Over-Achievers

By Simon Parkin Published 14 May, 2009

Gaming's greatest achievement (points).

With a grand total of 311,673 gamerpoints, Xbox Live User Stallion83 has won more in-game achievements than any other player. Indeed, he's earned the full 1000 gamerpoints for no less than 204 of the 437 games he's played on his Xbox 360, a Herculean accomplishment of time, effort and, in a great many cases, skill. And yet, as the URL of his website, www.1milliongamerscore.com makes perfectly clear, Stallion83's quest for numerical glory is not even halfway done.

Late last year, Armour Games released a free to play browser game titled Achievement Unlocked. The instructions read: "Who needs gameplay when you have ACHIEVEMENTS? Don't worry about beating levels, finding ways to kill enemies, or beating the final boss... there are none. Focus solely on your ultimate destiny: doing random tasks that have nothing to do with anything. Meta-game yourself with ease! Self-satisfaction never felt so... artificial!" To date the game has received 1,156,149 plays and enjoyed countless mentions and dissections on blogs and gaming websites around the world.

You know your idea has made it when close to 1.2 million people play a parody webgame about it. Come to think of it, you know your idea has made it when Sony steals it wholesale to use in its own console's online superstructure. Or when Blizzard builds it into the framework of the most popular MMO in history. Or when The Simpsons, that sieve of all cultural detritus worthy of satire, make it the subject of their game's very first joke, rewarding players with an Achievement merely for pressing the start button on the menu screen for the first time.

'Over-Achievers' Screenshot 1

Microsoft has been quick to respond to the Achievement love-in, allowing for web gamercards and Xbox.com integration, and making them more visually exciting in the NXE update.

It didn't take long for gamers' initial reaction to the Xbox 360's meta-reward system to turn from uncertainty to acceptance. For many, like Stallion83, it was then just a short hop to all-consuming obsession. That we should have become so enamoured with Achievements should be no great surprise. Maintaining an indelible record of our in-game accomplishments somehow ascribes them a greater sense of purpose and worth. And, by keeping a running tally of all the points we've ever won, the very act of playing videogames is turned into a high-score challenge, a meta-game that plays out across our entire videogame library, not just within individual titles.

But for all the satire, every gamer knows that Achievement points, as ridiculous and vacuous as they might appear to the outsider, reveal deep truths about why we play videogames. Humans like to be told they are clever and talented and skillful and videogames are machines precision-designed to do just that very thing. They may first hurl us on to spikes, blow us up and punch us in the tits, but these setbacks only make the accomplishments all the sweeter. Master a game system and, in contrast to the fickle vagaries of real life, you will have your reward. And we have become so accustomed to having our worth as a gamer relayed by a number - a high score in Pac-Man, a character's level in Final Fantasy, a number of kills in Halo - that simply watching a number slowly increase is often enough to convince us that what we're doing is somehow worthwhile, perhaps even that we are somehow worthwhile.

The truth is that Achievement points are, for many, the glue that holds Microsoft's Xbox Live service together, the reason why we buy a cross-platform game on one particular system and not the others, one's gamerscore simultaneously a badge of bragging rights, a measure of how thoroughly we play our games and, most troubling, an irrefutable record of how we spend our days.

From the perspective of a developer, however, Achievements have a great many other tangible benefits. They allow game-makers to tap into the different reasons why different players play particular games, sending one group off to collect a thousand orbs, another to accumulate ten thousand kills and another still to work to become the best in the world.

'Over-Achievers' Screenshot 2

The gnome quest in Half-Life: Episode Two is at the extreme end of the meta Achievement scale. (Thanks to PC Gamer's Tom Francis for the use of this screenshot.)

Some developers employ Achievements to encourage players to use all the in-game tools available to their character, or even to explain in explicit terms how the game systems work. Many developers use Achievements to make jokes or wry commentary. Dead Rising's 'Zombie Genocider', awarded for killing 54,594 zombies was drolly-trumped by Left 4 Dead, which offered 'Zombie Genocidist' for killing 53,595 of the undead. Almost all of Civilization Revolution's Achievement names will be hilarious to hardcore RTS nerds (and impenetrable for the rest of us).

Of course, at their worst, Achievements seek to somehow make up for a lack of interesting in-game challenges, sending players off on empty fetch-quests and inane collect-'em-up hunts. But at their best, they inspire us to play the game in new and interesting ways, subverting the games rule-set, and, in the case of Geometry Wars' Pacifism Achievement, even birthing new game modes in future sequels.

So we mock Achievement points because they spell out in large numbers what is so pathetic about videogames. But we also celebrate them, because, when used in funny, creative or interesting ways, they also spell out what is so compelling and wonderful about videogames. Because for every Achievement in which you have to do nothing more than play through a tutorial there's another that subverts convention, rewarding you for skipping it instead. For every fetch quest that has you collecting dogtags for the millionth time, there's another that makes you fight the baddy with your arms tied behind your back. And for every Achievement you earn in jest for pressing the start button, there's another that only rewards the single best player in the world. With that in mind, turn the page for ten of the very best.

1. Dead Rising

  • Achievement: 7-Day Survivor
  • Instruction: Survive for at least 7 days.
  • Gamerscore: 30
  • See it done.

As if being set upon in a mall by fifty thousand zombies at the end of the world wasn't enough of a challenge, the infamous 7-Day Survivor achievement requires you to play the game for 14 hours straight, while everyone and everything in the game is turned against you and, just to top it off, while having your health constantly deplete. Sure, it's a challenge of endurance, as much as skill, but this is the longest day for the Achievement whore rivaled only by Rock Band 2's Bladder of Steel achievement for an act of sadistic endurance.

2. Crackdown

  • Achievement: Body Armor
  • Instruction: Use the Harpoon gun to attach 5 gang member corpses to a single vehicle.
  • Gamerscore: 10
  • See it done.

More fun than using a rudimentary map printed out from Gamefaqs to locate that bastard last hidden orb, Body Armour has you using the DLC-exclusive harpoon gun to impale five gang members to a car of your choosing. The harpoons disappear after around 60 seconds, but that should be more than enough time to get the set. Brings new meaning to the phrase Pimp My Ride.

3. Fallout 3

'Over-Achievers' Screenshot 3

Forget killing this guy - go rescue a violin.

  • Achievement: Agatha's Song
  • Instruction: Completed "Agatha's Song".
  • Points: 20
  • See it done.

There's a cute sort of absurdity in having to trek across a post-nuclear wasteland in search of a priceless Stradivarius violin for an old lady. The instrument can be found in the depths of a pre-apocalypse recording studio (allegedly owned by one Rick Rubin), resting in a dusty violin case. Bring it back to the amiable Agatha and her melancholic strains will sound out across the wasteland's airwaves, a constant reminder that beauty can always somehow be salvaged from desolation.

4. Half-Life 2

  • Achievement: Targeted Advertising
  • Instruction: Pin a soldier to the billboard in chapter Highway 17.
  • Points: 5
  • See it done.

Valve knows better than most how to frame a good Achievement, and the developer's bumper game compilation, the Orange Box, is filled with ingenious meta-missions. Pinning a soldier to a billboard with the harpoon gun is one of gaming's most enjoyable visual puns.

5. Half-Life 2

  • Achievement: OSHA Violation
  • Instruction: Kill 3 enemies using the crane.
  • Points: 5
  • See it done.

