No unified Wii friends list

By Tom Bramwell Published 15 March, 2007

Even though it could be done.

Those of you hoping that Nintendo would implement a unified friends list for Wii online titles might want to suck on your cheeks for a bit: Wii friends lists will need to be set up for every game you play.

That's according to a GameSpy representative responding to questions about the online matchmaking technology they will be supplying for Nintendo. "The Wii friend lists are game-specific," the spokesperson told a Nintendo Wii blogger who also works as games editor for a German television station.

Disappointment is likely to be amplified, too, by the PR's revelation that "GameSpy's technology does allow for features that could span multiple games". It's just that Nintendo Wii won't be using them that way.

We asked Nintendo UK whether we were missing something; whether there was some obvious reason for going down this route rather than adopting the unified approach that has become a console gaming standard, but were simply told, "Nintendo has taken this step as we believe it's the right thing to do."

Picture of Tom.

About Tom Bramwell

Tom is Operations director of Eurogamer Network and Editor-at-Large of Eurogamer.net. He joined the company in February 2000.

Read more articles from Tom by visiting the Tom Bramwell archive page.

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Comments (117) Latest comment 5 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Scimarad #1 5 years ago

    Awaits screaming hordes of Xbox fanboys...

  • Pirotic #2 5 years ago

    whats the point in having online games when you have to exert so much effort and time just to find somebody decent to play against, nintendo should sort it out - I'm fed up of having to scrape around looking for friends codes all over again when a new game comes out.

  • Aretak #3 5 years ago

    "Awaits screaming hordes of Xbox fanboys..."

    They'll be arriving right after the screaming hordes of Nintendo fanboys who'll have convinced themselves this is a great idea.

  • peterfll #4 5 years ago

    Does it take an "Xbox fanboy" then to work out this seems pretty short sighted?

  • Tonka #5 5 years ago

    It really is a bit silly.

  • Dafub #6 5 years ago

    This is just madening they might as well have no online service at all.
    considering they are using a friend code system I cannot see how this would provide any more protection to the kiddies. I can't think of any other reason for this.

  • Mr_Brown #7 5 years ago

    I agree, this is ridiculous...if it can be done, why isn't it? Why because one of your competitors are doing it? If it works it should be in their as standard. Foo's

  • SBfistfun #8 5 years ago

    Gamepsy + Nintendo = poo

  • Xerx3s #9 5 years ago

    This is made of fail.

  • Hog-lumps #10 5 years ago

    What is the actual advantage for nintendo of having a seperate friends list for each game?

    \ponders

  • Dezm0nd #11 5 years ago

    Bah what a shit way of playing online, despite being a free service I wont be playing online casually like i do with XBL.

    What a load of rubbish!!!

  • Talha #12 5 years ago

    Why am I not surprised?

  • bushwod #13 5 years ago

    Big mistake nintendo. Why are they so terrified of online. It's not like you can even talk to other gamers as there is no wii headset.

    After some many great decisions nintendo's handling of online communication is frankly shocking. I'll doubt I'll ever play online games with my wii, specially as I have an 360.

  • sickpuppysoftware #14 5 years ago

    I don't even own an XBox and I can see how stupid this is. Are they trying to make PS2 online capabilities seem attractive?

  • Genji #15 5 years ago

    "What is the actual advantage for nintendo of having a seperate friends list for each game?"

    I'd like to know this too. Nintendo must know how incredibly annoying this is, so there must be some good reason.

    ...there HAS to be!

    /frantically searches

  • MadMirko #16 5 years ago

    Ok, but does this mean a unique friend code for every game? What's all this talk of "friend lists"? I don't care either way (have had no troubles with friend codes and could live with them again), but do they mean your buddy list is different in each game, or are the codes needed different for each game?

  • jellyhead #17 5 years ago

    I really hope Ninty have a good reason for doing this, I can only think that it's so you can have a list containing only those people who have the game but surely that could be done with a unified list too? A central list and then when you launch a game only those with the game are shown.

    Seems a bit silly and lazy to me though at the moment.

  • MadMirko #18 5 years ago

    What is the actual advantage for nintendo of having a seperate friends list for each game?

    So you can have different buddies for different games? Most of my friends do not like to play strategy games, so there is no list to have them on a list in a strategy game.

    That aside, I would really like to have someone explain how the Wii online part works.

  • Keso #19 5 years ago

    I'm not a screaming Xbox fanboy, but i sure as hell won't be scraping around for friend codes again.

    I can't understand why AC:WW didn't just have a lobby where people could be invited back to your town...

  • Darren #20 5 years ago

    There'll only be a handful of Nintendo Wii games worth playing online anyway so online gameplay on that machine really doesn't interest me at all, in fact, I'd go as far as to say it's unnecessary. Online gaming is vastly overrated in my opinion, nothing beats playing against people in the same room as you.

    Mutliformat games will be available on the PS3 and Xbox 360 anyway, which means online support in most cases, and I'd rather play multiplayer games on the Wii with family and friends as it's more fun and natural. Playing against a faceless, voiceless human controlled avatar/bot just isn't going to be the same and is only handy for first person shooters (again the PS3 and Xbox 360 more than cater for this genre) and racing games (ditto) which support more than four players (the limit imposed by splitscreen games).

  • Steroyd #21 5 years ago

    I'm really not bothered about this, but outright shutting out online play to only those you know of their friend codes is plain retarded.

    /glares at Animal Crossing.

  • smoison #22 5 years ago

    Because a friends channel would be so hard to make....

    Oh Nintendo, why make online so complicated....

  • Moz #23 5 years ago

    Yes in light of XBL this does seem a bit stupid.

