NVIDIA bombards PC game pirates News

I agree with the sentiment but abhor the DRM.

"I just don't know how anyone could consider that a cool thing to do - it's not. It sucks"

Oh ffs, let me grab my small violin.

I absolutely agree with his sentiment, but anyone who thinks that appealing to a game pirate's sense of fair play is being grossly naive.

"Its not - it sucks" is one step removed from "You wouldn't steal a car".

They could just release them through/register them via steam?! problem solved! Steam wins! :P

DRM, of some form, is a necessary evil for computer games, day one piracy is really wrecking the business. Plus, pc games are waaay cheaper than they used to be and compared to console games theyre a bargain! I like the way valve worked it with steam, you can buy the full game on disc, but the .exe isnt released until day of release. Genius.

Online distribution/platforms (à la Steam) is probably the most obvious way to go for the PC. And it will just pave the way for the consoles.

What about charging an extortionate amount for graphics cards, and releasing games for nothing?

:)

I'm weeping into one of your £500 notes at this moment.

Once off activatoin/digital distribution = good idea

Constant checks where you have to rely on internet connectivity and the publisher being in business to fund activation service = Bad idea.

"Spogsoft regrets to annonce that the servers for Blahgame are to be shut down for finanial reasons"

Just like Msoft did with its rental music service

Ys, he's going the way of Stardock.

Rewarding paying customers with free content.

The problem - as ever - is that you employ masses of DRM, which just annoys the people that legitimately aquired the product, while those that did not are just bypassing all that junk with a crack of some sort. This is the way it has always been, and the way it always will, you won't appeal to the better side of people by weeping gently.

Even if people pirate games, people still need a good graphics card to run them. I don't see why he should be complaining. If people don't buy games, they have more money for the cards.

EDIT: Anyway, free content for games after they have been released is almost a distant memory. Epic still makes bonus packs for the terribly underselling UT3, but Infinity Ward can't be bothered to release the new CoD4 maps on the PC...

This doesn't work anyway. There are versions of HL2, Counter strike etc. which have been cracked and run independently of steam. I doubt it will take long for cracked versions of mass effect to appear.

The way he looks at piracy, I look at DRM.

Isn't the obvious answer; "Because its free?" :S

Piracy is bad, you say?
OK, I'll stop doing it then.

I prefer pirates of the seven seas...


... Aarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

The film & music industries are having the same problem.

DRM hasn't helped them there - what has helped is embracing the new culture, and by making their content easily accessible.

Locking things down doesn't help you get your product to the consumer quicker, it doesn't cut down piracy, and it sure as hell doesn't ingratiate you to your customers!

TL;DR:

Ask not what your customers can do for you, but what you can do for your customers!

DRM must die. Fine, one off activation is a viable method, but my gaming rig doesn't have a permanent connection, so I won't be able to play it. So no Mass Effect for me I suppose, but I'm happy with KotOR.

"You're going to start out with a basic service, which is the game, and then increase the value of that service through patches, mod packs, expansions, maps and so on. That's the direction it's going to go, because the pirates are just killing the developers - and I think it's really unfair, what they're doing."

That's not actually a bad thing. Give us regular free content updates and we'll love you even more, big boy.

/is waiting for the next 2 pages of argument over whether piracy constitutes theft

Yet here in EG most of my fellow EGers are still in denial and thing PC-gaming piracy is overstated. IMO, it's not, it's the biggest problem PC-gaming ever faced.

"If people don't buy games, they have more money for the cards. "

but less new games available that need a new card, fewer games pushing the technology forward, fewer new cards released, less money spent on the cards, economies of scale go down, card prices go up & research and dev budgets shrink.

Well I think this is a whole crock of shit. Developers have made it clear the "big buxx" are to be gleaned in the console market and PC gamers can just make due with the fetid after-birth. If a PC game is actually worth playing, and these days that is exceptionally rare, then people will buy it. COD4 PC is testament to that.
Then you look at companies like UBI and EA who are almost wholly concerned with profits and synergy and pro-active business bullshit and see the ported dumbed-down bug ridden crap they churn out for PC and wonder why the market is dying.

increase the value of that service through patches, mod packs, expansions, maps and so on

Patches too? You mean the code that fixes problems in games you already sold?
How about focussing on not releasing buggy software first?

This rant won't decrease piracy and neither will more invasive DRM...

Also the anti-piracy program that came with Sniper Elite, Starcom or something, wrecked by DVD-drive.

edit: Starforce. (Starcom was great.)

I really don't buy this. I know far more people with chipped consoles than who pirate PC games. It just so happens that the current generation is too new for that to become really widespread. If anything, PC pirates are in the vast minority because very few people have the patience to do that every time they want a new game. Especially with all the issues it can cause with updating and multiplayer.

Stronger DRM will increase piracy because making legal games difficult to play will of course make people choose the more user-friendly pirated games. On the other hand, if you don't do that, economic common sense dictates that many people will go for the free option (capitalism=individualism=selfish individuals). The market needs to adapt to the market trends, and that means cheap or free PC games.

I'd rather it was a creative industry based on user generated content, which we are seeing increasingly, but advertising-based (like Battlefield Heroes) makes sense for the foreseeable future.

