LOTRO could be next "mass-market" MMO

By Oli Welsh Published 1 September, 2008

Aided by console, new payment models?

Lord of the Rings Online's executive producer Jeffrey Steefel has told Eurogamer that he thinks the Turbine game is the most likely MMO to achieve mass-market success, after World of Warcraft.

"There's another level of success, which is reaching a certain mass-market critical mass, which to be totally fair, only Blizzard has achieved completely so far," Steefel said in an interview published today.

"We think that we are the game that has the most likelihood of being the second to do that, but we're not there yet."

Turbine does not publicly release subscriber figures for Lord of the Rings Online, but maintains that the game is profitable, and growing.

Steefel's optimism about LOTRO's future stems from the Asian launches, the return of Tolkien to the cinemas with Guillermo del Toro's forthcoming Hobbit movie, and Turbine's determination to bring the game to new markets.

He expects the game will need to move beyond a standard subscription model in the long run. "This is a franchise that's going to continue for years and years and years, and there's no way that the singular, monolithic, USD 14.95 a month subscription model is going to last for years and years and years all by itself... it has to change."

Steefel also gave the clearest indication yet that Turbine's in-development console game is a version, or extension, of Lord of the Rings Online.

"Consoles only have a certain number of buttons, so how do you help someone use a console controller to manage inventory and skills and traits and deeds and crafting items and all that stuff in a way that's not just painful," he said, naming several gameplay elements specific to Lord of the Rings Online.

He discussed the potential of two players co-operating on one machine in a persistent world - "You can imagine how cool that would be. Very challenging to do, but again, possible," - and of using multiple devices, such as consoles, PCs and mobile phones, as access points to a single virtual world.

But, he said, "we're talking right now about taking games and putting them on console, or building games specifically for console."

Check out the full Lord of the Rings Online: Mines of Moria interview with Jeffrey Steefel for more.

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About Oli Welsh

Oli is Eurogamer's acting deputy editor and reviews editor and likes to take things one word at a time. He is among the best dressed people in South London.

Read more articles from Oli by visiting the Oli Welsh archive page.

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Comments (27) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • Triggerhappytel #1 4 years ago

    I didn't know Del Toro was directing the Hobbit movie... awesome; I've got a real thing for his movies at the moment (going to see Hellboy 2 later this week).

  • magicpanda #2 4 years ago

    I resubbed to this over the weekend and it's just as busy as when I played a few months ago. It's very good and nicely polished but there is something about it that I cant put my finger on. Something just doesn't click and it all feels a bit soulless.

  • DFawkes #3 4 years ago

    +1 to Magic Panda

    I too resubbed recently (just ran out), and although I really enjoyed it, and technically it's a good enough game and has plenty to offer, it just lacks that spark that makes me irritated when I can't play it.
    I can understand people liking it a lot, there's plenty to like.

  • Rizo #4 4 years ago

    Why not reveal your sub figures are they really that bad?
    Did Magic panda recently double there sub numbers?
    Can I rub the silly pandas belly?

  • butler` #5 4 years ago

    LOTRO is a big deal. There's plenty of clues to suggest that their sub figures are in excess of any other Western MMO (that isn't WoW).

    It's a great game, it derserves the success.

  • Fleisch #6 4 years ago

    +1 again to Magic Panda, I cancelled WoW and subbed to this after getting the Gold edition in the sales, was excellently presented and great fun but lacked the X Factor that WoW has....needless to say im back on the Warcrack!

  • [DVDF]Gooner #7 4 years ago

    It is a great game, nicely polished, stable, deep, good story arc, some nice ideas....but, and as others have said, it is hard to put your finger on exactly what it is missing, but the closest i have come to reasoning why i stopped playing was that it takes itself just a little bit too seriously, the humour, what there is of it, feels a little contrived. It does however deserve its success, the launch was extremely good and the development since then has been first class. There is room enough for this and WoW.

    AOC may be as unstable as a recovering crack addict and be trying to be all things to all players which is deadly for a release thats six months premature but it does offer a different approach. It's all very Grolsh (it's not ready) but full marks for trying.