    But on the other PC gamers have been dealing with this for years. The likes of Steam and GameSpy do make things easier, but you still need to have about 5 different games network programs on your pc each with a separate friends list.
    Though even that could be set to change once XBL-PC goes live. Though if that is successful it could be a dark day indeed. As much as I like xbox I don't want it having a monopoly. Which is starting to look likely is Ninty and Sony don't pull their fingers out!

    What is going on with nintendo? The Wii exploded onto the market, and despite it continue to sell strongly I can't help but feel it's starting to loose steam.

  • Keso #24 5 years ago

    What are you all talking about, Nintendo have embraced online with open arms... What other console can you vote if you like a cat or dog best... THEN VIEW THE RESULTS?!?

    Genius.

  • MadMirko #25 5 years ago

    I'm really not bothered about this, but outright shutting out online play to only those you know of their friend codes is plain retarded.

    To be fair, that is not an attribute of friend codes, but up to the game. All DS games relied on friend codes, but look at Mario Kart and Metroid Prime Hunters where you could play against totally anonymous strangers without having to know their friend code. It was / is up to the game.

  • Genji #26 5 years ago

    "Oh Nintendo, why make online so complicated...."

    Well, for protection, I suppose. If Nintendo are keen on making an online system suitable for safe family enjoyment, then they have to make compromises. The price of a kid and parent-friendly online service is the sanity of just about everyone else. I guess that's how they see it.

    :-/

  • trevd72 #27 5 years ago

    nintendo really are the daddy at making a pigs ear of things are they not!!!! They have the whole world at thier feet with the positivity around the wii and then they release no games, big games are knocked back and then this. For the love of mario give your head a shake.

  • #28 5 years ago

    Oh, another reason not to switch on my wii.

  • Keso #29 5 years ago

    "Well, for protection, I suppose. If Nintendo are keen on making an online system suitable for safe family enjoyment, then they have to make compromises. The price of a kid and parent-friendly online service is the sanity of just about everyone else. I guess that's how they see it."

    So how would a unified friends list not do this? You could still be required to enter a friend code, only once rather then for every game you buy.

  • Stormflood #30 5 years ago

    You have to accept it: Nintendo is not about Hi-Def, online, surviving.

  • Genji #31 5 years ago

    "So how would a unified friends list not do this? You could still be required to enter a friend code, only once rather then for every game you buy."

    Look man, I don't know. I'm no happier about this than you are, but there has to be some reason why they prefer different codes for different games.

  • Moz #32 5 years ago

    Why can't parents just take more responcability for their kids and learn for them selfs how the toys their kid is playing with work. If a parent bothered to read the manual for a 360 they would learn how to use parental controls, there's even markings on the box and the games letting you know that such a system exists!

    Would give little jimmy a chemistry set and let him go up to his room with it with out even checking on the box to see if it's suitible for his age rang? No you wouldn't, yet that is exactly what alot of parents seem to do with games consoles!!!

  • kenty #33 5 years ago

    i thought elebits had online functionality that utilised the internal Wii number list?

  • justMe #34 5 years ago

    This is not news, it's unfounded speculation. Wii codes are not friend codes, and even on the DS you can play with strangers...

  • moggsy #35 5 years ago

    Look man, I don't know. I'm no happier about this than you are, but there has to be some reason why they prefer different codes for different games.

    Probably because it's easier and cheaper to set up - it is free after all.

  • McBradders #36 5 years ago

    Dumb. Dumb. Dumbdumbdumbdumb.

    Nintendo, you fail at the internet.

  • Xerx3s #37 5 years ago

    I don't get the whole pedo protection thing. Isn't this system better for them? I mean, when someone tries something on psonline or xbl, it can be investigated, followed by a ban on the credit card and passing the data on to the police.

    With this system, they get a clean slate with every new game. It also makes them really hard to track down for the police.

  • Moz #38 5 years ago

    @justMe, you can play with strangers yes, but can you then add then to a friends list or a recently played list so that you can challenge then again? Always playing against random strangers just becomes shallow and dull. Being able to build a list of friends means that over time you get to know people online. And while they may still be fairly shallow friendships, it's still better to play with people yuo can have a bit of laugh with and that you have an idea of how they play, especially in team games like GoW and GRAW

  • kangarootoo #39 5 years ago

    Let me speak for all the non-fanboys out there.

    If true, and if I understand it correctly, this sucks ass.

    That is all.

  • MadMirko #40 5 years ago

    @justMe, you can play with strangers yes, but can you then add then to a friends list or a recently played list so that you can challenge then again?

    That was even possible on the DS with Metroid Prime Hunters. It was called a "Rival", then.

  • chupachups #41 5 years ago

    (sigh)

    Sony has had a lot of flak over their pricing recently, and now it's Nintendo's turn to get it over their stupid feeble approach to online gaming.

    Nintendo, you've had years to get this right. What is your problem?

    Nobody but nobody wants separate logins, and it's even more amazing that Nintendo imposes separate logins within their own games on the DS.

    Why is it that my friend code in Mario Kart can't be the same as the friend code in Animal Crossing? Why can't I just have one friend code for one device? Xbox has had this for years, even the N-Gage had a unified login right from the beginning. It's not difficult to do.

    Beyond just friend codes, Nintendo's utterly pathetic "connect24" idea is another example of how little understanding they have of the online world. We DON'T NEED devices to be permanently online in order to receive messages or downloads, because the internet uses these things called "servers". These "servers" store all your incoming data for you, even when your computer is disconnected from the internet.

    It's like Nintendo's online division is stuck in the 1970s or something.


