Sony warns against grey imports

By Games Industry.biz Published 19 October, 2006

After bashing Lik-Sang in court.

Sony has warned that it will take legal action against anyone engaging in grey importing of its products after scoring a High Court victory over online retailer Lik-Sang.

In his ruling yesterday, Judge Michael Fysh found that Lik-Sang - which offered Japanese PSPs to European consumers via its website - was in breach of intellectual property rights.

Lik-Sang had claimed that it was operating within the law as the company is based in Hong Kong, and has no trading presence in the UK or European Economic Area.

But, as reported by the Financial Times, Judge Fysh ruled that, "The acts of which the complaint is made have, in my view, been perpetrated not in Hong Kong but here in the EEA, and without Sony's consent."

Sony declined to comment directly on the case. However, a spokesperson did tell GI.biz: "The law is clear; grey importing PS2, PSP or PS3 into the EU, without the express permission of SCE is illegal. Therefore, we will utilise the full scope of the law to put a stop to any retailers who chose to do this."

He continued, "Ultimately, we're trying to protect consumers from being sold hardware that does not conform to strict EU or UK consumer safety standards, due to voltage supply differences et cetera; is not - in PS3's case - backwards compatible with either PS1 or PS2 software; will not play European Blu-Ray movies or DVDs; and will not be covered by warranty."

It's no surprise that Sony is offering a strong warning against importing PS3s - there's likely to be a high demand for the consoles in Europe, following the announcement that they won't be officially arriving here until four months after they go on sale in the US and Japan.

The company will doubtless be looking to avoid a repeat of the events of last year, where several retailers, including ElectricBirdLand, ended up in court for selling import PSPs.

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Comments (70) Latest comment 5 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • space_ace #1 5 years ago

    import ps3... hmm what a good idea, thanks sony :)

  • Foxclose #2 5 years ago

    Just do it!

  • DJmizuhara #3 5 years ago

    Oh well...I guess I'll sell them through forums instead of ebay...I'll get 2 machines on the 11th of November :D

  • Sko #4 5 years ago

    He continued, "Ultimately, we're trying to protect consumers...

    ...", stifling a laugh, tears welling in his eyes and turning redder by the moment.

  • ManicDrunkMonk #5 5 years ago

    Why would anyone in their right mind ant to import a PS3 at present. Although i'm pretty sure it will have a strong line-up of games in 12-18 months, right now you'll be getting the glitchy early systems with lacklustre games.

    On top of all that you have to go through the hassle of switching power supplies etc.

    The only people that want to do this are people that want to show-off that they have new hardware a few months early.

  • Steroyd #6 5 years ago

    well you wouldn't be in this situation if you didn't delay in Europe now Sony.

    I'm wondering though they orignally had a forecast of shipping 6 million units worldwide before the end of Fiscal year (March 2007).

    Now with Blu-ray diode shortages delaying the Euro launch they STILL intend to ship the same amount of units in the same time frame excluding Europe.

    That's just sick and wrong.

  • MadMirko #7 5 years ago

    Ultimately, we're trying to protect consumers from being sold hardware that does not conform to strict EU or UK consumer safety standards, due to voltage supply differences et cetera; is not - in PS3's case - backwards compatible with either PS1 or PS2 software; will not play European Blu-Ray movies or DVDs; and will not be covered by warranty

    Great, just great. I'm looking forward to them "clarifying" more region-free facts.

  • Psychotext #8 5 years ago

    I can see why they're doing it, but please don't try and tell me it's for my own good.

  • Caimbeul #9 5 years ago

    yeah, what happened to the region free gaming that Sony promissed?

  • trevd72 #10 5 years ago

    did they say that they are protecting us from a crap product.

    fuck 'em. wii60 all the way.

    I now officially hate sony....jeez, i have spent more than enough on them over the years. i want a ps3 as soon as I can cos i am a spoilt brat so let me, its my money my choice. It really all comes done to money and zero goodwill between us and them. I hope this generation see's them go all sega n' shit.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 14:43

  • lambtron #11 5 years ago

    "The matter is clear; grey importing PS2, PSP or PS3 into the EU, without the express permission of SCE seriously undermines our god-given right to extort Europeans. Therefore, we will utilise the full scope of the law to put a stop to any retailers who chose to do this."

    Fixed.

  • mkreku #12 5 years ago

    I can't believe the judge ruled in Sony's favour on this one. How can it be illegal to have a company in Hong Kong and let everyone in the world buy stuff from their webpage? If the item is legal in your country, you should be home-free.

