LBP would not work on 360 "as it is" Comments by Robert Purchese

@Whatsfor
I'm not so sure about that. While the creation side does allow for lots of surprizes - computation machine, trampoline and bucking bronco mini games, music sequencer - it's not a jack of all trades in terms of genres and what you can do. At it's heart the core mechanics are that it's a platformer - regardless of what people want it to be.

What I think is consistent about the majority of previews is how much fun it is to play. Regardless of the content it's fun to just mess about in with other people. Fun is a factor missing from a lot of games.

I find it deeply ironic, that a game which looks most at home on a Wii, is turning into a major seller for the PS3, after all the Wii-bashing about "simple fun games"....

If it floats your motor boat then more power to you.

@bengray66

because each individual ps3 owner represents all ps3 owners amirite?

farticusmaximus, Well clearly it is up for debate otherwise posters on this site would have accepted Evan's remarkes that it isn't possible (in it's present state).

@bengray66
I've never seen this as a Nintendo or Wii game. The style of the game screamed Sony of old at me from the first screen shot. Its the sort of stuff they have been sorely lacking in this gen - aside from PSN titles.

@Rash and Farticus
I think you are talking about different things. Farticus is talking about possible as a game idea, Rash is talking about possible without changes (for better or worse). Both are correct.

There is no debating whether it's possible, from a technical perspective, on other platforms. That is a no-brainer. Having played vast quantities of, and marvelled at the physics of the incredible Boom Blox, LBP would even be possible on the Wii.

How do you know this, or are you basically just saying it for a reaction?

Seriously, unless you are qualified in the field of programming and/or work for MM then please share with us just exactly how you reached this conclusion.

@Goodfella
At the core in order to replicate LBP on the Wii you would need a decent physics engine. It doesn't have to be exactly the same in order successfully replicate the game. What LBP does is simulate stuff like gravity, friction etc. This is ably demonstrated in Boom Blox. I don't think Farticus is suggesting the exact physics models used in LBP could be done, but a decent enough cut down version to get the same effect should be possible.

DrDamn, Ordinarily, I'd agree with you, but this is Fart we're talking about and he did said "technically" so once again, the guy's talking out of his arse (though his comments regarding Motorstorm were surprising).

DrDamn, I'm not convinced though. The engine is making levels on the fly. Players are jumping in and out of a level at will and the engine is having to calculate a large amount of data to make it all possible. Boom Blox as a game is much simpler than that.

Take out a lot of the graphical niceties and there are always ways and means to work around restrictions - as I said it might not do things the same way, with the same precision - but the approximation would be workable. The Wii isn't that much of a slouch in terms of computational power.

@miiguel:

quote: "Most hyped games in history: Halo & LBP "

Yeah.. but at least from the hype I knew what halo was ... an overhyped fairly average - quite boring - shooter.

I still have no idea how LBP *plays* apart from that it has a boring looking level editor

Woohoo, finally some value for my FOUR HUNDRED and TWENTY FIVE POUNDS.

"We have invested billions of dollars, a processor rivaling that of super computers, uniquely designed to support the massive processing requirments of digital entertainment"
Kaz Hirai 2006

Smelly, without wanting to stray from the topic too much... Whats your idea of not boring? I'm not a Halo fan but I dont think it looks boring. Likewise with LBP the intrigue about it keeps it from being boring...

"Whats your idea of not boring? I'm not a Halo fan but I dont think it looks boring."

Okay.. the first was cool as it was the first "proper" fps on a console.

Sequels dont interest me at all, because now there's too many fps's on consoles...

it's like going back a decade or so to the snes where every game was a 2d platformer..


"Likewise with LBP the intrigue about it keeps it from being boring..."

Which was my point.

Halo had shit loads of hype.. but at least you KNEW what the GAME was.

My prediction.. this is an average boring game with a nice level editor.

It looks like Fallout has been released eaerly....

What?

>It looks like Fallout has been released eaerly....

