Only bad Wii games sell badly - Bloober

By Robert Purchese Published 13 January, 2010

WiiWare dev on Capcom's "bitching".

Capcom's "bitching" (and subsequent back-track) about poor sales of Resident Evil: Darkside Chronicles was ill-aimed, WiiWare developer Bloober Team has told Eurogamer.

"With such a strong install base it's hard to believe that there's not enough people to appreciate mature, core content," said executive producer Marcin Kawa. "It's all about games and quality. I'm not surprised that another shooter on rails doesn't sell well. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to figure out that people expect something more than that..

"I bet No More Heroes 2 will do pretty good, as well as the new Metroid and Capcom's Monster Hunter. I hope that Last Flight will be successful and that's because we're making a game that was thought out as a Wii game.

"Instead of bitching," he added, "we'd rather create something that has value and doesn't feel like a third-rate port put together to make a quick buck."

Bloober's making Last Flight, a visually simple but striking action-horror game inspired by Golden Axe, although we've yet to see the similarities. Importantly, this is a WiiWare game aimed at a mature audience that Marcin Kawa is adamant exists on Wii, despite the public lethargy for critically acclaimed games like MadWorld and No More Heroes.

"Was it the right decision to develop a game on Wii? Should we make it less violent? Are we gonna sell enough copies to pay our bills? You know, typical questions, nothing unusual here," Kawa said. "And while we love and respect Capcom and Pachter, we wouldn't go that far and say that mature stuff doesn't sell or that it's the platform holder's fault.

"Our logic is far simpler: if the game doesn't sell, we did something wrong."

The first episode of Last Flight, of which there are four, will be released on WiiWare "really soon".

Picture of Robert.

About Robert Purchese

Bertie is Eurogamer's Senior Staff Writer. When he's not hunting down news stories he's often found playing with his kids or gabbling about fantasy games and strange online worlds.

Read more articles from Robert by visiting the Robert Purchese archive page.

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Comments (56) Latest comment 2 years ago

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  • menage #1 2 years ago

    Yeah, cause Okami did stellar

  • darc #2 2 years ago

    "despite the public lethargy for critically acclaimed games like MadWorld and No More Heroes"

    I know I'm setting myself up for many, many minuses, but I think the fact the likes of MadWorld and No More Heroes are "critically acclaimed" says it all. With a very few exceptions, the Wii owner has to choose between these two unfortunate options:

    a) style over substance
    b) none of the above

    P.S. Okami is one of the exceptions. But of course, Okami had been developed in full before the Wii even existed.
    Edited by 2 at 13/01/10 @ 16:56

  • ignatiusjreilly #3 2 years ago

    cianchristopher going for the lowest-ranked post award in the next podcast too.

  • Skurmedel #4 2 years ago

    It disappeared too... peculiar.

  • ChadSexington #5 2 years ago

    No More Heroes and Zack And Wiki are two Wii games that we can all name off the tops of our heads that didn't sell well.

    I really can't see NMH2 doing any better than its predecessor.

  • stevetuck #6 2 years ago

    there is plenty of bad wii games that sell well... like the juggernought that was carnival: fun fair games

  • Murton #7 2 years ago

    There's a lowest ranked post award on the podcast? That explains why those GT5 articles are written as pure trollbait. Thanks ignatius, I understand now.

    On topic, the Bloober guys make a good point. If you're dedicated to the Wii and develop a good game that works well with the controller then it will sell, but that doesn't change the fact that what would be considered a core game on the 360 and PS3 is a niche game on the Wii because of the way Nintendo have marketed the console. Conversely casual and family-friendly are the core demographic of the Wii, something which can be argued is niche on the HD consoles, though the wand and Natal may change this this.

