Colin McRae DIRT Comments by Kristan Reed

"If anything, it's the gigantic PS3 triggers that we still have trouble getting used to, but that's possibly down to not having played too many racing games on the platform to date than anything."

The triggers are fairly horrible tbh - this seems to be the general consensus at least among the people I know (both casual and hardcore).

"If anything, it's the gigantic PS3 triggers that we still have trouble getting used to, but that's possibly down to not having played too many racing games on the platform to date than anything."

Yeah triggers are terrible, can't understand why all of a sudden every PS3 driving game (bar GT HD) thinks it necessary to utilise them since ever since PS2 the face buttons have been analog and worked fine. Hope there is the option to revert to the much more comfortable GT control scheme.

Yep. The triggers are shite and need a serious rethink.

"But in terms of how it ran, the differences were nigh on imperceptible..."

Kristan needs glasses!

I have compared the two versions and the PS3 version runs far smoother than the 360 version (which is terrible!). Less tearing too. But the PS3 version seems a tad aliased though.

"I have compared the two versions and the PS3 version runs far smoother than the 360 version. Less tearing too. But the PS3 version seems is a tad aliased."

PS3 version was the lead platform, right? That would explain a lot.

SEGA RALLY easily for me!

"PS3 version was the lead platform, right? That would explain a lot."

Dunno... Maybe it's just because the developers took the extra time for the PS3 version. The 360 version seems sloppy developed to me and both versions should have been identical.

I like the triggers, not as much as the N64 pad, but I've no problem with it.

Then again I do have freakishly long fingers in comparison to my palms...

Worse than Halo 2 and 3 but just as good as Halo 1 then.


What? ;)

"SEGA RALLY easily for me! "

I agree... SR is pure fun while DIRT seems very "meh" to me. Codemasters should not have dumbed down the CMR series to attact the American audience. A shame!

There is a lot less slow down on PS3 than 360 too though its not entirely eliminated, I'm suprised the review never picked up on this.

The PS3 triggers aren't a patch on 360's (for the record:this doesn't mean I hate Sony).

Well I have compared the two versions (both final builds) myself on the same HDTV and can say the difference is big. But many seems to be blind to framerate- and tearing issues - the reviewer must be one of them.

Call me blind all you like, but I sat down with the 360 version for 15 or so hours and did not notice any tearing issues at all. There was some minor slowdown here and there, but nothing that affected the enjoyment of the game. Maybe to a small extent it's down to the differences in TVs, as these arguments have raged throughout the lifespan of the 360, with some people ranting on about perceived v-sync horrors and others swearing blind they're not there.

Bah MotorStorm > Dirt

Well Beano I also have compared the two final games and there isn't anything big about the difference between the two. I am not sure if you need to blow out your 360 cache but the two games pretty much ran the same. I will give the edge to the PS3 because it did feel more consistant but on my 56HDTV there was no big difference in the performance of the two games.

Did someone mention "tearing"? Where's Darren when you need him...


;-)

"Colin McRae's untimely passing the day after its release on PS3 also grants it a special significance"

Right. I suppose THAT's the PS3's fault as well?

Krudster, hows this game with the wheel? What wheel support is there, and how's the force feedback in that? I have both the PS3 and 360, but the PS3 has typically had so much better wheel support that this is a hugely important thing for me. Using the controller I thought that the driving model was incredibly meh, but if the feedback on the wheel is good that might help, and often there's a slightly different engine behind the game when you use a wheel anyway.

I'd also like to know if there are sixaxis steering controls as well. In Motorstorm these worked great, and so far I still like that game better. But who knows I might change my mind on Dirt if I try the full game.

"For us, it's bumper cam all the way"

Bonnet owns bumper every time.

You heathens.

Don't mind using the triggers myself, not as comfortable as the 360 ones, but still more than usable.

As mentioned, the PS3 version is actually smoother for me to. The only real artefact's you get graphically are on the main menu where you can see some jaggies on the text.

Edit: Wheel support on the 360 is one of the worst implementations yet, as it lacks any cohesion between the what you see and what you end up feeling. Though not as bad as Sega Rally... wtf were they thinking [too see what I mean, drive on smooth tarmac without touching the wheel, and accelerate slowly and steadily, the wheel just goes nuts flying left to right].

Yup this game is supposed to support Logitech G25 on PS3 and I'd really like to buy the G25 but untill I know there is enough support for one I am a bit weary for spending £130, I already have a wheel for my PC that I could replace but only want to if it can be used on PS3 like G25.

Any chnace you have a G25 lying around Eurogamer to test it.

I didn't noticed tearing on 360 or PS3 but I definately noticed the chugging moreso on 360. PS3 triggers aren't as good as 360 but you do get used to them.

So, the Ps3 version is better... at least that.