    All of this feels very petty of Sony. It's like they're trying to stop anyone in Europe to get a Playstation 3 just because they've said so. "If we decide that noone in Europe should have a Playstation 3 before March, then NOONE SHALL HAVE ONE BEFORE MARCH!!". Bah.

    I still say boycott Sony in the EU for treating us like second rate citizens.

  • Darkedge #13 5 years ago

    fcuk you Sony - what did phil say about europeans not minding the delay?

    oh yes Phil harrison said that if gamers want the PS3 at launch they will sell more on import, as they have always done
    How does this fit with suing the shite out importers?

  • aine #14 5 years ago

    Sony can suck my ringpiece. That is all.

    I really hope the PS3 doesn't sell... then it won't end up with a similarly huge and diverse game library as the PS1 and 2 before it, and I won't have to buy one.

  • Xerx3s #15 5 years ago

    I thought that sony said that it would be region free games, wtf is the point of that when you aren't allowed to import? *confused*

  • Psi #16 5 years ago

    Breaking news! Sony chastise Lik-Sang after they toss a small amount of food between the bars of the european cage. Sony are very upset that the euro's are fed anything but the low grade reconstituded overpriced gruel they are used too.

    more at six!

  • Dizzy #17 5 years ago

    But... but... region free???

  • trevd72 #18 5 years ago

    so are we in agreement that sony are a bunch of spoilt sports and bastards!!???

  • aine #19 5 years ago

    Wouldn't surprise me if it was region free in the US and Japan, but not in Europe.

  • Psi #20 5 years ago

    Dizzy if sony snap liksangs ass in a beartrap over hardware you can sure as hell bet the same will apply to software in the same ruling.

    Overpriced euro pricing rocks!

  • peterfll #21 5 years ago

    Dr Mr Sony.

    First. Sort out your global release schedules for your hardware and software, which currently leaves the European market being treated as the poor relation.
    Second. If incompatibility between regions concerns you then do not introduce regional locking into your hardware and software.
    Third. Your judgement and this case on what is legal and illegal is this area is not definitive. If I buy a Japanese PS3 next month and bring it back to the UK with me, as long as I declare it to customs I'm not breaking the law.

    Forth. Fuck. Right. Off.

    .... you patronising bunch of absolute wankers. If you put as much effort into sorting out the first three points as you do putting your legal teams on to grey importers, public perception of your company might not be in the gutter.
    Edited by 3 at 19/10/06 @ 15:02

  • kaleii Verified Editor-in-Chief, Country Manager, Eurogamer Sweden #22 5 years ago

    I'm guessing that it's just PS3 games that are region free, whilst PS one and PS2 games still use the same region coding as their previous systems.

    So if you buy a japanese PS3 you can only play japanese PS one and PS2 games (but all regions for PS3 games).

    Makes sense, as they're still releasing PS2 games, and those region locks still "need" to apply for their markets.

  • mingster #23 5 years ago

    Yup as Kaleii says on the region encoding...
    plus the publishers have the option of region encoding the discs if they want too same as Xbox 360

  • thegouldfish #24 5 years ago

    New drinking game, each time Sony do something stupid you take a drink.

    Here I will start off by just passing out bottle of Vodka it will be quicker.

  • ecureuil #25 5 years ago

    You're protecting fuck all you greedy bunch of cunts. Fuck off and let us import, it's still going in your pockets, isn't it?! Wankers.

  • Schiraman #26 5 years ago

    What a fucking joke, protectionist trade practices like these should be outlawed.

    Clearly region-coding and similar methods used to set one price in one territory and a completely different price in others are *not* good for consumers - whereas the right to buy a product from wherever the hell you like is.

    I mean FFS how can it be ethical to criminalize a company that simply imports products for which there is a demand?

  • Kostabi #27 5 years ago

    Surely a sale is a sale, Sony shouldn't care where the machines end up so long as they're paid for. Idiots.

  • AcidSnake #28 5 years ago

    Well a sale is not always just a sale...
    See, a european sale will give them a whole lot more money...
    Europeans will gladly pay more for their games, and wait longer...oh and they never complain...right?

    Anyway I'm all for that Sony boycott...
    I've bought Subsistence (finally)...so apart from Guitar Hero 2 and MGS4 Sony will never have anything I need anymore...
    And I might even wait for the 360 version of MGS4...
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 15:43

  • Les #29 5 years ago

    "Sony shouldn't care where the machines end up so long as they're paid for. Idiots."

    Of course Sony (or any of the other manufacturers) doesn't really mind importing by the hardcore. But if they don't act against it in general, you might see Japanese/USA PS3s available at places where less informed people can buy one. And those people will then call SCE when their PS3 blows up when they connect it to the power grid, gives a shitty image on a standard PAL TV or can't play their PS1 and PS2 games.