    "So you can have different buddies for different games? Most of my friends do not like to play strategy games, so there is no list to have them on a list in a strategy game. "

    But that would be a case for having a categorised friends list, not completely separate friends lists.

    There's just no excuse for what Nintendo's doing, they seem to completely misunderstand how online works.

  • Genji #42 5 years ago

    "Probably because it's easier and cheaper to set up - it is free after all."

    Actually, that is a very good point. My ire would be multiplied if I had to pay for this stuff.

    It's a shame that you have to pay through the nose for VC games, though.

  • moggsy #43 5 years ago

    We DON'T NEED devices to be permanently online in order to receive messages or downloads, because the internet uses these things called "servers". These "servers" store all your incoming data for you, even when your computer is disconnected from the internet.

    Servers cost money though.

  • Moz #44 5 years ago

    "Probably because it's easier and cheaper to set up - it is free after all."


    As is PSOnline and that has friends lists! Plus a load more features

  • Genji #45 5 years ago

    "As is PSOnline and that has friends lists! Plus a load more features"

    That's just one game, though.

  • Talha #46 5 years ago

    I recently gave in to the screaming little boy inside me and plumped for an XBox360. Will buy a PS3 too, once there are enough games on it.

    For the record, I did not HAVE to buy an HDTV to play in hi-res because MS make this neat HD AV cable which means you can enjoy HD gaming on virtually any CRT or LCD of a sufficient size.

    The first game I booted was, of course, Gears of War. During the first few levels, as I experienced flawless visuals, pristine music, and nothing to hinder suspension of disbelief (like hiccups or jaggies), I finally began to grasp MS and Sony's insistence on HD gaming.

    By comparison, suddenly this whole giddy Nintendo framework is getting on my nerves. Wii is not terribly cheap - in fact, it is pretty expensive for what you get. I can safely say that nothing comparable to a Gears or an MGS or a GT or a Halo will EVER turn up on Wii. Wii games are not cheap by comparison, to boot.

    So you end up spending a broadly similar amount of money in the long run to enjoy endless MArio variants, in pathetic fidelity compared to the other two, and crippled online functions. The thing that Wii - does - why, you could just as well do it by getting a DS or even some decent emulation software on your PC.

    Yes, I am a graphics whore - seeing how that sweet HD cable leveled the playing field (against my prior perception that you HAVE to have an HDTV in order to see 360 or PS3 games properly), I must conclude that purchasing a Wii doesn't make any sense any more and it is, in fact, Nintendo who are charging a premium on their console (remember, Sony throw in a Blu-Ray player).

  • bdc #47 5 years ago

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see that this is a missed opportunity.

    "The right thing to do"? You bunch of batshit loco developers. I have no idea how your console managed to pip number one spot.

  • kangarootoo #48 5 years ago

    @Talha

    I don't agree with all your points (I do actually agree with most of them), but good points well made. An interesting take on "value" not being the same thing as "cost".

  • zuljin #49 5 years ago

    @chupachups
    "Xbox has had this for years, even the N-Gage had a unified login right from the beginning. It's not difficult to do."

    *twitch*
    Just because it's been done by someone else makes it no less hard a feature. It requires standardisation across all games. I think a little bit of programmer inside me just died when you said that...

    @Talha
    "For the record, I did not HAVE to buy an HDTV to play in hi-res"
    Great! One thing tho, the amazing difference in graphics that you're seeing, it really does get even better on an HD TV... Saw it on a friends 32" Bravia, saving up as we speak!

  • Carrybagma #50 5 years ago

    We asked Nintendo UK whether we were missing something; whether there was some obvious reason for going down this route rather than adopting the unified approach that has become a console gaming standard, but were simply told, "Thanks for letting us know."

  • Rob #51 5 years ago

    I can safely say that nothing comparable to a Gears or an MGS or a GT or a Halo will EVER turn up on Wii.
    No shit sherlock. Of course, reasonable people can also see that nothing comparable to Wii Sports/WarioWare will EVER turn up on 360/PS3. Do you see now, they offer different things! Oh my!

  • ChrisOTR #52 5 years ago

    Ouch. That's a big stumble for Nintendo.

  • RexRunti #53 5 years ago

    Actually I think the whole lack of unified online experience comes from problems wih third party publishers. MS had a lot of trouble when the set up Live, EA even threatened to boycott the service. This is because having a unified experice means putting a big chunk of the online systems in the hands of the console manufacturers, along with all the statistics and advertising opportunities. MS remaind stubbon though EA got to use their own servers (which until very recently were awful), but Sony, who will never have the same financial clout, decided on a pretty much 100% up to the publisher system. Nintendo aren't even operating their online service but rather pushing it out to another third party, GameSpy so aren't even in a position to negotiate.

  • Talha #54 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo: Coming from you it matters a lot to me that you agree with MOST of my points. For me, Wii is simply not a good value because it confines you to a specialized category of (low-def) gaming, contrary to what Ninty might say - I hope it has dawned on Wii owners by now, which is fine IF you are into that. Even a basic PC is better value than Wii in that respect.

    @Rob: First, that's no guarantee. Second, even if it is, believe it or not, MOST GAMERS CAN DO WITHOUT THEM (as Gamecube's sales figures prove). There is a reason MS or Sony are not busily concocting a Wii Sports clone right now.

    @Zuljin: Yeah I know, but for me HDTV's are still a little too expensive for me right now. I am waiting for a time when they will cheapen further before buying one. Happy saving!
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 10:40

  • Steroyd #55 5 years ago

    Chupachups: Nobody but nobody wants separate logins, and it's even more amazing that Nintendo imposes separate logins within their own games on the DS.