Personally i prefer Motorstorm.

Your link to the original review seems to be via the admin.eurogamer sub-domain. What's your password, Kristan? :)

Rash - "PS3 version was the lead platform, right? That would explain a lot."

I would expect so. I'm not 100% on the details, but as far as I know the Neon engine which this is built from (and the next Toca/Operation Flashpoint games) was created by Codies for Sony. Not sure if Codies have exclusive rights to develop using it, or if we'll see in first-party Sony games in the future, or what.

One thing I do know is that a codition of Codemasters creating the Neon engine was that it was to be compatible in cross-platform development, hence DiRT being on 360.

krudster - "Call me blind all you like, but I sat down with the 360 version for 15 or so hours and did not notice any tearing issues at all."

Sorry but you did ask... you're blind! ;) LOL

Seriously unless you were playing this game on a 14" portable from 12 feet away, you cannot fail to notice the tearing as the game doesn't go ten seconds without tearing. It's one of the worst offenders on the Xbox 360 in my opinion along with Splinter Cell: Double Agent and the pre-patched Saints Row. Doesn't alter the fact that those games are great obviously but the visuals are marred somewhat by the "wobbly" look. The PS3 version is much improved in this area and if you play from the internal view, you'll hardly see any at all unlike the 360 version.

P.S. I hope JonFE's happy now? :P

Fuck me! An in-game screenshot!

Heh, not quite, this is a 50" 1080i Panasonic Plasma, and I'm pretty well versed in what V-Sync tearing looks like. Like I said, maybe it's down to the TV. We've been down this road before...

I'd agree that the American bits (voice-over and CORR races) are shite.

I also think that the cars are a bit "floaty", and the tarmac stuff, cross over events are better fun and more realistic then the gravel events.


Sony really lost an opportunity with the DualShock3 to fix the L2/R2 triggers. They should be convex rather than concave and have a rubberised finish like the tips of the analogue sticks.

@les: "ever since PS2 the face buttons have been analog and worked fine."

Hmm, apart from the fact there's absolutely no physical feedback to tell you how much force you're applying -- hence the laughable need for a guage on screen in the likes of GT4.

Everybody else has managed to get triggers right since the Dreamcast. How can Sony still be making a bodge of it 9 years later?

Neon is based on PSSG tech (which is a Sony format) but was developed first for 360 then moved over to ps3. The reason the performance will be better on PS3 is that it has been released months after the 360 version so the niggly performance bugs will have been ironed out...

See??? Told ya...

Dirt 8/10 and Sega Rally 9/10 *rollseyes*

30fps on an arcade racer. Sega, what have you been doing for the last ten years? Remember the Dreamcast? Crazi Taxi? 60fps. So you got your ten mile draw distance so you can get a nice picture up on IGN, got your car with bits of obligatory mud on the bumper, got your stupid rutted race course which makes not a stuff of difference given the lame handling engine, and what are you left with? A clumsy heffer of a game which splutters out an unconvincing 30fps. You also made the mistake of running the front end at 60fps, something those folks at Codemasters, who have similarly little mastery of the system, avoided with the flawed CMR Dirt giving a solid but pathetic 30fps performance.

I am tempted to get rid of every game that runs at anything less than 60fps. There's no excuse when you have games like GT5 Prologue, Gaiden and RR7 providing a true next gen experience. I can let Oblivion off the hook. But not Heavenly Sword. 30fps on a fast moving slasher is a travesty.

Why do 90% of PS2 games run at 60fps when only a meagre handful of 360/PS3 games can manage it? Gimmicks, that's why. Complex, CPU frazzling real physics engines such as Havok, real time lighting and over complicated reflections, track deformation, damage.

I can understand that FPSs and RPGs don't need 60, but racers and slashers do and I will be boycotting any future releases in these genres which opt for page splashing gimmickry at the expense of a smooth, slick HD experience.

You might have picked up that I also really wanted to like this game!

Who in their right mind thinks: OK, let's update this old arcade classic, you know the one that's still there in Gatwick airport and any number of rusting seaside slot rooms, and always has a few kids with backpacks stuffing coins in it; and give it a next gen facelift - oh and let's fill it full of gimmicks so it can only run at 30fps, nobody will care...

It's an arcade game ferpetesakes and have you ever seen an arcade game run at anything less than 50fps? Nope. Only us poor old souls with expensive hardware at home have to put up with that!

For me the joy of arcade racers IS the framerate...there's nothing like a well modelled palm passing smoothly through your peripheral vision while an approaching vista - jaggies and all- can be seen approaching from the horizon. Outrun 2 had it. Ridge Racer lives by it. GT5 redefines it.


Rant over!

