World of Warcraft Comments by Ellie Gibson

Only £8.99/month? I was finding it easier to resist when I thought it was £14.99 :(

*sigh*

No doubt I will be making my first character within the week now. Goodbye social life!

I hope they do make a X360 version, so there is at least one MMPORPG I can play alongside the missus.

That's all great, guys but please get inter-account character transfers going. Yeah, I know two people aren't supposed to share the same account according to the T's & C's but out here in the real world that happens. A lot.

I want shot of my missus' Level 60 Druid onto her account so I can get a turn on mine. :)

Biggest concern of the moment is the growing imbalance between raiders and non-raiders which effects every aspect of the game, the lack of meaningfull PvP and the ongoing everquest-ifying of a game that was supposed to be friendly to casual players but isnt the moment you hit end game.

ellie, you're the same as aleks when it comes to social online issues, i think wow are perfectly correct to say, these arent game world issues. because they shouldnt be.

We're told that the gentlemen we're about to interview, WOW producer Shane Dabiri and operations man John Lagrave, can't comment on the allegations of racism and anti-gay discrimination, since they are entirely responsible for the technical side of things.

It would be nice to see this and topics like it discussed more. Perhaps EuroGamer interviewing other industry figures to talk about video game ethics? I'd certainly welcome that. Rob's social responsibility article on GI is the sort of thing I'd champion more of.

Inter-account character transfer will never happen.

It would just make it far too easy to sell pre-buffed chars specced out with uber epix.

Did they say anything about giving Level 15 Dwarf paladins any gold?

agree with El_MUERkO, for a lot of people the most enjoyable part of the game is level 1 to 59. I know quite a few people that get to level 45 or 50 and then just start a new char.

Inter-account character transfer will never happen.

It would just make it far too easy to sell pre-buffed chars specced out with uber epix.

They've said before that it's on the cards. They suggested that to protect against the exact case you're postulating there would be a transfer fee and a limit of a single transfer from any given account.

Sure, I suppose there are possibilities for abuse in all sorts of ways but given Blizzard's stance and performance in this regard in the past I'd trust them to handle it well. And it's not as if WoW has a shortage of crap players anyways, so a few that buy their way to 60 aren't likely to stand out too much. ;)

Stickman: Sorry, only Lvl 14 and below get 1000000gold, Lvl 15 plus characters get a donkey.

"Lvl 15 plus characters get a donkey."

sorry, the role of annoying talking animal sidekick is already taken.

actually, I have a relevant question for once. I confess up front that I'm not a MMORPG player, for assorted reasons, not least because our only non-console games platform is a MAC (girl fiends choice, not mine). But this end game thing - if levels 1-59 are enjoyable, why does it all go tits up at level 60? And if (as I understand it) WOW levels top out at 65, isn't 60 levels out of 65 a pretty good average? I can think of a good many games where at least one level in 12 is pretty annoying... Is the problem that by this time the xp requirements are so great that actually getting though 5 levels takes as long as the preceding 50 (rather like the grind to get to Elite, for those that remember it...)?

sorry, probably being thick, but genuinely interested...

Although WoW sounds WicKeD, 15 bucks a month is more then any game can justify.

The fact that guild wars (and it is not the only one) can existe without a monthly fee proves that.

I dont expect to pay tech supprort juste to play a game....

>_> I prefer everquest 2

The "end game" is when characters reach the level cap which is currently Level 60. Because no more XP is awarded, much of the incentive to undertake quests is removed. Also, quest rewards become less desirable simply because the chances are you have already found/won/bought the gear you want.

This only leaves one major activity: raiding for epic gear. This usually necessitates groups of 8-40 people; a lot of planning; a lot of dedication; and a lot of grinding the same instances again and again and again. This is in stark contrast to the way the game has been to that point (exploring new and diverse regions, taking on interesting quests solo or in small groups, etc.).

Now to give Blizzard their dues, they do add new end game content (like the faction rewards, Battlegrounds, upgraded areas like Silithus) but it's still a definite shift away from the tone of the game to that point.

For most people that can't face or aren't interested in the end game, the solution is either quit playing or simply roll another character and start over.

Although WoW sounds WicKeD, 15 bucks a month is more then any game can justify.

The fact that guild wars (and it is not the only one) can existe without a monthly fee proves that.

I dont expect to pay tech supprort juste to play a game....

