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Microsoft creating its own Wiimote? News
Xbox 360 Wii News by Robert Purchese
Microsoft may be developing its own version of the Wii remote, according to MTV News.
Apparently evidence of a prototype was provided by an anonymous source.
The sketch shows a Wiimote-like design featuring an analogue stick rather than d-pad, and suggests there will be no nunchuk and that it will interact with the Live Vision camera.
"The whole thing is a colossal clusterf***," the source told MTV. "[Microsoft] marketing just want it so they can match the Wii point for point. The biggest parts of their marketing materials outline how easy it would be for third parties to port their Wii games to the 360."
The source goes on to reveal that Rare is the creative force behind the interface as well as the controller design, and will also be creating a Mii avatar system to go with it.
This, we're told, will be a more complex offering than the one for the Wii, and will be tied to games compatible with the controller rather than all titles like Gamertags are.
The source concludes by revealing that Microsoft has been working on the project since last August and is trying to get its motion-sensing controller ready for launch by the end of the year.
Is this anything more than research, Eurogamer reader?
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Madafunkola
08/04/08 @ 08:59
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This is a predictable move. How many iPod clones have we seen - the Wii is the new iPod.
But anyway... let the battle commence: |
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seasidebaz
08/04/08 @ 09:03
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what a load of pap.
rare have really lost it this time. this just proves that they want to make games for nintendo again. |
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Eurgh, if this is true then it just screams of desperation, with Microsoft resorting to copying Nintendo's ideas for the sake of capitalising on the casual market that the Wii attracts. Sure, everyone copies ideas, especially when they're good money making ones and who can blame them, but I just cannot see this making any difference to the Xbox 360 sales in the long run because this remote will only ever be used by a small percentage of 360 users thus the number of games that use it will be limited. Add-ons for consoles tend to sell poorly so I can't see this being any different, no matter how good it is. It's just coming too late IMO but if the next Xbox uses it from Day One then fine, that might work because the controller would be standard.
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@ Darren
"Eurgh, if this is true then it just screams of desperation, with Microsoft resorting to copying Nintendo's ideas for the sake of capitalising on the casual market that the Wii attracts." Sony did it, not only with sixaxis but also the original analogue controller (after N64 pad came along) so MS are not doing anything new just using the good ideas of others. If it is true and with 360 being cheapest, they may just steal some of those casuals. To me it's clearly obvious people are buying the controller more than the games available when it comes to the Wii. |
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Mentalist(air)
08/04/08 @ 09:14
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Well, the strategy worked pretty well for Sony on the PS1 with the Dualshock pad.
I guess Microsoft think they need a bunch of shitty Ubisfoft minigame ports in order to capture the casual market. |
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Not to mention even if this wasn't such a patently lame hoax, any plans to even attempt to rip off it's control scheme will be painstakingly analysed by Nintendo's legal team. Any... ahem... REMOTE attempt to steal the idea or the concept is going to be pounced on and lawsuits up the jacksie and back will ensue.
Microsoft might also want to pay attention to the PS2 attempt at remote-controllers over the Xmas period (the sphere and the club and that), because they were shockingly painfully bad. It's all well and good to have such a control scheme and a controller but then you have to make sure it is used in the right way. On a Wii, seeing as it's generally (unless you pay extra) the only control method there's an incentive to get it right, or use it properly. On a PS2 or X-Box 360, when there's an already-standard control mechanism, there's really no incentive because you're more likely selling the device more than the game, so games tend to be shit as a result. That's how I see it anyway. Microsoft wouldn't do this, and even if they did, I doubt they'd do such a basic sketch or rip off the design of it so patently... |
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kangarootoo
08/04/08 @ 09:16
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Its worth nothing that the sketch is a reproduction by the "source". Its not supposed to be an actual product design.
Not saying that fact makes this a true story, but those saying about how "multimillion dollar internationals [don't] draw prototypes in MSpaint" should take note. |
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Well, if the source has the original sketch why not show the original sketch? I mean, then we could see more what the point is.