I really don't buy this. I know far more people with chipped consoles than who pirate PC games. It just so happens that the current generation is too new for that to become really widespread. If anything, PC pirates are in the vast minority because very few people have the patience to do that every time they want a new game. Especially with all the issues it can cause with updating and multiplayer.

IMO, it's not, it's the biggest problem PC-gaming ever faced.

Absolutely. MMOs and online-based games such as Quake Live and Battlefield Heroes will keep it going, I believe, but for titles with little to no online offering there is barely any point being exclusively PC.

Simple solution, lock one game to one console, or with a PC game lock it to one copy of Windows. That way it can't play on any other console / PC. If your console breaks or you upgrade windows then you can transfer ownership of the game, but you need authorisation to do so.

It would kill the second hand and rental game markets, but the game developer doesn't see any of that money anyway. If that's the price we have to pay then so be it. I hate pirates, anyone with pirated anything should be taken anyway and shot. OK maybe that's a little extreme. But I hate bloodsucking pirates.

"If a PC game is actually worth playing, and these days that is exceptionally rare, then people will buy it"

I'm not sure that is true. If a game is worth playing, people will play it. Maybe that is a safe statement to make, but the actual spending of money is influenced by far more factors than just the quality of the product.


@Lin

"I really don't buy this. I know far more people with chipped consoles than who pirate PC games."

I'm not sure what you are saying here. That because your individual circle of friends contains more chipped consoles, PC piracy is less prevalent globally than console chipping? That is simply not true. PC piracy is way more prevelant than console piracy, even with the PS2 being as ludicrously popular as it was.

"If anything, PC pirates are in the vast minority because very few people have the patience to do that every time they want a new game."

Truth is, piracy on any platform is in the minority. The majority of gamers buy their games, but that doesn't mean the minority don't have a powerful influence over the bottom line when it comes to profits and recouping the dev investment.

i pirated alot of games in my younger years when i couldn't afford them and it was easy access.

but now i've grown into a valued customer so wheres the problem?

@expiredone

That isn't entirely disimilar to what Windows itself does.

However, its not the simple solution it might appear to be as removing the locking is just a part of piracy process. That is kind of the point here. Whatever form of protection you use, it means nothing is all the pirated versions of your game have it removed.

Although I don't agree with piracy, the whole 'It kills developers' argument is nonsense.

If I pirated a developer's game and they went out of business, what do you think would happen? Yes, they'll go and get jobs elsewhere. So you're not killing any talent or design flare at all, you're just moving it along in the worst case scenario.

Blaming piracy on DRM? Give me a fucking break guys. It is laughable that some are pissed at BioWare for the DRM on ME/PC. What the fuck did you expect?

Pirating is STEALING... If you pirate you are a FUCKING thief... and no, not like Robin Hood... more like a purse snatching junkie asshole.

/End of Self-righteous Rant

Perhaps releasing buggy games with ludicrous system requirements in genres that are already crowded on a format that's easy to copy (despite invasive DRM that won't be present in a pirated copy) whilst granting legitimate customers absolutely no right to return the item if it's faulty or doesn't work with their hardware (meaning they absolutely cannot get their money back - unlike pretty much every other consumer product on the market) means that people are more likely to look at getting hold of it for free, rather than risk wasting any money on the slender chance it isn't shoddy, generic crap that they've seen dozens of times already.

Just a thought.

Hehe, major devs and publishers looking for excuses why their shit doesn't sell while indies and eastern european products (Witcher, Stalker) make solid profit. It's always easier to cry and blame others than to fix problems in ones own backyard (excessive system requirements, bugs galore etc.)!

'If I pirated a developer's game and they went out of business, what do you think would happen? Yes, they'll go and get jobs elsewhere. So you're not killing any talent or design flare at all, you're just moving it along in the worst case scenario.'

Pretty sure they wouldn't go and make another PC game though.

My company used to make PC & Console games but PC games are very much an afterthought now. If it's easy to port over, lets do it, otherwise no point making it PC first, although there are large numbers of gamers, not a huge % actually pay anymore. i reckon about 50-60% of PC gamers i know, pirate, where it is about 5% of console gamers.

@jaxon58

So money to pay for development costs will appear out of thin air ? Oh, I get it, companies will pour money into games development out of the goodness of their hearts so people can have their games entertainment for free.

I go through piracy stages. Dream cast for instance, pirate games were everywhere, i didn't have to do a sodding thing to my console, fiver vs 30 quid. i slept like a baby at night too.

then the ps2, once it was chipped. again price. if its between me having the money in the pocket or the games industry, well I'm going to choose me aren't I.

xbox on the other hand, whilst tempting to get it chipped, meant i couldn't go on xbox live easily, if at all. same for the 360.
this has effectively scuppered my pirating days.

people pirate movies and music and games because its cheap, fast, effective and instantly gratifying. plus seeing as AAA titles in all three of the media disciplines are a rarity, more often than not if you pay proper for media, you feel a sour taste in your mouth as it never lived up to the hype. this way i am never disappointed, never out of pocket and can practice kleptomania from the comfort of my own home.

sounds to me like there are whining not because they dont get enought money, because of people pirating, but because they dont get buckloads of money because of people pirating.

skeletor, stoat, jaxon: why do "pirates" pirate the games then? if they're so bad and whatnot, they shouldn't do it. I mean, excuses are getting pretty pathetic right now. And the level of complains show that perhaps this rigid measures can, in fact have results. Don't compare small "indie" projects to major productions. The later have to have a big return, or in fact PC will have but flash games and MMO's. Why do you think MMO's have such success? They're much harder to steal. I have friends that play a lot on PCs and never, ever buy their games, yet they bought WoW... .
There's no excuse for piracy, ppl do it because it's free and it's easy. It doesn't matter if the game is good or not.