    That's the thing though, Nintendo has set it up so all you have to do is click online... and your online keeping it very simple.

    But at the same time Nintendo does stuff like Animal crossing where only people you have the Friends codes are able to meet your village, plus the reason of friends codes existance means squat if you can enter a sort of lobby like in Mario Kart where it's strictly down to quick play only instead of choosing Lobby's at whim.

    No shit sherlock. Of course, reasonable people can also see that nothing comparable to Wii Sports/WarioWare will EVER turn up on 360/PS3. Do you see now, they offer different things! Oh my!

    PS3 + Eyetoy = Motion sensing wii-style.

    It's possible, so i wouldn't necessarily say NEVER with 100% conviction.

  • jonsaan #56 5 years ago

    Doesn't seem like a huge issue to me.

  • Keso #57 5 years ago

    Motion sensing sports on other consoles you say?

    Guys, this was done on the PS2 and Xbox a year before the Wii was even released.

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    It was able to sense subtle movements much better then the Wii remote can to.

  • McBradders #58 5 years ago

    I love the way people think Nintendo has the only motion sensing doo-da on the market. The Sixaxis is a -very- nifty piece of tech, capable of much of what the Wiimote is.

  • SBfistfun #59 5 years ago

    ^ Nope

  • kangarootoo #60 5 years ago

    @Talha

    I guess it comes down to what each gamer in question requires from their system. For some, the PS3 will be the best value, for others it will be the Wii, for others the 360.

    The only issue I took with your previous post was the suggestion that including a blu-ray drive was inherently good value. Again, it depends on the user. If you want blu-ray and plan to buy a drive it is great value. if you don't care about that, its not such a great deal.

    However, nothing can be viewed in isolation. Someone may have no interest in blu-ray but the PS3 may STILL be the best value deal for them. Maybe they must have tilt and HD, in which case the PS3 is the only option for them.

    Value is also I think directly relative to people's ability to buy (or at the very least, its importance is relative). If one option is beyond your means, it is immediately viewed as being poor value.

    I think it is what has form some people's view of the PS3. If it was more affordable, it might then appear to be better value than previously thought (which sounds kind of obvious, but its not quite as simple as first appears).
    Edited by 2 at 15/03/07 @ 11:11

  • kangarootoo #61 5 years ago

    @SBfistfun

    Its is you know. The aiming bit is really the only difference. Seriously.

  • Genji #62 5 years ago

    "It was able to sense subtle movements much better then the Wii remote can to."

    It'd be interesting to try controlling a racing game with it, though. Or any other game apart from the one it was designed for.

    Seeing as this looks like it will turn into an "OMG WII/NINTENDO SUX" thread, I offer this rebuttal:

    WII ROCKS! NINTENDO ROCKS!

    Take *that*!

  • WillTheSecond #63 5 years ago

    Oh, God, what the f**k are you doing Nintendo?

    There's no need to call up the hordes of PS3/360 fanboys, this is going to piss of Wii fanboys just as much. Hopefully the angry reaction to this all over the net, on forums, blog comments and of course all the major websites will show Nintendo what a huge mistake they're making. If they want to win they must capture both the core and casual market, with this decision they're abandoning the core market in favour of a sloppy system.

    Quite frankly, they have a unified friend code system, and this move not to use it makes no sense whatsoever. Even that system is bad enough considering they released an internet browser with no content protection for youngsters at all, far more dangerous than any game lobby.

    Ridiculous. I am now seriously considering buying a 360 if the situation does not change.

  • Lemming81 #64 5 years ago

    Sorry to point out the obvious here, but isn't this because the Wii is a family orientated machine? Little Johnny and his Animal Crossing friend list doesn't want to be mixed with angry spotty teenage brother Timmy's Gore Fighters 5 friend's list does it? The console is designed for more than one person...

  • justMe #65 5 years ago

    The sisaxis is a glorified nunchuck,

    wiimote + nunchuck = twelveaxis + pointing device

  • Keso #66 5 years ago

    "It'd be interesting to try controlling a racing game with it, though"

    Well for that you would just use the SIXAXIS wouldn't you ;)

    I'm not saying the Wii suckxxx, I own one (I did have 2... god bless eBay), I’m just a little disappointed with it, that’s all.

  • Rob #67 5 years ago

    @Rob: First, that's no guarantee.
    PS3 + Eyetoy = Motion sensing wii-style.

    I like the way you folks just ignore things to suit your argument. You say that Halo/GoW/MGS could not be done on a Wii - I kind of agree with you. Except that, obviously they could - just with a few less polygons and in SD. MGS came out on the GC (which the Wii can outperform), Halo came out on the XBox (which the Wii can outperform). Perfectly possible YES. As good as the 360/PS3 versions graphically NO. I see you argument, you're talking HD, next-gen graphics. However, if you're going to say that a few polys makes the critical difference there, how you can then even begin to suggest that the SIXAXIS and the Eyetoy are in the same ballpark as the Wii Remote?

    Face it: 360/PS3 graphically have it beat. The Wii will never match 'em. However, the Wii Remote is bounds ahead of the SIXAXIS/Eyetoy and likewise will never be matched on the 360/PS3. And it doesn't matter.

    I can't understand why people feel the need to be so black and white about it - each system has a prefectly good set of plus and minus points. You don't have to choose one and defend it with your life you know. Doing that will just mean you miss out somewhere along the line.

  • kangarootoo #68 5 years ago

    @Lemming81

    A friends list of some sort if of course a great idea for the reasons you give, but a different code per game? I don't see that offers any more protection than could be afforded by an attentive and sensible parent.

