Microsoft's Greenberg lays into Blu-ray

By Robert Purchese Published 10 October, 2008

"It's pretty clear it is not the next DVD."

Xbox 360 group product manager Aaron Greenberg has put rumours of Blu-ray on 360 to bed and had a dig at the HD disc format in the process.

"We have no plans to integrate Blu-ray into the Xbox experience," Greenberg told Major Nelson, cementing the corporate response given earlier.

"We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want. We also believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content."

Despite promising to keep the "gloves on", Greenberg proceeded to question not only sales, availability and price of the format, but also its long-term future.

"No one knows," he said, "no one knows what Blu-ray will be. It's pretty clear it is not the next DVD, right? The days of one physical format being the standard are gone.

"Let's say right now we're not sure if it's the next UMD or the next DVD," added Greenberg, suggesting "it got Blu-rayed" will be the expression for future products in this perceived grey area.

"I went to Sony's [TGS] booth, and their Blu-ray presence...It used to be like their whole booth was Blu-ray. It just keeps shrinking down. Now it's just this little corner and there's no one there," he said. We can think of a couple of counterpoints, but we're not touching this one with a bargepole.

Aside from Blu-ray, Greenberg nattered about the Microsoft TGS conference and how John Schappert nearly lost his voice before the event.

He also touched on the improved performance of Xbox 360 in Japan, where the console has outsold its PS3 rival for the last few weeks.

"Never before have I seen - in the eight years I've been coming to TGS - this sort of shift from, frankly, the PlayStation brand to the Xbox 360 among third-party publishers. We're the platform they're looking to to help grow their franchises around the world," he concluded.

The Microsoft TGS keynote was delivered by John Schappert early yesterday morning, and revealed a 19th November date for the New Xbox Experience, announced the standalone Halo 3 Recon expansion, and confirmed Tekken 6 for Xbox 360.

Following the conference, we caught up with Xbox Live boss Schappert put a few questions to him.

Picture of Robert.

About Robert Purchese

Bertie is Eurogamer's Senior Staff Writer. When he's not hunting down news stories he's often found playing with his kids or gabbling about fantasy games and strange online worlds.

Read more articles from Robert by visiting the Robert Purchese archive page.

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Comments (120) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • jack_klugman #1 3 years ago

    We can think of a couple of counterpoints, but we're not touching this one with a bargepole.

    Don't tease.

  • Halo.Jones #2 3 years ago

    We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want. We also believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content."

    But you are quite happy to force consumers to swap discs when playing titles like Final Fantasy and other titles that span several discs?

    Greenberg, you're a dick.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 16:43

  • Eraysor #3 3 years ago

    Blu-Ray will certainly never have the adoption that DVDs have now, but I don't really see the point in him bringing it up. In the next generation MS will have to find some sort of larger storage format than the dual layer DVD, and I really, really hope they don't switch to 100% digital distribution.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 16:45

  • Razz #4 3 years ago

    That's rather obvious. It's becasue the opposition console has BlueRay as standard and is a sellign point. Of course he's going to bring that up.

  • andijames #5 3 years ago

    I hope in the next generation they include a hard disk as standard then! Plus with bandwidth limits in place in most broadband packages does he really think that it's going to go completely to digital downloads? I think blu-ray, or any disc format, will be around for some time to come.

  • Freek #6 3 years ago

    Except ofcourse that digital downloads are full of nasty DRM restrictions (borrow from a friend? Buy second hand? NO) and of signifigant lower quality then disc based HD movies.
    Or the fact that I could never fitt my entire movie collection onto a harddisk.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 16:52

  • stepneg #7 3 years ago

    "But you are quite happy to force consumers to swap discs when playing titles like Final Fantasy and other titles that span several discs? "

    Even if they released a BR addon it still won't mean FF will come on BR as not everyone will buy it, in fact it's pretty clear that not many people will buy it at all.

  • dadrester #8 3 years ago

    arrogant fuckwit.

  • Ducklord #9 3 years ago

    Oh dear god. I do find myself wandering whether he genuinely believes this stuff, or if it's simply the wads of money being stuffed into his pocket. I'm truly sick of the console brands constantly trying to put each other down. -.-

  • NickJC1 #10 3 years ago

    People still complain about swaping disks every ten hours?, are you that fucking lazy?, really?. For anyone who isn't a total lazy bastard it's a non issue and always has been.

    And this guy is right, fuck Sony and fuck Blu-ray.

  • Darren #11 3 years ago

    So we're going to be downloading high-quality 50 GB 1080p movies packed with extras and top-notch audio onto our Xbox 360's to keep over the next few years then are we, Microsoft? ;)

  • Demento41 #12 3 years ago

    "We also believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content.""

    I'm sure that's very comforting to all the people who went out and bought the hd-dvd addon.

  • ronuds #13 3 years ago

    Well, it's not as if Blu-Ray sales as of today aren't backing his point. Last I saw, they were declining. Whether that will continue, I don't know.

    "But you are quite happy to force consumers to swap discs when playing titles like Final Fantasy and other titles that span several discs?"

    Whaaaa? 360 games won't come on blu-ray discs this generation no matter what happens with an add-on.

  • turnget2005 #14 3 years ago

    What an absolute MUG!!!

    no one is forced to buy a bluray, I never had the sales clerk in the shop point a gun at me and say "buy the disk bitch!"

    Still bitter that HDDVD got PWN3D!

    Its funny how nearly all the MS execs always take pot-shots at Sony every time they get a bit of lime light while Sony execs don’t really say anything. Look at today’s interview with Yoshida, he even wishes the Xbox well in Japan.

    I have both consoles and they both have let us all down, I remember the HYPE that both consoles received before they came out, then when they finally arrived they were not nearly as good as we had been lead to believe.

    Have a bit of dignity you PRICK. If your shit was so good it would sell itself without all the trash talking. WANKER!

  • Darren #15 3 years ago

    @Eraysor - You make a good point there. The next Xbox is rumoured to be two or three years away and I don't think at that point that digital distribution will be mainstream, certainly not for 10-20 GB+ games nevermind movies. I think Microsoft will have to include an optical drive and it is very unlikely to be DVD not when a BD drive is backward compatible. If the BD market continues to expand as it's predicted it will, I've absolutely no doubt that the next Xbox will include a BD drive for both games and movies with digital distribution still being pushed as a long-term replacement.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 17:05

  • Vin #16 3 years ago

    Some sad, scared little manchildren in this thread.

