechanics, the dual stick FP slashing works for me - responsive and well layed out at the default. For those bothered, I think you can individually map the controls to you suiting.

    If you like having your hand held while playing through a game then maybe this isn't for you. But once you get the hang of the 'b' menus (360) you become the master of your own destiny and they game opens up. Multiple quest on the go? - why not. I wonder what's in those mountains? - Go there. What's Kvatch like I wonder - let's see. Once you wrap your brain around this mentality and stop worrying about "how do i complete this game" or "how can I do everything" then it becomes an absolute pleasure to play - a real joy.

    Personally I wouldn't have dared to post without 15 hours of actual gameplay under my belt for this kind of game. Conversly I got GRAW done in 10h or so. In fact, after getting into this, it's hard to rate games like GRAW well at all. Only HL2 (on xbox I'm afraid) compares in terms of sheer joy in the game experience. Yes the voice acting can be a little strange at times, with odd lines every now and again, but generally it's above average and considering it's all voice acted (admittedly with duplicates, but still) it's a remarkable achievement.

    Yes, daunting, and for some alien, but when you get your head round to the style of play and get to grips with the menus and the way the stats work (all explained the the manual very well if you read it after playing for a bit) it becomes a real treat.
    For all it's shortcomings, this is well within what I think is the top 5% of games made, if not top 2% - and therefore, barring being able to give 97%, we round up, and award 10.

    To those who gave it a 1 - get lives. This game is so far from a 1, even if you don't like it.

    PS - someone wanted to know how to heal those red stats - go to a chapel (found in any town) and pray at the main alter. There's other stuff in the chapel you may want to look at, but I want to avoid spoilers if I can - sorry if this is a spoiler!
    PPS - someone said they couldn't play in 1st person because the dungeon was too claustrophobic - that's the point of a dungeon! Bar the odd time I want to see what I look like/what I have equipped I'm always in 1st person - it really is the most immersive way to play. But go with whatever you like though - it's ridiculously easy to switch between them.

    /after reading 300 odd posts, feels a bit ill.
    /Just what does the grab button do?

  • Furbs #295 6 years ago

    If you have something that "swings" (like those spiked things on chains) you can grab them and swing them. I'm sure theres more uses though. I did try to grab a dead body but it barely moved - I think my strength may not have been high enough though.

  • tengu #296 6 years ago

    You can drag dead bodies all over if you want. I've dragged a couple over the edge of cliffs for a laugh(haha see them crumple!). Don't know if strength has anything to do with it, just don't move too quick while you're dragging them.

    Also fun is using grab to scatter books on the shelves, or pick up a plate on a stacked dinner table and use it to sweep everything else off the table.

    Silly perhaps, but the little touches add to the fun don't they?

  • #297 6 years ago

    Re Grab
    Wow, now that is cool!
    Can't wait to finish work and try dragging things! Perhaps I'll go to the arena and after I've dispatced another pitiful apponent I'll drag him around a bit in sheer mockery and listen as the crowds roar their approval! It is the little things it's true - I almost posted a list of them in my previous post, but held off. Yes, there are lots of them.
    BTW the manual tells you how to try and stop a friend attacking you (if you hit a friendly by accident in battle they can take it personally) which is very useful at times - I wish I'd known it before, as I re-did a quest just because of this. It also has a lot of other useful stuff in - i fully recommend it.

  • Fatfish #298 6 years ago

    I'm not here to argue whether the 360 version is superior to that of the PC. Nor am I here to argue whether Oblivion is a true RPG or just an action/adventure with levelling.

    The fact of the matter is, everyone is entitled to their opinion - if you like it, then great. If you loathe it, then bad luck and lets hope something else comes your way that you do enjoy. The bottom line is, this game is flawed in many minor ways, but when viewed as a whole, it's a great experience - if it's your cup of tea. If it's not, then no matter what is said, you won't enjoy it.

    @ Ave - does it really require a leather bound, 3 tome dissection and critique on your views of the game to honestly say your not enjoying it? No - see, I just did it in 4 words - you're not enjoying it - ok, so 5 if you count the apostrophed 'you are'. What really annoys me about your post, is how quick you are to sing your own praises regarding your so called 'literary' skills, and yet your style of writing is that of a teenager who has only a rudimentary grasp of the English language and who relies on Word thesaurus to provide alternatives to make themselves sound 'more cleverer' than they actually are. Whilst your use of the English languauge is not strictly incorrect (for the most part), your grammar and sentence syntax is absolutely awful and makes reading your post a chore - not to mention the length. I'm not disputing you've won literary awards - but does 'Letter of the Month' from Take A Break magazine really count?!?

    My advice would be to shorten your post, take life less seriously and buy a different game if you don't like Oblivion. Oh, and remeber, it's a f*cking game - it's not real life. Of course their's going to be issues in a project this big - exactly what were you expecting from the developers? Photorealistic graphics, with a 35 mile real-time draw distance, dynamic lighting, real physics and an AI system so effective and complex that it will one day awaken, become aware of it's own sentience, realise that man's struggle for existence is futile and then attempt to end it by instigating WW3 a la War Games via your 2mb broadband link?? Tit.
    Edited by 1 at 27/03/06 @ 11:23

  • MrChuckles #299 6 years ago

    Well, i got it on my PC on Saturday, runs like a dream, except the 6-7 crashes i have had. Then again, it is an Elder Scrolls game and they have always been bugged to hell.

    Strange thing is i don;t mind, the loading times are so much shorter than on Morrowind that i lose about 30 secs and am back in again.

    Yeah, the combat is still shoddy (but better than Morrowind), but my biggest issues have now gone (The stupid journal, and the no idea where you are supposed to go next) to put it blunty, this is probably the best hardcore RPG ever made. (Even maybe better than Baldur's Gate 2!).

    Sure, loads of people will hate it's gfx (just because they aren't right up with FPS's), but to get the visual look it has AND have all the amazing depth and the HUGE content is amazing.

    Truly awesome. And with the cool mod tools expect an almost limitless number of adventures to come out for it.

    Obviously some people don't like hardcore RPG's, and to those people i say 'don't get it', just for the same reason i won't ever get Shadow of The Colossus because i don't like platform games, even though it is the greatest platformer ever.

    Anyway, everyone at work who has it, loves it, and we all work in the games industry, so we are picky bastards.

  • #300 6 years ago

    I just realised my beloved 331st post will never get read.
    *sobs*

    PS can we hold off on the grammar police - if it's readable it's ok by me. If it's not readable, I tend to just ignore it. (is readable even a word!?!)
    Edited by 1 at 27/03/06 @ 11:43

  • BremXJones #301 6 years ago

    Oerhort: "And this is not really a nice way to answer his arguments, now is it? I think you're being a bit cheap here. "

    No, it wasn't and yes, it was.