  • Steroyd #69 5 years ago

    Sorry to point out the obvious here, but isn't this because the Wii is a family orientated machine? Little Johnny and his Animal Crossing friend list doesn't want to be mixed with angry spotty teenage brother Timmy's Gore Fighters 5 friend's list does it? The console is designed for more than one person...

    Yeah but what's so hard to have a traditional online multiplayer lobby but taking out voice chat or text surely that'd be a better solution than "what does this chocolate taste like" spaztastic online service?

    And what's to stop little Johnny going on random internet forums asking random people for Friends codes to Animal Crossing?

    All that does is take control outside of the Nintendo circa.
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 11:29

  • McBradders #70 5 years ago

    @SBfistfun

    Quite simply, you fail at hardware comparisons.

    What does the Wii have that the Sixaxis does not? Pointing.

    Wow.

  • Talha #71 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo : Yeah you are right about the Blu-Ray bit - but my argument was based on the assumption that what value would PS3 represent to someone who hates the guts of the PS brand and everything it represents. For such a person, it will boil down purely to the hardware, which we all know Sony are selling at a loss, so it even becomes good value.

    Similarly, 360 offers a good games portfolio spanning a wide range of tastes and genres, so it is good value for anyone (even those who were not great fans of the XBox gaming library, like myself).

    But the Wii - aaah, that's tough. We all know the hardware is underpowered. We all know that no one will do a Halo or an MGS for it (regardless of what COULD be done). We all know that the games release schedule is drying up. We all know that all things said and done, the Wii games portfolio appeals to the DS/GCN demographic and virtually no one outside that group. We all know that in case of cross platform titles, the Wii version will be a severely crippled one. We all know that the Wiimote advantage (if there was one) has been at least partially neutralized by Sixaxis (copycats or not). We all now know that Wii online isn't going to be much better than PS2 online.

    So if someone has a few hundred quid to spare on a console and has no loyalties, what would you advise them? A Wii will save them a couple hundred ones at the outset, but nothing more - the peripherals and the games are priced at par. And most of those games are, might I mention, low-def, second grade fiddles to their cousins on PC, PS3 or 360.

    THAT's what I am talking about.

  • Rob #72 5 years ago

    So if someone has a few hundred quid to spare on a console and has no loyalties, what would you advise them?

    Surely the advice would depend entirely on their situation, their likes, their dislikes, their lifestyle. There is no 'one-size-fits-all' answer to that one.

  • justMe #73 5 years ago

    A few points regarding the Wii:

    The DS/GCN demographic (emphasis on DS) is going to easily surpass the PS2 in numbers pretty soon, how is that a bad target audience?

    The Wii games release schedule is not drying up. On the contrary, it's heating up.

    The wiimote pointing device is a revolution in itself, just like the DS touch screen was.

    What they call the "recruiting power" of the Wii is unlike anything before. Noone stays indifferent after they see the Wii in action, almost everybody wants to buy one. Both the PS3 and 360 are just traditional machines, most "normal" people will just ignore them.

  • Talha #74 5 years ago

    @justMe: I won't answer your post because I think I have made my case based on facts and not opinion. Suffice it to say that in my humble opinion, all that you wrote exactly is what Ninty's marketing guys want you to believe. In other words, there is no innovation, no pleasure, no fun, no value, outside of Nintendo

  • LetsGo #75 5 years ago

    WHY ARE PEOPLE SO SURPRISED!

    Ninty have ALWAYS said the Wii multiplayer is going to be EXCATLY like the DS.
    The Wii is NOT a hardcore games machine thus it doesn’t require a detailed friends list.

    Yes, I would love something like XBL but it isn’t gonna happen….

  • spongebob #76 5 years ago

    I understand Nintendo's family-friendly approach. Having said that they're not really supporting the Internet gaming concept where you can always find someone to play against or with. Now it's more like LAN-gaming party without the physical get together factor. What Nintendo gamers now need to do is roam around in all sorts of Internet forums to find people to play with. In the end of the day this might be as family-friendly as the traditional XBLA and PC approach.

  • zuljin #77 5 years ago

    @justMe
    "Noone stays indifferent after they see the Wii in action"
    Actually theres one in my office. Haven't touched it. I like what I see, but much prefer what I see on XBox 360, PS3 and PC to be honest.

  • Talha #78 5 years ago

    @zuljin: In your office? Consoles? Where do I sign?

  • zuljin #79 5 years ago

    @Talha
    Become a programmer, we're required by law to be geeky. Beware though, you will have to:
    - Become an avid Star Wars fan
    - Shun natural light
    - Learn to juggle
    - Laugh at jokes such as "Why did the programmer confuse Halloween with Christmas day?"

    Answer is because 31 oct = 25 dec (31 base 8 = 25 base 10), btw...
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 12:37

  • Talha #80 5 years ago

    @zuljin : Well obviously you do have an idea of an Accountant's life, and his sense of humor!

  • kangarootoo #81 5 years ago

    @Talha

    Like I said, my disagreements were minor. I do absolutely agree with you that the value of the Wii is simply not based on on cost alone.

    I was really excited about the Wii, and when I first played some games on it I was totally impressed. But slowly, slowly I am starting to wonder what is going to happen next. The number of decent titles seems to really be dropping off save a few obvious exceptions.

    I'm sure there will be some first party titles along in a bit to get things to some degree back on track, but the quality of third party offerings seems to be overall a little poor. Now some will argue that is because devs are not able to design effectively for the new controller, and I would probably agree, but when a gamer goes shopping they don't really care about the excuses (as no customer does, and as no customer should have to), they just want to see a range of good games on the shelf. Currently that is what is holding the Wii back for me and many of my friends (some of which have delayed a purchase, some of which have made one but are now wondering where the rest of the good games are).

