L4D2 racism accusation "insanity"

By Tom Bramwell Published 31 July, 2009

Valve baffled by New Orleans dig.

Chet Faliszek has said that Valve was baffled by complaints on the Houston Chronicle website recently about "racist undertones" in Left 4 Dead 2.

In a blog earlier this month, Chronicle writer Willie Jefferson said that L4D2 was "already causing an uproar" - maybe true, but not for the reason Jefferson suggested, at least as far as we've seen.

"Set in New Orleans, players will have to fight their way through hordes of zombies - with several of them who appear to be African-Americans. When I saw the first trailer for the game, all I could think about was Hurricane Katrina and the aftermath," he wrote.

"Setting the game in a city that was scene of dead, bloated bodies floating by so soon afterward was a bad call, IMHO. The city has had enough to deal with - Valve, you should have spared them, even if it's just a video game."

Faliszek, speaking to Destructoid, described the piece as "utter insanity".

"There are mixed races of zombies, there are all different races of zombies that you shoot, and since we placed it in New Orleans, that makes it racist?" he responded.

"I honestly re-read the paragraph about five times ... but when two of the characters in your game are African-American, it's a weird thing to be accused of. We're like, 'how does this work'?"

Indeed, said Faliszek, Valve was treating the city with the "utmost respect", and deied the company was trying to make a statement. "We would not cheapen it," he said. "I love that city."

Left 4 Dead 2 is due out on 17th November for PC and Xbox 360 and you can catch up on our latest hands-on impressions and video interview with Valve's Doug Lombardi over on the gamepage.

Picture of Tom.

About Tom Bramwell

Tom is Operations director of Eurogamer Network and Editor-at-Large of Eurogamer.net. He joined the company in February 2000.

Read more articles from Tom by visiting the Tom Bramwell archive page.

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Comments (93) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • ZuluHero #1 3 years ago

    Isn't he talking more about the setting rather than the race of the zombies though? Or am i missing something?

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #2 3 years ago

    I think an ill-informed journalist has jumped on the wrong bandwagon.

    Maybe N'Gai Croal will phone him up to put him right.

  • the_dudefather #3 3 years ago

    "Set in New Orleans... When I saw the first trailer for the game, all I could think about was Hurricane Katrina and the aftermath,"

    All I could think of was that level in Hitman: Blood money or that episode of the Simpsons when Skinner and Wiggum are PIs in pursuit of Big Daddy(tm)

  • Crea #4 3 years ago

    Burn the racists! Burn them!

  • lambtron #5 3 years ago

    I mistakenly clicked on his blog and now feel the overwhelming urge to punch him in the face.

  • Kremlik Verified Co-Founder, Crash To Desktop #6 3 years ago

    Is this another 'oh the journalists that did RE5's 'racisum' got cred.. This is my attempt to do the same' bit?

  • El-Dev #7 3 years ago

    ""Set in New Orleans... When I saw the first trailer for the game, all I could think about was Hurricane Katrina and the aftermath,"

    At least you can take on a Horde of Zombies with a gun, you're pretty buggered when left to fight a Hurricaine.

    Does this mean we'll never see any more movies set in NY because of the 9/11 attacks?

  • carlitoswagon #8 3 years ago

    Reminds me of the 'GTAIV will make you want to kill real humans' baw bags talked by other stupid journalists

  • Bazfrag #9 3 years ago

    Ban this filth!! Or not. I think residents of NO are more upset at the criminally slow response from Insanity Bush when the floods happened than they will be over a videogame.

  • Domovoi #10 3 years ago

    So N'Gai Croal works for the Houston Chronicle now?

  • coomber #11 3 years ago

    That Simpsons episode in New Orleans is f***ing classic lol.

  • UncleLou #12 3 years ago

    I find it pretty naive if people can't at least see why RE5 is worthy of a discussion in that regard, but this seems ... strange. If it was only about New Orleans being a somewhat insensitive choice, fair enough, but he seems to combine that with the racism debate. Hm.
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 09:15

  • Eraysor #13 3 years ago

    I'm not really sure why New Orleans is considered a sensitive choice. It's not like the zombie invasion is actually happening.

  • penhalion #14 3 years ago

    Wow a lot of people including Valve and the follow up journalists, seem to have gotten the wrong end of the stick. This guy was merely saying that the setting was in real bad taste. From his perspective, thousands died there and now Valves game is effectively getting you to kill them again!