    Was about as nice as I could get, however. I don't really consider the sort of RPG-fanboy arguments worth dealing with, and honestly thought it worthwhile for people who didn't know what RPG codex was like to be told what sort of environment the comments are from.

    That is, a very whiny one. You'd have easily been able to find a post on RPG codex, just as elaborately and angrily written, on any of the "good" games the post cited. It's what they do.

    You have no idea how many insults I had to delete from this post to try and appear calm.

    KG

  • Stickman #302 6 years ago

    "does 'Letter of the Month' from Take A Break magazine really count?!?"

    lol, excellent! Or should I say outstanding, brilliant, exceptional, first-rate, admirable, superb, tremendous, poor (Antonym)?

  • krudster #303 6 years ago

    All I know is: even the best games ever made seem to offend people in some way. This one's no different.

    It's exactly the same with any entertainment medium - it seems the better something is (certainly, the more *popular* it is), the more some people go out of their way to find fault with it. I'm not sure if this makes them feel better, or whether they simply do it to wind the fans up (by the way, I'm not guilty of this!).

    Who knows?

    The fact that Oblivion is a game in the hardest of hardcore genres means we also have to put up with some of the most anal discussions possible. It's not possible to simply enjoy something, is it?

    The funniest thing is, certain people seem to be spending more time composing huge rambling diatribes than actually playing the game - madness!

  • El_MUERkO #304 6 years ago

    I accidently head shotted a guard and he was not impressed, 'hey I'm on your side' he said with arrow thru his head like one of the comedy ones, funny stuff

    those three sisters in the farm house would soooo virtually get it

  • InfiniteFury #305 6 years ago

    I can't pray in the chapels to heal effects as I've been a naughty boy apparently. I need to repent for my sins and my crimes according to the messages but I have no bounty on my head.

    Does anyone know how to fix this please?

  • SirScratchalot #306 6 years ago

    I´m sort of in two minds about this game. It does what it does very well but it also has a lot of niggles that really pull me out of the experience. The speechcraft game being one. I´ve learned to accept it for what it is though and to detatch myself a bit from the narrative and instead revel in the magnificent improvments since morrowind - meaning quests that are actually fun and involving to play. Also I find the graphics for lack of a better word, schizophrenic. But there´s such a breadth of things to see and do that I can´t but forgive it. It´s not Planescape Torment or Fallout but instead truly improves upon the old daggerfall formula. Pherhaps one day there will be a perfect mixture of tight narrative and freedom. Until then Oblivion will do very nicely and it might actually last me until DNF is released.

  • kangarootoo #307 6 years ago

    Wow, the fact this thread is so huge has to be testament to something regarding this game. I'm sure Bethesda are delighted (edit: in general I mean, they may not even be aware of this thread :) ).

    Regarding the grab function, I find it very handy when setting off tripwire traps in dungeons using items other than my own head :)

    @InfiniteFury

    Is there anything about that in your journal? It sounds a bit like a quest introducer to me. Might be off the mark though.


    @elchuppa
    I find the bow to be outstanding when used in conjucntion with the sneak ability. 6x damage from sneaky shots (the bow-drawn posture changes to show this is in effect) will drop many opponents in one go. Plus, Oblivion supports extra damage for headshot, so aim those shorts carefull for better effect. When you get your marksman skill up to journeyman you can zoom in when aiming too (for the many that, quite reasonably, can't be arsed to read the manual).

    I was suspicious of handto-hand as a combat method, as a lot of posh weapons bring magical abilities too. Hand-to-hand can't do this unless there are posh gauntlets out there or something. If you aren't too far into the game you might consider a restart?

    As far as starting up the game, I've never taken a stock class and I don't think I would. Custom classes give you much better control, even if you only tweak one or two of the major classes (as I did, given the Thief class didn't give me exactly what I wanted).
    Edited by 1 at 27/03/06 @ 13:53

  • dllord #308 6 years ago

    One of the best games ever made! Thats all i have to say!

  • Fatfish #309 6 years ago

    @ Stickman: LOL. Shucks - thanks! I seem to remember our last discussion wasn't quite so conducive - glad to see there's no grudge. :)

    Apart from the minor issues with regard to the frame rate and pop-up (at least on the 360 version), what other improvements would people like to see?

    Personally, I'd like to have a bit more life in the city/settlements. Although they're huge and there's quite a bit to see and do, the streets and surrounding areas always seem a little empty. Apart from a handful of guards and local residents milling around during the day, there's not a lot else. You would have expected there to be open air markets, perhaps events in the gardens or crowds in the streets - instead, it's maybe 5 or 6 people walking up and down these huge boulevards periodically disappearing in to doors. I know that most are running on a scripted routine and actually play part of a quest of some sort, but some back ground filler wold have given the urban areas much more life.

    The only other thing I'd liked to have seen was the option to have more than one character running in the quest at any one time. How good would it have been to be able to switch between characters and take your quest/adventuring in a different direction? Perhaps have them all waiting at a local inn sat around the fire. The quests should remain the same though - not sharing the overall quest between the different characters, but allowing them to complete each quest independently. As it stands, if you want more than one character, you have to save it seperately. Ok, only a minor thing, but it would have been nice.
    Edited by 1 at 27/03/06 @ 14:27

  • JediMasterMalik #310 6 years ago

    IF YOU DON'T LIKE THE GAME SHIT UP I DO AND THAT'S ENOUGH FOR ME. :p

    The graphics are great and combat is fun. If you've got a crap rig blame that not the game. The dialogue is good with player interaction and the quests are very oroginal imo.

  • Glitch #311 6 years ago

    The best game I have ever played. Best game of the year.

    I cant get over how open the game is! you could play this game for 15hours and not go down the same path once! its sooooo good!

    Only problem I have is stealing, when I stole a sword, I walked around without a problem, then fast travelled to a city to look for a guild and was stopped by 3 guards for theifing.

  • #312 6 years ago

    @Glitch

    This is described in the book.
    If you were seen thieving there is a price on your head.
    News travels fast. “Fast” travelling actually takes time (i.e. you don’t arrive at the time your left), the the horse beat you to it I guess, unlucky!
    Just go to jail and learn to steal better (also described in the manual why this may be)!
    Enjoy!

  • widow88 #313 6 years ago

    On Hand To Hand Combat:

    Like any skill in this massive game, it takes time to develop. Once you get to journeyman level you will start to develop additional moves, i.e. I'm playing the blunt skill and as a journeyman I can now knock the weapon out of my enemies hand. This applies to all combat skills but will vary by skill. Hand to hand also rocks becuase it quickly degrades your opponents fatique. Also there is no need to repair your weapon. So while everyone else would need to cast a drain/absorb faitique spell or use an an enhanted weapon, you won't.

  • dmigsy #314 6 years ago

    Played about 20 hours so far. Still to complete the first quest.There is so much cool shit to do. Rescued some chick from a village cult just now. Kick ass game. Defo 10. Never liked my real life job anyway.....