How many times have you been sat at the controls of a 50-foot crane, just wishing you could tear off your safety helmet and start swinging its colossal steel arm around in wide arcing motions, like some sort of giant orange mace, flailing your co-workers in their faces until you achieve enough up force to take to the skies in your awesome crane-o-copter? Sadly, OSHA violation only lets us live out one of those fantasies.

6. Star Wars: The Force Unleashed

  • Achievement: Worst Day-Shift Manager Ever
  • Instruction: Kill 12 Stormtroopers as Vader during the Prologue.
  • Points: 10
  • See it done.

Darth Vader was never going to make for a good boss: too much mind control and distracting asthma to make working life pleasurable. But if you're the guy with the withered face under the mask, tossing your foot-soldier stormtroopers into nearby tree-trunks so their pathetic backs snap like your estranged son's temper? Well, that's another thing entirely.

7. Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock

'Over-Achievers' Screenshot 4

Pacifism wasn't just the best Achievement for Geometry Wars, it was a blueprint for one of the sequel's best modes - not to mention the Achievement strategies of numerous other games within and without.

  • Achievement: Tone Deaf
  • Instruction: Beat any song on the expert difficulty with the game's sound options turned down to zero.
  • Points: 5
  • See it done.

Many Achievements require players to self-limit themselves in order to increase the challenge. Tone Deaf is king of this approach, requiring players to complete any song on the hardest difficulty with the music turned off, playing an audio game with just the visual cues. Sadly, you can cheat by turning the sound options off for the last couple of notes of the song only, but still, it's the thought that counts.

8. Half-Life 2: Episode Two

  • Achievement: Little Rocket Man
  • Instruction: Send the garden gnome into space.
  • Points: 30
  • See it done.

Not so much a fetch-quest as an escort quest. Carrying a garden gnome through the entirety of Episode Two is one of gaming's most delicious and yet infuriating challenges, as anyone who's tried to balance the blasted thing on the bonnet of the rickety car in the Hunter-Chopper pursuit can attest. But it's all worth it when you get to see his stupid hobbitty face light up as you stuff him in the hold of the space shuttle, right? Right?

9. Final Fantasy XI

  • Achievement: Reach Character Level 75 (multiple)
  • Instruction: Achieved level 75 as [insert job class].
  • Points: 30 x 14
  • See it done: N/A

Widely regarded as the hardest 1000 gamerpoints you'll never earn, this set of Achievements is reserved for the player who manages to level every job class in Square-Enix's sprawling MMO to a dizzying level 75. As it takes the average player anything from 12-18 months to level a single job to that level, the idea of doing so for 14 different job classes is, how should we say, a long-term project. As far as Eurogamer is aware, nobody in the world has earned the full set of Achievements legitimately yet, and nobody is likely to within the next decade.

10. Shadowrun

  • Achievement: Shadowrun Fever
  • Instruction: "Catch it!"
  • Gamerpoints: 25
  • See it done.

The only STD-based Achievement we know of, Shadowrun Fever is viral in every sense of the word. Based on the popular American online sport of tea-bagging, in which sexually-confused teenagers dip their virtual balls into the mouths of dead teenage boys, you'll need to "catch it" off someone who already "has it". Oh God. No. I just read that sentence back. What the hell am I doing with my life? Achievement Unlocked: Reached Epiphany RE: Indefensible Futility of Your Hobby.

Picture of Simon.

About Simon Parkin

Simon Parkin is an author and journalist on video games. A regular contributor to Eurogamer since 2005, his work has also appeared in Edge, The Telegraph, Gamasutra and Boing Boing.

Read more articles from Simon by visiting the Simon Parkin archive page.

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Comments (132) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • penhalion #1 3 years ago

    What Gnome quest?

  • Murbal #2 3 years ago

    Someone's been playing Too Human...

  • Yossarian #3 3 years ago

    Article needs more 'Nothing Special'.

  • Gecks #4 3 years ago

    earth defence force 2017's inferno mode is my 'proudest' achievement. after that dinged i emerged sweating from the lounge proclaiming "I AM EDF!"

  • muscleblade #5 3 years ago

    The Shadowrun Fever is amazing. You do not only need to kill a person that has the achievement, but you need to teabag him a good few times for it to unlock. Crazy stuff really. They got the idea from all the teabagging in Halo 2.
    Edited by 2 at 14/05/09 @ 14:13

  • jonsaan #6 3 years ago

    I thought every single one of Fallout 3 achievements could be added easily on the PC version?

  • Tyronne #7 3 years ago

    Gnome quest...I think it is where you find a gnome pretty early on and have to take it with you through the levels and then when you get to the rocket arming bit near the end, you place the gnome inside the nose cone and launch it into space.

  • Sir_TimAlot #8 3 years ago

    Achievements rocked my world......now trophies do.

  • Wastelander #9 3 years ago

    I've got Zombie Genocider!
    DR had some fantastic achievements. Really worked with the multiple playthrough nature of the game.

  • Darren #10 3 years ago

    I lost interest in Achievements about two years ago when I realised that they were actually distracting me from enjoying and playing the games normally. I can't remember the last time I noticed I had one, I think I have them disabled in the Notifications menu. So now I tend to just ignore them, which is even easier now my gaming platform is my PC, though they do unfortunately crop up in the odd game on that system too.

    They're the most pointless thing ever IMO and a wasted opportunity to actually reward the gamer with something *useful*, for example, unlocking a new costume, vehicle or bonus level, that kind of thing. Even free themes and gamer card pictures or even Avatar costumes would be better than a meaningless number attached to a digital card that no-one else but you is interested in.

    Anyone know my Gamercard score? No, neither do I! :D
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 14:23

  • sanctusmortis #11 3 years ago

    Achievements certainly have some great examples; getting all orbs in Crackdown felt great, as did getting every point out of Fallout 3 and Fable 2.

    You need to do a 10 cheapest list, though; I vote for Avatar, Virtual On Oratorio Tangram (10 points for watching a video?) and Dash of Destruction (200GSP, free game)

  • DUFFMAN5 #12 3 years ago

    Achievements are fookin great, Spent the morning whoring for some in Mercs 2, winch level 3 and race nicely on my gamercard now ;)

  • Mark1412 #13 3 years ago

    "They're the most pointless thing ever IMO and a wasted opportunity to actually reward the game with something useful"

    For you perhaps, but again read the article. There's a huge argument as to why they're great, mostly centering around the fact the best ones promote either approaching the game in alternate ways, or doing ridiculous things that are FUN. Wasted opportunity for those of us who want a little more replay value or enjoy the occassional humourous achievement? Nope.

    Again wasted opportunity for who? Microsoft have created a massive niche following of people addicted to these things that buy and play games on the 360 for the achievement support, it's one of the selling points of its console to a small market. Wasted business opportunity? Nope.

    Halo did the whole costume thing too.

  • Xerx3s #14 3 years ago

    I actually walked around for 40 something hours with that violin before I knew what to do with it (found it before I got the quest).

  • Sir_TimAlot #15 3 years ago

    Give Agatha a sheet of music paper and ask for a reward for a sweet unique Scoped .44 Magnum Blackhawk

  • PrivateFloyd #16 3 years ago


    when i first got my xbox i would play any old tripe (case in point if you look at my tag!!) At no point did it get obsessive, just friendly banter between mates down the pub about whose e-penis is bigger.

    Nowadays im alot less bothered unless i am actually interested in the path leading to "Achievement Unlocked". A good example being the recent wolverine game where the achievements led you to vary fighting styles and moves and even the little easter eggs that could be found. And a special mention to L4D achievements. Yossarian + legend ; )

    My rule of thumb now is if a game keeps my attention long enough to earn a shedload of achievements, great. if it doesn't, no big deal.

