Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots Comments by Rob Fahey
Solid Snake: Ovaltine Years. Read preview, watch trailer.
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"And while you'll see graphics of that level in the game, it might not add up to the same effect, due to you moving around and all."
A cut-scene isn't the same as gameplay? OH NOES!!!1! Last time I checked MGS is played using a top-down camera angle so of course it won't look the same. Even a monkey could spot the difference. If the cut-scenes (using the in-game engine, I might add) look this good, I'll be more than happy, as will most. Quit picking this thing apart - it clearly looks fantastic and is a great showcase for the PS3, gameplay or not. |
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Well the game is so damned far away, I wonder if the demo will look as good compared to other titles already available - though I never underestimate Kojima's ability to stun.
Hey, PES_Fanboy, I never said you CANT comment if you are not interested in MGS. I just said that there are some people who remind you every minute that they are not interested in MGS and don't care about the demo - THATS what bothers us. |
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We'll probably do something about Gears of War at some point this week, I guess. I'll say this straight out though - having seen both that and MGS4 running on giant hi-def screens this week, there's simply no comparison. It's cool that we have a proper idea of GoW's gameplay, definitely, whereas MGS is all cutscene so far (albeit real-time cutscene), but GoW's graphics aren't in the same league at all.
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LeDilettante : if you read the thread, you will see that there are OTHER people who have been bothered by this phenomenon of people discussing the demo and then saying they don't give a shit about either the game or the demo.
As for leaving these shores, I meant that particular thread only. NO SUCH LUCK FOR YOU GUYS ON EG!!!! MMMWWHHAHAHAHAAA!!!! |
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Pes_fanboy thats probably the best I've heard of all the guys preordering an xbox360. Not buying any games and testing them by renting, I think you can safely finish most of the games in a day or two.
Oh and please Kojima, make the game use a Resident Evil 4 type viewpoint. A topdown camera is lame.
Edited 1 times,
most recently on 19/09/05 @ 12:30
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FluffyTucker: You have homed in on the truth. PC graphics card ARE that underused. Why? Because NVidia and ATI are always trying to force us to buy their next-gen $600x2 card and getting us to ditch our current ones (which weren't cheap to begin with). How else can you explain Gran Turismo? MGS 4 certainly can be reproduced on a good enough PC, but guess what: it will never happen due to greed of PC hardware moguls!
IMHO, PC game programmers don't bother that much about optimizing their product.
Edited 1 times,
most recently on 19/09/05 @ 12:39
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Hmm. I think it's becoming increasingly obvious that where this next generation of consoles are concerned, the quality of graphics will have more to do with the ability (and/or budget afforded to) of the development team than the limitations of the hardware itself. This has always been true to a certain extent, but it will be much more pronounced on the 360 and PS3 methinks.
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cardboardMonster
19/09/05 @ 11:54
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GoW does look superb, but an inconsistent 30fps frame rate isn't quite as impressive as a flawless 60, so stills may not tell the whole story.
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Whether you love or hate MGS, you have to admit that the graphics (especially the FPS parts, ironically) looked amazing and far better then anything else seen so far on any format.
I didn't want to buy a PS3 but it is going to be very hard to resist after seeing visuals like this... DAMN YOU SONY! /shakes fist |
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"GoW does look superb, but an inconsistent 30fps frame rate isn't quite as impressive as a flawless 60, so stills may not tell the whole story."
Your "flawless 60" is a tech demo, no physics, no A.I, no collision detection, no gameplay, so cut-scenes with no realtime gameplay may not tell the whole story. |
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We'll probably do something about Gears of War at some point this week, I guess. I'll say this straight out though - having seen both that and MGS4 running on giant hi-def screens this week, there's simply no comparison. It's cool that we have a proper idea of GoW's gameplay, definitely, whereas MGS is all cutscene so far (albeit real-time cutscene), but GoW's graphics aren't in the same league at all.
Dare I say it? The REAL next-gen? |
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tonynibbles
19/09/05 @ 12:41
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Yeh - I do tend to listen more intently to the people actually at TGS.
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PES_Fanboy
19/09/05 @ 14:16
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IMHO, PC game programmers don't bother that much about optimizing their product.
Well, the main issue here is not knowing their platform. Being a long-in-the-tooth (too long to work in the entertainment industry anymore - thankless, badly-paid area that it is) QA engineer, I find it against most fibre of my being to defend developers, but this is a HUGE issue in PC gaming, both for the QA teams and devs. The possibilities of PC configurations playing your games is, on the whole, an unregulated nightmare of epic proportions. Early on in the actual development (i.e. past planning and design), suggested hardware resources are mooted (or should be), and when the beta drops, there are test rigs constructed of the most-common configurations. The game has to look equally (relatively) good on a shit config (draw distance shortened or res dropped) as it has to on a top spec - guess which one gets less time spent on it? Consoles are one (or two if you're MS now!) configuration, so they are much much easier to wring out all the performance - you know everyone's got the same gfx processor etc |
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Xavier_B_OXford
19/09/05 @ 16:57
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Why oh WHY do you pathetic cat raping $ony fans continue to delude yourselves that your beloved B$3 is going to ever be anything more than a piece of dogshit stuck to the heel of the mighty jack boot of the supreme Xbox 360?