  • Ak1ra #315 6 years ago

    Maybe people vote 1/10 just to compensate the unfair 10/10.

  • Ak1ra #316 6 years ago

    Yes, I'm still playing it and I find the game very good (a 8 or 9/10 game). But the game is unbalanced. Sure you can create anything, a thief, a diplomat, etc but if you want to play the game in a medium difficulty you got to pick a very combat oriented char.

    Another thing that bothers me is that everyone gets stronger with you. It's logical to use it on the main quest monsters, because this way you can do it anytime and it's always challeging. But the problem is that every friggin enemy in the world gets stronger and stronger as you do. And this is bull, you only fell that you've grown stronger since the beggining of the game when fighting rats. It's ridiculous reaching lvl20 and see bandits with the finest armors of the game.

    It's a pitty this site went for the "easy review", playing surely only the main quest and them giving it a superficial classification of 10/10. I find it very amusing when in March everyone is already talking about the Game of the Year. Maybe Oblivion will be it, but not until the 1st patch.

    Let's hope Edge gives a more profund review.
    Edited by 6 at 28/03/06 @ 02:33

  • Krun #317 6 years ago

    @perrythegreat

    Your PC will not run it.

    The graphic card alone needs 256mb plus your computer needs 1GB. You mention 64mb which is not enough for either.

    A new PC that will run this game well will cost £1000+
    A new xbox 360 will be £300 aprox (including the game)

  • krudster #318 6 years ago

    Oblivion is No.1! It beat The Godfather, which is nice.

  • krudster #319 6 years ago

    Ak1ra - how do you know how much I played? I played about 12 hours of the main quest, and probably 18 hours of side quests. Does that make it clearer for you now?

  • Talha #320 6 years ago

    I have played this game for about 5 minutes, and IMHO it deserves 10/10. Why?

    1) On PC it is a no brainer to install and play, with super-simple installation routine, no stupid copy protection - no BS in other words
    2) The way it detects your settings instantly is cool
    3) I have a modest rig with P4 3.0, 768 MB RAM and a 6800GT - and it runs beautifully. The only concession is that I have to play it at 1024x768, with everything up all the way. 1024x768 is not a bad resolution by any means - some games (including this and Doom III) scale beautifully over lower resolutions
    4) It has a PROPER, dreamy title, a proper score, classy interface, and polished touches everywhere.
    5) It is available in a good-looking box with no stupid online services to activate and stuff to download.

    In short, it is every PC gamer's dream. Other devs should learn. It is very important to instill a sense of well-being in the player and make life as easy for him as possible when he first opens the box- that will only enhance his enjoyment of the game.

    The only gripes are that character animation is not upto HL2 levels and framerate is inconsistent. And, oh, I have yet to survive the first mice attack.

    And this is my first RPG ever.

    ;-)



  • MyPointIs #321 6 years ago

    Maybe in a year's time we'll still be commenting on this thread.... Is up for the record, surely. It's about to become a regular meeting spot, like an internet cafe :-)

    Kick ass game btw, well worth my sorry life.

    I think it honestly deserves the 95% is getting all around.

    If you aren't a soured PC die-hard TES fan, if you are new to the genre, make it +1.

    So that would be 105%

    Out of a 100.

    Nuff said.

  • #322 6 years ago

    @Ak1ra
    You have some valid points, but I would like to think that the Eurogamer reviewers actually have some conscience and wouldn't dare to review this game without at least 20-30 hours of gameplay.

    Personally now I have racked up 20+ hours and last night watched a friend go through the starting stage again. He went for a mage-style charachter and found the begining/tutorial a piece of piss, barely getting scratched. Me with my sword was right in the thick of it. (For god's sake he could kill a goblin with one touch spell at the end of the sewer!)

    As someone else said being a combat charachter does yeild more challenge, but then levelling up your magic (minor) skills is easy too. Yes it's annoying when you get killed by your basic bandit/monster (at level 11 now) and they seem a lot tougher than in the begining (I came across two trolls yesterday that my attcks had no effect on!). This can be annoying, but if you're canny with combat you usually win and whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger. However it would be nice to come across some enemies that you can destroy.

    Ak1ra, the question really is - do you see this game in the top 15% or the top 5%. For me it surely is top 5% (better than the average 20 other games) which makes it a 10/10 really.
    Edited by 1 at 28/03/06 @ 09:52

  • Moonprince #323 6 years ago

    If you have the pc version, you really need to check the mods released and in the works. Leveling system etc is being fixed in a number of ways. Even without those mod, I have about 10 downloaded already that greatly improve the game.

  • Furbs #324 6 years ago

    Arent the fixes (ie the levelling system) just changing the way the game is played according to other peoples wishes rather than correcting errors? Its back seat development in a way.

    I'm sure you'd agree anyway, but its alot easier to sort out the "polish" in a simpler game like Burnout than something as epic as Oblivion. EA games are generally pretty bug free (*cough*Battlefield2*cough*) as they are simpler designs.

  • Moonprince #325 6 years ago

    That's true I guess. It's just, in my mind I'd rather not see a bandit kitted out in amazing armour/weapons. not my idea of a bandit.

    One small example of many. But as you say, individual perception all the way

  • Talha #326 6 years ago

    @ManicMiner: I wish you would have taken things a little in context. I agree with you about Burnout Revenge, but remember - that game is not a huge world with thousands of NPCs. If you had cared to read my whole post, I admitted that animation in some parts is amiss. But in recent years, what can be termed 'polished' has considerably slipped down a notch or two in terms of PC games. I for one no longer expect bullet-proof experiences, and therefore, I am not disappointed often.

    I was talking from the perspective of a person who has installed an RPG for the first time on his PC . But generally, I found the interface not confusing, and the game easy to get into, which is a lot for current crop of most PC games and especially of the few RPGs I have TRIED to play. As I had mentioned, those were my impressions for the first 5 minutes. Were I to nitpick, I would have been able to point out thousands of things. I said 'polished touches everywhere' - that does not automatically mean that the game is flawless or even 'polished'.

    Though English is not my mother tongue, I have had enough basic education to be able to decide where to use the word 'polish'. Obviously you have played the game for hours (which I haven't), and also, played Morrowind (which I haven't).

    If you think Oblivion is broken, or is not polished enough, there are more civilized ways to express your opinion than to ridicule, criticize or patronise other people rather than the game itself.
    Edited by 1 at 28/03/06 @ 10:59

  • krudster #327 6 years ago

    Don't rise to his bait, Talha. ManicMinerUk is one of the most patronising people ever to post on EG. It's just what he does.

  • meepster2312 #328 6 years ago


    Been playing this for a few hours and loving it. One thing - it gives me real motion sickness after about 20 minutes. I never get this with 1st person perspective on a PC game - it this a controller issue. Would I be better off playing the PC version?