  • degle #17 3 years ago

    I find all of microsofts PR very very tiresome. Think someone needs to tell him we havnt made it past 20 meg connections in the UK yet. Fuck digital distribution

  • TedMoseby #18 3 years ago

    Good grief I wish these people would just look at the way people currently use the media they've purchased such as DVDs - it's simple then to see that there is just no way that digital downloads are going to replace physical media any time soon.

    Think of Joe Public buying a DVD - he/she may lend it to a friend, or watch part of it in the living room then maybe watch the last part of a film in bed upstairs, let alone watch it with parents etc. The point is, the physical media allows so many diverse ways of watching a film - the "viewing experience" as it were, that digital downloads simply can't compete with (and that's not even touching on the issue of allowed download limits for bandwidth etc.)

    I can just imagine saying to my mother "Oh sorry, I have this great film that I think you'll love, but you can't watch it at your house because you don't have an Xbox 360...."

    And don't even start with the amount of disc space required to actually "keep" these downloaded hidef movies, especially with the ridiculous price that Microsoft want to charge for the hard drives in their machine.

    Grrr!

  • chris_ace #19 3 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • Britesparc Verified Creative, ITV #20 3 years ago

    But I don't like digital downloads, I like to have physical media with a box that I can stack on my nice shelves and re-arrange obsessively like John Cusack in High Fidelity :-(

    Admittedly, I'd like it if I could rip my films to a hard drive so I didn't actually NEED the physical media, but I still WANT it...

  • miiiguel #21 3 years ago

    I t seems like Blu-Ray was important up until HD-DVD died. Now it seems like no one cares about it, not even Sony.

  • turnget2005 #22 3 years ago

    how did this guy get his job? it seems that most of the people on this site most whom are not top earning execs have more sence than this idiot. it kills me when someone opens their mouth and the destink smell of shit arrives!

  • electrolite #23 3 years ago

    Right about Bluray

    Wrong about Digital downloads

    Next....

  • rudedudejude #24 3 years ago

    haha this guy is a total retard. is he american? has he even though through what he has said?

    How did he get that job lol.

    Peter Griffin for his job!

  • ronuds #25 3 years ago

    @ hedbog
    "With Blu_Ray, and any disk format, I can simply take the disk with me and put it in a compatible player - of which there are plenty of alternatives to the PS3 (Laptops, Desktop PCs, standalone players, Multimedia PCs)."

    Ummmm, you realize that you could buy 10 360's and be able to play your DL'd movies on any one of them, cheaper than you could 5 blu-ray players, right?

    Can't you also hook your 360 up to a PC and stream DL'd movies through it? That's a question...not a statement.

  • Vic #26 3 years ago

    "We have no plans to integrate Blu-ray into the Xbox experience,"

    With all the noise that the 360 generates, its probably for the best. Plus, it means HD movie buffs wont have their 360's on for as long, so there's surely less chance of RROD money for MS to cough up, no?

    And "Xbox experience?" WTF? What a pretentious c***!

  • El-Dev #27 3 years ago

    Layin the groundwork for a HD-DVD revival?

  • turnget2005 #28 3 years ago

    @rounds

    dont be silly mate, i think you know what hedbog was trying to say.
    but i will put it into simpleton terms for you:
    if you download a movie on your xbox you can only play it on your xbox, and lets just say that you never got to finish the movie in your living room cause the kids came home or whatever, if you had a disk, bluray or the like then you could watch it on something else! or say that you wanted to watch the film again at a mates house how could you do this? and dont say bring your xbox to his house cause that would be a bit chorfull for most people.

  • Eighthours #29 3 years ago

    Its funny how nearly all the MS execs always take pot-shots at Sony every time they get a bit of lime light while Sony execs don’t really say anything. Look at today’s interview with Yoshida, he even wishes the Xbox well in Japan.

    Actually, today's interview with Yoshida is the first time I've ever seen a Sony exec NOT take massive potshots at MS and it was a refreshing change. Don't know which planet you've been living on for the past few years, mate.

  • ronuds #30 3 years ago

    @ turgent

    I know what he was saying, but what he was suggesting is a pretty costly proposition. Most people don't want to buy 1 blu-ray compatible device, let alone one for every room.

    And if someone could answer my streaming question, it would basically make his point nil - except for the fact that you could bring a movie to someone elses house. With NXE, though, they're allowing people to share movies, which is pretty cool.

  • el_pollo_diablo #31 3 years ago

    Blu-ray will start to take off when the prices come down a bit, which I anticipate happening in time for this xmas.

  • kangarootoo #32 3 years ago

    "We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want"

    What, like woefully overpriced proprietary hard drives and memory cards?

    This kind fo commentary from any company is just yawnsome these days. Sniping is so last season.

  • miiiguel #33 3 years ago

    Anyway, the most verbal complains come from ppl who don't want to get an xbox ever.
    That said, I do like the physical media, but industry seems to be ditching storage media which rely on mechanical movement (EMC is pushing flash memory equipped in their high-end SAN devices, for example). Maybe we'll have the next consoles with this and a mem-card reader, and games will be distributed that way ?
    Well, that's a few years away anyhow, as the current western world economy situation I'd expect to see the next genration still quite a few years away. This same capitalism hicup is not helping Blu-Ray, as well.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 17:50

  • Vic #34 3 years ago

    Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiguel in dream world again.

  • Dizzy #35 3 years ago

    "Blu-Ray will certainly never have the adoption that DVDs have now, but I don't really see the point in him bringing it up. In the next generation MS will have to find some sort of larger storage format than the dual layer DVD, and I really, really hope they don't switch to 100% digital distribution. "

    Solid state. Next gen consoles will probably not have optical. Optical will probably be a dying format in 3-5 years.

  • Darren #36 3 years ago

    I love buying music CDs... but what do I do when I get them? I rip them onto my PC and/or PS3 so I can listen to them!

    So while having a digital copy is a very nice thing to have for the sheer convenience of having, say, my entire music library immediately to hand, I still like to have the original product on a disc. Not only does it make it feel like I own the thing I paid money for, it also serves as a backup (a DRM-free one at that) should I need to re-rip them. I think if my only option was to download stuff at a price - and I've said this before and I'll keep saying it - I'd have no second thoughts about downloading stuff illegally without DRM as digital distribution feels like one step away from that. I'm pretty sure a lot of other people wouldn't either.