    Colour has nothing to do with it. It's more the bad taste of setting it in a city that has only recently suffered mass deaths. Those left behind hardly want to be reminded of the fact, let alone play through their ruined streets shooting their honoured dead like cattle.

    When the disaster occured, it took the american government ages to respond and many see this as being because the area is full of poor african-americans and not wealthy white folk. It's like a sinking ship where the captain yells "Money and connections first, followed by white folk, followed by women and chldren oh and then those there coloured folk ken swim fer shore behind us!".

    I don't think Valve had any intention of offending anyone. I guess it just shows the underlying insensitivity of american society as a whole. The fact that they (Valve) couldn't see the offence they would cause to the survivors of the disaster by setting a killing spree style game in the ruins of their homes has to say something very sad about society.

    feel free to -1 me all you like :|

  • UncleLou #15 3 years ago

    Wow a lot of people including Valve and the follow up journalists, seem to have gotten the wrong end of the stick. This guy was merely saying that the setting was in real bad taste.

    Read his blog. There clearly is an accusation of racism in there, it's not just about the setting. Otherwise he wouldn't stress how some of the zombies are afro-american, nor would he write a sentence later how you shot blacks inRE5.

  • dfunked #16 3 years ago

    If one positive thing has come of this, it has made me realise that I've missed an episode of the Simpsons...
    Bunch of whinging clungebags!

  • Vice.Destroyer #17 3 years ago

    you get a +1 from me, Penhalion. Well said.

  • carlitoswagon #18 3 years ago

    Thats explains why I like playing Louis..........kill, kill, kill the white man, kill him until he is dead ;)

  • bigbadbeasty #19 3 years ago

    @penhalion

    With that logic you simply couldn't set a game anywhere. Pretty much every place on the planet will have had some kind of disaster in it's life time. Especially in major cities.

    Should no games be based in London due to the plague, or the fire, or the war? New York because of 9/11? Etc... Granted if there WAS a zombie invasion in New Orleans it would be in poor taste, but there wasn't.

    Or are you saying that you can only cover certain disasters after a non-specific set period of time? Games set in WWII are quite common.

  • Petulant_Radish #20 3 years ago

    If colour has nothing to do with, then why mention it?

  • The_Inquisitor #21 3 years ago

    It's difficult to judge from where I am as I don't know much about the city (except for the decent music scene), so the first thing that springs to mind is that tragic event 5 years ago.

    For many people though, perhaps the city isn't just a place where a hurricane hit, just like New York isn't just a city that had a terrorist attack. So why not take the focus off the negative, even if it's just in a video game.

  • anomagnus #22 3 years ago

    Valve shouldn't even have responded.

    Most journos are hacks, whos only concern is controversy, and video games are the new easy target.

  • Zomoniac #23 3 years ago

    Resident Evil 5 was considered racist by retards.

    Indeed. Even more perplexing was the fact that so many of its scenes looked to be near carbon copies of Peter Jackson's King Kong, with its depictions of huge-eyed black tribespeople looking drugged up and Satanic lurching towards a group of white people with the only question in their heads being "do I kill them then eat them or eat first?", and yet I recall not one instance of major complaining about the incredibly similar race depictions in that. If anything RE5 is surely less bad, as killing a black man is slightly more excusable when he has a man-eating steroid-driven giant octopus growing out of his face.

    Surely it is more racist to set a game anywhere there are black people and not have any black people in it?

  • El-Dev #24 3 years ago

    People are too easily upset these days.

    Was there much controversy when Cloverfield came out?

  • mukki #25 3 years ago

    ok sooooooooo any games with zombies will be automatically labeled as racist?

    Errr ok...

  • kangarootoo #26 3 years ago

    @CountFapula and Zomoniac


    Bung a cork in it dudes. The RE5 discussion is old and boring. How about we discuss the subject at hand?

  • w1ntermute #27 3 years ago

    I'm seeing a lot of these provoking blog posts recently from idiots that know nothing about reality.

    You know, he could always ask the opinion of black people if they think it's racist before making the boldest claim he could ever make for his own race.

  • UncleLou #28 3 years ago

    and yet I recall not one instance of major complaining about the incredibly similar race depictions in that.

    There was a huge debate about King Kong at the time.