    I have been slated many a time by alot of people by some of the shite that is on my games list but who cares, you didnt have to endure it, i did!! (although even i cringe about some of the things i have played; lost, CSI, Surfs up, Open Season - im looking at you!)

  • Yossarian #17 3 years ago

    The two achievements I am proudest to have.

    1. Halo 3's 'Annual': added a year after the game's release, this is unlocked by playing the last level of the game to completion again with three buddies, on Legendary, with the Iron skull on, and all of you driving individual Ghosts (!) instead of piling into the usual Warthogs. Hilarity and friendships ensue.

    2. Left 4 Dead's 'Nothing Special': complete a campaign in one run without anyone taking so much as a point of damage from any of the special infected (hunters, boomers, smokers, witches, and, yes, tanks). Masochistic madness.

  • Aggesan #18 3 years ago

    @designerheadache

    That's a pretty awesome feat. I heard it's a rather difficult game. I really want that game, but I'll hold out until E3 to see if it will be announced to be released in Europe. If not, I'll import it.

  • Wastelander #19 3 years ago

    I quite liked Lost Odyssey's "Million points of Damage" and "500 Perfects" achevements as well.
    You got them naturally just by playing the game, but they were cool little landmarks anyway.

  • Bigglesworth #20 3 years ago

    Don't understand the whole achievement whore thing at all. Franky it seems kinda tragic IMO.

    Agreed. Trophy Whoring is where it's at!

  • GreyBeard #21 3 years ago

    12-18 months for a level 75 in FFXI is something of an exaggeration.

    5 years ago that would have been accurate, but thanks to a re-profiled difficulty curve and a lot of changes to make gaining experience points easier and less dangerous its realistic to say its more like 4-6 months of casual pay.

    There are methods to level a lot faster than that (the fastest I've ever heard is 2 weeks), but obviously that requires supportive friends and a masochistic dedication to the grind. (No-lifers only)

  • geeza2020 #22 3 years ago

    crane-o-copter = LOL, thanks for the afternoon pick-up!

  • Domovoi #23 3 years ago

    That Tone Deaf achievement is great. A nice second is the one in which you have to complete the game both in normal and lefty flip mode, or the one where you have to use a regular controller, but they're not quite as evil as having to turn off the sound.

    My 'proudest' achievement moment was getting the Lone Wolf achievement in The Lost and Damned, in which you have to kill a Rockstar employee in the Lone Wolf multiplayer mode. The very first time I tried that mode, I got lucky and came across the wolf on a long straight stretch by accident, gunned him down, and got the achievement. Either there are an awful lot of Rockstar employees playing that game all the time, or it was a real lucky shot.

    Best application of achievement titles is Lego Indy, for me. I didn't look at the achievement list before playing, so every time I happened to do something that triggered an achievement I was treated with an unexpected but funnily appropriate movie quote.

  • Yossarian #24 3 years ago

    I think well-designed achievements, as this article says, can cast a new perspective on something, subvert or play with a game's design, or even bring you closer to your XBL friends. Generally they give you reasons to keep playing games long after you might have discarded them otherwise.

    But bad achievements, and achievement whoring for the sake of gamerscore, are the devil's work.

  • SYS64738 #25 3 years ago

    Everybody their own I guess and if they add some extra replay value to the game then surely that's a positive thing - it's not like the game *forces* you to go for achievements..

    Can't say I'll ever get into it though, just don't have the time/dedication/stamina and would fall into the same category as other posters that focus on game progression only - having said that I gained a handfull of points by accident once while playing GTA4... thought first oh no not one of those stupid OMGWTF10 errors again - before i realised it was only just a GFW notification :D

  • Super_Zee #26 3 years ago

    I really like Achievements - I'm not obsessive about them but I really enjoy trying to get them on a second playthrough.

    The Gnome one wrecked HL2:Ep2 for me, though - carried the little bastard almost to the end, put him down safely for an arena battle then found some invisiwalls has appeared meaning I couldn't get him. Turned it off and never finished it.
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 14:44

  • DFawkes #27 3 years ago

    The ORange Box has some of the best. I loved the one for doing Ravenholm (a place they apparently "don't go";) with just the Gravity Gun. Turns it into a survival horror section, where you're always mindful of where the closest bit of scenery is in case you need to pelt it at someone.

    And the one for kiling with a toilet. that's always funny.
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 14:43

  • Sir_TimAlot #28 3 years ago

    I grew quite attached to that little gnome, we had some good times, and some bad, but was truly sad to see him go as i blasted him into space...........its what he wanted.

  • menage #29 3 years ago

    I like achievements. Not the full 1000 score thing cause I have better things to do, but some are really fun. It's not like in game skill challenges werent there before achievements, ratchet had them already for example. So they are the same idea only implemented better and in all games. Gamerscore is useless though, but I still like it when I hit another level.
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 14:43

  • Xerx3s #30 3 years ago

    There has to be some irony in voicing your opinion about how tragic and unimportant achievements are on some comments section on the internet.

  • Anthony_UK #31 3 years ago

    Mile High Club?

  • VicViper #32 3 years ago

    @darren

    Tut tut thanks to Eurogamers linking of gamertags to your profile anyone can tell you and you invited everyone to check I suprised none has.

    I'm sitting at 16k ish and for a while I was trying very hard to get as many as I could I lost interest like yourself, but if the achievement inspires a way of playing the game outside the norm I can get behind that. Pacifisim from the1st Geometry Wars is a prime example of making your play the game differently in an interesting way unfortuantly that type is the minority I do not need an achievement for beating a level the story/progression should be reward enough.

  • metalangel #33 3 years ago

    So many great achievements, and you waste two slots of the top ten with Targeted Advertising and OSHA Violation? The Gnome one is only hard because of Valve's shit game design. The "amazing" physics engine causes the gnome to clip through the car as soon as you start moving (for some reason you can't open the trunk to put it in, or ask Alyx to hold it) and there's one sequence where you leave the car and go fight. I left the gnome in the car, only to find that a scripted sequence resulted in the car being moved and the gnome didn't come with it. And an invisible wall prevented me from climbing back over the easily scaleable wall to get back to where it would be.

  • Batfink #34 3 years ago

    Don't care for them myself. If I want to play the game in an inventive way, I'll use my imagination, thanks!

  • kinky_mong #35 3 years ago

    PEDANTIC POINT: Targeted Advertising in Half Life 2 is done with the Crossbow, there isn't a harpoon gun in Half Life. Agatha's Song is also a bit of a strange choice for top 10 achievements when the same game has Psychotic Prankster.

    I think achievements are the best new development of this generation of consoles. I've always been a completionist when playing computer games and it's great that there is now a more visual representation of my efforts.

    It's unfortunate that some developers feel the need to use achievements to push their lousy multi-player modes (grinding out Kingpin in Saints Row 2 was a particularly dark moment for me) but when a really inventive set of achievements is used in a game it really extends the lifespan of a game (Valve being the kings of this).

  • smernicki #36 3 years ago

    my proudest achievement is probably winning a match of SF4 online

    most poorly implemented achievement i've found was probably Soul Calibur 4 when i got 5gp for switching the game on

  • Remy #37 3 years ago

    Yossarian & others have it spot on. Except "the devils work" doesn't do it justice when bad achievements combine with competitive online games. Then bad achievements can actually ruin the game itself.