  • miiiguel #37 3 years ago

    @ Vic: Well... "we" just bought 40 Tb in flash memory space, with "our" EMC-DMX4..., and now that we've tasted it, we want no more HDD. It's 10x faster (and still 20x more expensive, but time will change it...).

  • mcbi4kh2 #38 3 years ago

    It's pretty clear it is not the next DVD, right?
    Why is it clear? Comparing blu-ray sales with DVD 2 years after release gives very similar figures.

    Never before have I seen - in the eight years I've been coming to TGS - this sort of shift from, frankly, the PlayStation brand to the Xbox 360 among third-party publishers.

    That maybe because the 360 has been released for 3 years? So 8 years ago the 360 probably didn't have as much attention?


    We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want
    and if they do, we will charge them as much as we can get away with (hdd, wireless)
    Fixed.

    Becasue HD-DVD lost we believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content."
    Fixed.

  • Darren #39 3 years ago

    @Dizzy - So you're suggesting that the next PS and Xbox won't be able to play music CDs, movie DVDs or any of our old games that we already own and digital distribution will take over just like that?

    I can't see it myself... I'm pretty sure the next Wii, PS and Xbox will have an optical drive but maybe their followups won't in 10 years time.

  • dryden555 #40 3 years ago

    this is standard PR talk but at the same time, consumers simply arent buying BR like they did DVD's. They cost too much AND its often easier to download movies and TV shows via alternate means.

  • Vic #41 3 years ago

    Right Miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiguel, and how much did that cost you?

  • miiiguel #42 3 years ago

    @ Vic: I suspect you are not interrested in a decent conversation, so let's end it, k? No hard feelings, I just expressed my opinion and gave a real life example which as to do whith my job as a *Nix administrator in the SAN field. Maybe some other day, when you feel a bit less "wity".

  • Fab4 #43 3 years ago

    I still buy CDs

  • deathdealer619 #44 3 years ago

    We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want.

    Yeah like the three xbox 360's I have had to buy due to faliures of the hardware, good one tosser.

    Also Blu ray is a great format for dvd look at the sales figures I have both hd dvd and blu ray and blu ray is the same quality i feel in a visual sence.

    Ths would be offering the consumer more variety,This is not forcing people to purchase one if they did a stand alone extrenal blu ray drive for 360 owners, that comment in short is utterly stupid.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 18:27

  • Vic #45 3 years ago

    Everyday you make these little sarky comments about the PS3, and here you are talking about adult conversations?

    Optical drives are not going to obselete by the time MS releases its next console, which will probably be 2010. Plus, after all the fuss made about BC this generation, it will be a big issue next one too.

  • bad09 #46 3 years ago

    If you've got nothing to counter you have to knock.

    Sorry MS you dropped the ball on HD DVD and as HDTV ownership grows (and Hollywood output quality improves - finally) the BDA (and PS3) will reap the rewards - eventually.

    / hugs his blu (as well as fire sale HD DVD) and pokes his tongue out at video marketplace

  • miiiguel #47 3 years ago

    "Everyday you make these little sarky comments about the PS3, and here you are talking about adult conversations?"
    This is not a PS3 thread, I haven't type PS3 at all. I'm 33 years old.

  • Pooley #48 3 years ago

    I hate PR crap from corporate suits like this guy.

  • miiiguel #49 3 years ago

    "Everyday you make these little sarky comments about the PS3, and here you are talking about adult conversations?"

    Vic
    10-Oct-08 18:11:00 Well Gears' got 8/10 from EG, so I guess Wipeout HD is the superior game :D.

    And for the record, Killzone 2 will be the best looking console game released this generation, ahead of GT Prologue. Anyone who thinks otherwise is an assclown :D.
    ignore poster


    Vic
    10-Oct-08 12:54:30 Other than Gears what else is there? COD4 is there for my FPS needs and is better than Halo, then you have R2 and Killzone 2 dropping. Next year, there is a unique squad based shooter in MAG coming out, whereas 360 boys get...more Halo. Fable 2 might be good, might be shit. And then err, Too Human and Banjo :D.

    Vic
    09-Oct-08 23:47:15 Alan Wake in another game which will be out on PC, when its finally released. Banjo looks crap anyway, so that just leaves the likes of Lips which is a Singstar rip-off. Infinite Undiscovery looks like it was made with the 10-year olds in minds, so I'll leave that out for me.




  • makeamazing #50 3 years ago

    Just got a load of BR disks from Play, in the 3 for 2 sale... which makes them pretty reasonable priced.

    I wouldnt replace my DVD collection with bluray but im certainly replacing my best movies on BR when they come out... the quality is so much better, its a bigger difference than i thought it would be (I got my PS3 for games originally, but now using for movies too).

    I put on Rambo and I-Robot the other day and the quality was amazing and worth the cost. THe only thing that would kill BR is if movie companies put bad transfers/same quality as dvd to BR. At the moment i havent purchased or come across any.

    Thsi MS guy sounds like a muppet, really poor PR from all these so called big wigs.

  • bad09 #51 3 years ago

    @ makeamazing

    I'm with you the quality is amazing! Like you I'm not replacing everything but certainly replacing my favourite movies (the war is over movie industry, where the hell is Aliens, Star Wars, Star Trek and LOTR????!!!!) and all new movies are of course blu.

    Also, even on HD DVD, I love PIP and all the little extras you get.

  • Vic #52 3 years ago

    Does that prove a 33 year-old (lol) troll?!

    Please dont let teh evil blueray be in xbox Mr Gates! :D

  • skillian #53 3 years ago

    Just thought I'd add that 20% of Iron Man's sales have been on Blu-Ray, so even though it might not ever hit the heights that DVD did, it's a long way from being a failure.

  • Tetsuo_Shima #54 3 years ago

    cartridges are the way forward

  • Ryze #55 3 years ago

    /yawn

    /waits for Blu-Ray 360, while playing GAMES on DVD 360

    edit: Firesale HD DVD FTW!!! £2.99 now!!!!!!!!!11one!!!!
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 19:26

  • stampax #56 3 years ago

    Why do people here seem to like personally attacking the man. He's a PR man - if he is asked a question about bu ray, hat else can he say - "it rules and our product badly needs it" - of course not. He's just doing his job.

