Haze not in HD, has 4GB install Comments by Robert Purchese

@Rash

What's that got to do with anything?
Sony aren't responsible for MGS4 or GT either and they're being hailed as the new saviours, much as Haze was until recently.

Arbiter, but..., but...,

"PS3 Only True HD Console?
13th Dec 2005, 20:40 GMT

According to SCE Studios President Phil Harrison: PS3 will be the only console available to provide playback of movies in an HD format (BluRay) and it will also be the only console to offer games in 1080P resolution. Click here for more details."

Can't you see, that, there's nothing "wrong" with PS3, the only thing it makes it a "funny system" is what was said before debut, at least for me.

@Arbiter - You're missing the point that both Microsoft and Sony have promoted high-definition gaming as one of the things that defines their new consoles from their previous ones. So can you blame people for getting upset when they've gone out and bought 768p or 1080p HDTVs to play their games on only to discover that they aren't even HD. IMO the whole HD thing is overrated, it's clear to me that neither the 360 nor PS3 can guarantee all games run natively in HD, no doubt we'll have to wait for their successors before that happens. If HD gaming hadn't been so heavily promoted then I'm sure no-one would have batted an eyelid at Haze running at 576p, it would have been a non-issue. However, the bland look of the game and lack of detail would still attract criticism I'm sure.

Yeah, 576p isnt such a big deal if the gameplay is amazing, that seems to be the SDFs reaction to this news (that and blaming Free Radical). But i think the real issue isnt about Haze being 576p and the difference the drop in resolution will make, the real issue is it's yet another exposure of Sony lies about all PS3 games being 1080p @ 60fps / the PS3 being an uber-graphics machine.

Seriously, GTA and now Haze, I cant believe such an alledged wonder-machine cant muster 720p on two of it's biggest titles.

Bloodkult, The attach rate on the other hand backs my theory. Those Wii's are being bought because of one game and that affordable price, otherwise they're gathering dust. Those HD systems will sell by the bucket load from Autumn onwards. I don't understand why this is such a surprise. The business end has always be the lead up to Christmas.

I remember the uproar when it turned out that Motorstorm and Resistance were to be 720p and NOT 1080p.

/Bakes some delicious roflcakes

edit: needed coffee

Haze will feature multiplayer matches for up to 16 players (including bots) across six different maps taken from the Campaign mode of the game. These matches can be played via LAN or online play, and can take place across three different game modes: Deathmatch, Team Deathmatch and Team Assault. players hosting matches can decide are the basic elements for the maps they'll play on. These cover everything from the game type that you play to the number of total players that will be on a map. You can also decide what the time limit and kill limit per round is (up to an hour of play and 100 kills or no kill limit at all), the autobalancing of teams and whether or not bots will take the place of humans. If you want, you can add up to 15 extra bots in a round to get some practice in the Deathmatch modes before you go online, and you can tweak their effectiveness between four different skill levels to give yourself a challenge. On top of this, you can adjust the rate that a player respawns into each round as well as the number of rounds you'll play.

Team Assault is an intriguing mode because it is a mode that tasks both sides with a set of objectives that they can carry out in any arrangement to in order to win the round. These non-linear objectives keep the mode fresh because players will constantly have to adjust their tactics in order to defeat their opponents. At the end of each match, players are greated with three separate screens. The first is a score screen that indicates who was playing, their number of kills and their number of deaths. The second screen is full of additional statistics that multiplayer fans would be intrigued by. Haze tracks everything that every player does in a round, including some pretty obscure stats, such as the amount of time you crouched in a match, the total number of bullets fired and even how long a player was alive in a match. All of these stats then translate into one of eleven awards at the end of the match. These cover everything from the Marksmanship award given to the most accurate player to the ignominious Lemming award for the most suicides.

Haze has been first reviewed by Famitsu and PSM Italy. The game received 34/40 in the famous Japanese magazine and stroke an astonishing 9/10 in PSM.