    These days it's not so much about making good games and more about marketing really, essentially Capcom were looking for someone to blame because they didn't do their marketing properly and now Bloober are taking advantage of the situation to score some free publicity for themselves and thus showing that they understand that marketing is every bit as important as development.
    Edited by 1 at 13/01/10 @ 17:27

  • butler` #8 2 years ago

    describing mature/adult games as 'core' on the wii for the win

  • Evolution #9 2 years ago

    @ChadSexington

    NMH sold well enough for the publisher and the designer to be happy enough to make a second one. It is the highest selling game Suda51 made so in those terms it was as success. Zack and Wiki looks to be about a monkey and a shirtless boy pirate, would you buy it if you saw it? (It is a cool game, just saying it wouldn't be an impulse buy like, Modern Warfare might be)

  • marty_k #10 2 years ago

    @Evolution That's what I meant, thank you.

  • TonyHarrison #11 2 years ago

    Instant respect for Bloober. Finally a dev that isn't going to look for excuses and other people to blame when something doesn't sell millions.

    EDIT: People are missing the point, it isn't as black and white as saying a good game will sell well, and a bad game will sell badly, there are many exceptions on all three consoles (yes, good games on 360 and PS3 often have poor sales as well) that prove both those statements wrong. This dev company are different because they aren't giving a half-arsed approach to Wii development and then blaming the audience when it goes wrong.

    However, make a good game, and you're far more likely to have strong sales than you are by releasing a bad one, regardless of the exceptions to that rule.
    Edited by 1 at 13/01/10 @ 18:15

  • gjgjg #12 2 years ago

    hmmm. okami?

    i tihnk he misunderestandamates marketing, public trends, product placement, and the fact that the nintendo market is not 'hard core' gamers market at the moment.
    ok dead space is another rail shooter but still , if it gets good reviews then it shuold sell by his logic. it did nay
    Also GTA chintown is another 'nintendo' example.

  • ChadSexington #13 2 years ago

    @ Evolution

    I take your point, but NMH still sold less than 500,000 worldwide, so it's hardly up there with stuff like MW2. Admittedly cheaper development costs for the Wii probably meant it turned a profit. It will be interesting to see how well NMH does on the PS3 and 360.

    And as for Zack & Wiki, I did buy it! Although the monkey/shirtless boy pirate combo was more a pleasant side effect than a selling point to me.

  • Mono_X #14 2 years ago

    @Murton

    "These days it's not so much about making good games and more about marketing really."

    IMHO. this has always been the case. Agree with your opinion about Capcom though.

    What I see being different these days is that a lot of large publishers/devcos have put all their backing and money behind the two niches consoles. So now they're having to develop Wii games quickly with much smaller budgets and then complain when they don't get sales.
    Things were much easier when all they had to do was back the Playstation brand like for the previous 2 generations.

    BTW, Okami sold more copies on the Wii than it did on the PS2.

  • varsas #15 2 years ago

    @gjgjg: Selling close to 1 million copies with Chinatown Wars is bad?

    Regarding Zack & Wiki, I think that around 0.4 million sales is decent given it's a new franchise and there wasn't any real promotion. I think that in an age of Professor Layton and puzzle game popularity, a sequel with enough promotion could do well.
    Edited by 1 at 13/01/10 @ 17:59

  • Retroid #16 2 years ago

    "Only bad Wii games sell badly"

    That's one of the most stupid statements I've ever heard.

  • ChadSexington #17 2 years ago

    @ Mono_X

    Do you have any evidence for Wii Okami outselling PS2 Okami? By everything I've see the sales have been about equal or slightly in favour of the PS2.

  • TonyHarrison #18 2 years ago

    "Also GTA chintown is another 'nintendo' example"

    Don't bring up Chinatown Wars, the DS version is a massive success compared to the PSP versions abysmal sales.

  • varsas #19 2 years ago

    @ChadSexington: http://ww w.vgchartz.com/games/index.php?...

  • marty_k #20 2 years ago

    Relax guys, I acknowledge that "My Fabulous Pony: Super Party Edition" will do extremely well but still, we believe that there's a noticeable group of people who own the console and would like to play some 'real games' ;-)

  • NeonStorm #21 2 years ago

    "Only bad Wii games sell badly".