  • Dizzy #329 6 years ago

    I have played for a long time now and you do not have to pick a combat character. In fact a non-combat char is maybe even more fun to play. Of course you cannot finish the game without fighting so your char should have some combat skills (mages and archers seem to be the uber builds here).

    The leveling of enemies is brilliant... you never played Morrowind I assume? The low level critters kept on attacking you and it was very annoying. Now every battle is a challenge. Great idea!!!

    And you do get stronger... enemies level up with you, but you have way better gear and usually some custom items/spells.

    I still play WoW a lot but I feel relieved to enter the much more realistic and believable world of Oblivion, where I can do more or less what I want. usually I start a game and decide what to do... explore a bit, maybe some quests, check out some dungeons, gather some plants or try to steal some interesting stuff or even just wander around to see what will happen. before you know it 5 hours have passed. If any game ever deserved a 10.. this one is it. No not perfect.... just totally 10/10 absorbing.
    Edited by 2 at 28/03/06 @ 11:22

  • #330 6 years ago

    a game which sucks the hours from your life with such ease, majesty and grandiosity deserves 10.
    Just like Dizzy said, this game can easily take away 5 hours. I did nearly 20 hours over the weekend alone - and never once got bored or really frustrated (except when it crashed and I hadn't saved it for a bit (only crash I've had though - 360)).
    Even after these marathon sessions I still really wanted to play more! Oh and maybe did 1% of the quests! (If felt like).
    Being able to voice chat with a friend while playing is kinda cool too - esp. if they're playing it as well.

    /Did anyone else choose the scout class? - I'm starting to think it wasn't the best.

  • king_skins #331 6 years ago

    Yeah I choose scout... a dark elf, being resistant to fire helps when closing Oblivion gates :) and once you work on your blade & block skills you get a lot better and it gets a little easier. Also practicing your regenerate skills is a must.

    I did have to turn the difficulty down a little though. Being charged twice by a stunted scamp and then dying was driving me insane. Everyone was so much harder than me, two unblocked attacks and it was game over.

    I've been playing for over 20 hours on the weekend and been really enjoying it. Although not being able to carry much stuff is driving me mad, having to juggle stuff about and drop things. I'm constantly on my limit and if you come across someone with nice armour or weapons that you've plundered you can't take them to sell :( am I missing something?

    I'm currently trying to track down the Mythic Dawn in the main quest, does anyone know how far a long that is?

    Also anyone have any links to sites with good information about the game?

  • #332 6 years ago

    dark elf scout here too. Not started main quest. 20+ hours, level 11. Wouldn't know how to 'turn the difficulty down' though, and quite frankly wouldn't dare!

  • kangarootoo #333 6 years ago

    @ManicMinerUK

    You are talking specifically about graphical polish. You are also comparing Oblivion against a very focussed game when you choose Burnout. Burnout does very little, but what it does it does very well. Content wise Oblivion does shit loads, like lots, and then some. Given its collosal scope I think it is very well polished, just not so much on cosmetic aspects that frankly, in a game of this type, aren't that important.

    Of course its not perfect, but its extremely incredibly good. That warrants a 10 for me.

    And for the person who said this shouldn't be a 10 because the score should cater for all gamers everywhere. Err, are you sure that is really what you meant. If you assume that an RPG should be scored for RPG fans and haters alike how could you possibly give it a number that would mean anything? Should you average the scores, meaning many games would get 5 or 6?

    I think reviews should absolutely be conducted with the target audience in mind. We aren't buffalo, we can use our minds and make descisions for ourselves. I'm not a major fan of fighting games like Tekken and DOA, so when I read a review of that sort of game I expect that review primarily to tell fans of that genre what is good and bad in the title. I then apply my own knowledge of my own preferences and make a descision for myself on that basis.

    The reviewer isn't there to tell you what to buy, thats not their job. Their job is to give you enough info (hence it being called a "review", for the dictionary pedants) so you can make the choice yourself when you next go shopping.

  • SeesThroughAll #334 6 years ago

    @Krun:
    The graphic card alone needs 256mb plus your computer needs 1GB. You mention 64mb which is not enough for either.

    I have a mere 128Mb in my graphics card, and my system RAM is just 512Mb. By turning off most effects and cutting down the draw distance, I still manage to run the game, even if there are many places where it runs like molasses.

    And nevertheless, it still looks and plays much better than Morrowind.

  • Lovemoose #335 6 years ago

    @krudster
    Don't rise to his bait, Talha. ManicMinerUk is one of the most patronising people ever to post on EG. It's just what he does.

    OK, two problems here for me:

    Problem 1 - Manic's post wasn't even remotely patronising, especially compared with some of the others in this thread.

    Problem 2 - Since when did it become fair game to insult and patronise readers?

  • Furbs #336 6 years ago

    Been going on for years :)

    And it did come across as patronising. "Do you even know what polish is?" (or words to that effect) cant be anything but.

  • SeesThroughAll #337 6 years ago

    do you know what polish looks like? I ask because this game has hardly any. Load Burnout Revenge, look at the screen... THAT is polish. Now load Oblivion and behold the text heavy front end against a relatively static backdrop... go into the game and switch to third person view and jump, notice the lack of animation. ride a horse close to a wall and watch the game make no effort to prevent its entire head from penetrating into the rock...

    Are you talking about the "realistic physics" of Burnout? Should we call that polished? Hint: people want to enjoy it, not complain about the small technical details.

    Text heavy front end? Never played a quality RPG, did you? Thought so. Go play Diablo. Go on...

  • Talha #338 6 years ago

    @Krudster & Furbs: Thanks for the support

    @kangarootoo: +1 - glad to see most of you got what I meant

    @Lovemoose:"I think people use phrases and terms they've picked up from websites without really understanding them nowadays... " If that doesn't come accross as patronising or insulting to you, I guess you are Manic himself, or you don't know what patronising means.... (That didn't sound patronising to you did it, eh?). And I guess it is fair game for people like Manic to insult and patronise, but not others, right?


  • Lovemoose #339 6 years ago

    "I think people use phrases and terms they've picked up from websites without really understanding them nowadays... " If that doesn't come accross as patronising or insulting to you, I guess you are Manic himself, or you don't know what patronising means.... (That didn't sound patronising to you did it, eh?). And I guess it is fair game for people like Manic to insult and patronise, but not others, right?

    I'm not manic himself, and I reckon he's the kind of bloke who wouldn't have to hide behind a sock to reinforce his argument. I didn't hear him insult you either.

    "I think people" is a phrase that would denote a general aspect of the current debate, rather than specifically aimed at you. If it was aimed at you, then I agree, on re-reading, it comes across as patronising.

    Neither was my post an attack on you, and I'm disappointed you had to resort to being patronising to attack me... easy to fall into the trap though, right?