  • Fallen_Angel #8 4 years ago

    Agree with those who say that its missing something. I got myself a lifetime sub at Christmas, and have recently got myself into a Kin, and both are helping me stick with it, and while its an awesome game to play, it just needs something to be on par with WoW, but I don't think anyone can figure exactly what it is. Although one of my biggest problems is that everything (Up to the Lone Lands/North Downs at least), looks pretty samey, but I'm thinking that Moria is gonna change all that.WoW does have the benefit I think of having massive variety (From what I remember when I played it a few years back), that most of the different zones have a completely different look and feel to them.

  • Velios #9 4 years ago

    EVE online completely pisses on LOTRO and is far more deserving of mass market success imo.

  • AOFanboi #10 4 years ago

    LotRO = Asheron's Call 3 with a Tolkien theme, Warhammer looks to be a two/six faction Dark Age of Camelot, Champions Online looks a wee bit like a reimplemented City of Heroes...

    Yeah, I exaggerate. But I would love some less derivate elements - or is there only Lego Universe to look forward to?

  • Dizzy #11 4 years ago

    Best MMO out there (and this comes from a WoW end-game raider).

  • Hamflank #12 4 years ago

    Perhaps they should fix the awful controls and character models, before aspiring WoW-like success.
    Edited by 1 at 01/09/08 @ 18:49

  • Tyranix #13 4 years ago

    Oh God Turbine/Codemasters/whoever controls LOTRO, please don't go Blizzard's route and do anything to get more money...

    I played WoW for three years like so many people, and I have so many great memories. It is a great game, but so shallow now that I have moved on to LOTRO.

    I can sympathise with the people saying it lacks something...I agree, but I still much prefer it to WoW as there is more to do other than kill things. I just really hope they don't stop with their incredible free updates and start focusing purely on money.

  • Nill #14 4 years ago

    Best MMO out there (and this comes from a WoW end-game raider).

    Doesn't make me very excited. End game-raiding in WoW isn't exactly my highest fantasy of what I'd like to see from future MMOs.

    Not trying to be a prick or anything, but I found this comment kind of amusing. I mean, you enjoy what you do and that's obviously fine, but I'd like future MMO-designs to be at least a ton more creative and than WoW ever was and ever will be, and I really hope we'll eventually see something that'll utilize the real potential the MMO-concept carries.

  • Dizzy #15 4 years ago

    "Doesn't make me very excited. End game-raiding in WoW isn't exactly my highest fantasy of what I'd like to see from future MMOs. "

    Err??? I didn't mean that :)

    LOTRO is VERY different from WoW... it has made some great design decisions that have paid off.

  • Darkjinxter #16 4 years ago

    The Magic Panda is spot on with the soulless comment.
    Dizzy seems over-enthusiastic, or perhaps it's just me who felt the whole thing so WoW samey, even in the raids I took part in. hours spent racking up a massive repair bill ftw.

    ...and the crafting, pipeweed it was, gain master level at a craft which would earn you zilch. Why bother? The WoW monster's crafters each and every one has a part to play and will gain the coin in doing so. Turbine wasted me pipe-weeding time. Which annoyed me do much I'll be looking forward to bashing a Balrog's head in, but only for the one-month (re) subby that comes in the box.

    ...and the 'interest level' mentioned in the article??? LotRO mucks about so much with Tolkein's work and gets away despite being 'officially' sanctioned by Tolkein Enterprises it's a bloody joke.....Loremasters indeed :p

  • AphoticCosmos #17 4 years ago

    EVE > LOTRO tbfh

    I played LOTRO for 2 months when it came out and it just slowly died for me. All the players of any worth just left the game mid-July, early-August 2007 and since then only the hardcore tolkien nutters who will troll you for hours if you mix up a bit of lore have been left.

    That, and despite all the undeniable pretty-juice and uber-sound and all the nice touches, it just felt really, really empty after a while. OK, this is coming from an EVE player where some systems will have hundreds or thousands of people at any one time and some will have one or none, but LOTRO just didn't have enough people in it to be a world. I found myself increasingly having to solo stuff, and after the end-game raid bugged twice in a row I just gave up.

    Might be good now, but Turbine ruined the market share it could've had if it had just bugfixed some more and added a more interesting level of PvP.

    So yes, EVE-O really does deserve the mantle more, especially when walking in stations gets added sometime next year.