Face facts, this video is about as 'real time' as the Killzone trailers from E3, which were about as real as my left testicle, WHICH I WAS BORN WITHOUT THANK YOU VERY MUCH, and to believe otherwise just shows how unbelievably sucked in you have become by the $ony hype machine, which will do nothing more than just shit you right back out like the snivelling smelly turds you are! And what's with the pitiful old man in this video? Is THIS what passes for a heroic figure on the BS3? A nicotine fuelled old codger who has to be looked after by Robbie the fucking Robot? Pathetic. You BS3 losers want to play around with an old man to get your kicks? That makes you perverts in my book. Us Xbox fans are a bit more normal thankfully. Now excuse me while I go and play with some soldiers... |
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tonynibbles
19/09/05 @ 17:05
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Dude, listen to yourself.
Just exactly how old are you? We're all gamers, we all love games. What the hell is wrong with you? |
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ReanimateD
19/09/05 @ 19:20
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Xavier_B_OXford, obviously you havent played any MGS games. ITs about realism, and Ive never seen a person not get old in real life, hence the.....wait a minute.....why am I even trying to justify it to you? *regrets the 15 seconds wasted on this post*....
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Cosmopolitan
19/09/05 @ 20:36
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"Why oh WHY do you pathetic cat raping $ony fans continue to delude yourselves that your beloved B$3 is going to ever be anything more than a piece of dogshit stuck to the heel of the mighty jack boot of the supreme Xbox 360? " (SNIP)
What's B$3? If it's a new console from Sony, I want it NOW! |
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all i know its real time demo well thats what Kojima said so i belive him
all u fag fanboys need to know both consoles will be able to handel the Unreal3 Eng. and there is no proof that Killzone was Prerenderd well i hope it looks like that and iam happy to see that sony still supports the ps2 a lot and dont forget the psp and MS is forgetting about the Xbox did see any new games and nitendo fuck you show me some games fuck the controller ( i love that they try new thinks ) whats MS plan for the X360 Sony has the Eyetoy Nitendo is trying the new controller MS is forgetting about Xbox 1 and no new game s like WE love katemari, or God of war really Whats their plan Gears of war is that it you have to do better Fuck all fan boys if iam wrong than PLZ proof it and dont start saying shit Where did you find that out i would like to know
Edited 2 times,
most recently on 20/09/05 @ 03:43
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Quote : "FluffyTucker: You have homed in on the truth. PC graphics card ARE that underused. Why? Because NVidia and ATI are always trying to force us to buy their next-gen $600x2 card and getting us to ditch our current ones (which weren't cheap to begin with). How else can you explain Gran Turismo? MGS 4 certainly can be reproduced on a good enough PC, but guess what: it will never happen due to greed of PC hardware moguls!
IMHO, PC game programmers don't bother that much about optimizing their product. " Wrong.. The reason pc gfx dont look this good is BECAUSE pc game programmers bother to optimise their products. A pc game programmer has to support the lowest (most popular) graphics card. Why spend time doing pretty special fx for the handful of graphic card owners who have the latest models (which as you say, are bloody expensive)? On a console, you can gaurantee every single owner will have the latest graphics hardware. On a pc, most people still havent upgraded their geforce 2's. With the majority of pc owners still running on geforce 3 spec pc's, you'd be mad to only support the high level stuff (and subsequently only sell 2 copies). |
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Smelly: i am fully with you on the fact that PC programmers don't know where their game will end up. My point is, why is that many PC games don't run that well on even a reasonably high-spec card? For example, I found my Myst V demo stuttering at 1280x1024 on my P4 3.0 GHz with a 6800GT. And does that mean that buying a high-spec card will ALWAYS be a losing battle?
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LeDilettante: You're kidding yourself. People said the same thing about the MGS2 trailer and look how that one turned out. I mean, why would they waste time creating something that won't even run on the final hardware? Give them a little more credit than that.
And you can't compare rendering stations (which is what your mate most likely works on) to dev kits. A dev kit is supposed to represent an approximation of the final hardware, not some uber-powerful machine that can run anything your throw at it. That would be extremely counter-productive. If anything the final hardware is supposed to be more powerful - as was the case with the 360, apparently. "-Will we see CGI scenes of that quality on PS3? Yes, but most likely they won't be rendered in real-time, hence the need for large capacity storage (Blu-Ray anyone?). " Are you kidding me? Don't act so dumb, I know you're smarter than that. You know full well Sony chose the blu-ray format to promote it to the average household, not so developers could fit more FMV in there to 'fool' the general public into thinking the PS3 is more powerful than it really is. Jeez. |
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It's most likely a dev tool they'll be using to create the final game, yes. They obviously have the ability to create effective cut-scenes using this, something which I'm sure they'll take advantage of. Obviously the gameplay has yet to be implemented, but I see no reason to assume the final product won't offer in-game cut-scenes of this quality. And considering the MGS series has always used its game engine to create cinematics, it's a safe bet that the gameplay will offer a similar level of visuals (albeit from a less dynamic top-down angle etc).
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Seriously, if anyone here thinks that this is truly what PS3 games are going to look like you are in for some serious dissapointment come launch day. This is clearly not in game footage, there isn't one shot that looks like you could control the character from it (when it actually gets to Snake that is), this, although clearly very pretty, is just a film trailer. Except it's not. At least with a film trailer what you see is pretty much what you're going to get when you get to the flicks. There's no guarantee that the finished product can live up to the quality of this trailer.
Personally I really want it to, but I just can't bring myself to really believe that it actually will. |
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Dev kit are usually hugely more powerful than the hardware the game will run on, in terms of rendering and so on.
Actually, dev kits are pretty much always significantly less powerful than the final hardware, until a few months before the launch date when they're brought up to the final spec. I wouldn't want facts to get in the way of your rambling, though :) |
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