    No, my problem was that it was one of the first times I'd seen a writer on the site just post a straight out insult. No reasoned argument or debate, just a straight: "don't worry, he's a twat, therefore irrelevant"

    Back to the beef. Oblivionisn't polished in some areas, but that doesn't detract from the fact it's a 10/10 game. I just wish it did have some of the polish that a fully fixed game should have. Losing sounds, and crashing on loading a game is NOT acceptable on a console game. Especially a £50 console game.

  • Talha #340 6 years ago

    @Lovemoose : Honestly I did not mean to attack you or even patronise you in my post - just meant to demonstrate what it felt like to be 'patronised' - surely you can decipher that from my post. Still, my apologies for the misunderstanding.

    On the other hand, Manic's post WAS targeted at me, if you read the recent comments.

  • Scurrminator #341 6 years ago

    not as good as final fantasy VII

  • redd #342 6 years ago

    it might not be perfet, but its substantially better than any 8s and 9s ive seen here. I mean, if you are going to rate Black with an 8, you sure as hell should rate Oblivion at least a 12! Oops the scale stops at 10.. there you have it.

  • Fatfish #343 6 years ago

    Kangarootoo said "We aren't buffalo..."

    Speak for yourself matey! F*cking marsupials, always think you're better than all the rest - we may not have the ability to think for ourselves, but we sure know how to roll in our own shit! So there.



    Moo.

  • Fatfish #344 6 years ago

    @ Talha - you're right to be defensive about ManicMiners comments. I read them as being directed at you too. Best bet is to take Furbs and Krudsters advice and just ignore it - it's not worth rising too.

    Lovemoose said "No, my problem was that it was one of the first times I'd seen a writer on the site just post a straight out insult. No reasoned argument or debate, just a straight: "don't worry, he's a twat, therefore irrelevant"

    Perhaps that's because there's some history there? I doubt Krudster would have made such a sweeping comment without having had something to base it on. People (even writers/reviewers) are entitled to their own opinion.

    And yes, I did intentionally single out writers/reviewers in attempt to show them as having a lower standing in life than most normal, well adjusted human beings. ;)
    Edited by 1 at 28/03/06 @ 16:10

  • krudster #345 6 years ago

    Check through any review I've written over the past year...you're guaranteed to find some needling comment from MMUK directed at me. Ho hum.

  • Nikanoru #346 6 years ago

    To be perfectly honest, compared to that new Crysis video, some of the foliage in Oblivion looks, and I'm nearly afraid to say this, downright mediocre and uninteresting. This is when coming straight from the aforementioned video clip, of course.

  • Furbs #347 6 years ago

    Difference is, Crysis is a year off being playable :p

  • Fatfish #348 6 years ago

    Oblivion 1. Crysis 0.

  • #349 6 years ago

    Can I play Crysis now then?
    Oh, will my current PC play it?
    FFS, how can you even compare the two games! Get off!
    Edit: NO offence meant. EG - Hey look a game in the future is graphically better than a current game - no shit! Crysis' gameplay may suck balls, it'll be a while till we know. Until then, what have we lost as consumers? - Nothing. So why even bring it up!?
    Edited by 1 at 28/03/06 @ 16:51

  • krudster #350 6 years ago

    To be honest, compared to a game I've not even seen yet that might be out in five years time, this looks rubbish. I mean, this doesn't even have voice recognition. FFS!

    5/10

  • #351 6 years ago

    With the benefit of time travel I can tell you the photo-realistic worlds in Elder Scrolls X are way better - no stutter, and a control system directly hooked into your brain so that there is no boundry between you and the gameplay.
    ESX -10/10
    EXIV - 1/10

  • Nikanoru #352 6 years ago

    Whoa, holy christ, way to get defensive there guys.

    Yeah so Crysis isn't out, your point? Its not like it's a generation away. Add to that the obvious fact that we're fast entering the stage where it's not really about the level of technology anymore, but about the design skill behind the experience.

    Ok, how about this one: the trees and bushes look crummy, period. It's nice that it's all procedurally generated and such, and I'm sure nerds everywhere will orgasm over the technical specifications and would get just as excited if they'd be watching the programming code scroll by. Aesthetically though, it's as if some teen just discovered photoshop's clone brushes, and that's what nobody seems to want to acknowledge among all the hype. There, I said it.

    Why even bring it up? Well, I live off taking away people's joy, because I'm mean spirited like that. :(

  • kangarootoo #353 6 years ago

    @ManicMinerUK

    "if you think it is, you need to revise your definition of "polish""

    Holy shit. That has to be the biggest ego I think I've ever seen on these pages, and I bet you don't even know why.

    Here's a helping hand.

    "How about you revise your definition of polish?"

    You see the way I used "How about" at the start of the sentence, turning it into a suggestion instead of an empirical order. Last time I was at school, I didn't see your name on any of the English text books.

    Dictionary time.

    To remove flaws from; perfect or complete
    To become perfect or refined

    Hmmm, seems to me that either you take the "perfect" part of the definition, which means you are saying Burnout is perfect (which is a little ludicrous I'm sure you would agree). Or you take the "refined" side of the definition, which sounds pretty subective to me, meaning I can say Oblivion is polished if I want and there's nothing you can do about it. Nah nah nah.

    Oh shit my mistake. In my haste I foolishly pointed my browser at www.dictionary.com, when in fact I should have pointed it to www.mmuk's-ego-dictionary.com. I stand corrected.

    Learn to take yourself less seriously. Elvis didn't, and look what happened to him in the end.

  • kangarootoo #354 6 years ago

    @Nikanoru

    I agree people got a little bit jumpy on you there, but you aren't really comparing apples with apples (more a case of comparing apples with an as yet unidentified fruit).

    We don't know how large the game areas in Crysis are yet, we don't know if they are streamed or loaded in chunks, we don't know if they were custom build from the ground up or procedurally generated. I could go on. The point people are making is that anyone can create a tech movie that looks better than a current game, because the brief for an advert is this "make the game look f'king great". The brief for Oblivion was rather broader than that.

    If Crysis always looks that good and is mega fun to boot, then hurrah. But we simply don't know yet so you might as well say Charlise Theron looks better than Oblivion (umm, in which case I would agree and logic be damned, but you take my point).

  • Ak1ra #355 6 years ago

    @kangorootoo
    [The reviewer isn't there to tell you what to buy, thats not their job. Their job is to give you enough info (hence it being called a "review", for the dictionary pedants) so you can make the choice yourself when you next go shopping.]

    Believe me, many people are buying Oblivion thinking this is the best game ever, because of all the 10. Many of them will be a bit disappointed (just a bit), and many whould wish they bought a different game. Writing a review is a very big responsability, more so when you trust the website.

    Edited by 1 at 28/03/06 @ 21:59

  • Furbs #356 6 years ago

    In that case they are very dumb and deserve everything they get.

    I also have a nice seaside property on the Isle of Wight I'd like to sell them, and my revolutionary new chocolate fireguard.

