L4D1 DLC pricing not Valve's decision

By Tom Bramwell Published 4 September, 2009

MS wanted "economy of value" on Xbox 360.

Valve's Chet Faliszek has told Eurogamer that upcoming downloadable Left 4 Dead 1 expansion Crash Course costs money on Xbox Live because Microsoft insisted upon it.

The Washington-based developer traditionally refuses to charge for DLC - as Robin Walker put it when we asked in May 2007, "You buy the product, you get the content" - and this explains why it's free on PC.

"We own our platform, Steam. Microsoft owns their platform. They wanted to make sure there's an economy of value there," Faliszek told Eurogamer today when asked about the 560 Microsoft Points (£4.76 / €6.72) price tag for Crash Course.

When pressed about whether Microsoft effectively enforced the pricing, Faliszek added: "Well, they helped us get the first one out for free. We had the one DLC out for free. And I think... they have to look and say, wow, we're kind of being unfair to everybody else if these guys can do that.

"It's not like we're [Valve is] looking at this as, 'Oh my god, we need some money, we're going to charge,' obviously, or we'd do it on the PC. So it's just kind of the way the system works right now."

Crash Course is an upcoming campaign for Left 4 Dead 1 that's been designed not exclusively but predominantly for Versus mode, which should allow fans of the competitive survivors-versus-infected mode to play through a game in 30 minutes rather than the two hours it sometimes takes with No Mercy, Dead Air, Death Toll and Blood Harvest, the original campaigns.

Faliszek also confirmed that it's still down for release in September, and said that no decision had been made about compatibility between it and Left 4 Dead 2 yet. Because Crash Course is specific to the L4D1 development base, whether or not it works with L4D2 is indivisible from the issue of whether the whole original game works with L4D2. If the first game is ever made to speak to the second, then so will Crash Course. Otherwise no.

Look out for our review of Crash Course as soon as it's out.

Picture of Tom.

About Tom Bramwell

Tom is Operations director of Eurogamer Network and Editor-at-Large of Eurogamer.net. He joined the company in February 2000.

Read more articles from Tom by visiting the Tom Bramwell archive page.

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Comments (39) 2 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • RobotRocker #1 2 years ago

    I suppose hes got a point. That and cert doesnt come for free. MS really does need to find a way to allow developers to release meaningful content at a price they prefer though. Even if free content is supplied with an advertising condition (I.e. This pack is brought to you by Coke Zero style packs) if some developers like valve absolutley insist on it.

  • Earlyflash #2 2 years ago

    If developers want to charge nothing for their content, then they should be allowed to. I can't see how this is being 'unfair' to anyone else. All developers should be allowed to set their own price points, then it's fair all round.

    Seems a little unfair to charge on one platform and not the other, especially when there is a premium for lauching content on the 360 already (licencing fees).

  • bad09 #3 2 years ago

    Valve: "Hey MS we got more DLC it's going for free again!"

    MS: "Free? On Live? AGAIN? No"

    Valve: "Why? we want to reward people who spent money with us, plus we are knocking out a sequel fairly quickly one this one expecting people to buy"

    MS: "Yeah but if you go around making yourselves look all caring and generrous what will the likes of Capcom and EA do? How will they rape the arse off games by selling costumes and other unimportant stuff that adds nothing to the game?"

    Valve: "Well surely it's their problem if they want to abuse DLC and rip off consumers?"

    MS: "No, on Live we at MS try to make them look super friendly awesome 'cos we get a cut of the loot you see. Now L4D is a popular game so we.....er..you and us will make lots of loot. Now CHARGE the bastards!"


    A few months later.....