IGN

maybe it's not that messy, i'll give it a try and after that make up my mind, but from what i've seen, 4GB mandatory install, mediocre graphics and competent but not innovative gameplay... i'm afraid that these game will be average, just as every other shooter in the past 10 years (exception made to COD4 due to it's amazing multiplayer).

Such a shame - and seems so unneccessary, especially after all the delays :(

@Prodigy_BE

Why must you continually tell us that you used to be a games journalist? Why?

The resolution doesn't matter, and I could even turn a blind eye to the massive install size (though I don't approve).
It's just a pity the game isn't better. The demo was so painfully average.

Fwing, It's got everything to do with it. FR don't have the depth of experience, knowledge and time that the devs at Worldwide Studios do with the platform. Making comparisons like that aren't valid because the pool of knowledge varys from dev to dev, out side of Sony.

@miiiguel : Not to defend sub-HD games (or Sony), but they never claimed all PS3 games would run in 1080p. Quite a few PS3 games do run in 1080p... just not as many as we had hoped :(

PS3lol. Lets hope MGS4 can deliver the goods then. Its good that MGS4 is PS3 exclusive or else the PS3 only owners would cry over another comparison article. Lol. MGS4 might be the first PS3 exclusive that actually delivers on the promise. I personally prefer Ninja gaiden 2 but thats just a matter of personal taste.

'Rash, the other consoles are fighting over scraps, there's only one winner this gen, and it's Nintendo.
Its attach rates and even game library mean nothing, they make a profit on every bit of hardware sold, and they are selling by the metric fucktonne.

@Beano, but they did claim they would be the only. As a matter of fact, they implied (as long as they could...) that PS3 would be the "real next gen", and much better than everything else. That's what makes me ps3lol, every so often.
Other issues are the install thing which I dislike oh so much, the controler..., but those are details and minor stuff which 360 also has (a bit noisy).

Best. Thread. Ever.

We should all be playing happy games anyway...Lost Winds is out tomorrow!

@Rash

So how come Konami and Polyphony can do it? Or the Uncharted guys? By your measure all non-1st-party titles wouldn't perform well.
There are some clever guys at FRD. Maybe they just didn't have enough time. But if it takes too much time for developers to get the power out of the PS3 (unless they have deep pockets) then isn't this a flaw?

Either way I guess if the title performs well its due to the PS3 being a great machine and if it doesn't its because the developers suck?
Nice cop-out you have there.

Bloodkult, You think that Wii is going to last 10 years??? Not with that hardware it isn't. Beside's Wii sells because of Wii Sports. A system seller if you were in need of one.

@Beano

They did claim that their console was superior in every way expecially in the graphics department. And its pretty clear that isnt the case as of now. It probably never will be the case either ( trust me ).

"but they did claim they would be the only"

True - at that time MS didn't offer 1080p games or even supported 1080p output. Today only a few 360 games run in native 1080p. The rest is upscaled from 720p.


"They did claim that their console was superior in every way expecially in the graphics department. And its pretty clear that isnt the case as of now."

I agree... marketing hype WTF.


"It probably never will ( trust me )."

Why should I trust you?

You have a time machine? ;)

Fwing, It's not a cop out. CoD4 and Burnout Paradise were both 1st gen titles on PS3 and both performed equally if not better on PS3. If Haze, a console exclusive, can't deliver a similar level of technical achievement are you going to tell me it's because of the inability of the platform??? That's bull.

Rash, you think the PS3 and the 360 will!?

The rejection of the HD consoles all over the world means they'll be lucky to even survive this generation, have you seen the Japanese charts lately?
If your fancy console with a new GTA game can't outsell a console bundled with a non-game about balancing on cheap plastic board in the good ol USA you know you're fucked.

Bloodkult, There are many factors in play here. Needless to say we aren't going to cover them all on these pages. All I know is in terms of hardware, Wii can't last the distance.

I thought middle age was finaly catching up with me and that I was growing out of games...