    Can I plug my own blog about this topic here? Yep I reckon I can ;)
    [link url=http://agoners.wordpress.com/2008/11/24/to-strive-t o-achieve/
    ]http://ag oners.wordpress.com/2008/11/24/...[/link]
    [link url=htt p://agoners.wordpress.com/2008/11/25/4tw11one/
    ]http://ag oners.wordpress.com/2008/11/25/...[/link]

    Oh and my fave meta-game with gamerscore.. getting it to read exact numbers that are meaningful to me:
    [link url=http://agoners.wordpres s.com/2009/02/15/ultimate-achievement-unlocked-macross-gamer score/
    ]http://ag oners.wordpress.com/2009/02/15/...[/link]

    I'm also glad reading Super_Zee that someone else has witnessed the annoyance of invisible walls appearing in HL games. It's been driving me mad.

    One thing that's totally wrong about the article.. Civilization Revolution achievements being in-jokes for RTS fans? What? Firstly Civ Rev isn't even RTS (although it sort of is online I know). But its achievements are all historical or movie references or simply 'appropriate' titles & really quite widely 'got' I'd say:
    http://ww w.xbox360achievements.org/game/...

  • Negotiator #38 3 years ago

    Off topic, anybody preorder Fight Night 4 and got the code for the demo, because I am still waiting.

  • kinky_mong #39 3 years ago

    Negotiator, is there an achievement for asking that question in every comments section?

    UTFF (Use the fucking forum)

  • Negotiator #40 3 years ago

    Now I know why you call yourself mong.

  • paulf #41 3 years ago

    call me old school but I'm not really bothered about acheivements, I did get 1000/1000 in King Kong though ...

  • Negotiator #42 3 years ago

    Answer the question!

  • Domovoi #43 3 years ago

    Yes, I got it. If you didn't get it yet, then that means you won't get it. I guess that means preordering a second copy, or having to wait until it's out. Sucks for you.

  • sneetch #44 3 years ago

    @Darren
    I lost interest in Achievements about two years ago when I realised that they were actually distracting me from enjoying and playing the games normally.

    Yep, sometimes they just prove a drain on the enjoyment, the "Kill 100,000 enemies whilst backflipping off a trash can" or "Complete a 10 minute section without taking damage" style achievements have actually put me off playing games. I'm a bit of a completion-ist and if I know I can't complete something then I often can't be bothered starting it.

    I personally like achievements that unlock naturally during the course of the game, for finishing chapters, beating bosses, getting equipment and so on. I don't like missible ones (especially collection ones where areas can't be re-entered) or branching achievements, where you can only get one of several per playthrough, Ninja Gaiden is the worst offender there, requiring about 8 playthroughs to get all the achievements, that's frankly unreasonable, IMO. Mass Effect was poor too, requiring 3 playthroughs minimum to unlock 1000 points. When I realised that it sapped the fun for me, it became work.

    Since then I've largely just ignored achievements, if they unlock cool but I'm not gonna waste my time standing in a field slaughtering Gribxox to get the "Killed 15,000 Gribxox in a row" achievement. Still haven't finished Mass Effect though, that left a sour taste in my mouth.

    Anyone who doesn't "get" achievements: they're just another type of reward for gaming, they provide positive reinforcement, an acknowledgement that you've achieved something (well fancy that ;) ). Just a mechanism where the game says "nice one". A basic knowledge of human behaviour will tell you that people who feel rewarded by an activity will be more inclined to continue with that activity. It's the reason people play games, you feel enjoyment and rewarded for your time. Achievement whoring is just chasing that reward, people do that kind of thing all the time, the same as going for the high score or trying to complete a game 100%.
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 15:40

  • seasidebaz #45 3 years ago

    most poorly implemented achievement i've found was probably Soul Calibur 4 when i got 5gp for switching the game on

    I would disagree. Dynasty Warriors gives you 20 points the first time you save the game.

  • Negotiator #46 3 years ago

    Yes, I got it. If you didn't get it yet, then that means you won't get it. I guess that means preordering a second copy, or having to wait until it's out. Sucks for you.

    Are you telling me I preorded it for nothing, is that what your telling me.

  • a8a #47 3 years ago

    FFXI isnt THAT bad. The first job to 75 will take a loooong time. After that, the process is speeded up considerably by better knowledge of the game... and more money :p Sure, it's probably still the hardest one in the list. But there are plenty of people out there with Maat's Cap (the ingame recognition of having levelled 15 of the games current 20 jobs to 70+). Most of those will of course be on PC... not sure if there is anyone with the full set of achievements on 360.

  • midnight_walker #48 3 years ago

    @Domovoi: Sorry to burst your bubble, but I think that achievement is a viral one - so you get one for killing anyone who has ever killed anyone who has ever killed anyone who's killed a dev, and someone else would get it for killing you. I too got it on my first kill when GTA was free for a week.

  • Murbal #49 3 years ago

    Achievements are so well implemented. So says my PS3 owning brother-in-law when he came round to play GW:RE2 recently.

  • Spydy #50 3 years ago

    Why put yourself through hell trying to reach a number that means squat?

  • Gecks #51 3 years ago

    @sneetch
    i thought the mass effect achievements were great. the game gets much better on the harder difficulties, and i probably wouldn't have touched them if it wasn't for the achievements. much like the whole 'dark side'/'light side' aspect. as much as i enjoyed KOTOR, i gave up a few hours into my 'dark side' playthrough. by using the achievements, mass effect had that tiniest of incentive for me to commit to playing the game through that second or third time, and once you get past the tedious citadel section, the game is its own reward.

    i think of achievements as ways of the developer flagging up parts of their game that you might otherwise miss. you could argue that good game design would do that for you regardless, but good game design is hard to find and achievements can be done by the work experience boy.
    Edited by 2 at 14/05/09 @ 15:50

  • Domovoi #52 3 years ago

    @midnight_walker: Seriously? That'd be dissapointing, but hey, free achievement. I do wonder why it says "Kill a Rockstar developer in a ranked multiplayer match" though, instead of "Kill somebody who has this achievement"?

  • Farzlepot #53 3 years ago

    I enjoyed many of the achievements in Fable 2. It's the only game I've ever played where you get rewarded for setting up an orgy, or getting a town full of people pissed. Fallout 3 is the only game I own where I've got all of the available achievements, including the DLC stuff, but that just has more to do with the fact that I love the game so much that I've been everywhere and done everything regardless of the achievements. I've come close on Call of Duty 4 too (I'm not doing that epilogue mission on Veteran difficulty, it's just too frustrating), which also had a couple of interesting ones.

    Half-Life and Portal are interesting beasts. As I only play Half-Life games on PC I've only had the opportunity to get achievements in Episode 2, and unfortunately back when it was released the achievements didn't seem to be stored on a central server anywhere - so as soon as Windows needed re-installing, the next time I played the game all of the achievements were wiped clean. But even though there was no gamerscore, I still made an effort to get some of them because of how entertaining they were.

    The article is spot-on really - good, creative achievements bring their own rewards and encourage you to play in different ways. And there are some really, really bad ones too. I'm looking at you, Rockstar!
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 16:12

  • Jonny5Alive7 #54 3 years ago

    I agree about the violin thing actually, its just a side mission just like all the other side missions it isn't really made different by it being an achievement. Psychotic Prankster is the best one, I didn't even know it was possible to do that until going through the list.