    Just Dance. That is all.

  • Mono_X #22 2 years ago

    Okami Sales.

    Wiki
    [link url=http://en.wi kipedia.org/wiki/Okami#Sales
    ]http://en.wi kipedia.org/wiki/Okami#Sales
    [/link]
    VGChartz
    [link url=http://vgchartz.com/games/index.ph p?name=okami&keyword=&console=®ion=All&developer=&publish er=&genre=&boxart=Both&results=50&order=Hits
    ]http://vg chartz.com/games/index.php?name...[/link]

    Yes, yes I know that neither sources is particularly great. - But I take it where I can get it. :p

    It is worth noting that there are twice as many PS2 owners as Wii owners, so in relatively terms its done much better on the Wii

  • Malek86 #23 2 years ago

    @darc: I agree there. It seems that every time someone wants to do a mature game on the Wii, for some reason they have to make it absolutely over the top and favor style over substance.

    I honestly don't know who's worse: those who think "the Wii can't sell mature games", or those who do stuff like that, because they are essentially thinking "the Wii can't sell mature games, so we've got to make our game as notable as possible".

  • FogHeart #24 2 years ago

    Third party exclusives I've seen advertised for the Wii on TV:-

    Madworld

    Erm....anyone seen any others?
    Edited by 1 at 13/01/10 @ 18:31

  • Murton #25 2 years ago

    Fogheart: Nintendo do offer a very good marketing package to select 3rd party games that they feel will allow them to better sell the Wii hardware. Granted it's rare, but the Wii version of Ashes Cricket, which was a very different game to 360 and PS3 version springs to mind and the advert was really popular if I remember correctly, more so than the Ant and Dec ones anyway.

    They also ran an ad for F1 2009 on release in order to sell the F1 wheel attachment and cash in on the Grand Prix and I believe there was a TV ad campaign for No More Heroes too. While I'd definitely agree that Nintendo are notorious for being generally unsupportive of third party developers these days it must be said that when they do show support they go the whole hog.

  • oerhoert #26 2 years ago

    Differentiation is key to create unique value in your product, which is one reason why MadWorld, to name one example, is so extreme. However, you also need to appeal to some urge in a significant part of the gaming audience, and this is the tricky part.

    The thing with Darkside Chronicles is that everyone already bought the last RE rail shooter. Of those, not everyone was enthused enough to come back for a second round, which is highly understandable.

    The low sales is probably a mix of the Wii's emphasis on cooking, partying and fitness, the fact that RE was already out just two years back with a similar game, and the fact that the core audience had a lot of other stuff to look at during that period, such as Modern Warfare and Uncharted 2. The big question is; if Capcom decided to make Resident Evil 5 exclusively on the Wii, would the audience have been there? If it was obvious that it was a flagship title? This is the hard thing to determine; other than Nintendo, few of the major gaming companies have put flagships on the Wii at any point -- Monster Hunter 3 will be one of the first, I believe. Will be interesting to watch that one.

  • Luckyjim #27 2 years ago

    There is some truth to what he's saying, though. I can't think of a single third party Wii games that comes anywhere close, in terms of quality and broad appeal, to what Nintendo has produced for the console themselves or third-party titles on the 360/PS3. If such games existed, people would buy them.

    The examples of third party games that have been good but failed to sell in large numbers - Little King Story, Zack and Wiki, Madworld, Okami, NMH etc would probably sell just as badly on other consoles (as Okami did on the PS2). They are niche titles whatever format they're on.

    At least this chap's argument is refreshing. Instead of blaming the market, as Capcom et al have done, he's blaming the developers and publishers.

  • des #28 2 years ago

    lol..wrong...look at the sales charts,bad Wii games sell like crazy.

  • electrolite #29 2 years ago

    ""Only bad Wii games sell badly".