  • Madafunkola #29 3 years ago

    What about the fact that Zombies are based on Voodoo which is very popular in New Orleans?
    Maybe New Orleans is a perfect Zombie game setting? How about they set it in 2002, that way it's before Katrina and therefore not connected?

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #30 3 years ago

    Bullshit, Penhalion.

    You don't see newspaper reports about the insensitivity of setting a TV series full of the living dead in Louisiana.

    New Orleans and the whole southern gothic genre has always been a touchstone for voodoo, zombies and the like. Hurricane Katrina has nothing to do with that.
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 10:07

  • Rodafowa #31 3 years ago

    @bigbadbeasty

    Please, please, please tell me that you're wildly exaggerating to make an absurd rhetorical point. Because on the face of it you seem to be saying that the survivors of a tragedy that happened five years ago deserve to be treated with no more respect and sensitivity than people living in a city that suffered a tragedy five hundred years ago.

  • Monkey_Puncher #32 3 years ago

    OMG this game promotes black on black crime, BAN THIS SICK FILTH!

  • bigbadbeasty #33 3 years ago

    @Rodafowa

    As I said, is there a time limit then? 9/11 wasn't 500 years ago. There are still people alive that either survived or took part in the first and second World War.

    This game has absolutely no connection to the events in New Orleans, it is purely a setting, a location, theme or whatever you want to call it. It is a bloody game with zombies in it, it has nothing to do with a natural disaster.

  • XdarXideX #34 3 years ago

    This guy CAN'T be this stupid. It has to be a publicity stunt... though I don't know why anyone would want to invite hate mail into their lives.

  • DDevil #35 3 years ago

    Look, we've been over this before people. The only races it's OK to shoot and kill are caucasians and the Spanish.

    And probably the French.

  • teabagger #36 3 years ago

    Personally, if I were a 'New Orleaner' I'd be deeply upset that some middle class waste-of-space journalist with an axe to grind thought that what really mattered to me was some perceived racism in a game rather than channelling that same energy into something that would have an *actual* positive effect on the still-very-shitty lives of a lot of folk there.

    I think a lot of people get outraged about these kind of things as it detracts from the guilt they subconciously feel about having done nothing about the real issues.

  • El-Dev #37 3 years ago

    You never hear the Nazis moaning about COD games.

  • kangarootoo #38 3 years ago

    @bigbadbeasty

    I think your reference to the fire of London was stretching things a little :)

  • AphoticCosmos #39 3 years ago

    Stupid journalist is stupid.

    If there is one game developer out there that means no offence, is composed entirely of nice guys and just wants to make good games without offending anyone, it's Valve, because they're freaking awesome.

  • drunkymonkey #40 3 years ago

    Yeeeeah. I trust Valve to be making racially sensitive and respectful games far more than I do a company like Capcom. This is just a dumb accusation.

  • rhubarbandcustard #41 3 years ago

    The only group that Gabe Newel hates more than blacks are thin people.

    Expect L4D3 to be set in and around a fashion show.

  • zoidberg #42 3 years ago

    Can't these people move on? Thousands died in other places of the world too, including Europe (Kosovo), the Middle East and even Asia (tsunami). Noone is making fuss over those. Things happen, people die, they are mourned, then life goes on.

  • IronCladChicken #43 3 years ago

    @UncleLou
    It was discussed - a lot - Then it was found to be a silly argument & everyone moved on.

    @Madafunkola
    Zombies are originally from European wichcraft not voodoo - Obviously not watching enough QI :)
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 11:28

  • Tuffty #44 3 years ago

    @penhalion

    Except in L4D, you're not asked to kill the reanimated dead. Valve stated once before that L4D's zombies has always been based on a 28 Days Later type infection that turns the living into the Horde you have to survive against.

  • sneetch #45 3 years ago

    @penhalion

    No, he's talking about racism in games, the blog entry is even titled "Racism in video games: The new norm?"

    From the article:

    One of the games that comes to mind is "Left 4 Dead 2." Though the game isn't out yet, it's already causing an uproar. Set in New Orleans, players will have to fight their way through hordes of zombies - with several of them who appear to be African-Americans. When I saw the first trailer for the game, all I could think about was Hurricane Katrina and the aftermath.

    Mentioning New Orleans brought some bad memories back for him and that's sad, it was a terrible tragedy, but there were no zombies involved during that disaster. Basically, he brought with him a load of baggage and dumped it onto the game because of the setting. Why the need to even comment that several of the zombies "appear to be African-Americans" surely if anything that's a good thing? Two of the main characters are also black, surely that's also a good thing?