  • smernicki #55 3 years ago

    "most poorly implemented achievement i've found was probably Soul Calibur 4 when i got 5gp for switching the game on

    I would disagree. Dynasty Warriors gives you 20 points the first time you save the game."

    i think one of the madden games i played also had an achievement for turning the game on. IMO that's worse than first save, although not by much....

  • GamesConnoisseur #56 3 years ago

    No one doesnt have to really like the Achievement or feel that you are forced to play the game a certain way, just play game for fun!

    Very well written article that recognised the value that the system brings and how its being copied (sure MS wasnt first), I have said previously and I ll say again. This gamerscore and achievements system have added value and created new way of playing games that I would NEVER have tried to do so previously.

    Play on a more difficult mode or play as evil character, and missed out a lot from the games. Check out my gamerscore, I do not have many 1000/1000 as I m NOT going to grind my way to get 1000. I only play as long as I m interested or its fun.

    There are lots of example where it really worked and others that its fallen flat on its face. Devs are more creative and challenging gamers to do more. For me switching off Achievement would be in a way to deny yourself chance to play the game in a certain way? Forget the idea collections quests or getting a full skillsets, I m referring to being encouraged to do better and trying to play a game a bit differently.

    Believe you me, that the Achievement/Trophy is now here to stay and will exist in one form or another from this generation onwards.

  • kinky_mong #57 3 years ago

    @ Negotiator: If that's your best attempt at a witty retort than I can only assume you haven't received your Fight Night demo because GOD HATES YOU.

  • muscleblade #58 3 years ago


    "I put in reasonable hours on my machine and I'm at around 6,000 I think"

    Really! I play a few hours here and there and i have almost 70 000.

    "Gaming should be about fun, and sometimes, not always, but sometimes Achievements distract from that badly"

    That is very true. Thankfully the achievement lists has gotten better and better.

  • Gearskin #59 3 years ago

    Achievements can be great if they are used to extend the life of a game. The ones that are there purely because they have to be are pointless though. Fight Night Round 3 being a perfect example. Nothing hard about that.

    It's the ones where you have to beat the game on different difficulties, or perform specific actions that rock. Like forcing the player to beat Dead Space using "One Gun."

  • Negotiator #60 3 years ago

    @ Negotiator: If that's your best attempt at a witty retort than I can only assume you haven't received your Fight Night demo because GOD HATES YOU.

    I thought it was pretty good.

  • Chupakun #61 3 years ago

    Yay, maybe I too should join this race for wasting my time only to achieve an arbitrary sum of numbers that says nothing about my skills in a game. And the reward? Why, an ever-growing number of course!

  • gallow #62 3 years ago

    I don't really care about achievements/trophy's but at the same time I look at my mates trophy list and think they have more than me so I must do something about it. That then goes against me having no time to collect trophy's as I don't have much time so I just play through games and move onto the next. But inventive tasks like the gnome quest would be fun.
    Edited by 1 at 14/05/09 @ 17:10

  • DUFFMAN5 #63 3 years ago

    I completed Fear and got under 100 I think, for beating the fookin game!
    I wish that the split between off line and on line was 90/10 in all cases. I don't play over Live much due to my main gaming time being 04:00-06:00, at this time (uk) you mostly get Yanks on line and that really isn't for me!
    Edited by 2 at 14/05/09 @ 17:12

  • _LarZen_ #64 3 years ago

    Im a Playstation3 fan but I love the achievment system on the X360 so im gonna buy only exclusive games for the PS3 from now on....the rest is gonna be all on the X360.

  • Stoatboy #65 3 years ago

    The worst achievement IMO is Guitar Hero 2's "fail a song on easy" one. I doubt many people got it without deliberately playing to lose.

    It also has one for sitting through about 20 minutes of credits too. I got that one whilst playing King's Bounty on my PC.

  • DUFFMAN5 #66 3 years ago

    Meet John Woo anyone ?

  • dudefella #67 3 years ago

    No "Irony"? Fail.

  • onyxbox #68 3 years ago

    Getting excited about Achievements is like getting excited about Tesco Points that don't buy you anything or give you a discount.

    Wat's the f'ing point in that?

    I understand that it can be used to highlight things in the game that may not have been noticed but surely the game should be compelling enough and have a rewards system in built for trying certain things... having a public version of it simply puts pressure on those who care about the system to do the things without any other compelling reson other than to "Get Gamerscore"

    Rather than award the gamer with something like a new wepon etc. we end up with a 'Badge' that's f'ck all use to anyone.

    Sorry... Achievements / Trophies are not for me and I wonder what impact they have on the direction of game design....

    Shall we craft a proper reward system for trying things out such as Mario / Metroid etc. or shall we just throw in some Achievements?

    Lets just hope that the answer is always "Yes" .... que Avatar !

    Nevermind eh?

    /rant over

  • Pastici #69 3 years ago

    But Tesco points are actually worth money, you can buy food with the coupons they send you.

    I like them, I'm guilty of playing a few games just for the cheevos, mainly Skate and Skate 2 but I love them games to death.

  • smernicki #70 3 years ago

    "shall we craft a proper reward system for trying things out such as Mario / Metroid etc. or shall we just throw in some Achievements?"

    oh dear.... Nintendo fan-boy upset over no achievements eh? ;-)

    just kidding

  • RustyBullet #71 3 years ago

    I wont mention no names cos he cries when i make out that he is a cheating little whore, but i think achievements are great expesialy when you earn them youreself, what gets me is when some little dip shit downloads someone elses hard work and tries to pass them off as his/hers own work. Then achievements become pointless. At least on the PS3 trophies cant be glitched.

  • FogHeart #72 3 years ago

    Achievements given just for marking progress through a game are pointless. "Congratulations, you aren't bored enough of this game to stop playing yet!" Meh. So let's forget Agatha's Song as an interesting achievement, yes?

    Doing cool-and-wacky things are much better. Like the HL2 crossbow and the Crackdown ones.

    But I want some achievements based on freaky bad luck happening to you. Like in L4D, I want an achievement for being boomered, smokered and pounced in the space of a few seconds. You know, so if someone sees that you have the achievement, they think "Oh shit! The poor sod!"

  • Kafkaesque #73 3 years ago

    RE: FFXI achievement - if you're playing a couple of hours every night as many MMOers do, you're looking at a couple of months to get there once you've gone round once as long as you can get a party. And to be fair, FFXI is one MMO where you can usually get a party going at any level, the main restriction is having a donkey job no-one wants in a party (hello PUPs everywhere!). Plus there are people who've been playing for 7 years on PS2 and PC who've migrated to 360, they can get the achievements straight away as long as they've got the required levels.

    One achievement I'm gutted never to have got despite completing every other song on Expert on GH and Rock Band is Kick The Bucket. Might have to have another crack at that, but I have to say I'm not as sharp as I was, GH4 doesn't push you anything like as hard as GH3.

  • Ryze #74 3 years ago

    I really don't have the time to finish most of my games these days, nevermind chase achievements.

    When I retire in 2045, then I'll focus on them... if I was still 15, then they'd be irresistable.

  • bad09 #75 3 years ago

    I like achievements, but not really bothered about them.

    Sure it's nice when one pops up and I always get a little proud if it's a good one, I beat my chest to a few like some of the L4D ones or 100 wins on SF4 :)

    Honestly though I don't play to get a 1000 (just look at my profile) and just don't see the point, I much rather just play the game (or not if it's crap!). Of course though, to some, achievements are part of the games now. Some poor lonely souls buy crap or even cheat to get them..

    / buys Avatar for a easy 1000....