  • Ak1ra #357 6 years ago

    Yay, let's take advantage from dumb people! Nice one Furbs

  • Furbs #358 6 years ago

    Hey, I consider it financial Darwinism.

    If they are able to use a PC to find this website, have enough disposable income to afford a 360, spend £50 on a game and yet arent bright enough to realise that:

    a) this is a role play game
    b) the words above the number tell you how it plays
    c) that 10/10 doesnt not mean the best game in the history of everything ever

    then they should be exploited to subsidise the more astute gamer.

  • Talha #359 6 years ago

    @Krudster: I think people shouldn't blame you if most of Manic's comments are like that. I appreciate that you must have endured a lot to adopt that attitude, and reading his latest comments, I can see why.

    @OThers: Hey, what's this talk all over about Crysis? It's a different game - it sure won't run on my PC. It does look gorgeous though, not doing any visual favours to any current game, be it Oblivion or anything else.

    The real question to ask here is: Is Oblivion much better looking than Far Cry with its pseudo-HDR enabled? Sometimes I think not, though my tech knowledge is limited. That does not mean that it is not breathtaking to behold, by the way.

    EDIT: 400th COMMENT!!!! Where is my paid vacation to Bahamas, EG? Surely I have added one more page to the thread and perhaps increased your ad revenue from this article alone by about 20%!!!
    Edited by 1 at 29/03/06 @ 07:15

  • krudster #360 6 years ago

    I don't need to add anything to MMUK's latest 'retort', I think he managed to enlighten most people as to why his comments might come across as personal, and generally quite rude. It's the nature of the internet, I guess.

  • Ak1ra #361 6 years ago

    @Furbs
    Yes, 10/10 doesn't mean it's the best game ever, but it means that this game is better that, say Wind Waker, Rome: Total War or Resident Evil 4, and I don't think it's true. I always come to EG looking for a more down to earth review, not some perfect score just because many people were expecting this game.

  • MJ #362 6 years ago

    Ak1ra - do your own review then!

    Opinons are like assholes, they both appear on the internet.

  • #363 6 years ago

    @MMUK

    "Krudster - You remain the most humourless person I have ever met, and I'm never sure whether you deliberately miss the times when my tongue is in my cheek or if you are genuinely just bit of a grumpy arse"

    Not only is this a personal attack but:
    i) Have you even met krudster? If so can you take your personal battle a bit more, umm personally - and not post crapola on the internet that I have to wade through. If you haven't ever met him then I suggest you take a reality check.
    ii) I tend to type with my fingers and produce words and sentences. I use vocabulary to convey my point. Judging when your tongue is in you cheek can therefore be difficult. Use better words so that it's easier to tell that while you're typing these words you actually have your tongue in your cheek, or preferably, just don't.

    Anyway, back to Oblivion....
    Edited by 2 at 29/03/06 @ 11:38

  • Pike #364 6 years ago

    Wow, a fair number of amusing whiners in this comments thread.

    ManicMiner guy: Polish is relative. You can't apply the critera of what constitutes polish in one genre of games to all other genres.

    Ak1ra: Stop being boring, please.

  • kangarootoo #365 6 years ago

    @Ak1ra

    "but it means that this game is better that, say Wind Waker, Rome: Total War or Resident Evil 4, and I don't think it's true"

    Errr, I do. I honestly do, I'm not kidding, not a bit (its a close thing mind).

    So what do you say to that? Other than "well, I guess it really is just subjective opinion after all"? For hardcore fans of western RPGs, this probably is goint to give them more hours of fun that those listed above (none of which are really in the same sub-genre as Oblivion).

    So what you are saying is, Oblivion isn't 10/10 for you personally. Thats absolutely fine. It doesn't mean the review score is wrong, it simply demonstates the subjective nature of reviews (which is what half of this thread practically has been trying to make clear).

  • oerhoert #366 6 years ago

    Talha: I found MMUK's last post to be quite reasonable, actually. Haven't read all the referenced earlier disagreements, though.

  • Talha #367 6 years ago

    @oerhört : You mean the one about krudster? The one where there is a mention of him sniffing the pants of Stuart Campbell? Then you'll find anything reasonable.

    To be fair though, I think it is better if you trawl through the last 20-25 posts. Then you will see what's what.
    Edited by 1 at 29/03/06 @ 13:10

  • Rambaldi #368 6 years ago

    @Ak1ra

    We get the message. You can stop now.

    Please.

  • Ak1ra #369 6 years ago

    @MJ
    You got that right!

  • Stickman #370 6 years ago

    Have we stopped doing the 'better than Halo' thing then?

  • #371 6 years ago

    no I didn't miss it, I was trying to read a thread about Oblivion.
    I obviously went wrong somewhere.
    And using the thesaurus doesn't cut much ice here. :p

    Anyway, back to Oblivion... Ah sod it, we're too far gone. Last post on this thread... ever.
    Edited by 2 at 29/03/06 @ 16:10

  • Pike #372 6 years ago

    It's not a hard concept ManicMiner. I guess you might be able to figure it out, if you take your time.

  • kangarootoo #373 6 years ago

    @ManicMinerUK

    "So, let me just get this straight, I'm wrong to say that Oblivion is unpolished because polish is relative? Run that by me again?"

    No problem, glad to help. Here we go.

    That isn't what I said.

    There, does that clear things up for you.

    You were stating a definition of "polish" that was your own. A definition that didn't match up with the one found in any dictionary you care to read. You then deemed to tell me my definition (the one found in the dictionary of the language I *thought* we were using) needed updating.

    Hence my amusement at the magnitude of your ego. If you want to create your own language then by all means be my guest, but don't act like everyone else is an idiot just because they don't conform and adopt it.

    "Give me the guy who just says "shut it you lot, the game sucks ass" any day.. at least he's got the balls to stand by his own thoughts!"

    You might prefer him, but he would still be a self important cock.
    Edited by 2 at 29/03/06 @ 16:33

  • tengu #374 6 years ago

    The further into this game I get, the more bugs that seem to crop up. Last night I lost a couple of hours through having to reload so often to fix screw ups in the game. It's getting really annoying.

  • #375 6 years ago

    Oh I couldn't resist it.
    Shut it ManicMinerUK, you suck Ass!

    Prefer me now?

  • kangarootoo #376 6 years ago

    @tengu

    Which platform was that on? What was the issue you saw?

  • tengu #377 6 years ago

    On the 360, and there's been a lot of different little things that have been happening to really annoy me in the game. I can't go into detail on some for spoiler reasons, but lets just say the crappy AI on 'friendly' characters has caused me to have more than a couple of reloads for some missions. Other stuff that's happened includes falling through the floor to my death in the Oblivion planes towers(happened twice), I got stuck inside a wall when I somehow backed through it in another tower, on a couple of occasions I had the guards come after me for some reason when I did nothing illegal, and when I ran out of the city, the 'pursuit' music kept playing even after I was well away from the guards, so I couldn't fast travel anywhere.