5 million subscribers beg to differ. I really wish people would stop comparing Guild Wars to WoW or other MMORPGS. GW is a great game, but it's not a proper MMORPG.

thanks Phattso. kinda sounds like the malaise that's afflicted RPGs since Gary Gygax. D&D tried to get round it by encouraging you to build your own kingdom and the whole thing turned into a tedious resource management exercise tacked onto the end with shonky rules...

"We also provide 24-7 customer service..."

Last time I looked it was 9-5 5days a week, with in-game petitions taking up to a day.

It's 10:30 to 8pm 4 days a week, 10:30 to 7pm on friday.

My mistake

so according to him, all those suckers paying £9 a month for WoW are paying for tech support that they never use? i can't imagine anyone who plays WoW calls up tech support to the value of £9 every month... guild wars for me thanks.

stoopidgreg - never was there a more apt username.

awww, really? I'd always kinda assumed that you were a little pencil sketch with skinny little arms and legs and a big white head, a bit like the Saint's logo.

/is disappointed :-)

The problem with the lvl 60 'end game' stuff (for me anyway) is simply that with a job, a house, 2 kids etc etc I really don't have time to spend 5 - 7 hours farming instances (dungeons) for the odd piece of good kit.

Plus most of the group's that go there tend to start at like 2200hrs on a weeknight, and when you get up at 0530 for work it's just not an option.

Another thing, which is absolutely nothing to do with Blizzard, is that most high level guilds expect you to have some kind of voice software (like Ventrillo) when you do a high lvl instance, and sitting plugged into a headset for 7 hours is not exactly my idea of looking out for my family :/

Overall, I'd like to see some lvl 60 stuff where you can jump in for a couple of hours, maybe even some solo'able lvl 60 quests for good items.

Otherwise, I'm doomed to see lvl 60 as my time to keep starting new characters (which is exactly what I am doing now after taking my first warrior to lvl 60).

It's a quality game, and In terms of hours played per pound spent it's probably the most value as well. It's does get a bit boring at level 60 particually because there's very little you can do without getting together groups of 30+ players. I'd like to see some mini games (say like shooting gallery in RE4) at the darkmoon fayre with rewards for good scores, just something that you can dip into and not spend hours on.

[I]It's just that suddenly a lot of people showed up - sort of like when you're at a party and suddenly 15 people walk through the door and they all want a drink. It's like, "Well, I'll get that to you, but it's going to take a bit of time,"[/I]

call the fucking annology police this fuckers serving time!

This is a party you sold tickets for and said it would go off without a hitch! An each time I goto the bar I have to wait for an hour! An this party is every night for a year now and you still aint got the right number of staff servin so I get a drink in good time at the bar! The amount your raking in you should be ashamed there's any problems at all never mind brush shit off like a joke :P

What I can say to those that have a pretty full life outside of the game (and this includes me, too - full time job with overtime; missus and house waiting for me; etc. etc.) is that a good Guild can make all the difference.

For example, I joined one recently with an active forum outside the game that makes planning effective instance runs a breeze. I can't go every night. In fact, once a week would be pushing it. But I've been able to suggest a time and date that works for me, and then get other guildies (some in the same boat as I) to sign up.

What it means is that I can get some good game time in, on my terms, and with the chance for an epic drop. Personally I play for fun rather than gear anyway, but at least this way my character is still making progress through the end game and I'm not reduced to grinding faction solo or playing a lowbie I've created.

And it means I'll be more prepared for the push to Level 70 when The Burning Crusade lands. ;-)

@Phattso

What server do you play on? Not Stormreaver by any chance? Your Guild sounds like the sort of one I'm looking for hehe

Nope, Shadowsong I'm afraid. :)

Bribe us with epixx to move! Oh yes!

guild wars is as much an MMO as phantasy star online, in that the cities act like big lobbies and the actual play sessions are instanced, player hosted.

Why would anyone let the raids of the "endgame" keep them from playing the very playable game from 1 to 60? Just stop playing when your character hits the level cap, and go play something else. Or even a different race/class combination from 1.

Why would anyone let the raids of the "endgame" keep them from playing the very playable game from 1 to 60? Just stop playing when your character hits the level cap, and go play something else. Or even a different race/class combination from 1.

No offense, but have you levelled a character up to 60? It takes, literally, months. You get attached to the character, the style of play, the accumulated gear, etc. etc. To suddenly hit an arbitrary dead-end in a real time evolving game world is quite harsh.