  • toy_brain #30 5 years ago

    All the hoo-ha with Sony banning PSP imports never seemed to make any impact on my local indie shops importing them, and they continue to sell imported (USA) PSP games as if they were regular PAL releases.

    Which just goes to show.
    No-one cares about the North East.

    Yes, sometimes it pays to live in the 'poor' end of the country :p

  • rosler28 #31 5 years ago

    Thanks sony for protecting my rights, I really appreciate that.

    Also thanks for producing such a weak launch line up/proposition that I have absolutely no wish to buy a PS3 for the foreseeable future.

    Maybe when Konami launch a real next gen Pro Evo I'll check back in with PS3.

  • bigbadbeasty #32 5 years ago

    "Maybe when Konami launch a real next gen Pro Evo I'll check back in with PS3. "

    Nah, i'll just get it for my 360!

  • JediMasterMalik #33 5 years ago

    Why are you guys so fucking angry at Sony, if they feel their rights were violated they should, if the law is clear, which it is, why the fuckare you so angry? More pointless and stupid Sony bashing? I mean did you bash Immersion when they sued Sony for breaching the law? Didn't think so...

  • lambtron #34 5 years ago

    You are right - we should be thankful that we live in a society where Sony can protect itself against people who want to buy their products!

    Thank fook for Sony!

  • JediMasterMalik #35 5 years ago

    Yup Lambtron, that's exactly what they're doing.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 16:26

  • lambtron #36 5 years ago

    Yep, pretty much.

  • AcidSnake #37 5 years ago

    Immersion had a point though...
    Sony stole their tech...
    Lik-Sang tried to sell PS3's to people who want them...

  • Nobuo #38 5 years ago

    "If incompatibility between regions concerns you then do not introduce regional locking into your hardware and software."

    With PS1 and PS2 games already being region-locked, the PS3 needs to maintain the ability to decode these only in whatever region it is designed for. It would be risky to allow PS1/2 games from all regions because the region locking was so closely bound to the piracy locking. PS3 software remains region free AFAIK.

    Anyway. TBQH I have nothing against restricting imported consoles, they can be quite dangerous to misinformed users, primarily in the voltage difference. Most early imported PS2s melted their transformers if you recall (though I'm not for a minute denying the REAL reason why they don't want their hardware imported to Europe).

    If they criminalized importing software, it would be a different story.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 16:35

  • Gurgeh #39 5 years ago

    Just wait till people discover their Sixaxis controller batteries cannot be replaced if they stop recharging (like the iPod situation)

  • trevd72 #40 5 years ago

    so is the battery different to the 360 pads??

  • peterfll #41 5 years ago

    @ Nobuo.

    Sony may (or may not - where's your proof on this point?) have integrated regional coding in with their piracy protection. If so more fool them, that's poor protection coding design in my book. I suspect however, it's not true. Regional coding isn't especially elaborate or difficult to break either, unlike piracy protection.

    My original point stands: if Sony are that concerned don't introduce regional coding in the first instance.

    As for melting transformers - you what? - how ridiculous! I've never heard of anyone's transformer melting (especially grey importers, but it's not exactly rocket science), and I and many others I know have been happily importing hardware for the past 20 years without anything exploding, imploding or otherwise. Sounds more like a Daily Mail type headline - or more to the point - something Sony would tell people to scare them off.

    Also, grey importing is a niche thing. HMV and Virgin are not the sort of retailers to get into it, they wouldn't bother beacuse of the warranty and support heartache it would cause them. They would much rather wait and sell the 'official' product.
    Edited by 2 at 19/10/06 @ 17:00

  • Kami #42 5 years ago

    Hooray for Sony. Another fabulous PR blunder that makes me wonder what happened to the once seemingly invincible giant...

  • Nippledoctor #43 5 years ago

    Sony recalls 9.6 million batteries.

    That makes it to approx 429 million $. I don't know what sort of batteries they are going to use for their next gen Foreman console, but that could be funny in the end.
    Not mentioning the fact that they could easily be sued on top of that, if PC manufactures such as Acer, Fujistu, HP, HP decide to go for it.

    Sony profit forecasts are reduced from 900 million Euros to 340 millions. Another hit in the teeth.

    Sony stops selling LCD screens because it doesn't make much cash for them, and competition is tougher, and some other products better in terms of quality/price.

    Basically Sony is desesperatly counting on its gaming division to help with cash flow, thus forcing them to use any possible alternative.