  • justMe #82 5 years ago

    @Talha: What I wrote is, of course, my opinion. But it's all based on my personal experience. I never really saw the DS success coming until I noticed my nieces started asking for one as their birthday/christmas present.

    The Wii is going even faster into that territory. Every time I invite a couple of friends (families all of them) over to my place, the wifes are the first to say "I want one", right after they try to design theirs and the childrens Miis. The husbands are convinced after they try Wii sports golf/bowling/tennis/boxing and some retro (R-Type or something) action. Try that with a "hardcore" 360 shooter...

    And I live in a country where the playstation brand is even stronger than in most other european countries...

  • Talha #83 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo : 100% agreed - that fog of initial euphoria is slowly lifting to reveal a mostly barren landscape (my, aren't we poetic today!). Thank Goodness I took my time to consider the investment.

    Although I did splash out $500 on an 8800GTS, and given that there are no DirectX 10 games for several months, and NVidia drivers will continue to suck and cripple my games for the foreseeable future, that does not make me the smartest guy on the planet!

    @justME: Hey, man - I am not saying Wii is bad or that it isn't adorable. I am not disputing your experience as well. I also admit that the launch lineup resonates with the audience. It is just that several factors have forced me to question whether the Wii is really as good (and good value) as Ninty claim it to be, and whether it is a good purchase in absolute terms.
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 12:58

  • Kropotkin #84 5 years ago

    @justMe This is a key point about the Wii. The non-gaming populace which outnumbers the gaming fans out there by a massive margin likes the Wii. They have little to no interest in the PS3 and XBox 360 because they uphold the gaming axioms we as gamers have cherished since the invention of video games.

    The Wii, like the DS generally turns away from these axioms by encouraging the type of games the non-gamer would enjoy like Soduku and Wii-Play. The PS3 and XBox 360 on the other hand continue down the same well trodden path that is almost a straight line from the Atari 2600. This in my view is no bad thing and is why I prefer the titles on those systems over and above the Wii.

    As to a unified friends list on the Wii or more to the point a lack of one this is all about the Wii's target audience. They don't care about online gaming. The mere concept horrifies them and thus Nintendo does not with to push it for the Wii. Anything that alienates the new audience they have decided to tap into is a no-no.

    In summary the Wii is not really aimed at the likes of Eurogamer posters but to folk who don't even know Eurogamer exists...

  • justMe #85 5 years ago

    Is the DS a good purchase in absolute terms? Isn't it severely underpowered when compared to the PSP? Couldn't you use the very same logic to call it expensive in "absolute terms"? What makes it so successful? Would you have predicted its success a few moths after it was released?

    I'm not talking about "absolute terms", I'm talking about clear signs. The current release schedule of Wii games is nothing compared to what it can become when the 3rd parties realise those signs are real. And I believe it is already starting, even faster than with the DS. With the Wii, Nintendo managed to identify the details that made the DS (and, to some extent, the PS2) the current success story, and concentrate on them.

  • justMe #86 5 years ago

    Kropotkin, Nintendo is trying to do to the online gaming population exactly what they did to the general gaming croud: expand it. To do it they decided to go back to the basics, the only way to have an entry point that doesn't scare newcomers away at first glance. I am sure they will also cater to the more experienced crowd, some of those newcomers will move on, others will keep it simple/casual.

    Sony and Microsoft will, in a few years, thank Nintendo for the lesson they gave them this gen.

  • spongebob #87 5 years ago

    DS has a bucketful of "nice" and "good" titles but there's not one title out there yet that makes me buy it. Zelda might change it.

    PSP has the same dilemma. Lots of decent games, no real system sellers. The homebrew and versatility (esp. as a media player) is the only thing that makes it appealing to me.

  • kangarootoo #88 5 years ago

    @justMe

    The DS has had a consistent stream of great titles though, pretty much from the get go.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not writing the Wii off. It is selling very well and nothing would make me happier than a whole load of great titles for the platform. I just think that until those titles surface, its appeal clock is ticking.

    That is the same for any platform though I guess, you have to have the games or nothing else matters. I just hope Wii doesn't go the way of the GC for the same reasons. Choice is good, and I'm not even close to being a fanboy so I don't much care who "wins".

  • justMe #89 5 years ago

    The DS had a few good titles from Nintendo at the start. It took a long time for 3rd parties to realise the DS's potential (in both gameplay and market share). Mario 64 (N64), Wario ware (GBA with innovative controls), Mario Kart (snes/N64). Every single "hardcore gamer" complained and predicted the console would fail.

    With Zelda, Wii sports, Wario Ware, Excite Truck, VC, Mii/News/Weather/Voting/Opera channels, and many other stuff to play with , I don't see the Wii drought you all are talking about. Or maybe I see it, but I then look at us all as some kind of gaming "junkies" and realise that we will never be satisfied (unless we get an overdose, happended to me a couple of times). The current Wii portfolio is more than adequate for a 6 month old console. The usual big guns from Nintendo are still coming and 3rd parties are jumping in all the time. The Wii will not be another GC, it will be another DS.

  • elvenearth #90 5 years ago

    Bloody outrageous mate!!

  • AcidSnake #91 5 years ago

    Just arrived...

    bad show nintendo...unjustifiable...

    Now to read the comments...

  • RexRunti #92 5 years ago

    There are a lot of comparisons being made between the DS and Wii, but people keep forgetting one thing. The DS is a handheld console the Wii isn't. I should point out that I always thought the DS would outsell the PSP because the PSP was (at the time) focused on PS and PS2 ports and not quick and simple gaming for train journeys etc. of the DS.