...then I sold the PS3, bought a 360 and spent the whole weekend gaming. God bless you Xbox Live :)

Oh, and Haze is dull dull dull if the demo is anything to go by and lazy lazy lazy if this news is anything to go by

It doesn't even need to, the Wii and DS has made enough money for Nintendo to 'do a gamecube' two generations over with money to spare.

@Rash

COD4 and Burnout are from deep-pockets developers working on bankable IPs. They get the time and resources they need because they're guaranteed a return on the investment.
FRD aren't stupid but something has clearly gone awry. Like I say I think the PS3 is too complex to get the performance out of in the time-frame allowed to most small developers.

@richardiox - To be completely fair, both the 360 and PS3 have their share of sub-720p games... remember the 360's flagship title, Halo 3, ran at 1152x640 with NO anti-aliasing and PGR 3 was 600p too. ;)

However, when you look at multiformat games the PS3 does seem to suffer more than the 360 which leads me to suspect (and I add that this is just my own opinion as an owner of both machines) that perhaps Sony's machine really isn't as powerful as Microsoft's. Maybe it's because the PS3 is more complex, whatever, while the differences between the two machines are certainly not as pronounced as that of the PS2 and Xbox, it does seem to me that the Xbox again has the edge this generation as far as graphics go, thanks to the forward thinking behind ATI's Xenos chip. Or, again, perhaps it's just because it's an easier machine to code for.

Fwing, Haze was first shown as a multiplat new franchise for Ubisoft's portfolio. Since then it has seen at a least a delay and change status from multiplat to console exclusive. It's isn't a small budget game. I agree something has gone "awry", but not what you think. It's a dev issue. Let's just agree to disagree on this one because my minds made up.

Can you imagine what this game would have been like if it had been forced out on time?

@Xerx3s

"Better a low res game with loads of details and gameplay than a stale highres one."

I totally agree, as I'm sure most of us do, the only problem is we've already seen games that look and play wonderfully on these systems in a much higher resolution than Haze. Uncharted, Gears of War and others have proven that things can be done better, I think that's the beef really. I agree with you though, as in, I personally couldn't care less about resolution. I think this kind of thing really upsets the non-PC gamer more than anyone else. PC gamers have had "HD" gaming for so long that it's really not an issue. For the "next gen" console crowd, they see it as something that was promised and therefore must be delivered (and fair play to them).

Darren, Personally, I think it's a combination of better GPU, unified RAM and easier to develop for. Until dev's fully unearth the strength of PS3 I'm not convinced 360 is more capable in any other way.

@RexRunti - Running at 640x256 with no AA? :P

So the graphics have been discussed to death, on to more important things like when will we get the EG review?

@ Darren and Rash'

Actually, I'd put more money on Microsoft's dev support tools - I seem to recall loads of interviews from a couple of years back, whereby devs (third- and first-party) were really shouting about Microsoft's support; how the tools they gave them were not only comprehensive but easy to use and, more importantly, familiar and adaptable from what they already knew.

Spec-wise, I reckon PS3 and 360 are just about equal - I'd say the Cell is probably better at the pure maths (so ultra-physics heavy games would benefit), whereas the 360 has the better GPU and AA scaler. So it's basically a wash - in terms of hardware. The key difference, I think, really is the support from the two companies.

I think Sony have what I may dare to say is their 'typical' attitude - developers should be thankful they have been given just the opportunity to produce games on their precious console, with only the 1.5 party devs (Insomniac, Squenix, etc) given extra help and support tools and insider know-how. The Epic team asking for help with UT3 springs to mind over this. MS on the other hand, appear to have extended help and support to pretty much every team that's out there, meaning they have a greater sharing mentality about tips and tricks, etc.

Just a though, mind...

"The rejection of the HD consoles all over the world means they'll be lucky to even survive this generation, have you seen the Japanese charts lately?
If your fancy console with a new GTA game can't outsell a console bundled with a non-game about balancing on cheap plastic board in the good ol USA you know you're fucked."