    You will forgive my simple english, it ain't my primary language.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 17:28

  • moggsy #44 5 years ago

    Personally, I imported a PSP when the second European release delay was announced. Lots of people did and even Which! magazine were recommending that you do this so lots of non hardcore gaming people will have done also. I think Sony took exception to this situation due to the sheer number of PSP's which were imported into this country by various suppliers.

    Thing is though, there wasn't a shortage of PSP's to import (they were readily available) so why didn't Sony just release the fricking thing in Europe when they originally said they would. They set up the situation and then complain about it.The PS3's release has now been set up in exactly the same way. Therefore I have no sympathy for Sony whatsoever as I'm sure most gamers don't.

  • Xerx3s #45 5 years ago

    Surely a sale is a sale, Sony shouldn't care where the machines end up so long as they're paid for. Idiots.

    Not true. Like every big multinational, sony is divided into region companies that need to make a profit. If you import stuff from another region, that would mean that this region would make less profit. In the end it doesn't really matter, but that's a factor in this for sure.

  • MrChuckles #46 5 years ago

    I sold my PS2 because of arsing region locking and the fact i only seemed to want games released in Japan and the US, i can't exactly see myself rushing out to buy the PS3.

    Still, getting a free 360 did make the decision lot easier, even if the stupid dvd drive is currently borked.

  • Nobuo #47 5 years ago

    "Sony may (or may not - where's your proof on this point?) have integrated regional coding in with their piracy protection. If so more fool them, that's poor protection coding design in my book. I suspect however, it's not true. Regional coding isn't especially elaborate or difficult to break either, unlike piracy protection."

    Yes Sony have a terrible history with regards to piracy. I personally have no trouble at all believing the two things are integrated, but it's not really important any more anyway.

    "My original point stands: if Sony are that concerned don't introduce regional coding in the first instance."

    Don't think Sony were alone being concerned with importing. Either way they can't change the fact that PS1 and PS2 games are region locked, whether it's in keeping with their current position or not.

    "As for melting transformers - you what? - how ridiculous! I've never heard of anyone's transformer melting"

    Really? Overheating's not exactly rare with mismatched, badly installed or just poor quality equipment, and when left to the average pleb who doesn't know what he's doing I can see this scenario being likely. And even store bought equipment can overheat - remember the deal with Sony and the laptop batteries? The BBC reported electrical fires there, so for an 'illegal' transformer to overheat is less than rediculous.

    Again, I'm not at all buying in to what Sony claim as the motivation behind this. Just saying I personally don't mind clamping down on importing hardware for these reasons. At the very least it's a lot more just than restricting software importing.
    Edited by 2 at 19/10/06 @ 17:59

  • Papalaz1 #48 5 years ago

    Sony are ghey.

    So they've got a judgment. Like to see them enforce it in HK. Teehee.

  • Scimarad #49 5 years ago

    Weren't we all assuming PS1 and PS2 games would still be region locked? That's was my reasoning behind wanting a US one in the first place...

    In other news I see the mentally deficient Sony hating brigade are still out in force:-(

  • Bates #50 5 years ago

    This is their life Scimarad. Would you take that away from them? :(

  • J_C_X #51 5 years ago

    Sony = Arseholes

    I import nearly all my games from USA or Japan. Lik-Sang is where I get most of my consoles and games. This stuff only encourages piracy, if games had closer release dates across regions we might not have this problem.

  • Kami #52 5 years ago

    Nice to see the people who have no idea that some of us have been at the recieving end of Sony's "Yes sir, please bend over and brace yourself" attitude out as well.

  • The-Bodybuilder #53 5 years ago

    I just love it when sony bitch-slaps us brits and europeans.

    Makes me feel durty.

  • The-Bodybuilder #54 5 years ago

    Why is it that there are sony haters? I mean, you all curse them now, but when you see the spiderman font on adverts along with weird, senseless promotion (3rd place, anyone?) you're ALL gonna buy it anyways.

  • kangarootoo #55 5 years ago

    "Weren't we all assuming PS1 and PS2 games would still be region locked?"

    Sony always said that was the case, and its not really a choice they could make anyway. You can't just ignore the region locking of the post-gen games without breaking the original publishing contracts.

  • JonFE #56 5 years ago

    If Sony didn't want EU gamers to import from, say, Japan, they shouldn't:

    a.Make them wait 'til March (or whenever PS3 actually launches over here :).
    b.Make Japan's price for the 20GB model so damn cheaper than the EU one.

  • yagisencho #57 5 years ago

    See, they're protecting you from their products. Good show, Sony! Keep it up.

  • Mr_Brown #58 5 years ago

    So long as this doesn't affect importing PS2 games, I'm not too bothered. But to be fair, I don't use Lik-Sang anymore. After getting import charges on all of my later orders >_

  • MadMirko #59 5 years ago

    The real reason they do this is their inability to provide enough consoles for a real launch. If the neglected Europeans start importing, the already meager allotment for the US and Japan seem even more ridiculous.