  • chronom4n #57 3 years ago

    yeah! one of the primary reasons that 360 has outsold ps3 is because of the price cuts and a couple of RPG's but aside from that nothing much IMO. What i still do not get to this day is that why have they not clicked onto the fact that price is a massive issue. now that a 360 can be bought for about £100 is just amazing. Let's just see if the 360 can keep up the momentum going.

  • drumbaby #58 3 years ago

    Protesting too much doesn't even begin to cover it. Twatberg, more like.

  • moggsy #59 3 years ago

    Digital distribution is already here. The Wii, 360 and PS3 all use digital distribution - the PS3 is a trailblazer in this regard due to it having full games available via download (e.g. Warhawk). The PC market is also now heavily into digital distribution (Steam etc). So there is no doubt in my mind that next gen consoles will not use optical media for games.

    As for movies, again digital distribution is already here, but it's currently more of a replacement for the rental market. This may change as broadband speeds and compression technology gets better. You may then 'own' a film which sits on a central server ('the cloud') ready for you to watch whenever and wherever you want.

    Optical media is on the decline and it's debatable how much of the market Blu Ray can get from DVD before the physical format dies a death. Not much I suspect. 1080P is overrated and the higher quality audio wasted on most peoples sound systems (i.e. the TV speakers in most cases).

  • MrWonderstuff #60 3 years ago

    If they believe the future lies in digital downloads why did they bother with the HD-DVD? Clearly M$ are miffed about losing the format war and are sticking their bottom lip out and saying "shant...shant shant shant!" whilst stamping their foot.

    As a 360 owner the lack of Blue-Ray support is important. Marketplace is not a great place for films tbh and my hard disc is only 20gig (5gig free).

    Once I get my hands on a nice high def telly I'll get a PS3 so I can see some top stuff on it.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 20:43

  • smelly #61 3 years ago

    I thought he had a point!

  • makeamazing #62 3 years ago

    @bad09 Aliens box set, I already have the special edition box set, but would certainly get it again. Alien looks amazing on DVD, what it would be like on Blu-Ray... wow ... that is something I would definately get :D

    @moggsy - yes Digital download is here already, but its far from perfect and far from being the number1 format. Even in 3 years or whenever MS decide to do the next console they will still do media, that would be a massive mistake if they didnt. In the uk the ISP's complained and wanted money off the BBC because the I player was killing the network. We still have crappy copper wire, seriously though, anyone who thinks that optical media is gone because download is here is very much mistaken. With games getting larger and networks already struggling (add to this normal network traffice, movie downloads and every thing else) there is no way the network is ready for the "Digital download" level that MS is talking about. Maybe 10 years if we are lucky.

  • smelly #63 3 years ago

    >Once I get my hands on a nice high def telly I'll get a PS3 so I can see some top stuff on it.

    In terms of video footage - you'll notice bugger all difference (unless you get a shit tv that doesnt display lo-def properly)

    Trust me.. I've stood in a SONY shop watching a dvd/blueray comparison on a HUGE f-off tv, from the distance i sit from my tv at home.. I could notice MARGINAL improvements..

    Sound is better imho.. but you'll need a decent sound system to cope.

    High def is noticable in games though

  • makeamazing #64 3 years ago

    Well Trust me Smelly when i Say... I have a 32 inch HD TV and there is a significant difference in quality between DVD and Blu-Ray... So I dont know what you saw, but everyone I know says its a big difference.

    Edit - Ah well perhaps its the size of TV and the distance.. my tv isnt that far away, but then again why would it be.
    Edited by 1 at 10/10/08 @ 20:53

  • bad09 #65 3 years ago

    @ makeamazing

    Yeah my lovely girlfriend got me that boxset back when it was £70. With BD live, pip, digital copies etc. I bet an blu boxset would be wicked! :)

    / strokes his awesome Bourne/Matrix HD DVD set

  • moggsy #66 3 years ago

    @ MrWonderstuff

    HD DVD was a stop gap for MS before it could get it's videostore up and running.

    @ makeamazing

    The Virgin cable network is already fibre optic to the street (as far as you need to go really). 50Mb broadband will be here soon.

    Meanwhile BT are rolling out ADSL2 and upgrading the phone network with 21CN which will both make 24Mb broadband available to everyone over the next couple of years.

  • bad09 #67 3 years ago

    "The Virgin cable network is already fibre optic to the street (as far as you need to go really). 50Mb broadband will be here soon.

    Meanwhile BT are rolling out ADSL2 and upgrading the phone network with 21CN which will both make 24Mb broadband available to everyone over the next couple of years."

    Good for them, I still like my boxes.....

  • moggsy #68 3 years ago

    @ bad09

    Some people still like their vinyl too.

  • immateriaux #69 3 years ago

    "We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want. We also believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content."

    Okay, say I want a copy to keep on my shelf and not stored temporarily in my console? What format you going to provide me with?

    "Let's say right now we're not sure if it's the next UMD or the next DVD," added Greenberg, suggesting "it got Blu-rayed" will be the expression for future products in this perceived grey area.

    The Xbox got blu-rayed?

  • davisorle #70 3 years ago

    EVeryone keeps calling Greenberg a dick by adding " HD dvd got pwned" etc. I mean stop making fool of urselves. He aint a dick. I didnt have an HD Dvd and wasnt intrested n getting one. I bought a console. its what he is saying and he's got a point. Now, if you are that fcuking stupid to understand that who's fault is it and why should anyone care.

    Yeah Sony is pointing the gun in ur fucking head like one of you said cause you cant pay any less to avoid the Blue Ray and dont tell me you need it. Why? to install ur games? To brick ur consoles? For slower installations? For worse game quality than the xbox version? lol How fucking sad is that really?

    Now stop being the dicks and let them enjoy it. Yeah if i were them i'd be mocking Sony as well. Shove the BluRay up your asses while i play games. Its THAT simple...

  • IronGiant #71 3 years ago

    Like it or not disc formats will be here for a long time yet. Joe public drives sales and joe likes to be able to go to hmv or asda and buy a disc off the shelf, as well as renting them from blockbuster. Of course Blu Ray isn't the new DVD, it's a high def format for those who are interested in top quality pictures and audio. It will continue to eat into DVD market share but will never overtake it.