We know what the point is I know, but the original sketch or technical drawing would most likely show us in a much better, clearer way how close to ripping off the Wii Remote they're prepared to go... |
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GamesConnoisseur
08/04/08 @ 09:18
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I believe that Sony was considering similar, so even if this story is true then that mean MS jumping in before Sony put on their trainers?!!
However should both MS and Sony eventually have their own remote and related casual games it would still be non standard as not all X360/PS3 owners have them and this form the biggest hurdle to possiiblity of capturing the share of Casual/Wii market. Will sell, I ll certainly get them for young family I have if the games are solid enough (no worse than what available for Wii) but it would only at best get the leftovers from Wii craze and wont cause any dent in Nintendo's profit. |
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kangarootoo
08/04/08 @ 09:20
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@Kami
"any plans to even attempt to rip off it's control scheme will be painstakingly analysed by Nintendo's legal team" Nintendo didn't invent the pointing device. If any other company released a similar controller using different tech, they would be fine. "On a PS2 or X-Box 360, when there's an already-standard control mechanism, there's really no incentive because you're more likely selling the device more than the game, so games tend to be shit as a result." Except for EyeToy perhaps, which has sold millions of copies. Or SingStar, which has also sold a stupid number of copies. |
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I dont understand, whats your problem with news like that!
the 360 is strong with core gamers, but it totally lacks the casual and family-gamers. It's not like it's impossible to have both. Look at PS2. When they announced Singstar, Buzz and Eyetoy, did anyone yell "but hey, this is the plattform of shooters and racing games"? No, I dont think so. If you want the 360 to be a healthy plattform with lots of interesting games, you should keep an open mind to what other ppl want to play. If the market says "we want dumb minigames on Wii", then the developers will give it to them. If the market says "We all have the 360" ..well, I guess you get what I wanna tell you. Just, you know... keep an open mind. (This is not true, if you're a PS3-Fanboy. PS3-Fanboys suck anyway) |
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I think we should also remember Nintendo may have patents or other legal protections on their design or the technology inside the Wii Remote. I know patents mean fuck-all these days because it's a cheap excuse to make lots of money off of big companies, but it's worth remembering that any attempt to directly rip-off the Wii Remote isn't going to happen without a legal challenge. I doubt Nintendo are foolish enough to not protect their work in some way, or have something inside it that is protected under some banal patent. People have been sued over less.
@ Kangarootoo; Fair point with those examples, but we're not exactly talking the same kind of controls here. Look at those examples over Xmas 2007, they could (and perhaps SHOULD) have been a real contender because the concept was rather sound, but they didn't take it much further than that. Guitar Hero is still pressing buttons and the like, so the only real case in point is Eyetoy... which was argued back then to be a rip-off of the Nintendo GameBoy Camera. So go figure. We'll probably find out Nintendo invented democracy at some point...
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most recently on 08/04/08 @ 10:27
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kangarootoo
08/04/08 @ 09:21
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@Kami
"Well, if the source has the original sketch why not show the original sketch?" Maybe they don't have the original sketch. The story says they saw a prototype, which they had sketched. |
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kangarootoo
08/04/08 @ 09:23
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"but it's worth remembering that any attempt to directly rip-off the Wii Remote isn't going to happen"
I think that is a fair statement all in itself. MS would probably agree. So avoiding making a "direct" ripoff is obviously key. |
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seasidebaz
08/04/08 @ 09:23
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ok, this does not require extra outlay for a controller.