    Bad09: "Hmmmm....why am I paying for whats free elsewhere? I've got a new PC, I think L4D2 will be a PC purchase....."
    Edited by 3 at 04/09/09 @ 07:56

  • byakuya83 #4 2 years ago

    Live users are already being charged a fee to use the online service and updates/patches can be downloaded free of charge, this is just greedy. Difficult position for Valve, risk alienating their own fans/customers by not releasing the DLC or risk alienating them by allowing Microsoft to charge a premium for it. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
    Edited by 1 at 04/09/09 @ 08:10

  • mcbi4kh2 #5 2 years ago

    Why can't they release it as an "update" instead of DLC, if thats what they really want to do?

  • TheMoonRat #6 2 years ago

    All updates, whether an expansion or patch, goes through Microsoft for certification. There is no way to pull the wool over their eyes over what the update is. If they say they won't pass its certification unless the content is charged for, well, they're the platform holders, you have to do what they decide.

  • mcbi4kh2 #7 2 years ago

    Oh.

  • swissorc #8 2 years ago

    Typical money whore microsoft not that it effects me as I don't own the game but this and the avatar market place they should be ashamed of themselves but they're not. Not sure how much it is the same on Home but I was of the understanding that stuff in Home is free or do they have "premium" content too ?

  • metalangel #9 2 years ago

    Oh yes, poor Valve, wanted you to have the DLC for free but no qualms about gouging you for the "sequel" coming out a year after the original!

  • RedSparrows #10 2 years ago

    Swissorc - you do realise the Avatar Marketplace is even more so than DLC, a simple 'don't buy it if you don't want to'. Sure, it'd be nice if MS were a little less money grabbing, but you have customer discretion - I dobut you sincerely desire anything from the Avatar Marketplace, so don't act as if MS is forcing it on you. It's not. DLC is a different matter, given it might be for a game you adore.

  • Zomoniac #11 2 years ago

    Not sure how much it is the same on Home but I was of the understanding that stuff in Home is free or do they have "premium" content too ?

    Well, playing Home is free, but if you want to buy anything it costs a LOT. £1.49 for virtual shoes? Over a fiver for an outfit?

  • PlugMonkey #12 2 years ago

    "But if Valve really wanna give it away, why not just slap some arbitrary price on it, like 10 MS Points?"

    At a guess, MS make a percentage on DLC sales. I don't think a percentage of 10 MS points is quite what they're after.

    "Bad09: "Hmmmm....why am I paying for whats free elsewhere? I've got a new PC, I think L4D2 will be a PC purchase....."

    Which is exactly what Valve want you to do. They are giving away content for free to promote a service they own. This isn't exactly a scandal. It seems like a fairly standard business practice to me.

    "Oh yes, poor Valve, wanted you to have the DLC for free but no qualms about gouging you for the "sequel" coming out a year after the original!"

    This is a particularly bizarre gamer whinge that I just don't understand at all. A sequel to a game people like is coming out and so they're complaining because it's coming out too soon. HOW DARE YOU BRING ME MORE OF A GAME I LOVE VALVE! I HATE YOU! I WISH I'D NEVER BEEN BORN!

  • Darren #13 2 years ago

    The fact that Microsoft insist on charging for this DLC on the 360 when it's free on the PC should come as no surprise to anyone... after all they're the only corporation to charge their console owners to play games online.

  • skillian #14 2 years ago

    They are giving away content for free to promote a service they own.

    They gave away content for free well before they owned any services. Just like loads of other games companies did at the time, and some still do today.

    This is not a promotion to try and move people from Xbox to PC, they're just trying to get as many people playing as much of their games as possible.
    Edited by 2 at 04/09/09 @ 10:12

  • hiddenranbir #15 2 years ago

    Poor 360ers don't get to access community maps either, do they?

    :(

    They gave away content for free well before they owned any services. Just like loads of other games companies did at the time, and some still do today.

    When and what was it?