I think he got confused with FlatOut

smelly, How did you reach that predition? This is what I don't understand. Nearly all of us are informed by the gaming media about things that interest us. If LBP doesn't interest you that's one thing, but to make a loaded statement like that not backed up by any credible source is plain stupid.

I agree with Rash' but he perhaps said it better then me..

Just fuck off Evans!

All I know is that this game looks fantastic.

Exactly how many news stories can be made from one game?

I'm pretty sure LBP wins the prize for most! Completely fed up of the game before even playing it, gotta love PR.....

the media for this game is endless.

can't knock Sony or their abilty to build hype.

MS should learn from them after once again totallly failing to market a great VP game.

This sort of info blitz is clearly designed to get it in our faces all the time, they need to learn this.

(though i'm actually getting a bit fed up with it. wish they'd shut now and just let me look forward to getting it)

@rash: no, he's right, it's all about making bold predictions, and hoping that you're right. My 2 cents: EG score 8/10, metacritics 90.8, barely 1 million copies sold.

8/10 all over it.

So intuitive to use, it only requires 40GB of video to train the user!

I'm interested in playing this sometime, but...dare I mention the fact that the PC games have had user-created content, including user-generated gameplay elements, for well over a decade?

@arbiter: ok, I forgot the fact that sony's gonna make some ps3+LBP bundles, which means I now predict it's gonna sell 2.5M copies total (standalone + bundled) , but that's my final offer...

@ yagisencho: so fucking what?

its just a side scrolling platform... thingy. im not making levels for no one, thats not my job, and im definately not making my own levels cos that defeats the point of gaming.

I'd be more worried about getting it to work on the PS3.

Guffaw.

I loved the comment about people saying blu ray isn't nessary are only bitter 360 owners with HD-DVD drives.

Quite the opposite, I can play both HD-DVD and Blu-ray films already and since HD-DVD's demise I have bought 70 films at £2.99-£3.99 each and the HD-DVD add-on for my 360 (£15) so I can play I good selection of my HD movie collection in another room too.

Also my 360, Wii and PC all seem to be doing fine with games on DVD.

Don't get me wrong the drive on the PS3 is a good value added feature if you want to play blu-ray, but it wasn't needed for games.

1) Regards the 40GB data being uncompressed - All game data on disc is compressed, because it's faster to load. No developer is going to pad out a game disc with uncompressed data and ruin their load times as a result! The only possible exception to that I can think of is streamed lossless audio if you're not loading level data on the fly, such as you might have on a video tutorial, though I expect high-quality audio compression to be used instead.

2) Alex never said it was 40 GBs exactly, only that they're filling up a dual-layer BRD. He's uncertain of the capacity of a BRD layer, which is 25 GBs and not 20. We don't kow where the interviewer got the 40 GB figure from, and we don't know what state of build that figure is either.

3) (Amount of content) * (content complexity) is what takes up a lot of that space, and not amount of content on its own. A game could be huge and still require little space because the content is low quality and/or limited. There are thousands of unique resources in LBP. Other games can offer thousands of unique items, say in something like Oblivion, but as LBP is going to have to manage these objects up close and personal, filling substantial amounts of screen-space, they will likely need to be created in higher detail. A fork in Oblivion won't need to be modelled in as much detail as a fork for LBP. From that viewpoint alone, it's clear a DVD's worth of content created at twice the quality would require twice the capacity, exceeding a DVD. Higher quality assets (less compression) will also take up space. Then there are about 30 music tracks going by the manual, and some (nine, or maybe all, but I don't think so) come with individual instrument components for in-game editing, so that 3 minutes of song with 5 different component tracks could become 15 minutes of audio data with separate drum, guitar, keyboard etc. tracks. There is actually a lot of content here, which was Alex's point!