    Just Dance. That is all. "


    Eh? How does listing an example of a bad Wii game that sold well make him wrong? He didn't say ALL bad Wii games sell badly. Read it again. In fact that goes for a few of you

  • Luckyjim #30 2 years ago

    Bad Wii games may sell well, but that's almost a separate argument. With so many Wiis out there, why don't both extremes sell well. It has to be said that the games that sell well are the ones that are advertised - bad or not.

  • KDR_11k #31 2 years ago

    I hate how stupid niche or plain garbage games always get used as the examples of why core/non-Nintendo/etc games don't sell on the Wii. What, a badly done generic FPS with terrible online MP didn't sell much? A repetitive game designed for 12 year olds judging by all the blood and swearing with a style that most people hate failed? A game carrying the name of an RE4-like that is a railshooter and comes with catastrophic box art and no marketing failed? All that is way more important than, say, all the CoD games selling at least a million each despite being pretty bad ports.

    Yeah, cause Okami did stellar

    I recall it sold like shit on the PS2.

  • jambo74 #32 2 years ago

    Must be a load of bad games then...

  • Anthony_UK #33 2 years ago

    ''Only bad wii games sell badly'' is the most stupid thing I've ever heard, especially from a developer!

    The problem with Wii games is:

    1) People don't want to spend £40 on a lightgun game, stop releasing them!!!!

    2) Hardcore gamers have pretty much given up on or like most of my friends sold there wii! Even those that haven't, most own a PS3/360 anyway. To be fair, typical 'mature' titles on wii look almost embarrasing next to there PS3/360 alternatives. Seriously, Dead Space or Dead Space Extraction (As good as it is)? Dead Rising on wii or 360? Unless a game takes advantage of the wii controls or is extremely stylised to stand out/hide the lack of processing power, it hasn't a chance. But at the same time something like Okami or No More Heroes are going to appeal to a relatively select group of gamers for these exact same reasons.

    When one of the biggest selling games is Wii fit, surely people can't be suprised when 'On rails Resident evil game 24' doesn't sell!!!!

  • Anonoman1337 #34 2 years ago

    Two points I want to make:

    First, to people like menage: Okami is a horrible example, because not only was it developed exclusively for the PS2 first (you know, the console with over 100 million owners), but it sold so poorly on that console that it actually shut down the company. Why is the Wii version the only one that counts now? Wishful thinking?

    Secondly, can anybody here name any third party game that eclipses Nintendo's efforts on the Wii? Anyone at all? Oh, no, you can't? Gee, I wonder if that has anything to do with it... I can name practically hundreds of third party PS3 and 360 games that make Sony and Microsoft's in-house games look tame; Nintendo, on the other hand, is the only company to max out the Wii (and, big surprise, their games actually sell). In fact, the highest rated third party Wii game is Resident Evil 4. There is absolutely no excuse for third parties to output such garbage.

    Oh, and for those that are pointing to games like Just Dance that paint the Wii's audience: when Nintendo began marketing to casual gamers, what happened to the 100 million+ PS2 owners? Less than half of that own a PS3 now. I don't think they just up and disappeared; I think the gamers that loved games like the EyeToy franchise and Ape Escape, Tomba, and such left because Sony abandoned them.

  • NeonStorm #35 2 years ago

    @electrolite

    Fair enough. I agree with your point. But Just Dance (which was either mauled or ignored by critics) is currently the highest placed Wii game in the all formats chart. Considering many of the year's superior Wii titles have sunk without a trace, it's still a stupid statement for him to make.

    EDIT: Scratch that, second highest behind Wii Fit Plus
    Edited by 1 at 13/01/10 @ 20:06

  • VMerken #36 2 years ago

    Apart from Okami, that other Clover game, God Hand - the best beat'em up to date - never sold that well either. Neither did Fallout, or Planescape: Torment. Or Vampire: The Masquerade. Or Silent Hill IV: The Room. Yet, I'm somehow glad I'm a minority buyer and these masterpieces ended up in my collection.

    So what do these examples teach us, Bloober Boys? there's much, much more to selling games than the game being good. It's one factor, but there are so many other things to consider.