    Oh, are any other multi console owners completely uninterested in Sony's offering? For some reason I just could not care less that trophies were added.

  • kentmonkey #76 3 years ago

    "Dead Rising's 'Zombie Genocider', awarded for killing 54,594 zombies was drolly-trumped by Left 4 Dead, which offered 'Zombie Genocidist' for killing 53,595".....yes, I can see exactly how L4D trumped Dead Rising. The developers must be very upset by being drolly-trumped by a game requiring 999 less kills to get an achievement. Very upset indeed.

  • patchbox360 #77 3 years ago

    the amount of red rings seen while racking up these points must have hurt

  • 8bitMofo #78 3 years ago

    A game that challenges me to do something while playing through, I don't mind.
    Multiplayer achievements are by far the stupidest ones.



    secretly looks forward to the 1750 points upgrade
    Edited by 3 at 14/05/09 @ 19:52

  • Gearskin #79 3 years ago

    ... you do realise the games are made first, right?

  • Retroid #80 3 years ago

    @lord: I don't particularily see how. I nfact, I think they've led some developers / gamers to be more creative with content.

  • Stoatboy #81 3 years ago

    @lord: Compared to the rest of the development process it takes fuck all time to make a bunch of achievements - even really good ones. We're talking a few man-weeks absolute tops in a dev-time totalling maybe 100's of man-years. Pretty much negligible.

  • Carlo #82 3 years ago

    Have we ran out of games to review or something?

    What the fuck is this shit article?

  • goz #83 3 years ago

    Lord: the Unreal Engine's been used on loads of non-FPS titles. Last Remnant, a JRPG for example.

    I mean, you're well within your rights to dislike the output of this generation's consoles, but whatever your beef is, achievements and the Unreal Engine are certainly not to blame...

  • The-Bodybuilder #84 3 years ago

    Achievements was the first thing to tell me I was no longer a "hardcore" gamer anymore.

  • Ryze #85 3 years ago

    lord's a serial chat-shit gimp.

    Best ignored.

    /snatches rose tinted specs

    Aaaaah.....

    /begins to hate on a fantastic (360 + secondary gaming machine) current gen

  • ViralNinja #86 3 years ago

    Wheres the "not bullet proof" for dying on easy mode in fiddy cent5 ? the "irony" from Bioshock for photographing wossiname? The achievement in Mirror's Edge for flicking some one the V? The Rock Snob award in GH2?

    And why after going on about it so bloody much in the article was Pacifism not listed as one?

  • The-Bodybuilder #87 3 years ago

    There are two types of gamers; the quantitative and the qualitative.

    Those of the former, generally care for achievements. The numbers in itself are some sort of quantification for thier gaming.
    For the latter folks (like me),achievemts mean jack all unless they were something more qualititative. Give me items, clothes, cars, weapons for getting an acheivement. Heck, give me gamerpoints for achievements (something initially thought it would be the first time I got a 360. Shame).

    I don't hate or judge people for liking them, and I can even see the point. As for me, I play games to avoid work and escapism, to enjoy the actual content itself and not achievements, So they mean nothing to me.

  • Genji #88 3 years ago

    Not bothered at all with them. They encourage people to play a game in different ways? I do that anyway! :)

    It would be much more worthwhile for me if they actually unlocked something in the game (ala Dead Rising, but more substantial), or earned you something other than a little number next to your name.

    They're a good idea, I suppose, but not that much different from just unlocking things within a game - at least not for me.

  • 3william56 #89 3 years ago

    Hardly "gaming's" greatest achievements - 360 gaming maybe. Ratchet and Clank had 'achievements' - skill points - albeit without the online willy waving - years before the 360 was a little red ring in Microsoft's eye, and has some great ones. Personal favourite: Happy Feat in R&C:F TOD - penguin a bunch of enemies, then get them dancing with the groovitron. Flower has some cute ones too, and I don't think much beats WipeoutHD for b*stard hardcore.

    So let's not feed the bias police - lets have a list of PS Trophies to match.

  • muscleblade #90 3 years ago

    "Achievements was the first thing to tell me I was no longer a "hardcore" gamer anymore. "

    Ok. But tell me. Are you a "hardcore" bodybuilder?

    @3william56

    You dont even know what you are talking about. The 360 achievements beat the PS3 trophies just because its easier to compare them to friends. Otherwise they are the same for the multiplatform titles. RE5, SFIV and BO:paradise have the same achievements/throphies on both systems for example.

  • ccfb #91 3 years ago

    "So let's not feed the bias police - lets have a list of PS Trophies to match. "

    Bias schmias. The core of this article is explained in the first paragraph : the NUMBERS. People like watching that ticker roll up by 10s and 20s. MS are pretty clever for pandering to that particular OCD.

    Also, nice to see the article acknowledge that "achievements" are actually anything but.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 09:25

  • miiiguel #92 3 years ago

    Still don´t understand the whining about Achievements, you can ignore them, you know that, don't you ? Regarding Trophies... lol! Clearly a rushed attempt to catch the full speed train.

    note-to-self: says the guy with 92% game completion.

    edit: oh. nowdays I tend to finish game's on Hard as well, if there's a tile to unlock. The gen before I rarely did that. And sometimes the games reach a new level of awesomeness when played on Hard.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 10:36

  • muscleblade #93 3 years ago

    "The gen before I rarely did that"

    I believe you rarely played games with a metacritic average score below 50% either like you do now.

  • Demiath #94 3 years ago

    Achievements don't really exist. If you have your Xbox 360 offline at most times (like I have for the last three years or so since I bought it) you'll never care about them, and be a happier person for it.

  • miiiguel #95 3 years ago

    "I believe you rarely played games with a metacritic average score below 50% either like you do now."

    What's a "metacritic" ? You mean other ppl's opinions?

    "If you have your Xbox 360 offline at most times "
    That's so weird... but don't mind me it's just my opinion, and that happiness thing it's "just yours" as well, right ?

  • The-Bodybuilder #96 3 years ago

    >"Ok. But tell me. Are you a "hardcore" bodybuilder? "

    Can't see the relevance, but I'm definately not. Heck, I wouldn't even consider myself a bodybuilder anymore, so my name is quite misleading.

  • Hypercube #97 3 years ago

    I quite liked Lost Odyssey's "Million points of Damage" and "500 Perfects" achevements as well.
    You got them naturally just by playing the game, but they were cool little landmarks anyway.

    I got the 1,000,000 ponts of damage while killing the Blue Dragon, so got two achievements after that battle. But I agree, it's nice to have a little landmark to let you know how far you've gone.

    Having only recently purchased an XBox 360, I am ambivalent about most achievements in all honesty. I think I would prefer to get one without knowing I was gong for it - like in RE5, I got an achievement for knocking an arrow out of the air with the knife. I didn't know there was an achievement for it, but it felt good to be told how cool I was ;)

  • muscleblade #98 3 years ago

    "What's a "metacritic" ? You mean other ppl's opinions?"

    Its the review average of most magazines and websites. If the average is below 50% like with Hot Wheels and CSI and you like those games better than say games with 90%+ average you have a pretty weird taste regarding games imo. I mean SFIV is one of the best fighters ever made but the achievements are both hard and timeconsuming. Is that reason enough to ignore the game. Of course not. Thats just silly.

  • muscleblade #99 3 years ago

    @The Bodybuilder

    Must be a pretty old picture on your profile then. Your in pretty good shape. It is you right?

    Reminds me that i need to take a new picture for my gamertag.