Maybe I'm just being grumpy but I cant help but think by adding unnecessary extras they're diluting the game, if they didn’t spend the time developing buggies couldn’t we have had a more detailed damage model, if they didn’t add trucks couldn’t we have had much longer courses, a selection of co drivers, deformable terrain ...etc ...etc.

In my opinion Codemasters changed how they went about making a racing game after the releases of TOCA2 and CMR2 and not for the better.

"Why do 90% of PS2 games run at 60fps when only a meagre handful of 360/PS3 games can manage it? Gimmicks, that's why. Complex, CPU frazzling real physics engines such as Havok, real time lighting and over complicated reflections, track deformation, damage."

360 and PS3 were released way too soon and are seriously underpowered to deliver smooth HD graphics coupled with more complex game worlds. Lost generation, this...

"real physics engines such as Havok,"

Sorry to disappoint you old chap, but even Havok is a very, very rough approximation of "real" physics. The fact of the matter is we're unlikely to have anything powerful enough to do anything other than an approximation for quite some time yet.

Also I'm certain that 90% of the PS2 games I own don't run at 60hz. In fact the only one I can think of offhand is GT4.

"Maybe I'm just being grumpy but I cant help but think by adding unnecessary extras they're diluting the game, if they didn’t spend the time developing buggies couldn’t we have had a more detailed damage model, if they didn’t add trucks couldn’t we have had much longer courses, a selection of co drivers, deformable terrain ...etc ...etc."

I completely agree with this. By adding loads of extra types of vehicles, Dirt is trying to be all things to all people. The phrase "jack of all trades, master of none" is very appropriate imo.

I only liked the Rally and Hillclimb events in the 360 version of Dirt. About halfway through career mode I got fed up with the dull Yank shite like rigs, trucks and buggies, and I actually put those races on the lowest skill level just so I'd only have to do them once.

@lambtron
"Sorry to disappoint you old chap, but even Havok is a very, very rough approximation of "real" physics. The fact of the matter is we're unlikely to have anything powerful enough to do anything other than an approximation for quite some time yet."

Have a read through the Havok docs. You'd be amazed how much effort is put into their engine to make calculations as accurate as possible. Ultimately, ofcourse yes it is an approximation.

Games = smoke and mirrors. People seem to forget that.

Nice to see EG keeping bang up to date as always by using 2005's artwork in their header...

"Why do 90% of PS2 games run at 60fps when only a meagre handful of 360/PS3 games can manage it?"

Actually, I believe 90% of PS2 games *didn't* run at 60 fps. If you're looking for games on the console with that kind of frame rate, check out the 2d capcom fighters, games like guilty gear, and a few games released very early in the consoles life time. Every other game will skip frames like a bitch, especially newer games, as developers push the PS2 hardware to it's absolute limit.

The only reason no-one notices is because playing games on a tv makes everything look terrible.

EDIT: someone already wrote this exact comment, heh :). Note to self - read all the comments next time.

... and arcadey racers such as Outrun C2C, Burnout ...

(and plenty of other PS2 stuff ran in a frame, such as sundry Namco and Sega fighters, God of War etc. etc. It's horses for courses obviously - Shadow of the Colossus was a slideshow at times, for example, but the tradeoff in that case was worth it.

However, I'm strongly in the camp that believes 60fps is synonymous, and inseparably so, from that slick arcade "feel". There's a reason all those classic Model 2 and 3 games didn't trade away framerate for graphical extravagance. I reserve judgement on Sega Rally, however, not having played it.)

Odin Sphere on the PS2 runs at 6 fps more than it runs at 60. :)

These tired franchises (yes, including the beloved SR) bring so little with each iteration. Perhaps it's about time to enhance the experience physically and not just, you know, virtually.. =/

The PS2 didn't have to output a "clean" VGA resolution picture, it's interlaced let's not forget. And the thing skips frames too as mentioned previously.

From the review "It simply doesn't feel 'right' that the notes are no longer read by a dour Scotsman"

Nicky Grist is actually Welsh and having met him dour is not a word that can be used to describe him. He's one of the nicest happy go lucky people you could ever wish to meet.

I'm struggling to see the point of this review, considering something like FIFA 08 on Wii and DS are completely different titles to the usual 360 'multi-format title' review reviewed, but have yet to get a mention on here.

I'd definitely say the PS3 version is superior judging by the 2 demos - Then again when I played 360 version I was reeling in horror from how americanised it was compared to previous titles. Playing the PS3 version later on, the voices didn't bother me at all as I knew who the guy was...

I don't know what V-sync tearing is and can hardly tell the difference between 30fps and 60fps, but somehow I think its better that way.

the graphics are gorgeous and the damage is impressive,but thats as far as it goes,i found it got boring quickly.

gameplay>graphics which is why i would recomend sega rally over dirt.