  • swissorc #16 2 years ago

    I appreciate that red sky it's just they launch these mii oops i mean avatars give bugger all customisation on them and then say hey want to do something with your avatar 2 pounds please where as ps3 guys get a virtual world to stomp around for free just stinks a bit. thats all but your right don't have to spend the money and wont only DLC i have ever had off xbox live are free for GRAW2, Halo 3 and GOW anyway
    Edited by 1 at 04/09/09 @ 10:28

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #17 2 years ago

    I think L4D2 will be a PC purchase

    If anyone's got a PC they've bought within the last 3 years, that's what they ought to do anyway. For a start, you'll probably save about 15 quid.

  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #18 2 years ago

    When and what was [free Content Valve gave away]?

    Team Fortress 1, Counter Strike, Day of Defeat... Prior to 2005, they were distributed by Valve as DLC for Half Life 1, for no money.

    Mind you, when they were just sent out on the internet for people to download, they weren't locked into anyone's rights-managed paid download service - either their own or Microsoft's.

  • Gecks #19 2 years ago

    PC games don't have a licensing cost to a console manufacturer in their margins, and for games sold through steam, valve get a cool 100% of the turnover. so it stands to reason that they get a higher return on each PC unit sold than each 360 one, right? i wouldn't be surprised if this is partially the reason they'd want to claw back some cash, regardless if microsoft basically force them to do it.

    for me L4D represented value for money at retail, and i'm not too bothered either way. i'm also not sure why anyone would really care about new campaigns as it's basically window-dressing to what is a fairly similar experience across the existing levels, thanks to the AI director.

  • dirk_aircool #20 2 years ago

    I've had several free downloads for games via XB live . both rainbow 6 games ( big downloads ) PGR games and quite a few others. So are MS picking on Valve or Has valve got the fient smell of BS about it ?.

  • miiiguel #21 2 years ago

    This is either BS or MS digs to pick on Valve. There's plenty of free DLC on Live, yes even to high profile games like FIFA; Fight Night; etc..

  • TeaFiend #22 2 years ago

    If people are downloading it, MS has to foot the bandwidth bill at the end. Everyone would love more for free, but costs do need to be recovered. And it looks like MS give values for DLC to cost based on what it is and how long it lasts, rather than the developer giving it a value (otherwise how many X99 point packages would there be, and then someone does it at X98 and so on?).

  • Freek #23 2 years ago

    Not entirely true is it. Because Burnout Paradise got substantial free DLC.

    In that case they had to do it, because it was free on PS3.

    Wich apparently means they don't see the PC as a competing platform, which is of course nonsense

    The rules are flexible and it all comes down to how much leverage you have over MS to force their hand, best way seem to be multi platform release. And since Valve don't develop for PS3, we get screwed.

  • prometheus3k #24 2 years ago

    There are also filesize restrictions on DLC, hence no UT3 Titan Pack. I have 360, PS3 and PC and do like Live's infrastructure but honestly, it's only there to milk more money from players... for things that should be free. I also don't like the idea of being charged for Xbox live when PC users get the same service (Games For Windows Live) for free, because "PC users expect it".
    But hey, 360 has a large userbase, and they expect to be charged for multiplayer/content... apparently :s
    Edited by 1 at 04/09/09 @ 12:12

  • Xerx3s #25 2 years ago

    DLC can fuck off. These days it has just become a free ticket to ripping people off.

  • HoriZon #26 2 years ago

    DLC can fuck off. These days it has just become a free ticket to ripping people off.

    Like ODST then ? :p

    End of the day its how its been on the 360 it shouldn't i agree but its how it is and gamers pay for them so they wont stop it.

    I for one will buy it love the game and its only £4-ish my lunch today cost more than that!
    Edited by 1 at 04/09/09 @ 13:23

  • Bazfrag #27 2 years ago

    The dlc is less of a problem than the dufus's that buy it. If we stop now, then the 108kb unlock files will also stop. Most people don't know the are mainly paying for content thats already on the disk.

  • GamesConnoisseur #28 2 years ago

    Sure we have the right to questions MS in the content of subsription based live and pricing policy for dlc, however impressions of PS3 dlc being free after Disgaea 3 DLC of £40 which is a special offer?!!