  • miiiguel #100 3 years ago

    huh? Can I not like SF4?... lol. Anyway, I like to read reviews, but fuck me if I ever let someone tell me what to do with my money.

    I couldn't imagine not buying/playing the 5/10 Blue Dragon. Now I'm going to replay Avatar.

  • muscleblade #101 3 years ago

    @miiiguel

    "Can I not like SF4?... lol."

    Of course you can. But have you played it?

    "Now I'm going to replay Avatar. "

    Sure you are.

    Each to their own.




  • Fab4 #102 3 years ago

    Achievements are great, iff you actually achieve them. What is pathetic is the lengths some people will go to in order to 'achieve' them. There isnt anything worthwhile in using game saves or boosting. Achievement whores ruined the ranked version of CTF in CoD3 because of their 'points matches'...it literally became Toss the Flag.

    So, play the game in the way it was intended, if you get the achievement in doing so, even better.


    p.s. Don't use your gamer score as some form of penis extension. It is what it is.

  • miiiguel #103 3 years ago

    "Of course you can. But have you played it?"
    God no! I'm a Virtua Fighter fanboy, (come on let everybody know... kool, kool thing).

    ""Now I'm going to replay Avatar. "
    Nah... I was just messing arround. I'm playing this German game my father brought me, and I bought Wolverine (I hope it has the easiest Achievements ever! - I'm a sucker for hack'n'slahes, and Afro Samurai wasn't everything I expected - and it had some bitchin' hard cheevs, that I can tell you...).

    @Fab4: MS banned gamesaves! Go ask StripClubDJ... lol! Him and alikes had their gamerscores reset and the gamertag painted green.
    Edited by 2 at 15/05/09 @ 12:10

  • Gearskin #104 3 years ago

    Call of Juarez has nice achievements too. Aside from the grinders, each level at some specific you needed to do. Something not required to actually complete the level.

  • muscleblade #105 3 years ago

    @miiiguel

    Wolverine is actually pretty entertaining. The achievements is not challenging at all. You get them all just by playing the game normally. You need to complete it 2,5 times though and to me thats not worth it just for the achievements. Good game for one playthrough though. I might play it again later on but like other hack and slash games it gets repetitive after awhile. Personally i would have seen a little more challenging achievements since the game isnt challenging at all. Might be better on hard mode but you need to complete the game on normal to unlock hard. Not a good decision achievement wise.

  • miiiguel #106 3 years ago

    oh dang! Afro had the same thing, Hard mode unlocked after Normal, though after finishing Hard I realised, maybe I wouldn't be able to do it if I had jump right into it. Anyway, I don't mind repetition - that's maybe the reason why I like this genre -, and Raven surely knows how to repeat themselfs. I loved X-Men Legends. Can't wait to start playing it, actually.

  • Fab4 #107 3 years ago

    They also banned modded 360s, yet I know 3 people who are using them to this very day.

  • muscleblade #108 3 years ago

    @Miguel

    You are one hell of a stayer i give you that. You dont quit until all the achievements are unlocket even though it requires some unbeliveable stamina. Like getting 1000/1000 in Afro Samurai or Blue Dragon. Im kind of like that with my training obsession. I can eat nothing but cod and broccoli for weeks just to reach my goal. If achievements are as important to you that fitness and working out is to me then you are truly insane though. LOL. Have a nice weekend my friend.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 12:30

  • miiiguel #109 3 years ago

    "They also banned modded 360s, yet I know 3 people who are using them to this very day. "
    That's true. Though those ppl never know when they turn their console on and are banned. Regarding gamesaves they are much easier to find, I doubt you know anyone who uses gamesaves as of today.

    @ muscleblade: you right, I do try to "catch them all", by legit ways, though sometimes I quit (thinks about Mile High Club); sometimes I have this rush feeling of acomplishment (thinks about "No Fighting in the War Room); sometimes a feeling of shallowness (Avatar). Afro was good on hard though, you should try it, nano-second reflexes required though.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 12:38

  • Fab4 #110 3 years ago

    Maybe not, however my point still stands...it is pathetic the lengths some people will go to pad a meaningless number.

  • muscleblade #111 3 years ago

    "it is pathetic the lengths some people will go to pad a meaningless number. "

    To gamers that care enough about achievements to know what their gamerscore completion is, the number is everything but meaningless. Crazy? Maybe. Still the case though.

  • EvilBob_leeds #112 3 years ago

    The PS3 trophies are actually coming on in leaps and bounds. Comparing between people is pretty simple and entirely complete, just pick a friend and all the games that you've both got trophies in are listed. Pick a game and you get a side by side comparison. Easy peasy. It is a bit of a blatant rip of achievments, but achievments were a good idea, and good ideas tend to get ripped off.

    Trophies are much better suited to some games than others; the more open ended the game the better. Fallout 3's Supermutant Behemoth trophy? Good. Makes you go back out into the Wilderness exploring new parts of the map. Guitar Hero 2's fail on easy? Bad. Giving away points for the sake of it.

  • muscleblade #113 3 years ago

    @Miguel

    Damn you have only unlocked a total of 2,645 achievements and i have unlocked 3,297 achievements.

    I guess your high gamerscore is kind of deceiving that way.

  • miiiguel #114 3 years ago

    My stats: Total: 2,652/2,860 (92.7%) - I couldn't, as is, have those many Achievements (units) as the total is < 3K. I tend to seek completion before I start I new game. Pitty you removed mr from your FL's, we could have some "spread sheet" fun. The reason I have more GamerScore than you, is perhaps, because of that, as I do them all (usually) I tend to score the ones with a high values, such as Afro's "Completionist" (Complete the game on both difficulties.) which is 200G.

    <a href="http://www.my 360stats.com/ach/Miiiguel/
    ">http://www.my 360stats.com/ach/Miiiguel/
    </a>
    [link url=http://www.my3 60stats.com/gs/Miiiguel/
    ]http://www.my3 60stats.com/gs/Miiiguel/
    [/link]
    Edited by 4 at 15/05/09 @ 15:08

  • smernicki #115 3 years ago

    one of my proudest achievements was beating all the time trial bosses on crackdown on pscyhotic difficulty

  • miiiguel #116 3 years ago

    And..., - well I think the majority of ppl who think this way are unfamiliar with the concept - some ppl think this is some willy waving thing, but is not. As an example: just the other day I received a message from a guy in my FL saying "woot! woot! You have almost all Achievemnents, but I managed to do one you don't have: "Mile High Club"", which I then replied with some sort of "good stuff buddy, well done!" or something like that. The guy than replied to me with a complete description how he did it, and how I should try it. That said, it came to be a very social/friendly thing.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 15:45

  • Gecks #117 3 years ago

    @miiiguel
    no left 4 dead? orange box? braid? edf? doom? rez? ikaruga? flatout?

    hard to max, but classics the lot of them. get on it :p but anyone who likes sonic youth is ok by me :)
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 16:33

  • miiiguel #118 3 years ago

    I have Rez, need to start playing it... regarding L4D and Orange Box I'm not much into competitive online playing, though I try to be as ecletic as possible and sometimes I go outside of my comfort zone. EDF..., wow, that on is one my "radar" for quite sometime now. That one, I will have it. It's tottally "my thing". Thanks for the tips!

    edit: ;) I'm glad someone noticed the stealth reference. Kudos to you, sir.
    Edited by 1 at 15/05/09 @ 16:58

  • N0vA_NIN #119 3 years ago

    Oh but your trophy card IS an extension of your penis, you can claim it's the biggest/longest in the world and it still wouldn't count for a damn thing.