    With consoles people want to sit down and relax/kill things. Yes there are times when you want to jump around and look like a prat, for example when friends are round or you want a quick burst of something and there are non ninty games that cater to this, Guitar Hero, Buzz, Singstar, EyeToy etc... But most gamers will prefer Sonic on a 'proper' console.

    The mass market didn't buy a PS2 for Singstar, they bought it for GTA and FIFA, then bought Singstar. People who buy a Wii for Warioware won't buy anything else or buy a 360/PS3 for GOW/GOW (gears and god) and then get the party games (if there were any on the 360)

  • sanctimoniousqf #93 5 years ago

    Silly silly Ninty... online is growing in popularity, and you are making it very hard to justify keeping your online crippled console. Given the lack of play it has had in recent weeks, even with the "highly innovative controller", and given this recent rumour, I am sorely tempted to trade it in, especially since I haven't even seen Cube quality graphics yet, let alone CubeCube graphics...

  • BigE0n #94 5 years ago

    Could this also be a sly move by nintendo to only allow offical games to be played online.... I'm not sure how the Friend code is tied to a game but if for example someone introduces a way of play 'Backup's' (cough!) on the system wouldnt this stop the backup being used online.... (If so it means that Nintendo dont have to speed lots policing the online system like Microsoft have too....?)

    Or is the freinds code different in its workings than that of say a STEAM id?
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 14:38

  • Trendyninja #95 5 years ago

    Why do people keep banging on about Nintendo being so family orientated? The exact same thing can be said about Microsoft for this situation. You can set up you Xbox Live options so that only your friends will ever see you online or if necessary no one can see you online, not even logon to xbox.com and see your acheivements or when you were last on line.

    Nintendo could easily doing something similar but for some reason or other they won't. Which I find very disappointing indeed.

    If Nintendo are prepared to accept that their machine will not be as graphically powerful as the 360 or PS3 they will need to do more then just pin all their hopes on the controller being the selling point. More needs to be done and a fully functional, easy to use online gaming service is one of them.

    I was fortunate enough to get a Wii on launch day but earlier this week I decided to sell the thing. It's not that I have anything dead against the console, I just felt that what it was offering did not fit my gaming style.

  • Trendyninja #96 5 years ago

    @Rob

    And can you honestly say that you have seen a Wii game that can be classed as being graphically superior to an Xbox game?

    I know I can't.

    A bit worrying really.

    I mean how powerful is the Wii, really?

  • Overlush #97 5 years ago

    Low spec system, poo-pooing HD and a decent online structure...

    Hmmm....

  • justMe #98 5 years ago

    How is that article related to what I wrote rdexter?

    Nintendo is the only console manufacturer that is also a game designing company at its heart at the same time. The only company that designs the hardware around the software and not the other way around. Games as an art form are very different from content-centred interactive movies. Gameplay will always be the art form related to games, not 3d design or story/script writing. Games on a limited platform will always bring out the creativity of the developers, instead of the finantial power needed for high-end content creation.

  • Trendyninja #99 5 years ago

    Yes and I guess that ethos is what brought the Gamecube it's unrivalled success.

    Seriously, get a grip.

  • kangarootoo #100 5 years ago

    @justMe

    "but I then look at us all as some kind of gaming "junkies" and realise that we will never be satisfied"

    That is almost certainly true :)

  • kangarootoo #101 5 years ago

    Calm down everyone. There we were having a nice 'ol chat about the value and future of the Wii, and suddenly everyone is reaching under the table. Chill out or go to your rooms.

  • zuljin #102 5 years ago

    @kangarootoo
    "Calm down everyone."
    Dude, saying that didn't work for Phil Harrison, why should we listen to you?

    :)

  • kangarootoo #103 5 years ago

    Shit, I've been countered with logic.

  • smelly #104 5 years ago

    oh FFS.. THATS FUCKING STUPID!!!

    Even the biggest fan (me) can see that's the most STUPIDEST DECISION i've ever heard!!!

    I absolutely fail to see the fucking logic in that!

  • smelly #105 5 years ago

    "Its is you know. The aiming bit is really the only difference. Seriously. "


    Sixaxis detects tilt. Wiimote detects acceleration (and pointing, and distance to tv).

    Sixaxis only detects tilt on one pad, wiimote detects acceleration on BOTH hands.

    Wiimote has rumble, sixaxis doesnt

    Wiimote has (shite speaker you turn off after minutes), sixaxis doesnt.


    There be you product comparision.. Bleep

  • zuljin #106 5 years ago

    @smelly
    I think Bradders was reffering to just the motion sensing capabilites being the same (although I do hope we get rumble back at some point *crosses fingers*)...

    "Sixaxis detects tilt. Wiimote detects acceleration (and pointing, and distance to tv)."
    Nope. SixAxis detects force as well. Whilst I disagree with nu-scifi terms like SixAxis, the reason for its name is that it detects rotation in 3 axes, and translation in 3 axes... Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that you have enough information there to calculate force.

    Hence, the SixAxis does everything motion sensing wise the Wii-mote does.

    Except the pointing thingie. :)

  • kangarootoo #107 5 years ago

    @smelly

    Ok, I'm nothing if not fair.

    I'd forgotten about rumble. I'd also forgotten about the speaker, and that does have potential for some nice accessory ideas.

    "Sixaxis detects tilt. Wiimote detects acceleration (and pointing, and distance to tv)."

    That bit isn't totally true. Sixaxis also detects acceleration. Thats why it is sixaxis and not threeaxis (aside from the fact it would lose its symetrical marketing novelty). The distance to TV is relative, not absolute, but again I agree that is a good feature.