  • mcbi4kh2 #72 3 years ago

    @davisrole


    I mean stop making fool of urselves

    I didnt have an HD Dvd

    Yeah Sony is pointing the gun in ur fucking head

    Perhaps you should stop spending so much time playing games and learn how to write a sentence. I know being a grammar nazi is annoying, but your post is truly, truly awful.


  • haldier #73 3 years ago

    Yeah, Im with him, 4.7 gig is better than 25 per disc, You will sell more disc as games get bigger!
    Also if the digital market is going to be bigger in downloading, why have you only cut the price on arcade, no disc and if you want one you will have to pay M$ money for it (meaning their 120 GB cost as much as a 1 TB you can put in PS3)!!!

  • moggsy #74 3 years ago

    @ IronGiant

    How about wondering into HMV or Asda and purchasing a code which allows you to download a game? Or purchasing a game online after which the code is emailed to you?

  • miiiguel #75 3 years ago

    yet another week end of hardcore gaming, starts now.

    See you Monday.

  • makeamazing #76 3 years ago

    @moggsy yep I know that some cable is getting faster and BT are going ADSL2, but in the case of BT, part will still be going down copper, which means there is still a major bottle neck unless you replace it all with Fibre. There are a couple of companies putting fibre through the sewers, but its still pretty much small scale. Im sure the number here is UPTO... as with many complaints about current broadband, eg 8MB isnt 8MB for many people unless you live close to the exchange. In fact I read a report which said the average speed people got is between 2-4MB on broadband.

    One other thing is that though speeds are getting faster, more people are getting online, and also more services in your house will use it (EG Cable is phone, computer and potentially TV live streaming (or thats the intention)... so even though people get faster speeds they will eat it up :D. Thats why even faster speeds and replacing copper exchanges and getting broadband to people who dont live near an exchange all add to the problem that optical media isnt going anywhere. I dont see the UK Government spending £15 billion on Fibre when they are having trouble keeping the banks going ;)

    Getting back on topic, I dont understand the MS guys seemingly overtly negative comments about Blu-Ray... Sony or MS have not been perfect in this release of consoles and having a go at a format that the industry needs isnt really helpful to anyone.

    @bad09 my wife forced me to get her Evil Dead 3, and the quality conversion is fantastic... very impressive, colourful and crisp.

  • peteb #77 3 years ago

    I thought swapping discs would be bad, but then I played mgs4 with it's "hey,let's install every level before you play it" and thought maybe swapping a disc isn't that bad really.

    Hate the idea of digital distribution though since I'm living in Germany and won't be able to fucking play anything,since I won't be able to import banned/censored games
    Edited by 3 at 11/10/08 @ 00:31

  • metalgsean #78 3 years ago

    Lol they are still very sore about HD DVD falling flat on its arse aren't they! I love microsoft, "we wont force people to buy what they dont want" apart from all the bits you HAVE to buy before your xbox will play games!!!! Once films are fully made with blu-ray in mind its gonna be bigger than the dvd, alot bigger i think. Yes digital is great, but you still need to buy hard drives, memory cards, a pc or something to play from etc.. and a HD film download is gonna be pretty big in terms of memory usage, which will take along time to download, and if your PC crashes you could lose all your films. I would have paid £500 for the PS3 without a Blu-ray player in it, it was just a very very happy bonus!

  • FooAtari #79 3 years ago

    These threads are so funny. If it wasn't in the PS3 at least 50% of the people here wouldn't give two shits about it. As it is though it gives the fanboys another bullet point to argue about.

    As for the people who say MS are bitter about HD-DVD failing. The main reason they released the add-on was to counter the Blu-ray selling point of the PS3. As it is HD-DVD came from Toshiba and MS had little interest in it beyond saying our console can play HD movies too!

    I would have paid £500 for the PS3 without a Blu-ray player in it

    Seriosuly, why? I wouldnt pay 500 notes for any console.
    Edited by 2 at 11/10/08 @ 00:27

  • SteveB #80 3 years ago

    He's right though, the future is digital downloads, just look at what's happened to the music industry.

    The jump from VHS to DVD was massive, just like tape\vinyl to CD before it, but DVD to BD is insignificant by comparison. MP3 has a worse sound quality compared to CD, but do the masses care ? No. They tried Super CD, but no one was interested because, like BD, you reach a point where the picture/sound quality is acceptable to all but the dedicated audio/visual technophiles and we have that now in CD and DVD.

    We are not there yet with films (the 360’s films are in stereo for f**ks sake), but with the level based nature of most games it doesn’t take a massive leap of imagination to see how they could be split into smaller, episodic and easily downloadable chunks.
    Edited by 1 at 11/10/08 @ 00:42

  • smelly #81 3 years ago

    @makeamazing: "Well Trust me Smelly when i Say... I have a 32 inch HD TV and there is a significant difference in quality between DVD and Blu-Ray... So I dont know what you saw, but everyone I know says its a big difference. "

    Are you comparing dvd and blueray on the same tv? Or blueray on the hdtv and dvd on a normal tv?

    A lot of "hdtvs'" dont display normal tv/dvds properly.

  • JHuxley #82 3 years ago

    I noticed the difference on the Planet Earth boxset, and I've only got a 720p TV. That's all I'm saying.

    Anyway, this guy comes across as a bit of a twat. He has a couple of semi-relevant points, yet manages to make himself sound like a tit anyway. I mean, I agree digital distribution is where we're headed, but not in this generation. So why not offer a Blu-Ray add-on in the meanwhile? I mean, weren't you all for giving the consumer a choice when you were touting your HD-DVD add-on? Whatever happened to that?

    Oh...it's a competitor's format and you don't particularly want to promote it. Got it. Why didn't you just say that?

  • Vic #83 3 years ago

    "Still don't want Blu-Ray, sorry... just not worth it really. Ask me again in another 6 months."

    Well you dont actually have a choice regarding the 360...

    As this generation goes on, I can see more people trading in their 360's for PS3's like some of my mates and other people I know, especially those 360 owners who have suffered the RROD (which will be a fair proportion).

    PC owners can play the 360 shooters on their PC, and get the genuine exclusives on the PS3.