    DLC can works but also open to abuses and gamers neec to wise up and vote with wallets. If Market is there and people happily pays for them hands over fists then hey who are we to questions them?!

  • cyber_nicco #29 2 years ago

    Well, just a small point in Microsoft's defense - they do pay for the servers, bandwidth, etc. to make the download available to even non-paying Live! customers...

    That being said, it seems like there should just be a flat fee of some sort - maybe 125 pts to host "free" downloadables. Or maybe free for Gold members...

  • metalangel #30 2 years ago

    @Plugmonkey: Then let me help you understand. It's a multiplayer game, those have a much longer lifespan than singleplayer games and can last you for years. Therefore, bringing out a new version that won't work with the old one within a year is just greedy. That's why Epic offered a huge discount to UT2003 owners who bought UT2004.

  • actionfitz #31 2 years ago

    "economy of value"

    or...
    Economy of The Shaft, as I prefer to call it.

  • PlugMonkey #32 2 years ago

    @metalanget

    If that was supposed to help me understand, it went a little wide of the mark. What? Everyone else isn't allowed a sequel because you're not done with the old one yet?

    L4D being multiplayer had nothing to do with anything. It's a game which I bought and have had dozens of hours entertainment from - although recently interest among my friends has been waning as we keep playing the same characters, scenarios, weapons, enemies and mechanics over and over and over. Bring on the sequel. We're ready for it. If, by your grace, you will allow it.

    Bringing out a sequel to a game isn't greedy when it has the content to jusify it. You know what's greedy? Buying a game, getting dozens of hours of entertainment out of it, and then bitching because someone isn't giving you dozens more hours of entertainment out of it for free.

    The other thing I love is when video game consumers refer to something hugely technically challenging as if it's just the developers being lazy. "What do you mean L4D2 isn't compatible with L4D? Why don't they just press the big MAKE COMPATIBLE WITH L4D button on the side of their kit?".

  • hiddenranbir #33 2 years ago

    Team Fortress 1, Counter Strike, Day of Defeat... Prior to 2005, they were distributed by Valve as DLC for Half Life 1, for no money.

    Weren't they community made mods before Valve got a hold of them? (Minus TFC?)
    Edited by 1 at 05/09/09 @ 17:30

  • mukki #34 2 years ago

    evil M$!!
    curious to see if this will be available in Germany in English... or at all available...
    or will I have to login into my fake UK account to buy it...
    not that I end up DLing the German version and all the zombies are going yaaaayaaaaa!
    ok sorry had probs with a German fallout 3 DLC in an English game...

  • Nephirion #35 2 years ago

    Is anything " Free " on Live these days

  • Retroid #36 2 years ago

    There's always 'sponsorship' for DLC, as has been done in the past for Gears of War. That's how a good few of the freebie themes on US Live are there, they're sponsored by Best Buy or somesuch.

    I can see both sides but as I consumer I have to come down on the "it's Valve's content, let Valve decide" side of the fence. There are plenty of pisstakers for DLC like EA and Capcom already, and that should be their problem, not ours.

  • gmjapan #37 2 years ago

    If you already pay to use the Live service then free shit like this should be free.
    Even if you werent paying for the Live service then free shit like this should be free.
    Personally, I dont give 2 hoots about DLC adding to games, i buy based on what I'm getting at the time. Theres no such thing as a promise when money is involved.

  • pot #38 2 years ago

    Steam works great. Just hurry up with HL2: Episode 3 already, damn!

    LOL @ people bringing up HOME like it is some great thing. It is shit! And was deleted from my PS3 long ago. Sony charges real money for clothes, houses and more in HOME. They also charge for premium themes and other stuff just like MS does. They both do it as they are a for profit business. Such a shock.

  • pot #39 2 years ago

    Saucymonk, there is also quite alot of free content on LIVE as well. Tons of videos, themes, demos, etc etc. Same as the PS3, there is free stuff and things that cost money.