The point isn't that there are no other options (such as restarting); the point is that Blizzard always made a song and dance about how the game wouldn't die out for the casual player once the level cap was reached. But it did. :) So here I am with my Level 60 Dwarf Hunter (Gravven) and nothing much for him to do. OK - I've gotten lucky with a guild, but the same isn't true for everyone.

The point of an MMORPG is that your character evolves as your experience in the game world evolves - that isn't the case for a lot of people post-60. It's not like a single player game that has a conclusion. It's not so easy to just walk away from the character you've invested so much effort in.

"awww, really? I'd always kinda assumed that you were a little pencil sketch with skinny little arms and legs and a big white head, a bit like the Saint's logo."

I am! It's just his contains the description - 'stoopid', and an actual name - 'greg', whereas mine, by definition, is just description. Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got a busy day on Googlefight ahead...

Psi:

Christ, he was just explaining what 'concurrency' meant. The whole point of them doing the interview was to tell people they're doing something about it.

And Giajin: WoW does of course run on the Mac (and very well too).

guild wars is as much an MMO as phantasy star online, in that the cities act like big lobbies and the actual play sessions are instanced, player hosted.

Which is exactly my point why it isn't a real MMORPG, and why you can't compare it to something like WoW. The cities are lobbys, but the real game isn't "MM", hence the comparison is a bit pointless, and even unfair, as they obviously won't have even a tiny fraction of the costs a game like WoW has.

@Wabe

yeah, I know, thanks. It just doesn't run on *our* mac, and the old upgrade wrangle just goes on and on - "well, it runs all the packages I need for work, and you've got the Playstation..." "it's an X-BOX" "... ok, X-Box thingy to play games on. Why do you need to play games on the computer? The computer's for work, and it runs all the..." etc etc etc ad nauseam.

after resubscribing to WoW after quitting last August I'm shocked at how badly the servers are running with constant lag issues compared to last year.

It is pretty shocking when I think about how much money Blizzard are bringing in each month.

Which is exactly my point why it isn't a real MMORPG, and why you can't compare it to something like WoW. The cities are lobbys, but the real game isn't "MM", hence the comparison is a bit pointless, and even unfair, as they obviously won't have even a tiny fraction of the costs a game like WoW has.

----

How does that work? I bet it takes the same amount of CPU time if not more per player on a guild wars server. Rather than one game world being hosted the servers are having to host thousands upon thousands of instances at once. AFAIK NCsoft did not take the instancing route to save money; but to make a more balanced MMO.

And as far as I'm concerned Guild Wars is massively multiplayer.

Blizzard should be ashamed that they charge £8 a month and still have problems. Guild wars offers streaming content, pretty good uptime and good tech support for free. How does that work?

Unclelou - WoW has instances too.. both are massively multiplayer or does over a million players not count as massively multiplayer to you?
;)

(both good yet different games. thats all)

(both good yet different games. thats all)

I've said that all along! :)

Phattso - you really know what you're talking about and your descriptions took the words right out of my mouth. My girlfriend and I have been playing since beta, now on our 3rd set of chars. A good guild does indeed make all the difference, our current one is great - complete with an 8 year old player, his mum and dad AND his granny and grandad. Now THAT is broad appeal.
Anyone who begrudges 9 quid a month for it simply hasn't played it or is a social retard. Anyone who begrudges the huge ammount of your free time it inevitably consumes may have a fair point however... :)

"stoopidgreg - never was there a more apt username."

that was really lame. ignored.

stoopidgreg; That was lame indeed. ^^

masterson; I have tried it and to be honest I don't think it is anywhere near as good as Guild Wars. For PvP there is no other MMO which even comes close, and as far as PvE is concerned Guild Wars just offers the best experience for me. And dare I say it again, it is free, offers constant free updates and damn good tech support. I don't see how Blizzard can justify £8 a month from 5 million players and still offer sub standard services.

I don't see how Blizzard can justify £8 a month from 5 million players and still offer sub standard services.

Well, let me put this to you. I've never been offered a sub-standard service. My server suffers, at worst, queues of two or three minutes and the down time is regularly scheduled (Wednesday mornings) for maintenance. Not that others aren't having problems, but just to gently remind folks that it's far from the majority.