  • holsty101 #84 3 years ago

    "A lot of "hdtvs'" dont display normal tv/dvds properly."

    Is that true? I try to up with what's going on in the a/v world & I've never came across any comment like that before. Any links?

    When I replaced my kick-ass sd tv with a mediocre hd one a few years back I've gotta say the only difference I noticed was in black/contrast levels.

  • Kryon #85 3 years ago

    @Vic(toria)

    "and get the genuine exclusives on the PS3."

    What, you mean like, Tekken 6, RE5, FFXIII, GTAIV, SCIV, Ridge Racer, Assassin's Creed, DMC4, Virtua Fighter 5, Fatal Inertia, Beautiful Katamari, etc, etc... Yep, gotta love those Sony exclusives, lol

    But of course you're right Vic, why would anyone want a 360 when it's cheaper and plays all these games with superior graphics. It's much better to spend twice as much for poorer quality, and then you can spend another £600 on a PC in the hope of a few of the 360 FPS getting a release a few years in the future, makes perfect sense...lol
    Edited by 2 at 11/10/08 @ 07:51

  • napalm68 #86 3 years ago

    I so want to bitch slap the next cock choking exec that tries to tell us digital downloads are the future. Yeah, the future of suck. I'd hate to have to rely on digital downloads for any of my standard def video viewing, let alone 1080p.

  • Steroyd #87 3 years ago

    Dear lord Microsoft shouldn't really say.

    "We believe that we shouldn't force consumers to pay for things they don't want. We also believe that the future's digital, and that's why we've invested in a massive library of entertainment content."

    The first part is a tired old they've been a broken record for many years now, but guess what, the Xbox 360 is selling as badly as PS3 regardless.

    And they're putting all their eggs in one basket Sony is offering PS3 games through physical retail AND DD, they're taking it one step further on PSP, while Microsoft is still selling... Xbox originals, you've been saying DD is the future since 2006 but Sony is actually doing it.

  • muftak #88 3 years ago

    shows you the differance in companys dosnt it

    Sony/nintendo = japanese shows respect and wont slag off other companys off.

    Microsoft = Amercain dosnt show respect ,wants world domination ,slags off everyone.

    DD is a totaly waste of time who wants all there films in poor resoultions and poor sound quality all on a hardrive or all there games having to download play and delete when the disc is full then wash rinse repeat to play them again .

    Then comes the fact if you HDD goes belly up thats everything lost or if you console fucks up everything lost.

    Then we hear but virgin have lines ready for 50mb you still wont get that speed and it still will take hours to download something

    Box version FTW , id rather have the product in my hand that on a HDD

    "What, you mean like, Tekken 6, RE5, FFXIII, GTAIV, SCIV, Ridge Racer, Assassin's Creed, DMC4, Virtua Fighter 5, Fatal Inertia, Beautiful Katamari, etc, etc... Yep, gotta love those Sony exclusives"

    okie who said any of those were exclusives only FF13 was ever said to be one , get your facts right jackarse plus VF5 was a timed exclusive
    Edited by 1 at 11/10/08 @ 11:05

  • sopaman #89 3 years ago

    This guy's an ass. Nobody's saying Blu-ray will be the next DVD, as even if it were to become the next reference format, it'd take quite some time to get there. Then he's saying Blu-ray's failing and that they "don't want to give the consumers something they don't want" when their company supported the more-than-ill-fated HD-DVD format... how's that for hypocrisy? Plus, maybe the fact that Sony isn't promoting Blu-rays so much at the TGS nowadays has something to do with: 1-it has no rival in the HD format war now, 2-Blu-ray software is selling well, there's not such a need to promote it... at a games fair.

    Also, I don't really think digital downloads will be the standard way of distributing most content in the future. Whether this guy likes it or not, most people like having what they buy in a physical format. At least I do. That doesn't mean I wouldn't buy smaller, cheaper games in DD format but there's no way I'm paying the same price to download a game than to buy it in-store.
    Edited by 1 at 11/10/08 @ 11:43

  • Kryon #90 3 years ago

    @muffcack

    "okie who said any of those were exclusives only FF13 was ever said to be one , get your facts right jackarse plus VF5 was a timed exclusive"

    Oh really? Are you sure about that, fuckwit? Try using Google and type in 'PS3 lost exclusives'..Fucking imbecile, it's you who needs to get your facts straight, KTHNXBYE.

  • drxym #91 3 years ago

    Microsoft were all for a physical format when it suited their purposes. They couldn't say enough about how great HD DVD was at the time, although their actions such as actually including HD DVD in an XBox 360 left a lot to be desired. But with HD DVD now dead and buried it sounds ever so slghtly hypocritical and disingenuous to claim physical is dead with it. Of course Microsoft were never really interested in physical to begin with which might explain the lack of internal HD DVD. Indeed it seems obvious they were using HD DVD as a way to prolong a format war against Blu Ray while pushing a digital alternative.

    Will Blu be the next DVD? I don't think so since it requires HD for starters but it will take more and more share as the world goes HD and it will become the dominant physical format. Since BD players are backwards compatible I still think DVD will continue since the costs associated with many niche titles and SD content will not be justified by using Blu.

    Unfortunately the digital alternative is STILL not there. Not from Apple, or Microsoft, or Sony, or Amazon or any other wannabe. There is nothing that comes even close to what Blu Ray (or HD DVD) offers. Nothing offers HD content all the way up to 1080p at such high bitrates. The quality of digital downloads is much lower, the resolution is lower, the audio is inferior and there are zero extras. And to cap it all, every solution of the many around are proprietary, incompatible, tied to a single provider, DRM'd up the wazoo and restricted to specific devices. Laughably there isn't even any cost benefits since a digital copy typically costs more than if you just shopped around for the DVD and ripped it and not much less than Blu either. There is also the threat that a store could die, or discontinue its key servers and you are left movies that you can't transfer or play anymore. Frankly you would have to be STUPID to buy a movie for your iPod or your 360 or your PS3 or your TIVO with such high prices and strings attached.