    The both hands things is also pretty groovy I agree.

    So, overall probably a better controller, but not the only ball in the park in that respect.

    :)


    Edit: "So, overall probably a better controller". Not necessarily better for the majority of games I might add. As Wii gives with one hand, it takes away with the other unless the devs can properly embrace the system (which some clearly can, and some clearly can't).
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 16:53

  • gingerlink #108 5 years ago

    actually, the siraxis does everything the nunchuk can, making it look crap again...

    I really don't see how this is logical though, surely if you want to play someone on one game you'll want to play them on another game.

    Plus i seem lots of people are forgetting that for most games on the DS at least, so would be the same case with the wii, that for most games you get matched up with random people, not people on your friend's list, hunters even had an option to add people you just played onto your rivals list so you could play again...

    so the whole friend code thing is only a hassle if you want to play specific people...which i geuss ends up being a lot which is why its annoying, o well

    EDIT: god i mispelt siraxis suraxis...
    Edited by 1 at 15/03/07 @ 16:55

  • smelly #109 5 years ago

    "so the whole friend code thing is only a hassle if you want to play specific people..."


    Like with animal crossing?

    I dont want strangers visiting me and vandalising my village when i sleep, i want to do that to friends!

  • Carrybagma #110 5 years ago

    I'm pretty sure this will change. Unless I'm missing something, this is just too badly thought out to be launched as described.

    Err..

    :o(

  • Carrybagma #111 5 years ago

    Help me - I'm trying to work this out.

    You have two people in this scenario, each with a Wii. They only want to play on-line games with eachother. What is to be gained from making them register each game with eachother, rather than a single Wii code?

    The only thing I can think of is some sort statistics gathering, but I'm sure they could have done that without needing to frig such a clumsy registration process.

    If there are no other ideas, then the only remaining explanation is laziness - porting an already clumsy model from the DS. If Nintendo wanted to bring 'non-gamers' into the on-line gaming world, they picked a good way to help put them off.

  • smelly #112 5 years ago

    I dont get it either.. it sounds like a lot of hassle for no real gain to anyone.

  • L0cky #113 5 years ago

    'Oh, another reason not to switch on my wii.'

    I'm with you. My Wii hasn't been switched on for nearly two months; what an anti climax after the novelty wore off. :(

    But then I do have a DS which takes all my gaming time, I think they just need to get the good games out the door.

  • Talha #114 5 years ago

    @JustMe: Really now, mate, that's plain ridiculous - why do Nintendo fans descend into esoteric rhetoric when faced with the slightest criticism is beyond me. Yada yada yada - gaming is an art form. However, art is NOT necessarily borne out of limitations, particularly self-afflicted ones. And game creation is as much an art on PS3 or 360 or PC or a DS as it is on the Wii. What gives some Ninty fans a license to be smug, cryptic, condescending, patronizing, self-righteous jerks, I don't know . What makes them think that Ninty being a games designer at heart and being PROFITABLE means SHIT to anyone is also beyond me. As if mere words could make up for physical shortcomings of a product.

    I didn't mean this to be a rant, but hell, I have to get my point accross.

    1) Previously I said Wii is not good value. Scratch that, I was being nice. The Wii is EXPENSIVE for what you get. Get it? Wake up and visit shops other than Ninty outlets.
    2) That controller might be nirvana to some, but it is JUST ANOTHER CONTROLLER to most. They'd be happy playing Zelda no matter what controller they have to use.
    3) The games portfolio offered, and to be offered, on Wii might PRETEND to cater to grandmas and kids and adults alike, but most of them are short, basic, pure twitch games. That makes them NICHE gaming and not mainstream. Go look up niche in a dictionary. The mainstream moved on approximately a decade ago for Ninty, and it is NOT what Ninty believe it to be. Instead, what are difficult, complex games according to Ninty are the new mainstream.
    5) Wii games are not cheap - I know Excite Truck is good, but with any other platform you'd expect such games to be in the budget category.
    4) ALl of the above suggests that Ninty are either very smart or mildly self-delusional. In any case, all they are resonating with is their traditional audience. Those will be the ones playing on their Wiis three years from now.
    5) For the record, Sony are just plain self-delusional, by the way.

  • justMe #115 5 years ago

    Calm down mate, I was just commenting on that article rdexter linked to, somehow implying that it was related to what I said before. In that article Chris Hecker accuses Nintendo of not pushing games as an art form.

    I never said that games made for Wii would be the only ones I would consider art, only that _sometimes_ the focus on "next-gen" graphics/sound/content can limit the creativity of the core gameplay element. When you have lots of money invested in making that content you are sometimes prevented from exploring the gameplay further because it could mean the need to redo all that same content. That makes the industry focus more on safe bet games, creativity is never a safe bet. By making graphics/sound second thoughts for Wii developers and challenging them with a different control method, Nintendo is trying to force them to go back to the basics, forget what they think makes a good game. If that isn't a push for creativity what would be?

    An analogy: movies. You don't have to spend millions to make a good film, there are a lot of shitty films out there with "next-gen" visuals (and they almost always make money), but sometimes someone comes out of nowhere to remember us that a good film is a good film is a good film...

    And I don't see people complaining that you pay the same to see an Hollywood blockbuster as any other low budget film.

    Unrelated: Excite Truck is in the budget category compared to most next-gen games (40€ instead of 60€-70€).

  • SuperBas #116 5 years ago

    Good job Nintendo. And by "good job," I mean "stupid crap like this will have me selling my Wii in no time."

  • kew34 #117 5 years ago

    wait... so how do u put miis on your mii plaza again

  • kew34 #118 5 years ago

    someone please respond!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!