    Is it causing an uproar? I haven't heard any uproar. Is he simply offended because he thinks/assumes people might/will be offended?

    Another game, "Resident Evil 5," puts gamers into the heart of Africa, blasting zombies. I bet you'll never guess what color they are.

    Well now, they're a lovely, happy, multi-ethnic group aren't they? Do some frickin' research, pal. There are some black zombies but strangely enough they seem to be in the minority in most of the screenshots I've seen. The only thing they don't do is hold hands and murmer "it's a small world after all" as they eat your brain! I was surprised that they didn't go for the full PC hat-trick and have disabled zombies in wheelchair accessible areas too.

    At the end of the day I personally don't find a game character's ethnicity note-worthy, especially when they're trying to eat my face. I would'nt play RE5 and go "yeah, finally someone who tells it like it is!" because I'm pretty sure that the living dead going around murdering and eating people is as unusual in Africa as it is here. Yet some people like this journalist apparently can't see beyond the colouration of the textures. They can't resist putting their own distorted emphasis on things, they think that the important thing is the attitude and preconceived notions they bring with them and that the developers are obviously racist. Even more so when they deny it or act confused by the accusation. Hell, on the internet denying something is seen as an admission of guilt by a lot of people.

    If you seek offense you're sure to find it. 2 + 2 = 5! OMG! 5! 5, you sick sons of bitches, you won't get away with this!
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 11:45

  • kangarootoo #46 3 years ago

    @IronCladChicken

    Some would say that Voodoo is a european invention too - a repainting of Vodou, done for negative PR purposes.

    Besides which, zombie is too varied a term, covering everything from dead person walking about, to living person appearing to be dead, to living (or dead) person being placed under the control of another. Zombies appear in all sorts of cultures around the world.

    That said, the "actually dead person walking about" type of zombie featuring in L4D is indeed not the type that originates in Voodoo. Which is probably what you meant. Though the name Zombie DOES originate in Vodou (its the name of a Vodou God - the Zombi spelling I think).

    Complex stuff :)

  • kangarootoo #47 3 years ago

    "If you seek offense you're sure to find it"

    That there is a world truth.

  • Collymilad #48 3 years ago

    Valve: It's 2009 , everythings racist.

    Isn't the fact that a game where you have black AND white characters shooting black AND white zombies is being called racist racist in itself?

    Should we just take out the african american zombies? But wait then we'd have a black guy killing only whites....oh, wait..
    Edited by 2 at 31/07/09 @ 11:55

  • chris_ace #49 3 years ago

    Post deleted at 11:55:13 13-12-2011

  • kangarootoo #50 3 years ago

    From that link...

    "The first bit of damage is depicted by a World Trade Center-like structure exploding and collapsing downward"

    trade centre-like structure? "Structure"? Its a building.

  • kangarootoo #51 3 years ago

    Wow, I just noticed Fox News actually have "fair and balanced" written next to their logo.

    Never have I seen that before on any news source website. I guess you just kind of assume that a good news source will be fair and balanced, and that any news source TELLING you they are... doth protest too much.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #52 3 years ago

    "When I saw the first trailer for the game, all I could think about was Hurricane Katrina and the aftermath" - why? because during the aftermath all the african americans acted like mindless zombies? I didnt see any difference in them...ooops.

    This is so stupid, saying shit like that is such a back handed compliment to their arguement. I really hope this site doesnt agree with such foolishness as they did with their sensitive souls feeling "uneasy" during RE5 - when that games A)based in africa so HAS TO have black people in it. B) The africans are infected throughout... during each and every cut scene (so that shit about it looking like the africans were possessed before being so is a case of playing the racism card too soon and jumping to conclusions REGY) C) the africans who arent infects are strong articulate characters - one you even get to play throughout.

    L4D2 is based in the south, New Orleans.. which believe it or not has a majority population of black folk. You've got another game based around infection.. shall we say that blacks are imune to infection in these games? surely thats just as racist as its singling them out? or shall we remove all the blacks from new orleans and have it a white only community? maybe we can even get special white hoods for the characters we play.

    How can people possible win against crys of racism unless they ignore it. Capcom compromised, at the sake of their own artistic imagining of the world they created... which is why we got an africa filled with indians, asians, and white's too. All because people cried racism before actually playing the game to completion. I hope valve are stronger.