    Digital is fantastic for casual rentals because DRM doesn't matter. There is an excellent value proposition to rentals where the alternative might be traipsing down to a store to get a disk. But it is nowhere close to offering an alternative for ownership while so many issues remain. The digital industry really needs to get their shit together. They must rally around a single digital format, a single rights management platform, a single format that plays back on countless devices and platforms. A system that lets users purchase movies from ANY online store, manage them on any PC or device of their choosing and play them on ANY compliant device without worrying that the key servers will die. Perhaps when that happens Blu may really will be in trouble but that day is still a long way off and there are plenty of hurdles to overcome first. Even broadband caps could scupper digital for years to come.

    So no, Blu Ray is not in trouble and wont' be for years. In the meantime, it will continue to grow as the world moves HD. When it does fail (as all formats do eventually), owners still have the content to rip or do with as they please.

  • sega #92 3 years ago

    I'm going to guess consumers wont take to Blu Ray simply because it seems too much like a new format (which it is) not offering much more than the last. People took to DVDs not just for picture quality, but because they didn't need to rewind tapes any more, could get extra features, can select scenes, change language etc.

    All Blu Ray offers over that is a better picture. Sure high def images look great, but to the average person it's not enough for a new format. If someone develops a disc that will not only store HD content for a HD player, but will also play on a standard DVD player (it can be done) and simply label it as a DVD with a sticker on a box saying "can also be played in HD" then people will buy them all up - mostly without even knowing it.

  • shotgun44 #93 3 years ago

    I like having blu ray on my ps3 but swapping disks is an unbelievable non-issue! We did it for all the Final Fantasys up 'til 9? STOP BLOODY MOANING!!

  • bad09 #94 3 years ago

    "All Blu Ray offers over that is a better picture. "

    Hmmm, have you used some of the great features on some of the better HD DVD/Blu releases. Trust me it's more than just a better picture.

    Even my girlfriend was impressed with the U-control stuff on Bourne Trilogy and she doesn't really do the extras on DVDs.

  • IronGiant #95 3 years ago

    Buying a download code from asda just aint gonna happen anytime soon. Why do you think the supermarkets still stock cds? Because a helluva lot of people like a physical copy, Physical formats are here to stay for a long time yet. It's not legal downloads that are hurting cd sales it's the illegal ones, DVD sales are very healthy and Blu Ray are increasing all the time.

    Anyway what MS thinks isn't the main factor here it's what the movie studios think and they're pressing ahead with Blu Ray and adding more and more extras to them. Personally im really looking forward to the Dark Knight Blu Ray which has a very cool feature:

    "For the Blu-ray Disc however, while most of the film will also be presented in the 2.40:1 anamorphic widescreen ratio, the scenes that were specifically shot in IMAX format will be presented at 1.78:1, which will fill the frame and will thus recreate the IMAX experience at home. This is not via seamless branching (you can't turn it off). But trust me: It's very cool. It's not gimmicky at all, it really adds something to the film - an extra little bit of 'oomph' to the action scenes, so to speak. So there you have it. It goes without saying that we obviously can't wait to get our hands on the discs."

  • karstux #96 3 years ago

    I like my media physical and DRM-free. As far as I'm concerned, Blu-Ray can go and die as well.

    When people compare SD and HD video, the methodology of the comparison is often very flawed. The quality of SD video on a HD display depends heavily on the scaler. So when you see a very badly scaled SD signal, and afterwards a native-res HD signal, of course HD is noticeably better. (Unfortunately, most TVs have really crappy scalers. So it's best to feed them only native res signals.) With a high-quality upscaled SD picture and native HD, the difference in quality is rather marginal, and certainly not worth the increased price and DRM.

    I recently bought a good upscaling DVD player, and I think I'm set for the next 10 years or so. I won't invest in Blu-Ray. At some point in the future we'll probably need a new medium for physical distribution, but I predict it won't happen unless:

    - it doesn't compete in a format war
    - it comes light on DRM (think CD and DVD)
    - it will be noticeably, tangibly better than DVD in real customer use (no gimmicks like HD, PIP and online content)

  • byron_hinson #97 3 years ago

    Edited by 2 at 12/10/08 @ 08:43

  • TheNinkyNonk #98 3 years ago

    Bluray is nice, no doubt, but I agree in with the article in the sense that, over DVD, it offers only a limited range of benefits. It is, after all, still just a digital disc (albeit in a nicer case). VHS to DVD was a physical leap AND and significant ergonomic leap. There just isn't that marked change from DVD to Bluray.

    Digital download, however, offers a new experience akin to what has happened with the music business. If the price is good and broadband speeds can provide the modern consumer with the immediacy they demand, people WILL go digital.

    There's some way to go though.

    Distributors don't (although I think they're learning) appear to be making digital distribtion the more enticing option in terms of pricing. People are willing to forgoe a physical medium if they feel they're saving a bit of cash. Charge them broadly as much and limit their experience in any way and they'll turn the other cheek. And until we can get to the point where Joe Blogs can download and start to watch an HD movie within 5 minutes of paying for it, there will always be too great a degree of inconvenience built into the expereince to make it broadly appealing.

  • bonker #99 3 years ago

    Interesting all the movie comments on this.

    I'm not sure why though.

    If you're *really* serious about movies then you either have a huge DVD collection (like me) and/or you have a HTPC with enormous disk space (also like me) to play stuff anywhere in the house.

    There's no way I'll ever start building another huge library of fecking disks, of any type - if I can't get it on the TBs of disk storage I have then forget it - it's 2008 already ...

  • Widge #100 3 years ago

    For Microsoft to embark on the digital download journey, would they not have to ditch the "this is a pure games machine" line they are going for and start heading down the path of making the 360 into more of a front room media centre type thing?
    Or is that heresy? Because apparently doing things other than games is apparently a massively bad thing.

  • MaxiSleep #101 3 years ago

    "All Blu Ray offers over that is a better picture. "

    Yeah.

    Thats why color tv failed
    And why Sky Digital Failed
    And Why Sky HD Failed
    And Why dvd failed

    Lol

  • drumbaby #102 3 years ago

    davisorle: "Yeah Sony is pointing the gun in ur fucking head "

    No. Noone forces you to buy a console. Noone. Not even Sony. Freewill is what makes you do it, which is all part of consumer excitement/ greed/ avarice.

    You get Blu-Ray as a benefit of making the choice, not as a punishment.

    Twerp.

  • smelly #103 3 years ago

    Quote : ""All Blu Ray offers over that is a better picture. "

    Yeah.