    People there get as angry as people here..., shares drop. Already they presented a very weak 2nd quarter, their profits dropped 93%!!. Source: [link url=http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsar chive&sid=a7oc0ukaHGR8
    ]http://ww w.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=n...[/link]

    They also projected their weakest year in 5, problems being the PS3, the battery fiasco and the slow sales of the PSP. Source: http://ww w.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=n...

  • chronom4n #60 5 years ago

    why on gods earth would i want to import a ps3 in? i mean the way the hardware is now designed means that the infrastructure is going to be much more complicated than say the ps1 or ps2. I would want my investment to be protected and that is why i can see why sony is saying youre imported machines aint gonna do much. other than just play imported video games.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 20:41

  • Freek #61 5 years ago

    Sony to consumer: "How dare you buy our products we offer for sale! That's illegal! We'll sue!!"

    And you're the company with financial issues? Really? Who'd have thought that!

  • LOLLERS #62 5 years ago

    Hmm, interesting, i've had a PS3 on pre-order at Lik Sang since January, I just had a feeling that they weren't going to make christmas in Europe and I could make some christmas beer money.

    Don't know what to make of this news really, the safety line is a poor excuse. It's obvious they're going to sell out whatevers available this christmas, why does it bother them so much which country they end up in. Guess it just doesn't fit in with their 'strategy'. :(

    Anyone want to buy a PS3 pre-order? (I haven't heard if selling pre-orders is illegal? :)



    EDIT: oh yeah, the people saying 'why would you want to import'?

    All it doesn't do is play PS1 and PS2 games (how much can you get a PS2 for these days? no big deal)
    Or
    play Blu Ray DVD's. Can you even buy blu-ray DVD's yet? again, who cares.

    There are going to be plenty of people willing to pay a premium price for a PS3 at christmas. There'll be a lot of rich people who are all like 'There's a new Play Station? Gotta get me one of those this christmas innit, gonna get mine from the E Bay'
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 23:34

  • Xerx3s #63 5 years ago

    Why is it that there are sony haters? I mean, you all curse them now, but when you see the spiderman font on adverts along with weird, senseless promotion (3rd place, anyone?) you're ALL gonna buy it anyways.

    Well, if we would all go out and buy them, the economy would go bankrupt. But then again, there prolly will be < 100 k units available at launch. ;)

    EDIT: In the EU obviously.
    Edited by 1 at 19/10/06 @ 23:30

  • JDub #64 5 years ago

    Okay, so what is the coup here?

    I was only talking to my mate tonight, who is dying to get his hands on a PS3 after patiently ignoring the 360 for the last few months (read: year). I've gotta admit, judging by the lastest PS3 vids, I'm starting to show more interest...

    The point is, if we source a couple (yeah....right) from either the US or Japan, are they gonna work? Are we gonna suffer in some way?

  • Psychotext #65 5 years ago

    You'll suffer... Sony will probably come around and break your knees, and maybe kill some puppies for fun.

  • dk_rare #66 5 years ago

    "Ultimately, we're trying to protect consumers"

    Sony really do have a sense of humor. Well, I import to Australia from Japan, and there is not enough money to be made by shitting on Australians, so I should be safe from Sony

  • Baz_Dude #67 5 years ago

    They really are a pack of assholes if they are gonna sue retailers who export products over seas. Come on, your still making money. No one wants to buy your over priced games so they buy online. I do it with the 360 and it saves me a shit load of cash :)

  • bloodflowers #68 5 years ago

    Nothing to do with the pricerape of course. No, not at all. Wankers.

  • Repsode #69 5 years ago

    The last time Sony did this I instigated a total Euro boycott on PSP, which is still in effect, with everything I buy for it coming from Japan or US, even the PSP is Japanese. A company that starts telling me how or how not to buy their products deserves not to get my money. I may pass on the PS3 until the next gen comes round and buy used.

    I am going to do my damned best to enjoy Sony products without giving Sony Europe satisfaction. They're the most insidious of the whole corporation. It's one thing to price rape, its another to close off perfectly legal means of avoiding it. I'm still paying Sony for it, it's not like I'm stealing.
    Edited by 1 at 23/10/06 @ 23:30

  • repetition #70 5 years ago

    Yep, pretty much agree with MadMirko. From comments elsewhere, they are clearly going to struggle to meet the 2m 2006 figure in Japamerica and so further pressure on the number of available units because of x0,000 leaking out to other regions is going to make them look even more incompetent in their core regions.