    Frankly the only racism in games is against the english who's race have found themselves placed in a sterotypical english villian role.. and never as the hero. Racism is negative labeling of a certain race - you dont get much more negative than always being the one out to destroy everything..whilst our friendly heroic americans save the day.

    If the racism card keeps getting played then the answers simple. Remove black people from games.. as they're obviously not ready for equal rights.

  • skillian #53 3 years ago

    ^ Wow, that wasn't too bad until the last two paragraphs.

  • Vice.Destroyer #54 3 years ago

    @monkeywithnoeyes

    If the racism card keeps getting played then the answers simple. Remove black people from games.. as they're obviously not ready for equal rights.

    It's not just black people that complain that black people are unfairly presented in videogames. And I assume that you meant proportional representation in media, rather than equal rights. Those two phrases mean completely different things. One is simply patronising. The other, breathtakingly racist.

  • Fleeby #55 3 years ago

    Smacks of a journalist trying to break out of the Houston Chronicle, get a profile and get on a proper paper. Well, he's got to kickstart his career somehow...

  • monkeywithnoeyes #56 3 years ago

    @Vice.Destroyer

    No i ment equal rights.. and for equal rights you have to take the rough with the smooth..thats just how life is. So if in RE 1-4 i'm killing white "zombies" in towns where the majority population is that of the skin tone white. Then it should come as no surprise that i be killing black "zombies" in towns where the majority population is that of the skin tone black.

    And ofcourse the same applies for L4D, and any other game that dare acknowledge the existance of a race other than caucasian

  • sarcasmoidosis #57 3 years ago

    Well, the author (I won't call him a journalist...) is probably black, as he mentions something like "I wouldn't be in this position". And if he would have played CoJ a while longer he would have seen that the Civil War is just a setting for the action, not the action itself, which takes place in Mexico. Where you kill Indians and Mexicans... Anyway, dumb article was dumb, as most of the "racist" or "sexist" ones are.

    I wonder how much equality can you get in your surrounding when you play the "the game MAN is keeping us down" card
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 14:15

  • Vice.Destroyer #58 3 years ago

    @monkeywithnoeyes

    Well. Wowser. I'm still not convinced that you understand what it means to not have equal rights for black people. I remember my uncle telling me that when he first arrived in London, it was quite common to have signs in B&B's, saying that they wanted no dogs, no irish, no blacks. Disproportionate stop and searches. Unfair employment practices. I can't believe you'd want the clock to be turned back in that way, because a (tiny) proportion of people have had the audacity to offend your world view with their complaints.

    For the record, I couldn't care less. And the accusations of racism are getting tiresome and a little embarrassing. But language like that doesn't help.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #59 3 years ago

    @skillian
    What was wrong with the last 2 paragraphs? racism means discriminating against a race of people by placing them in a negative light. Race does not equal skin colour. And theres no denieing that the cliched "bad guy/enemy/villan" is English. The English are a race.. just as the scottish, welsh, germans ect..regardless of sharing the same skin tone.

    And i mentioned it to show just how obserd, and to back how much of a double standard, with have with people so easily play the race card without much thought attached.

    RE was not racist. And L4D2 isnt racist. Its foolish to consider otherwise. And if the race card is so easily used then the alternative is just as obsurd... remove people of colour from video games - which surely is racist.

  • login_name #60 3 years ago

    To be honest, I can't think of anything more racist and insulting to the black American population than being called African-American. Why not just American?

    From now on I think I will call all caucasian Americans European-American.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #61 3 years ago

    @Vice.Destroyer
    We're talking about computer games in 2009. Not the history of discrimination.. which ofcourse was only too real. And yes i remember hearing of those signs too (we're irish).. but that has nothing to do with this. Allowing a passed history of discrimination to effect how you treat a race today is in itself discrimination. We should not be showing black people as any different in the year 2009..surely you must agree to this? and that means that they come with the same FAULTS as well.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #62 3 years ago

    @login_name
    Its not white people that have labelled them African-american. Its black people holding on to their identity after being "snatched" away from their home land.