    And Why dvd failed "


    DVD offered LOADS more over vhs than just better picture quality.

    - smaller, able to go straight to chapter, commentaries, no problems with "tracking", etc etc etc.

  • Calgon #104 3 years ago

    Sony fanboys call competition names while making "lalalalalalala!" noises with their fingers in the ears whenever someone points out how Blu-Ray isn't really doing that great.

    THIS IS WHAT BIG-DUMB-DRIBBLING FANBOYS AND HATERS DO.

    Thats how you fix a post people!. ;)

  • VMerken #105 3 years ago

    Meow, snarl, hiss!

    The jealous cat has spoken.

  • TRUTH #106 3 years ago

    Been to Japan - bluray over there nobody really seems to cares about it. Movie bluray are usually shoved in the smallest corners of the shops...Also with super hi-def as on PC's the next big thing, it seems bluray is more of a stop gap. It's almost been 2yrs and now major impact with BR. In a few years super hi-def will be hitting us (As seen on PC's), with Pioneer, Samsung, Panasonic, Jvc, Apple all already seeing this as the real hi-def future.

    It's also true the jump from dvd to br is not that big, hardly the fuss Sony made about it. Super Hi-def will have 16x plus resolution then what blu-ray offers at it's best.
    Edited by 1 at 12/10/08 @ 11:35

  • norsende #107 3 years ago

    Yeah why would X360 need a Blu-ray player? Pff.. It's so great I have a full-hd television but can't really fully use it because of Microsoft's bitterness in losing in the format race, so no watching 1080p movies! Thanks Microsoft, really liking your console right now!

  • RedSparrows #108 3 years ago

    Man, idiocy abounds in the comments.

    BIG CORPORATION IS

    A) STUPID
    or
    B) EVIL
    or
    C) THE WRONG ONE, COS THE OTHER ONE IS MUCH BETTER IT'S NOT EVIL (or all three)

    + added logical fallacy, pointless belligerence, fanobyism et al = fucktarded mess.

  • Xerx3s #109 3 years ago

    "Sony/nintendo = japanese shows respect and wont slag off other companys off.

    Microsoft = Amercain dosnt show respect ,wants world domination ,slags off everyone."

    It's just mind-numbing how short the selective memory of some people here is. Goldfishes have better memory than some people on here. :/

  • Gradius #110 3 years ago

    Xerx3s, you're right but be careful, you know you can catch teh bad AIDS if you venture too far into the comments section without protection! :D

  • Vic #111 3 years ago

    Its funny how many *ahem* people are against Blu-ray.

    When HD DVD was here, I'm sure most 360 owners were saying 'Yeah but its great that MS is offering us the choice'. Now its 'Sony is forcing us to rebuy our DVD collection!'

    Digital downloads are not a viable proposition. Who the hell is going to buy a film off XBL for a high price, when you can download the film at the same quality, with the same content for FREE from a torrent site? Blu-ray at least offers you the extra content and 1080p resolution.

  • Kryon #112 3 years ago

    Who the hell is going to buy a film off XBL for a high price, when you can download the film at the same quality, with the same content for FREE from a torrent site?

    People who aren't thieves? I mean, why would I pay to download a PS1/PS2 title from PSN when I could just use a free emulator? I'll tell you why, because I'm not a pirating scum bag who steals what he wants and shows a blatant disregard for the industry ;)

    You may aswell say "Yer but why shud i liek buy teh porsche wen i kan just teef it LULZ"

  • bad09 #113 3 years ago

    My brand new Incredible Hulk Blu with it's UControl special features pokes two fingers up at Greenberg and his crappy downloads.

    / wait impatiently for it to get dark!

  • Vic #114 3 years ago

    Dickhead.

    Hardly the same thing is it? Most 360 owners are chavs anyway; attaracted to the 360 by price, and not turned off by its unreliability :D.

  • Kryon #115 3 years ago

    Cocklover!

    Sorry, tourettes...

    How is it not the same thing? You're asking who will pay for something when they can just steal it, you make me laugh, you come out with a statement like that and then have the audacity to call other people 'chavs'..LOL, hilarious! :D

  • Vic #116 3 years ago

    No Kryon, it should be pretty simple to understand.

    There arent many people who will go out and steal a Porsche.

    But there are plenty of people who will happily download a film for free, especially when MS is charging a fortune for films with shitty bitrates and crappy 2-channel sound!

  • Kryon #117 3 years ago

    Download a film for free? You mean download it illegally. So Vic, how many movies and games have you stolen lately? You see, I'm not a thief so if something is out of my price range I would save for it or just live without it. Maybe if you did the same, Sony would make a bit more profit and could spend more on developing decent games? VicTheChavlol. Do you also try and sell clothes pegs by the side of the road?

  • Vic #118 3 years ago

    Loads :D

  • mr_trumpet_man #119 3 years ago

    People don't seem to realise that the uptake for Blu-ray is actually faster than the uptake of DVD.

    [link url=http://www.smartbrief.com /news/cea/storyDetails.jsp?issueid=E47907AB-032D-4758-A309-D 491AF8CFF2D©id=F458DC57-E9F5-40DB-A2A1-5BAA58717B70&lmci d=
    ]http://ww w.smartbrief.com/news/cea/story...[/link]

    [link url=http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/06/16/bd_vs_dvd_in _europe/
    ]http://ww w.reghardware.co.uk/2008/06/16/...[/link]

    I think people need to start comparing Blu-ray to the same period in the DVD life cycle rather than looking at what DVD is like now.
    Edited by 1 at 14/10/08 @ 18:55

  • Kryon #120 3 years ago

    @Vic

    Is it mostly gay porn that you download illegally? Yeah, I thought as much ;)

  • Calgon #121 3 years ago

    Oh come on people statistics can be used to prove anything is great... use your eyes, your ears and you head pehaps?, Blu-Ray isnt going to be the next DVD, its going to overtake it for new releases sure once everyone has HDTVs(its deffinately going to be slower for that reason... who cares how fast the Home theatre crowd have taken to it... its not mass market yet thats a different crowed than you're seeing now) but DVD was much more than new releases there were more reasons to buy old realeases again with DVD(already been listed here)... can many people who arent blinkered Sony fanboys really say Blu-Ray offers as many incentives to do the same again?
    Edited by 1 at 16/10/08 @ 22:32