    Oh, and

    @oerhört
    I bought a GameCube only for the Resident Evils. Metroid Prime was a nice bonus. If RE5 and/or 6 were Wii exclusives, I'd have a Wii. Simple as that.
    Edited by 6 at 13/01/10 @ 22:59

  • Retroid #37 2 years ago

    Given the amount of support Nintendo don't give to WiiWare titles, let's see how this dev thinks in a year-or-so's time.

  • FogHeart #38 2 years ago

    @Neon:

    What we're saying here is, "Only bad Wii games sell badly" is not the same as "Bad Wii games only sell badly". Hang on, I've got a Venn diagram in my pocket....

  • NeonStorm #39 2 years ago

    I can see the the holes in my logic now. Damn.

    / Bows out

  • oerhoert #40 2 years ago

    <em>Given the amount of support Nintendo don't give to WiiWare titles, let's see how this dev thinks in a year-or-so's time.</em>

    Good point. Although all the big three could do a lot better with showcasing their online catalog, Nintendo is by far the worst one. The usability and appeal of WiiWare has so far been abysmal, and given that the service is 1,5 years old they should really have seen to that by now. Lost business is what it is.

  • Jazzy_Geoff #41 2 years ago

    Dead Space: Extraction was an EXCELLENT game and sold like balls so based on that alone this person is talking shite

  • BonzoBanana #42 2 years ago

    There are 65 million wii owners out there but something like metroid prime corruption sells 1.5 million. The wii really is about casual games, fitness games, games for young children, non offensive games, simplistic games, party games. If you want to make a driving game for wii don't make it a F1 simulator make it a mario kart type game with fun characters. If you want to make a first person shooter don't make it a blood thirsty ultra violent game make it a funny family friendly game with cartoon violence that doesn't take itself too seriously. It seems to me you only have to look at what sells well on the wii to know what to develop. It seems a lot of developers are applying the same rules to wii as other consoles. Why make hardcore games for wii when hardcore gamers have 360s,pcs and ps3s.

  • Cappy #43 2 years ago

    Those figures cited for Okami selling better on the Wii than the PS2 are highly misleading.

    The PS2 figure is Japan only, they don't have any data for Europe and the Americas.
    The figure for the Wii is a total of sales for Japan and the Americas.

    With the sales from the Americas added on it would probably be the PS2 version which is ahead.

  • smelly #44 2 years ago

    "No More Heroes and Zack And Wiki are two Wii games that we can all name off the tops of our heads that didn't sell well. "

    And both are games which wouldnt have sold well on ANY platform.

    Same with Okami - which btw also bombed on the ps2.. but then i guess that just means games didnt sell on the ps2 did they .. oh .. wait!

  • figaro7 #45 2 years ago

    Capcom pushed such niche titles on the wii that i agree, they wouldnt sell well anywhere, its another case of the developer thinking they know what the wii market consists of when they clearly dont. Heres a clue, resident evil 4 wiimake sold over a million copies, whats that, a big budget 3rd person action shooter remake. For all the great wii niche games ive enjoyed, im not the majority of the wii market.

  • Collymilad #46 2 years ago

    Capcom are right.

    It seems to me like this guy just wants to sound good to be honest. Games that aren't geared towards the casual audience won't sell as well because the audience isn't there. At least not to anywhere near the degree it is on 360/PS3.

    It's not necessarily a criticism of the Wii, but it has had less attention in the area of traditional games compared to the other two consoles, so audiences after more "core" type games have moved there and are well supplied with the type of games they want to play.

    The fact that Wii fit and games like it dominated the top 10 for ages goes some way to proving what wii owners are after - and it's not the kind of thing that Capcom generally make that Wii owners seem to want - and it puzzles me if there are people who own only a wii and moan about a lack of core games - as imo apart from a minority of titles, the Wii is pretty much gone from that perspective.
    Edited by 3 at 14/01/10 @ 04:37

  • menage #47 2 years ago

    "
    Yeah, cause Okami did stellar

    I recall it sold like shit on the PS2. "

    Exactly, but the point was that only crap games sell like crap. Which Okami is the best exmaple of.