    America's full of people looking for their identity.. which is why you have Italian-american, Irish- american.. ect

    Its only because we're so clouded by Political correctness than we look upon anything mentioning a person of colour negitively... due to being overly sensitive. And it is looking at it in a negative light. You would never of said "i cant think of anything more racist and insulting to the white american population as being called italian-american" would you? why not? its the same thing.. its still segregation

  • Vice.Destroyer #63 3 years ago

    @monkeywithnoeyes

    As I said, I care not about the issues that people have with the representation of black people in L4D2. Or RE5. I really couldn't care less. The reason I have been commenting on your posts is because I don't agree with your the context you are using the phrase 'Equal Rights'. As far as I am concerned, you are using it completely wrong. But it's all semantics. I understand the point you are making.

    And in all honesty, it's not something that bothers me one way or another. As you were.

  • JensonJet #64 3 years ago

    The journalist knows this game isn't racist... if it were, he knows it wouldn't have been him breaking the news to the world. An out and out racist game would have been spotted and attacked by all manor of establishments a long time before this journalist would have had a chance to play the game. As for poor taste, it could be argued any book, movie or game portraying violence is bad taste, but violence portrayed isn't half as distasteful as real life violence.

    This is a journalist attempting to make a bigger name for himself by airing what he considers a contraversial subject matter in a game. And he knows it'll work, to an extent. There'll be many uninformed, non-gamers, old people, parents of gamers that will hear of this story, and so the journalist has indeed upped his profile somewhat.

    The Western games industry is far from racist. While it may not employ as many black people than white it certainly represents black and white, male and female characters respectfully and proportionally. The industry is run by and employees intelligent people, who are far less likely to be racist or if so allow their personal feelings be known.

    I think there should have been more outcry aimed at Hollywood for profiteering from the twin tower attacks by making millions producing films directly related to those terrorist attacks. I think every gamer or intelligent sensible person would stand by Valve. They chose a city who's architecture and style interested them enough to want to portray it in their game. Anyone in their right mind understands a zombie story, whether in books, films or games is purely fictional, and as a horror subject is impossible to be pulled into the racist row. Had Valve set the game in the aftermath of the hurricane and suggested that that's what turned the locals into zombies, then there would have been an outcry and understandably so, but it's not the case.

    In future, I think the games industry will have to have journalist sign a form that states that they understand the product is a piece of fictional entertainment and although based on real locations, the characters portrayed are completely fictional and do not represent actual people. I guess the industry is mainstream and popular enough to warrant those stupid messages we see at the end of movies stating such facts... and that no animals were harmed in the making! ...just for the uninformed, self-promoting journalists of the world.

  • login_name #65 3 years ago

    You would never of said "i cant think of anything more racist and insulting to the white american population as being called italian-american" would you?

    Yes I would.

    I also happen to know a few black Americans that hate the label - African-American. They are American. That's how they see themselves, that's how they want others to see them. They can't stand the term. They're about as African as I am. Black folk from the UK are not referred to as African-English or African-Welsh. It's just English or Welsh.

  • UncleLou #66 3 years ago

    While I think the whole "L4D is racist" claim is nonsense, I don't follow the "it's fictional" argument. What has that to do with anything? You could easily make a zombie , science-fiction or fantasy game/book/film that is racist (and in a more subtle way than using the n* word for black actors). In dictatorships,to make a somewhat similar example, people hide their critical views in science-fiction stories to fool official censorhsip boards, hoping they are too stupid (and they often were and are) to see the real message.
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 15:12

  • monkeywithnoeyes #67 3 years ago

    @Vice.Destroyer
    well i've told you how i was using the term "equal rights".. and it was kept in context of the rest of the post. You singled it out and removed it from that context. Which is a shame. As it was talking about discrimination.. and discrimination is treating one race differently from the other. So if i'm able to kill white people in a game playing as a black guy then its completely foolish to cry racism when i can kill black people playing a white guy in that games sequal.

  • Vice.Destroyer #68 3 years ago

    @Monkey.

    When did you tell me that you changed the definition of 'Equal rights'? Regardless, you can't just change the definition of specific phrases. That only causes confusion. But, like I said. nevermind.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #69 3 years ago

    @login_name

    Yes i'm sure you're outraged at the "racism" of the irish-american community being labelled irish american. And even more outraged when that community money pumped into it to support st patricks day. And i dare say more enraged at the racism when America singles out blacks by funding Martin luther king day.

    The whole point of African-americans being freed from the slave trade was to allow them their own identitys back, to change their names from their western "slave name" to their african ancestery. Its black people that fought for their identity as African-americans.. regardless of how your black friends feel about the term.