4) Alex Evans point on the game being possible on any platform, but being different : The original demo-pitch had a very simple 2D game, without any textures, and simple 2D physics. This was in essence the same game, and could be created on Wii or PS2, say. The same idea created on Megadrive with sprites and a vastly more limited selection of components would also be possible, and in essence - a platformer where you can also create stuff - would be the same. The implementation on PS3 is using PS3's resources to create someting unique to the platform. This includes a complex lighting model, 2.5D fluid dynamics for special effects, 3D model creation and destruction technology with on-the-fly mesh generation, and other lovely things that are very processor intensive. Clearly not all these technologies could be ported to all other platforms. A Wii version likely wouldn't have the explosives destroying terrain, for example. Alex didn't hazard a guess at what XB360 could achieve technically, despite the baiting question, as he clearly hasn't given it any thought. His point was that they targeted and developed for PS3, but had they have picked a different system, they would have created LBP, from scratch, based on that original simple concept game, and it would be different to some degree or other. LBP on Wii would perhaps be more LocoRoco in design, still be functionally similar, yet not be the same game.

5) Media Molecule isn't a Sony developer. They are independent. They left the XB360 exclusive Lionhead to shoot out on their own with no prior contracts. They created the prototype demo and pitched to Sony as their first choice publisher, and Sony got it and offered to take them up. I don't know why they went to Sony first - that'd be a great question for an interview, why they approached Sony first and not MS or Nintendo (my guess is Sony had the better reputation for supporting exclusives) - but that's the way it went. Now Sony are giving them excellent support and they're able to focus on PS3 without worrying about being multiplatform. They are free to create other games for other platforms if they want - they are not in any way Sony owned. The fact they are exclusive is more a testament to Sony's support and Media Molecule's principles as anything else. MM didn't want to do multiplatform with all its headaches, and Sony were happy to take them on on strength of a flimsy pitch and a cheap demo!

6) Yes, LBP is one of the most hyped games in all time! I'm extremely keen on the game, but even I'm rather sick of its frequent coverage in the gaming media with the same messages being regurgitated! However, it's better this way than being rolled out in nigh-silence and not getting the coverage it needs. Sony have fumbled other valuable titles before, and their overall marketing went completely down the pan from a couple of years back. At least they're back to being positive with their exclusives. For those following the gaming press, it's the same old thing, but each marketing push has the chance of reaching a fresh pair of ears and getting another interested party. Also don't forget the gaming press themselves are involved in seeking out interviews etc. Did Alex Evans contact GamesIndustry requesting yet more LBP coverage, or did GI.biz contact Media Molecule wanting an exclusive interview for a high-interest title...? And finally to MM's credit, the rollout of video clips are at least fun/interesting, like the Sackboy in the Wild trailer. The clips are often worth watching just for being entertaining regardless fo the fact they're pitching a game!

ShiftyGeezer is indeed a Shifty Geezer as most of is comment are on LBP.....

/pukes

I literally go into a tiny coma of boredom if someone's post goes on for more than four lines.^^
I think this game looks, erm, cute. And that's pretty much it.
I'm too lazy and too stupid to be arsed with fannying around making different levels. I want my game made for me, and ready to go.

Well, it certainly looks 30000 times more interesting than GOW 2....

not to dampen the spirit of the game, but side scrolling platformers? its a bit of a meh concept isn't it? been done to death, and whilst they can be good (Mario, flashback), even they went 3D after a while.

hasn't the universe evolved the concept a bit since then? physics and co-op are alright i suppose, but neither of them necessarily equate to refreshing original gameplay. especially if you are playing with morons.

"Well, it certainly looks 30000 times more interesting than GOW 2...."

30000 * 0 = 0... ;)

What we up to, 100 comments lolling at the news story? This game in its current form, if converted to 360, would not be possible on the 360. IMPOSSIBLE.

WHERE DO YOU SAVE THE UG CONTENT WITHOUT A HARDDRIVE!!!

You can't. And seeing as MS REQUIRE devs to not rely on a HDD, that means one SERIOUSLY crippled game.