But the only one making any money from the Wii's success is ninty, all the major devs make their money on PS2/3/x360

bioreit, If there was a prize for best hardware philosophy, then MS would certainly get it with their approach to 360. With PS3, because of it's unknown architecture, I have a curiousity is to see how the hardware can push creative devs that work to the system's strengths. Only then will we be able to make a fair comparison between the two systems. At the moment 360 has the advantage because devs can make the system sing, while they (rightly or wrongly) struggle on PS3.

I was watching Gamer TV at the weekend with my kid. It was a HAZE special and it did look tbh very average. I suspect Haze will appear on the xb360 as well as I did see a 360 in FRDs dev studio when that twat Rob was doing the rounds in the office.

That be said, pity for FRD. The ps3 is a fantastic machine but Haze will probably be on the 360 soon and look better with a 720 res.

I can't understand why, for some minds, an easier to code machine/system is a bad thing in comparision with the opposite...

I can watch 1080p movies with my PS3. that's not bad at all ;). Haze sucks anyway. no point in arguing about it. shame for the PS3 camp though. but hey.

+ spend my time playing COD4. I really have trouble quitting it. will there be a COD5 ? Post modern warfare? maybe pre-historic warfare, with clubs and all...

"will there be a COD5 ?"
Is already in development. It's by Treyarch, this time though...

miiiguel: Which minds are you referring to?

Played the demo, definately not buying.

@Rash' - At the risk of sounding pro-Xbox 360 (which I'm not), I'd say that while Microsoft might struggle to build reliable hardware, their tech bods certainly know how to make a good console packed with features. They proved it with the Xbox and they certainly managed to put together a decent successor, even if it is a bit crippled by the lack of a standard HDD IMO. Sony on the other hand, often give the impression that they've sat down and thought about what would be cool to include in a console, thrown everything into the mix and waited to see what came out! That's what the E3 2005 presentation seemed like. While I've no doubt the PS3 is very capable of producing many wonderful games, just as the similarly flawed PS2 was, there's no denying that it's an over complicated system to code for, just like its predecessor was. Ease of use just doesn't seem to exist at Sony HQ! LOL

Just make it 480p and put it on Wii. It'll play better than dual analogue anyway.

But really, 576p? That's just standard-def PAL with pro-scan... it speaks more of the inability of the supposedly HD consoles than the game itself, although the buzz for Haze is significantly negative at the moment.

LOLS3

Arbiter: I believe MS deserve kudos for their philosophy in delivering an architecture devs understand and tools to get them started on their games. On the other hand I agree the design and manufacturing of the hardware has been well below any electronic manufacturer's standard.

@vercetti102 - I have to say that I love my PS3 and, yes, it is capable of delivering stunning looking games that also play well as evidenced by Ratchet & Clank ToD, Uncharted and MLB 08: The Show but it seems that it takes a lot of hard work to achieve it and that's something not all developers are willing to do or, more likely, have the time or money to achieve. When you look at the PS2, most of its finest looking games like God of War and Shadow of the Colossus didn't come until very late in its life when developers had mastered the hardware and knew how to get the best out of it. I'm sure this will be true of the PS3 too but maybe Sony should sit down and think about how to make the PS4 a more friendly system to code for rather than repeating the same mistakes of the PS2 and PS3.

Maybe it was cross platform with the Wii, Wii being the main dev console :P

why are there so many 360 fanboys on this thread, why so threatened?

@WillTheSecond

"it speaks more of the inability of the supposedly HD consoles than the game itself"

That's nonsense, we've already seen that these systems can put out some really decent games and comfortably get along with a higher res than this.

I have been looking forward to Haze since it was announced, but the demo made my eyes hurt and some of the texture joins were of the standard found in first-gen PS2 games. This has gone from one of the reasons I bought my PS3 to a game I'll probably only pick up pre-owned.

And for that, I'm gutted - I just hope they can salvage the engine for TimeSplitters 4.