it requires extra outlay for the controller AND the live vision camera if you read it... that would mean costing around £80 for the two. now, for a new controller, that is extortionate. casual gamers will not pay that amount of money. next, RARE IS DESIGNING THE CONTROLLER, not microsoft. so, microsoft is probably not to be accused of copying. it's more likely rare want to go back to the nintendo love, and this is microsoft's way to appease them. let them make their own wiimote, for a more powerful console, then they have the best of both worlds. |
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@bad09 - I did actually say in the next line that everyone copies good ideas, which includes both Nintendo and Sony as well, and that is good business sense actually but adding analogue sticks or motion-sensing is totally different from blatantly ripping other people's ideas off as directly as is rumoured to be happening here. I'd imagine there will be a few law suits thrown at Microsoft if this turns out to be true. LOL
Sony's motion-sensing SIXAXIS was a waste of time considering how few games actually used it, nevermind used it well. In over a year since I've owned the PS3, only one game has attempted to make full use of it, Lair, everything else has either included it as a gimmick or used it poorly IMO. Often I forget that the PS3 has motion-sensing, that's how effective it is (isn't?) on that machine! LOL Anyway, I own a Wii so I'm not in the slightest bit interested in buying a similar product for the Xbox 360 because I'm sure it'll just end up getting used mostly as a gun in shooting games anyway, I can almost guarantee it! ;) |
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I think the story may well be true in the general sense that Microsoft are considering such a move but I'll plat piss if this is it. It's an almost identical copy of the Wiimote and I'm pretty sure Nintendo would sue the tits off them. Also since when did Rare do hardware? This story stinks, but I think next gen (or possibly this gen) we'll see a lot of controller types that embrace the casual market. Nintendo are doing such good business that there is no way that motion sensitive controllers won't be a major part of the next-gen war. Increasingly new games are really coming around to the Wiimote too - apparently they're finally getting the hang of FPS's and the football controls in Pro Ev were revolutionary. Increasingly it's not so much of a poor man's control pad, and I can even see control pads eventually being phased out. No time soon, as for me you can't match the precision of the X-box controllers, but one day it could happen.
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"Very interesting move. As long as they don't try to replace the normal controller and the quality of the software is above that on the Wii it could work."
It's only a matter of time before the 'normal' controller gets replaced. Let's face it, it's a very poor control mechanism. The only reason a small group of people puts up with it is because there wasn't anything better and they were dedicated enough to learn to use them. The Wiimote is a step in the good direction but controllers have always evolved and will for the considerable time because they're just not particularly good at what they should do. If this turns out to be true, I'm very interested to see whether MS will be actually able to attract a more casual market. And how will Sony react? They squandered their Eye Toy lead but have they been busy working in secret on something better? Its creator has said in the past that in his vision the camera would be used as the control device. |
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@ Les: "It's only a matter of time before the 'normal' controller gets replaced. Let's face it, it's a very poor control mechanism. The only reason a small group of people puts up with it is because there wasn't anything better and they were dedicated enough to learn to use them."
Are you from another planet or something? OK the D-Pad could be improved (don't care anyway, never use it) but the 360 controller is spot on, they got everything right on this one. |
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Mentalist(air)
08/04/08 @ 09:42
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It's only a matter of time before the 'normal' controller gets replaced. Let's face it, it's a very poor control mechanism
That's simply not true. Have you tried playing Tomb Raider on Wii? The 'standard' dual-analogue control pad is a far superior tool for playing games with direct manipulation of character movement and viewpoint, from the comfort of a living room couch. The only problem is that it's crap as a pointer. I don't think the wiimote is the optimum solution to combining the two, and the requirement of mice to be laid on a surface makes them awkward for console gaming. Still, I doubt this device of Microsoft's, if it exists (and it's the Rare connection that makes me dubious, unless they're just doing the initial batch of games or tech demos for it) is the solution either. But the way the wii-mote has grabbed the public imagination is quite incredible, despite the fact that it isn't even all that good, and I'm not surprised other companies want a slice of that. |
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"Are you from another planet or something? OK the D-Pad could be improved (don't care anyway, never use it) but the 360 controller is spot on, they got everything right on this one."