    Little stuff like this and others seems to happen a lot now(Though I now save constantly so it's easier to get around it when it does happen), and that's just in the past day. In the early stages of the game I had virtually no problems like this. Others don't seem to be having any of these troubles though, so I've probably just been unlucky.

    Don't get me wrong, I still really like the game, but the minor annoyances seem to be piling up and it's hindering my fun somewhat. A shame, yes, but I'll keep playing to the end, no doubt about that.

  • kangarootoo #378 6 years ago

    Bugger. I was hoinh you were going to say the PC version, because the 360 is what I'm playing it on (and the PC version will get patched more easily, though given recent news on that front I think it is reasonable to hope for a 360 "Cloak Enhancer" or something).

    "the 'pursuit' music kept playing even after I was well away from the guards, so I couldn't fast travel anywhere"

    I've seen the same issue myself as it happens, though I had been naughty so the guards at least had reason to be... err... on guard. When I got to the next town the guards seemed OK with me, unless I spoke to them and then they realised I was a big fat thief and threatened my forsooth with an unsundering or some such.

    Not had any going through walls business yet happen. Takes me back to Daggerfall (don't know how old you are, maybe you remember it) where getting stuck in floors was reasonably commonplace and there was a console command that would shift your character up a couple of game feet to get you out.

  • tengu #379 6 years ago

    I wouldn't worry too much, I haven't read about anyone else having these problems with the game, seems I've just been a bit unlucky lately with it. You'll probably have none of this yourself I'd say.

  • #380 6 years ago

    how's this for polish?
    To a certain extent the arrows in your quiver truly represent how many you have. Of course you can only see it for yourself in 3rd person mode, but it must apply for all NPCs too.
    For example - you have 3 arrows left - there's three right there in the quiver. You pull the trigger - the character actually reaches exactly for one, and pulls it out - hey presto there's now two and so on - I call that polished as f**k.

    When I think polish I think shoes. You can make them really shiny by polishing, but a shiny pair of shoes with no soles won't get you anywhere (PDZ was shiny as). Oblivion is a bloody good pair of shoes that, admittedly, the shoe-shiner has missed a few (very small) bits on. Oh, and a pair that not everyone will find comfortable.

  • psorcerer #381 6 years ago

    10/10 to Oblivion?
    This is ridiculous. I'm supposed to think that Oblivion is a masterpiece game like Shadow of The Colossus or even better? Pfff.
    For the first time the Eurogamer score disappoints me...

  • #382 6 years ago

    psorcerer I take it you've played the game?

  • Lawlost #383 6 years ago

    Any game that generates this much comment (425 and counting) and scores a 10/10, has to be worth looking at. I picked it up last night at PC World (Pre buy on the web for £19.99) and fully intend to see what all the fuss it about.
    Edited by 1 at 30/03/06 @ 13:36

  • psorcerer #384 6 years ago

    jamesphilp

    Yep. Played.
    Way better than Morrowind, but still a long way to go.
    And definetely NOT a masterpiece. Just look at the amount of bugs.

  • #385 6 years ago

    22+ hours here on 360.
    Even with some bugs (1 freeze during loading and some framerate dropping) it is better than 95% of games out there. Therefore 10/10. Simple as that.
    The Pc version may be more buggy, but that's the PC, not the game!

  • psorcerer #386 6 years ago

    jamesphilp
    > Even with some bugs (1 freeze during loading and some framerate dropping) it is better than 95% of games out there.

    Yeah, yeah. So it's 10/10 for the X360 game. If you put it this way - I totally agree with you, the games on X360 are so scarce and so horrible that even Oblivion gets 10/10.

    > The Pc version may be more buggy, but that's the PC, not the game!

    The PC has nothing to do with bugs, bugs are written by Bethesda programmers not the PC.

  • tiddles #387 6 years ago

    Well, I've played through nearly 20 hours of the PC version and it's a 10/10 game so far. It's obviously been designed to be an accessible console experience, but this hasn't noticeably hurt the PC version (although mods like the one to see more inventory items at once are helpful).

    I do think polish is a relative concept though... sure, it has quite a few bugs, but name a recent game of this scope which doesn't! It comes with the "free-roaming multiple path Western RPG" territory, I'm afraid. Patches on the PC will most likely fix the worst of them, and there's a good chance the X360 version will be patched too... yup, there was once a golden age of console games where they were flawless and bug-free, but as I say I can't see this happening with a game of Oblivion's size or complexity, and personally I'd rather have Oblivion and bugs rather no Oblivion at all. For a game of this type, though, I think it's fair to say that Oblivion is undeniably polished - certainly the quests, core gameplay, interface and environment designs are streets ahead of most other games in this genre, and huge advances over previous Elder Scrolls titles.

    And for what it's worth, I've fallen through the world more often in Shadow Of The Colossus than I have in Oblivion.
    Edited by 1 at 02/04/06 @ 18:19

  • stormuk #388 6 years ago

    For me the PC version wins - simply because for me the PC is meant to play this type of game, consoles dont hackit (pun intended) for me. Also its cheaper.

    Biggest downer for me was the spell cast system why bother with hotkeys - just cast the spell when you press 1 or up depending on format?

    Funniest moment was on the 360, killing a bad guy on top of a large hill and he rolled down to the bottom bouncing off some rocks etc.

  • Bumbuliuz #389 6 years ago

    I have spent around 45 hours with the pc version and about 40 with the 360 version. I like the 360 version more because of the performance I get. So I will try to finish the game on my 360 and try to get all the achivements after I buy my new pc later this month I will spend more time with the game there and try some mods and more stuff like that. After I beat Morrowind I spent ages with the mods that came out. I hope to do the same again with Oblivion.

  • TheJanitor #390 6 years ago

    looks like an average rpg, i'l pass. since x360 sucks too

  • Helios #391 6 years ago

    So uhm...

    I've been thinking about getting this. Keep in mind that i'm a COMPLETE RPG newbie, how accessible is this?

  • ave #392 6 years ago

    It's very accessable Helios, think of it as primarily an exploration game with generally simple & linear quests, and no real roleplaying so you cant make mistakes that way.

  • Helios #393 6 years ago

    Good :D

    Uh, looking at the acheivement... most of them seem to come from doing side quests for like, 5 different factions (going up in rank).

    If I don't do all these during the course of the game, once the main storyline is over, can you wander around and finish off an side quests?

  • ave #394 6 years ago

    Yup

  • Helios #395 6 years ago

    Sold.

  • Royal Fool #396 6 years ago

    I personally don't see how this game can be rated a straight 10, simply because it's too glitchy in the initial release version to deserve such a score.

    I recognize the scope of the game; it is massive and deserves high praise. The game is also a very solid gaming experience from start to finish - especially since the goalposts are so vague since you can do so many different things.