    We dont have the same in England because in England we lable ourselves as BRITISH. The term "English" has sadly become a dirty word..and feared in the media. Which is why the english press will ALWAYS without fail refer to an english person as british.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #70 3 years ago

    @vice
    How did i change the definition of equal rights? maybe you should explain just how my using the term in the context i did offended you?

  • IronCladChicken #71 3 years ago

    Bill's encapsulated review?

  • JensonJet #72 3 years ago

    login_name. I agree, I hate that the term 'African American'. But while it's an illogical term to the British, or probably any other nation on the planet, it's purely part of the language of America. In England it was once correct to refer to black people as 'coloured'. The term is unacceptable now. To me it's like white English people being referred to as English and the black population here being called Black-English. It's as wrong as it sounds. Why your skin colour is referred to when stating the country you come from is deemed important is beyond me. To me it's a constant reminder of racism. In terms of racism America is where England was in the late 70s, early 80s.

    I guess the history of the 'African American', 'Irish American', 'Italian American' descriptions spawn from the lack of history of the country. It's easy to forget in terms of history and age, America is but an infant! Obviously I'm not denying it's size and wealth, but certainly it's attitude and understanding often show it's true colours.

    What amazes me is that with such a high profile use of the word 'African', that the country deems helping one of it's mother countries in terms of freeing trade laws, and helping violent conflicts such a low priority. Financial aid quickly frees the conscience, but is just a veneer for the bigger issues. And it seems being a black dictator frees you from the wrath of America, unlike being an Asian or Arab one!

  • Vice.Destroyer #73 3 years ago

    @Monkey
    Whoa, whoa, whoa. Let's be clear. I am not offended by anything that you have said. It takes a lot for me to get offended. Especially by an anonymous poster on a website. As far as I am concerned, the phrase "equal rights" means that every person is to be treated equally by the law. For you to be throwing it around the way you were, meant something very different to me. You can think how you want, say what you want and it means nothing to me. Absolutely nothing. Even when you post something so bafflingly wrong like "The whole point of African-americans being freed from the slave trade was to allow them their own identitys back, to change their names from their western "slave name" to their african ancestery." All it does is make me drop my jaw and shake my head. But it does not offend me. Eurogamer taught me a long time ago that there are people around with very unique viewpoints.

  • monkeywithnoeyes #74 3 years ago

    @Vice

    Its pretty clear you ignored the rest of the writing on post 54 and singled out the comment about equal rights. "As far as I am concerned, the phrase "equal rights" means that every person is to be treated equally by the law" - i dont believe in ANY of my posts here i've said anything different? Infact all my posts to YOU have been saying how the same.

    58 "So if in RE 1-4 i'm killing white "zombies" in towns where the majority population is that of the skin tone white. Then it should come as no surprise that i be killing black "zombies" in towns where the majority population is that of the skin tone black"
    64 "Allowing a passed history of discrimination to effect how you treat a race today is in itself discrimination. We should not be showing black people as any different in the year 2009"

    I used the term equal rights in the context of THIS NEWS STORY. Which is about A GAME.

  • skillian #75 3 years ago

    A guy at work hates the term African-American simply because his family aren't originally from Africa, they are from Jamaica!

    But yes, it's true that we look at the racism debate with very different eyes than the Americans. And what seems like pointless bickering over here can be serious business over there.
    Edited by 1 at 31/07/09 @ 16:02

  • Vice.Destroyer #76 3 years ago

    I homed in on that comment because you said that they should "Remove black people from games.. as they're obviously not ready for equal rights"
    I didn't comment on the rest of your post at 54, not because I didn't read it, but because the last two paragraphs made me think we are not on the same wavelength at all. But the passage I highlighted, I just wanted you to explain further. I didn't see how you could justify removing equal rights for black people because some people complained about the depiction of black people in a videogame?

  • benstarkie #77 3 years ago

    What it all comes down to is you have far more Fast-twitch muscle fibres

  • login_name #78 3 years ago

    @monkeywithnoeyes

    Who said anything about being outraged? Does everything in this world only have 2 speeds - "off" and "fuck me my face has melted!"? Can't I just feel a term used is dumb and racist without being outraged? Is that not possible now?

    The whole point of African-americans being freed from the slave trade was to allow them their own identitys back, to change their names from their western "slave name" to their african ancestery.