    Personally I like trophies/achievements

    Before, I wouldn't play a game more than once or twice except for rpg's cause I had no interest in replaying it in hard or what have you, now with this i'm somewhat encouraged to go and replay the game on hard or expert.

    BUT, online trophies are a fucking joke, you really can't come to me and say you have done online trophies the hard way, because you'll be a liar, specially when they are so damn time consuming and that's why people won't bother in getting them the honest way, not when there's a much cheaper, easier way to get them

  • muscleblade #120 3 years ago

    @Miguel

    "The reason I have more GamerScore than you, is perhaps, because of that, as I do them all (usually) I tend to score the ones with a high values."

    Not really. I usually do the hard and/or big value ones. Its because i have more games like Orange Box for example that have 99 achievements and less games like CSI, Friend or Foe or Cars that have very few but high value achievements. Easy math really. It takes way longer to get the 99 in Orange box for a 1000 than 3000 points from those 3 games im sure.

    @gecks

    +1

  • Caspar_Esq. #121 3 years ago

    THREE from HL2?

    LAZY JOURNALISM

    SOMEONE GET BATMAN

  • miiiguel #122 3 years ago

    @ muscleblade: [link url=http://gamers.eurogamer.net/fight.php?red=mii iguel&blue=muscleblade
    ]http://ga mers.eurogamer.net/fight.php?re...[/link]

    You keep coming with those theories. This is no rocket science, I play more than, so I tend to have a bigger score than you, yes even on the games we have in common... go figure.
    Edited by 1 at 17/05/09 @ 04:16

  • muscleblade #123 3 years ago

    @Miiguel

    OK. You do play more than me. No doubth. I have two kids, full job and a very timeconsuming hobby that is fitness/ bodybuilding.

    The reason i have more achievements than you still holds true though. You have more games with fewer achievements per game.

  • muscleblade #124 3 years ago

    @Miguel

    "no left 4 dead? orange box? braid? edf? doom? rez? ikaruga? flatout?
    hard to max, but classics the lot of them."

    I have them all. You havent played any of them. Thats another reason my friend.

    edit: except EDF and Ikaruga.
    Edited by 1 at 22/05/09 @ 09:30

  • miiiguel #125 3 years ago

    Dude, I beat you at the games we have in common and at GS, what do you want to do about that? Go play some games... sheeesh...

    Now, I'm suppose to buy the games you want me to? Still... I'm going to buy EDF which you don't have... and Flat Out??!! What the fuck is that?
    Come on..., less time at EG, and you might, just might, some day catch (if you can).

    And, lol, can I choose some games for you to play as well (this is ridiculous!), let me see, go get these: Afro Samurai; Too Human; Lost Odyssey; KUF; Tenchu Z; Def Jam; VP; VP2. How do you say "I have every single one" and I'll add "and I have 100% completion at every one".
    I mean, you wana do some sort of competition you can't tell the rules alone..., is like when you told me "you have more Achievements than I do at GT4 because I don't do pigeons", come on...! What's next? "I beat at playing games in full moon nights?"

    My friend, I beat you at this meta game because I'm more dedicated and persistent than you (once again compare the games we have in comon if you don't dig gamerscore), that's a frikin fact. Maybe what you're looking for is "l33t" play or online rankes or twitch gaming, though this game is other thing completly.
    Oh btw, the "All dyes" Achievement at Fable 2 is very funny, specially the one you have to get at the colosseum... go get it!
    Edited by 2 at 17/05/09 @ 13:50

  • muscleblade #126 3 years ago

    I already have 100 % on Tenchu z, VP 1+2 btw. Those are among the absolutely easiest games on my gamertag too. Too Human and KUF = hours of grinding from what ive heard.
    Afro Samurai could be good, but i chose Ninja Blade instead.

    "Dude, I beat you at the games we have in common and at GS, what do you want to do about that? Go play some games... sheeesh... "
    Wrong. You beat me at some games. I beat you in games like: Halo 3, Gears 2, Aot and RE5 among others.

    The all dyes achievement might be alright i dont know. I never use guides when playing games because it ruins the experience for me personally. I have done it on a few occasions in the past and i stopped because it killed the fun of just playing the game.
    Getting the pigeouns or maybe the dyes without a guide. Is it even possible?

    Of course you win the metagame. You dont waste time on the really hard ( but fun) games. You are really dedicated and persistent either way. I hope you dont look back and regret it later on though. There are more important things in life than killing 20 000 enemies in Too Human you know. Maybe not in your opinion. You are a facinating person. I must admit that. I dont have anything against you in any way. I just like the discussion.
    Edited by 2 at 18/05/09 @ 08:58

  • Gecks #127 3 years ago

    flatout is ace! arguably the best racer on the 360, and has one of the hardest achievements in the 'get all golds in carnage mode' one, but was so satisfying to eventually get.

    i've no interest in score (mine is a mere 10,000 or something) but i love the challenge of some of these tough achievements, like flatout, edf, doom, etc. but hey if the game is shit then forget it.

  • muscleblade #128 3 years ago

    @Gecks

    Yeah FlatOut is great. Kind of like BurnOut only harder. The tough achievements is the ones i love the most too. I hate the collection and grinding achieves. One shouldnt only take gamerscore and completion % in consideration since its pretty easy to get both very high if you buy a certain type of games and skip the ones with next to impossible achievements.

  • tancredo #129 3 years ago

    I think achievements should acomplish two things:

    1. Make the player strive forward in the game. Offering achievement points for finishing the game in different difficulties but also rewarding exploration of the environments (orbs, tags, etc...)

    2. Make the player think about different ways to play the game. An achievement such us using granades to kill 10 fallen enemies or the execution achievement, in GOW 2, can make the player think about different ways to approach the game, instead of for example just using sniper tactics for the most part. Just and example, but achievements such as these can make a game feel like a complete different thing on a replay through.

    If they are able acomplish both things, I would not think achievements as useless.

  • Jamiesan #130 3 years ago

    Dunno if anyone has mentioned this already, but quite a few people in final fantasy 11 have an item gained by getting the first fifteen jobs to at least level 66(over 1,200 people confirmed because you get an ingame item for this). At this high level, exp is much easier to get nowadays so making the jump from 66 -> 75 for those hardcore players would be very easy.

    The hardest achievements in FF11 (from someone who has played it WAY too long) are:
    Obtain a Relic Weapon - If you manage to somehow obtain 1 million gil per week(I could personally make maybe 1/4 of that before becoming TOO bored), this would still take you 3-4 YEARS to get. Only about 1,000 people in the world have this.

    2 achievements that are impossible to get because the missions they come from are gonna be added in some future patch. Based on the pattern of GSP used, one will be from an casual endgame event or a mid-difficulty title(20GSP - same as limbus achievements) and the other will probably be to finish the latest expansion(40GSP - same as the other expansion achievements)

    disclaimer: I recently quit ffxi and wasn't a hardcore player, although I still played too much, lol

  • Grayvern #131 3 years ago

    how can gameroints engender anything when they offer no tangible reward apart from rather hollow bragging rites. When compared resi 4 and 5's monetary system or even coinage in an rpg, they pale in comparison because these syystems offer in game rewards.

  • muscleblade #132 3 years ago

    "Oh btw, the "All dyes" Achievement at Fable 2 is very funny, specially the one you have to get at the colosseum... go get it!"

    Got it.
    Edited by 1 at 20/05/09 @ 16:43