I'd prefer the honesty of Razor, though I despise the act of pirace, it's nor a personal thing, it's the act. When I found a Live "buddy" who was pirating games I just removed him from my list, I don't want to hang out with that crowd.

The problem is that it's so easy to pirate PC games. To pirate a console game you need to open up the console, voiding the warranty and start pissing about with wires and or chips. Once done you then have to get a PC with a BluRay or DVD burner and download the game which had it's DRM removed burn it to disc, put it in the console and hope it works. With a PC game you just download and run the exe and bang your done.

What I am aware of developers and publishers doing to combat this is put up fake copies of the game, wait for you to download it then sue for about a grand. The pirate always settles out of court because they don't want the criminal record.

And to all you pirates out their how is it any different from walking into your local Game or HMV and sticking a game under your jumper and walking out?

This comment is POWERED BY ALIENWARE

I don't pirate, but when I see absurd copy protection systems like the one on Mass Effect, I'm not going to buy the game either. DRM IMHO stops a negligible number of pirates, while irking your paying customers. Let me backup my games. Don't make me keep the manual around if I want to play them. Really don't make me depend on your servers being up if I want to play my games 3-4 years from now.

I know many a PC Pirate in their late 20's & early 30's and the reasoning goes something like this

Tell Wife/partner - PC costs XXXX pounds and we definitely need XXX gGFX card in it..

Mate gets decent gaming rig under pretense of other practical purposes (which most £299 laptops could do).

Mate now justifies to himself that seeing as he has made a £800 investment he can recoup it all back by never paying for a game.

Said mates partner would be going ballistic over a console costing a few hundred quid and him then spending over half a grand on games - plus additional arguments and sulks of her not being able to watch soap operas while he hogs the front room.

Needles to say he should buy some trousers off Ebay and start wearing some, better still take his partners.

Unfortunately he's not alone - I think it's due to most of my mates being used to having to play in the bedroom from growing up doing it - and PC bedroom gaming allows them the illusion of being in charge.

Grow up and buy some games - you soft lame pirates - better still give her the two finger salute get a console - and take charge of the front room your paying for! lol

@bcolter: If piracy was theft why on earth does the industry itself not use the word theft? If they could they absolutely would, but they can't, because it isn't - that's why. Theft involves depriving someone of an item. Piracy doesn't. You nick a CD someone else loses one. You copy MP3s, the person you got them from still has them.

Unless you've never infringed a copyright ever I really wouldn't be so keen to label others as FUCKING thieves. Especially since they're not, because it's not theft, as we've already established. Are you really suggesting you've never copied or used music, games, movies, tv programs, text, pictures, fonts etc. you had no right to?

@miiiguel

Personally I don't pirate PC games, mainly because the ones I like are generally from quality sources like the Civ and Total War series, and I'm more than happy to take a punt on them. I've also never bothered with torrenting software which I presume is what's required these days.

All I'm suggested is that there's an absolute shedload of reasons why people might consider piracy as a first course of action - if only as a try-before-you-buy measure. And whilst there will always be loads of died-in-the-wool pirates who would never have paid for the game anyway, it's pretty daft for the industry to make piracy look quite as appealing as it does, since every person who does decide to pirate it first with the intention of buying it later is one more person who may well not bother.

Encourage them to buy the game as a first port of call, by releasing innovative, largely bug-free games that don't require stupidly high specs that make people question whether they can even run the thing, and perhaps people will be happier to trust that their £30 will be well spent.

Any producer that makes their product *less* usable than the pirated equivalent deserves to fail. See stupid DVD's with unskippable warnings and music with battery killing Drm measures for example.

Stoat, I wasn't calling you a pirate, or judging anyone personaly, it's the act and its consequences. Like I said before I have some really hardcore pirate friends (one is in front of me right now...), and he's a nice bloke, I like him. But concerning video-gaming/copyrights (respect for digital work) we have completly antagonist views on the subject, so I avoid talking about it with him at all.
On the other hand, I'm not claiming that I'm perfect. I did some nasty things related to music pre-iTunes and pre-Zune, when I couldn't find obscure titles in the shops like Big Black, Revolting Cocks (anything Steve Albini...), but fortunatly now I can find anything.

Of course he doesn't want pc gaming to die. Who's going to buy his £500 gfx cards then? I'd imagine a sizeable part of nvidias money comes from game gfx card hardware sales. :D

digital bombardiers stole their digits