    But there ARE showstopping bugs. Quests can get broken (Ahdarji's ring quest, for example) and even skills get stuck (Hackdirt rescue quest boosts your mercantile skill but it gets stuck in the process, forever). NPCs in some cases won't recognize particular quest topics if you've done things in a manner the developers didn't predict.

    The leveling is ridiculous, particularly since some encounters will become impossible for you. have you tried going alone into Kvatch at level 20 or so (Alone as in "I did it when I was level 7 but all the friendly NPCs died, and I went to do other quests then came back many, many levels later";)? It's simply impossible because of the massive numbers of atronach enemies you have to face, all at once.

    Don't get me wrong, I love Oblivion. I've clocked over 100 hours in it with two different characters. But the game simply doesn't have what it takes to be a 10. Perhaps after some patches...

    I'm afraid Kristan, much like the rest of the gaming media, got caught up in the huge hype that usually surrounds games like these.

  • Carpathian #397 6 years ago

    I personally think that it's near impossible to please everybody reading the reviews.

    Take two cases:

    1) A rather buggy game that's massively impressive in it's scope, it's enjoyment, it's sheer 'grab you by the bits and keep you playing' ablility

    2) A perfectly programmed game, solid in every respect, that is pretty good to play but without that magic you get every now and then.

    Do you rate them both 9's for differing reasons or knock a mark or two of the former whilst *not* adding points to the latter for the same thing ? I know I wouldn't like to have ten numbers to pick from and, after two pages of pro's and con's, stump up for a definitive score. No matter how much you caveat it you know you're going to get slagged from one side or the other.

    Only way round this is to score it in letter format (A+, B-, C++) even though thats a bit vague, or have a second opinion for the big guns when they arrive on release. That's been done 'elsewhere' but it's still a simple method of checks and balances.

    Me ? I've got a 360 copy that keeps throwing me out of the game as an "unreadable disc" which means frequent saving but I'm *still* totally hooked even with that hassle in place.

    Sometimes style over substance 'sucks' (to coin a popular term on here) but there are are times when a little of each go a long, long way. For me Oblivion has that in spades and I can honestly see why a 10 *could* be applied in one persons view.

    Now, if you don't mind, I'm off to introduce my claymore to some stags.........

  • Mashum #398 5 years ago

    After a break for a few months I am enjoying this more now then ever, just past 100 hrs.

    In my experience Oblivion felt like samey trudgery when I was playing it as a first person bash 'em up. the dungeons seemed all the same, the trees and hills and rocks all looked very familiar and there seemed to be no reward in terms of 'new stuff' for completing each quest.

    However after getting familiar with the massive environment I appreciate it much more. The same goes for the many detailed and interconnected stories that the game offers and this breathes life into the quests and NPCs. I can forgive the pop up and the occasional bug in a game this ambitious.

  • Phil_Oblivion_TSI. #399 5 years ago

    Oblivion is the best bloody game ever made!!!! EASILY!!! I play it on my pc, and i wish i could get shivering isles soon! But it requires a 3.0 GHz Processor! Which i cant wait to see the graphics on. If its better than normal oblivion, I need to see. It definately deserves 10/10. If it didnt get 10/10 the reveiwers would be stupid

  • bakashinji #400 4 years ago

    Alright, I never, ever thought I'd be saying this, so please appreciate how hard this is for me to say, "I would rather play Morrowind five times over than play this game through in its entirety". Phew, yeah that's right, I would rather slog through an almost entirely static world, kill 18,000,000 of those goddamn birds and deal with being treated like a chump even after I was declared the Messiah of an entire race than deal with the even more limited and unbearably "look, but for god's sake don't touch" world of oblivion. How do I count the ways? One: an even further dumbed down skill system*. Two: A ridiculously idiotic, wildly over-hyped and mostly indiscriminate character interaction engine. Three: a combat system as diverse as it is exciting (if you can't tell in case of massive retardation/exposer to Halo 3, this is sarcasm). These guys are so obsessed coddling the lowest common denominator that they fall short of advances made back in the Ultima days of actually creating a dynamic world filled with people who give a shit about what you do beyond the obligatory comment on your latest reality changing feat. Sure, you can wipe of an entire town, but how should that change how the average peasant reacts to you- good god even the "sandbox" mess that was Fable acknowledged this. Then the massively exposed "OMG PHYSICS!!!!" system amounted to little less than npcs ragdolling 5 meters through a wall. Add that to the absolute inability to intact with the undeniably well mapped but unexpectedly spartan, unbelievably unoriginal/monotonous (pick you adjective!) dungeons and landscapes in any meaningful way and you got a game that fails demonstrably 4 of the things it harped on during its silly hype campaign. If killing to same monster in the same dungeon the same way for the 1000th goddamn time doesn't annoy you, I recommend buying WoW and dieing of self imposed exile (although I guess given the recent trend of ordering pizzas through these massively multiplayer social pariah creators, and dieing of malnutrition or heart disease is just as good). Unless you're a complete obsessive taking shots of Oblivion to tide you over on the rare moments you're not playing WoW and arguing with your guild mates over loot drama I can't see a reason for playing this game At least then you get the comradery of interacting with fellow people who have nothing better to do, rather than the emptiness (or oblivion?) that playing this empty game generates in your soul.

    *Oh yeah, the other complaint, while the other offenses are-or should be-universal to the non-retarded, this one has a opinionated bent. As a basic example that covers the many issues: There used to be three sword skills, they as well as their ax, spear and range cousins, got grouped into one obtuse skill, effectively destroying 1/3 of the depth of combat. As a habitual dagger user and magic hater (go figure) this is personally unforgivable. My only option was to lower the difficulty or pick up one of the ridiculously unbalanced, overpowered swords I'd picked up by exploiting stupid game flaws to kill enemies way beyond my level. The quit/uninstall buttons won. That's 6-8 hours of my life I'll never get back.
    Edited by 1 at 10/11/07 @ 02:20

  • FiOth #401 3 years ago

    Kristian, you obviously like "Morrowind for kids" a lot.I mean, how can someone possibly ever give a game like OblIVion 10/10?Yes, it was pretty back at it's time, yes it's got good atmosphere but the mechanics are simply generic and oversimplified to appeal to the masses.

    Morrowind is the game to go if you like open-ended games and if you prefer the (much cooler imho) post-apocalyptic setting go for Fallout 3.It's got better role playing mechanics than any Elder Scrolls game and it's world is full of personality.

    OblIVion?A HUGE word full of little (if not nothing) if you ask me :) .

    6/10 is my verdict (most of it goes for the great atmosphere - and I am saying this after playing for about 340 hours, don't ask me why).
    Edited by 1 at 20/01/09 @ 14:35

  • andywilkie35 #402 3 years ago

    You played a game for 340 hours even though you thought it was crap?

    You need help. Serious help.