    Here was me thinking the whole point of freeing the slaves was to allow them freedom. To be treated as human beings as opposed to animals or commodities. I'm pretty sure concerns over names and labels came a little further down the line. In fact, during the 70s I'm pretty sure the motto was "Black is Beautiful" and it wasn't until sometime in the 80s that the term African-American became popular.

  • frankfurter209 #79 3 years ago

    This is hilarious and so predictable. Like that other dude said, everything is racist.

  • giant_frying_pan #80 3 years ago

    If anything, demanding that the number of black zombies in the game be reduced or eliminated is itself highly racist because it shows a belief that black people should be immune from the zombie virus, when it's actually a quite non-discriminatory afflication.

    Although if the people that cry racist here want to believe that blacks are some sort of master race immune to things that strike other ethnicities down with zombie fever, then that's their own prejudices showing through and they should keep it to themselves.

  • hiddenranbir #81 3 years ago

    I thought he was gonna say racist cause one of the characters talks like Bubba and how his grandmomma said this and that. Sort of the stereotype of how a black man behaves in N'arleens.

  • TRUTH #82 3 years ago

    So it's okay for a black guy to shoot white people?????...Look it's a game with NO racial geography. This dumb ass is simply looking way to deep and trying to get publicity and then end up earning money. DROP DEAD YOU THICK RACIEST - WHO PROBABLY IS IN REAL LIFE>

  • Ryze #83 3 years ago

    Not racist at all, but perhaps a little insensitive taking into account the recent tragedy that took place in New Orleans.

    Perhaps we'll be doing the job of clearing the undead in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina in L4D2.

  • cyber_nicco #84 3 years ago

    @penhalion

    "feel free to -1 me all you like :| "

    It only lets me do it one time...

  • davisorle #85 3 years ago

    I hate racism etc wa too much. Sickens me. But this thing about the game is pure bullshit if you ask me.

    They should start bitching about RE5 ( racism ) and also about each video game that we love to much since they tend to be based on real life situations, facts and events ( wars or not ) and come to think of the ppl that lost their parents and family in each of those events and the people that get slaughtered or bombed on each of your favorite WW* game..

    lol Now they wanna be crying about the games again for racism and dissrespect to the places and people struck by facts in the past? ( with all respect to them and not to the ones bitching right now but ) BULLSHIT.

    peace.-

  • JaysonG #86 3 years ago

    N'Gai had a point about RE5. But I don't see any racist undertones in L4D2 at all. The only issue I can see is maybe a survival horror game so soon after Katrina (which was actually a while ago now, how the most powerful nation on earth can leave one of her city's in such disarray is a question for another day) is in bad taste (like that 'shock and awe' game or the canned Iraq FPS). But the journalist in question must have felt uncomfortable about what he saw, noticed some black people and made an incorrect assumption.

    Lazy journalism like that is annoying though as the next time an issue like this comes up it'll all be tarred with the same brush. Even if like with RE5 the person has a point.

  • Caimbeul #87 3 years ago

    "Does this mean we'll never see any more movies set in NY because of the 9/11 attacks" ...and london because on 7/11 et. Soon we will not be able to have games set anywhere. What about WW games? Games set in Iraq, Afganisthan etc? and the whole racist thin...well do you only get black people in New Orleans then and not anywhere else in the US?

    All very silly if you ask me. Attention seeking journalist.

  • Notez #88 3 years ago

    Ohh, all the insensitivity in the world of mature entertainment... If anything, games need to be more "racist" (by which I mean the developers need to have some balls if they are making a killing game in the first place).

  • SEVQA #89 3 years ago

    I remember a time when political correctness stood for: One eyed, Muslim, spastic homo!

  • Retroid #90 3 years ago

    GEORGE BUSH DOESN'T CARE ABOUT ZOMBIES

  • dominalien #91 3 years ago

    If there is one game developer out there that means no offence, is composed entirely of nice guys and just wants to make good games without offending anyone, it's Valve

    Unless it's Sony, the PS3 and its users ;-)
    Edited by 1 at 02/08/09 @ 10:29

  • Spekingur #92 3 years ago

    Isn't this something like a 'bad taste' advertisement? Controversial statements to get into more news and get free advertisement?

    In any case, the biggest racists are normally those who enjoy pointing out that something is racist when it really isn't.

  • kissthestick #93 3 years ago

    this is what happens when there arent enough decent black characters in videogames in the 1st place, the mainstream market seems it as weird and unmarketable