  • FogHeart #48 2 years ago

    Metacritic and most of its purchasers disagree with you there sir. Your opinion is not fact or even the popular one.

    "Games that aren't geared towards the casual audience won't sell as well because the audience isn't there. At least not to anywhere near the degree it is on 360/PS3."

    As a Wii owner who loves his ExtractionOkamiNMHAndSoOn games more than any other, I am that audience so it's not non-existent, but I suspect you are right in that it's too small to merit catering for. I am a bit ashamed to say I gave up believing I'd get the games I want on the Wii and bought a PS3. But I have so much trouble moving to its primitive controller so it won't get much use until the Wand is released.

    There never were any DragonAgeAssassinsCreedFallout3AndSoOn games for the Wii, but since Sony has seen the LEDlight with motion control I'm still hopeful I'll get the best of both worlds.

    I don't want the Wii to go on sale or gather dust, but I've lost heart. Even the meagre collection of games that will be released in the future of the kind I want on the console will probably find a better looking but just as well controlled version on the PS3 (as long as there's a nunchuck equivalent).

  • menage #49 2 years ago

    "primitive"?

    Really?
    It's nothing new sure, but I would choose it over the wii anytime.

    "Metacritic and most of its purchasers disagree with you there sir. Your opinion is not fact or even the popular one. "

    Ehm, I think I worded that wrong then. I meant Okami is awesome but it sold shit even though it was brilliant.
    Edited by 2 at 14/01/10 @ 10:53

  • Collymilad #50 2 years ago

    Haha the PS3 has a primitive controller?

    You do realise that the Wii controller without M+ is about as primitive as it gets?

  • FogHeart #51 2 years ago

    You do realise that M+ does nothing for pointing and shooting at enemies on the screen, which is the kind of game I look to play?

    Look, just before I got the Wii my last game for the PS2 was Resi 4. Then I played it all over again with motion controls on the Wii. I'm baffled that anyone can think it's better the first way, and when I assert that pointing at enemies on the screen is so much better than jiggling a tiny joystick until a reticle coincides with a moving target, I get marked down but nobody seems to actually poke the hole in my logic!

  • menage #52 2 years ago

    There wasn't any logic to poke the first time. You didn't say why.

    I can see it working for aiming (although the way you hold your Wiimote feels just as unnatural, and I'll ve damned if I would buy addons for any game) but I don't see it whipping out a bayonetta combo so versatility ends there for me.

  • FogHeart #53 2 years ago

    Yeah....you have to wonder how things would look right now if the classic controller was bundled. Which of course has twin sticks, D pad, two shoulder buttons and four face buttons. And probably costs a couple of quid to put together as it doesn't include any motion sensors or transmitting tech.

    I don't have any games that use it. Come to that, games that are not first person, driving or over-the-shoulder/third person make up a really small share of my collection.

    Oh, and for aiming games I actually hold my hands together, much like a classic controller, but adjust my right hand a bit from left to right to aim. Maybe people who first use the console hold out the Wiimote like you see in ads, but that gets a bit achey after a while.
    Edited by 2 at 14/01/10 @ 19:06

  • smelly #54 2 years ago

    I use the wiimote with the cord around the back of my neck while led on the couch.

    Personally i find it the most comfy controller to used, i like the freedom of hand movement.

    My ONLY complaint is that i wish the distance between the wiimote and nunchuck was bigger.

  • Mono_X #55 2 years ago

    "My ONLY complaint is that i wish the distance between the wiimote and nunchuck was bigger"

    I have a little gizmo that allows the nunchuk to have a wireless connection to the wiimote.

  • Mono_X #56 2 years ago

    Metacritic scores and perceived game quality are no real indicator of game success - this applies to all platforms.

    The Burnout games consistently get much higher metacritic scores than Need For Speed games.
    But the Need For Speed games consistently sell much better than the Burnout games.