I don't see £8 a month exhorbitant considering what I get out of it (£2 a week? who'd notice?) and it offers an experience that, for me at least, isn't bettered anywhere else. 40-person raids into Zul'Gurub? Yes please. The whole server (Horde and Alliance) working together and contributing items to the war effort to unlock the Gates of Ahn Quiraj? Yes please. :)

And before anyone asks, yes I also own Guild Wars. Yes it's a good game. And no it doesn't come close to giving me the WoW experience that has really been a natural fit for my gaming styles (post-60 notwithstanding). ;)

it's £9 a month, btw.

i know some (well, 5 million) people are fine with paying such a high premium for their digital drug of choice, but i _personally_ don't think it's worth it. i mean, when i buy a game i expect to only pay £30 and play it as much as i want. i could play it every day for a year and it would still cost £30. but with WoW you pay £30 plus £9 every month; that works out as £148 for a year. i mean, you could look at it as £2.25 a week, but it's still £148 a year. or you could just buy guild wars, play for a year, and buy something worth £148 at the end of the year.

"Drug of choice"? It's a game, pal - catch yourself on. :) Gaming is a hobby - whether it's me choosing to spend a few hours a week in Warcraft with some Geometry Wars 2 action on the side, or you playing whatever it is you play (I'm assuming you come here because you play games?) it's all just gaming.

Unless you're making an appaling and sweeping generalisation that all people who play MMORPG's can't go a day without logging on for a "fix"? In which case you've just lost whatever little credability you had to debate the subject.

Not your thing? No problem - good luck with whatever games float your boat. For me (after some 20 years of gaming) I'm lucky if there's three titles in an entire year worth my time. For World of Warcraft to provide me a few hours of gaming a week (work and family life allowing) is no mean feat, and is certainly deserving of the subscription fee compared to the utter dross that I see on the shelves week in and week out.

When I first had a butchers at WoW back in February '05, I thought "£25 plus £9 per month? Fuck *right* off". I had a quick go at a char I made on a mate's account and within the space of 10 minutes we were in the motor en route to PC World / Toys R Us to locate a copy. For £9 per month you really can get your coin's worth. I haven't once begrudged them the money, either, and I now pay for two accounts (I got one for the girlfriend in April). I like to think of it as buying Blizzard a pint each week.

But on that note, I *really* want Account-to-Account character transfers to happen. And soon. It's the usual tale; bloke lets his missus play his account 'cos saying "No, the EULA won't let me" is akin to saying "No, I'm a great big fairy", bird likes the game, bloke buys a 2nd copy, bird sneaks back onto bloke's account when he's working, suddenly both main chars are on the first account and are level 60 (and shoving for dominance).

It's not gonna be a big problem for eBay, despite what some folk think - as the system would create a huge paper trail. At the moment they have to buy an account, make the char and then sell an entire account off - now if they use the character transfer it'll make catching the bastards a bit easier. All they need to do is catch one character (In the same way they might now). Then they check every account that character has been through, and every account those accounts have sent to/from. And every account they have transferred to/from. That should enable the ability to automatically block every customer the originating account has ever had, plus any laundry accounts. Job done.
Having the service is gonna be more beneficial to customers *and* give 'em an extra fork to poke the eBayers in the arse with.

World of Wonga

'"Drug of choice"? It's a game, pal'

i know it's a game, but lots of people do get pretty addicted to it. i know a few people who used to play everquest far too much - like 16 hours a day. they would wake up at noon, play all day until 4 in the morning, go to bed and repeat that the next day. what i think is wrong with it is that companies who make games like this can exploit the unique addictiveness of MMORPGs and therefore charge them £9 a month.

So what you're saying is that you'd have no trouble with people getting madly addicted to WoW as long as they weren't paying cash for it? ;-)

I think it's wrong that anyone should have the time to play these things 16 hours a day. But maybe that's because I just paid my f*cking tax bill to the Inland Revenue last week and it still hurts. :)

I'm not in the bracket you're describing - I'm an adult with a career and a life. Gaming is my hobby, and one I'm more than happy to pay the subscription for in the case of WoW.

I'd prefer to think that Blizzard are catering for my needs as a gamer (on account of them being *dah dah daaaaah* a games developer) rather than some shady amoral gaggle of wankers that want to exploit a real addiction in the same way as (in an extreme example) the smoking cartels do. For me, the two couldn't be more seperate - for you less so. I'm happy to agree to disagree.

/hands over another £9. :)

Played WoW for about 2 months.

Not interrested in returning.