Oh, and the fact that stuff can be sold for MONEY in LBP... MS wouldn't let you do THAT, either.

And the 40G of tutorial is all the building tutorial stuff, not a tutorial level. Learn to read, people...

baz: in other cases it's been allowed (like FF11), so that's not entirely right. They would need to allow an exception though.

This game is going to be the best sold and least played game in ps3 history. I mean c'mon, it's a platform game with a level editor...WTF!11???

This will sell only like 100 copies... no matter how good it is!

Just checked out latest, vid! Looks the business!

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/39778...

"Sure LBP is being hyped, just like GTA4 was and Halo 3, Gears of War, Orange box, MGS4 and countless others before it. Big games get hyped and there's nothing you can do about it but wait for it to subside."

One of the meanings of hype: promote or publicize (a product or idea) intensively, often exaggerating its importance or benefits

In the case of LBP it's about informing the public as opposed to build up anticipation for a tested brand (most of the games in the above quotation aren't sequels by coincedence). Let's not forget LPB is a new IP that must convince gamers to spend their money on it while the sales statistics suggest they feel much more comfortable spending that same money on HD upgrades of old franchisses...

You should be in PR Les, as you talk fluent bullshit.

LBP is the single most Hyped game since.. well I honestly can't think of another game that has been so overexposed and yet revealed so little about the actual game (if there is indeed a game behind Sackboy).

Whether the brand pre-exists or not has absolutely nothing to do with Hype.

Whether a brand pre-exists and has a good reputation is a factor in exposure. With LBP there has been a case of overexposure for a couple of reasons. First off it was shown too early - because Sony needed the boost rather than the game needing to be shown for it's own benefit. If Sony were not in the situation they were at E3 in 2007 then it wouldn't have needed to be shown. Secondly it has genuinely captured something in the eyes of gamers and - perhaps more importantly in relation to exposure - journalists. It's not just that Sony are heavily pushing the game, it's the fact that sites like EG want and seek out info to print as it gets hits.

@Farticus
"yet revealed so little about the actual game"

That I don't agree with. Look at what has been shown in vids. Think back to E3 2007 - what did they show? It wasn't pre-rendered footage, it wasn't mock ups. It was four people playing the damn game through an entire level. There is plenty of gameplay vids out there and in promo stuff they are putting out. If you don't like the game they show then that's fine, but there is more actual game stuff shown in these vids than any other game I can think of.

@DrDamn

Yet for all those vids, no-one has a goddamn clue what you do in the game, apart from get from the start to the finish!

There is *plenty* of other info out there. What exactly do you expect a full description of the game from start to finish?

A couple of examples - just on the play not create side ...

* It's a platformer - you jump, grab hold of stuff, swing, jump on enemies weak spots, flick switches, avoid hazzards and trigger events
* You collect bubbles for points and when playing with others it track who collects the most and they are the "winner" of each level
* Co-op can allow you to reach other areas in levels as indicated by signs in the levels
* There are other collectables like Sackboy outfits and items to use in your own levels. The game tracks how much of the collectables you have found in each level.
* There are levels where you need to use create to complete a level
* There are race sections with a start gate and finish line within levels which tracks fastest times on leaderboards and within groups of people playing a level co-op
* There are competitive mini-games in different environments like a trampoline, bucking bronco and tower levels.
* You get prizes for completing levels
* You can play up to 4 player co-op locally or online

That's just off the top of my head.

Dont believe everything you read -- of course it will run on a 360, just as other games run on both consoles. duh.

@dryden555
11-Sep-08 11:46:34 Dont believe everything you read -- of course it will run on a 360, just as other games run on both consoles. duh.

I think if you took the time to 'read' the article that 'you don't believe' in, then you would realise that isn't the point.
duh.

oh, and kudos to 'shiftygeeza'...i think you got the ethos of LBP in a nutshell mate (if only these kids with short attentions spans, would bother to actually read a well informed post) they need their ears boxing sometimes.
TCH!