  • ZeroAX #18 4 years ago

    keed dreaming mate. keep dreaming

  • WinterSnowblind #19 4 years ago

    I refuse to pay the subscription fee, for any of these games. No matter how the developers try to justify it, there's just no way the games are worth that kind of money. And no, this is not because I simply can't afford it. Either lower the fee, or come up with some alternate method, and I'd definitely be interested in playing this on my 360.

  • iokthemonkey #20 4 years ago

    I don't get the whole "it's got no soul" thing.

    Granted, I've only been playing LOTRO for a few weeks but I've found it to be the most complete MMO I've played in a long time. It's got the swiftness and fun of WoW but with the added breadth of an old-school MMO like Ultima Online, which is something I've found lacking in most titles recently. It's stable, playable and actually rewarding to play, unlike AoC and offers a lot of new ideas. Even the stuff that aint' so new is still done well.

    And best of all, no Barrens Chat... :)

  • steoc4 #21 4 years ago

    Hmm I have a time card for this lying around.

    I picked it up cheap a while ago and played for a couple of hours but got distracted and never went back to it. Might give it another go some time.

  • iokthemonkey #22 4 years ago

    "Hmm I have a time card for this lying around.

    I picked it up cheap a while ago and played for a couple of hours but got distracted and never went back to it. Might give it another go some time."

    For some reason, LOTRO fell-off my radar and I never picked it up on release. However, I was surprised at just how good it was, especially - I think - in light of some of the recent additions.

    If you have the game and a time card, I'd give it a go - you've nothing to lose, really!

    And sorry if I sound like Turbine's PR guy, but I just think it's a shame LOTRO doesn't get the audience and success it deserves.

  • hiddenranbir #23 3 years ago

    I don't get the soul thing either. I've really engrossed myself into Tolkien stuff and, being on a RP server, enjoyed playing a heavy set, bearded Guardian that speaks as if he belongs in Victorian Britain.

  • iokthemonkey #24 3 years ago

    I can see how the game has all the "tools" for RP - the festival areas for guild bands, guild halls, etc. I just wouldn't dare play on an RP server as I get the impression it would be full of people speaking Elvish for real...

  • Neithan #25 3 years ago

    Although I have subscribed since launch, and this is pretty much the only computer game I play regularly, I do admit that LotRO is missing some "X factor." I played WoW for about 6 months and felt that it was also missing something that I "couldn't quite put my finger on" and that something was an over-arching epic storyline that I could take part in. So I quit and found that epic feel in LotRO. In LotRO I think the "soulless" feel has to do with the lack of life in the gameworld itself, and weak integration of the character into the world. It often feels fake i.e. shallow and artificial. The relative dearth in players on some servers during off-peak hours compounds the problem. What it essentially boils down to is a lack of depth to the game content, especially in how the player interacts with and influences the environment. The lack of depth can be seen in something as simple as a lack of interior areas and static communication with NPCs, as well as being treated virtually identical to every other character, regardless of race or class. Turbine just doesn't have the resources [yet] to bring this game to that superior level of polish.

  • iokthemonkey #26 3 years ago

    "The lack of depth can be seen in something as simple as a lack of interior areas"

    ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------

    That's actually something I'd never noticed that much until now: when you go into a "Hero Building" it's usually via a quick loading screen, which does break the immersion somewhat. My guess is they cut-down on the amount of interiors to avoid this, hence a lot of "street vendors."

    But yeah, you're right on that front!

  • kok_warlock #27 3 years ago


    This interview was just advertising and wishful thinking of that executive producer, I mean come on, LOTRO?? I've okayed the game, it looks good, it has a decent story, but it lacks in a lot of areas, specially the fun factor, I mean, it's entertaining for a while and then the novelty dies out like most average games.

    The critic reception was alright, but the sales of it was a bit of a failure, that's why they don't release subscription numbers, they sold only 172k copies of the game during the first three months, which is usually the strongest.

    No offense but this talk about LOTRO being the wow-killer and/or the next big thing is like 2 years old, it died last year after it was released and it proved it wasn't a big deal, and considering how the way this producer is speaking it never will.

    Steele, the producer, seems to think all of his problem are gonna be solved and his game will magically be better with some marketing and PR, meaning, releasing to other markets, more advertising and a new LOTR movie, and then he speaks of years and years and years to come, what is he expecting that an awesome movie is gonna be release every year?