I'm saying controllers in general are very poor and limited in giving you control over a game character. They're very inaccessible (which explains the Wii-mote success) while at the same time they are severely restricted in options which in turn puts a limit on what your game character can do. The standard console controller has been constantly improved but along rather predictable lines: adding analogue for d-pad, adding a stick and adding lots of buttons. Only recently has Nintendo left that path with touch screen and Wiimote (though Sony was there with Eye Toy first but unlike Nintendo they failed to realise the full potential of more accessible ways of controlling games) and that has resulted in tremendous success. They're definitely not there yet but it's a step in the right direction. |
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For those arguing about Microsoft potentially violating Nintendo's patents and the like, please be reminded that MS has already experiment with motion controllers before (Sidewinder Freestyle Pro) and probably has some patents of its own in place, plus pointing devices existed before the Wiimote. It's the execution that counts and certainly big N will defend its business fiercely, but let's not jump into premature conclusions.
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*Checks work mail for microsoft upcoming briefings and reveals* ..... nope
*Checks for any new NDA requests* ..... nope *Checks the dev forum for new posts* .....aw heck I'm not trawling through all this drivel about "How would I go about creating X" If this is legit, there's nothing official about it yet. |
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I disagree that the conventional controller is "poor" as I would argue that the Wii's remote and nunchuk combination aren't ideal for every game either due to the lack of buttons and those that are there are sometimes hard to reach because of the way it is designed to be used in different ways, including horizontal with the D-pad to the left.
The Wiimote works very well with simple games, which makes it ideal for casual gamers frightened at the prospect of having to use more than two buttons, but for everyone else brought up on conventional controllers they can feel limiting. Besides which, do people really want to play a shooter for hours pointing their arm out at the screen? While the Wiimote might be a good excuse to do some exercise in Wii Sports and such like, there are times when I just want to relax and it's harder to do that on the Wii than is on the PS3 or 360 IMO. |
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CreepinJesus
08/04/08 @ 10:26
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That's got to be the WORST attempt at 'news forgery' I've ever seen.
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captainrentboy
08/04/08 @ 10:27
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LOL.
That sketch was fucking awesome. Microsoft's R&D department are a right bunch of artistic and talented bastards. |
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muscleblade
08/04/08 @ 10:41
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@captainrentboy
You should read the text before commenting. Microsoft's R&D department has nothing to do with it. |
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"I disagree that the conventional controller is "poor" as I would argue that the Wii's remote and nunchuk combination aren't ideal for every game either due to the lack of buttons and those that are there are sometimes hard to reach because of the way it is designed to be used in different ways, including horizontal with the D-pad to the left."
I don't think the Wiimote is ideal. I do think it's less restricted than the old controllers. That games that were specifically designed for the old controllers don't always translate well to a new mechanism as the Wii-mote is to be expected. It will take some time for developers to adjust to this (same goes for sixaxis motion controls) as it differs from the input devices of the past 30 or so years. More so than graphics, memory or processing power, game controllers create the biggest contraints for what a game designer can do with his virtual world. I would be very surprised if 10-15 years from now game devices would still come with dual analogue controllers. |
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That sketch is quality, I like the way they havent even managed to make the A,B,X,Y Buttons the same size, some of them arent even round.
Its no secret Microsoft are working on something, during several keynote speeches over the past couple of years, quick google search found this from 2006 http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2006/08... |
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WinterSnowblind
08/04/08 @ 11:23
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What I find amazing about this is the amount of people critisising Microsoft, but ignoring the fact that Sony already done exactly this same thing, very poorly might I add. And in all fairness, Microsoft invented this kind of technology themselves, they've had this kind of thing in use for Windows since before the Wii, or even the Gamecube.
Obviously they fact they're using it with the 360 now is going to be because of the Wii's amazing success, but still. It's not like Nintendo and Sony haven't used any of Microsoft's ideas. |
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Someone's having a late April fool on MTV.
Surely you'd want the MIC near the top of the controller (so you can use it for other applications, like karaoke games) and the SPEAKER at the bottom?! Besides, their sizes should be the other way round as well, surely, with the MIC being smaller (usually is) and the SPEAKER being bigger? If that's how the Wiimote has it then Nintendo are disastrously wrong, too! |
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