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Harmonix's Rob Kay Interview

Xbox 360 PlayStation 2 PlayStation 3 Wii
Interview by Ellie Gibson

9 April, 2008

Page 1 of 3. Page 2 ->

Yesterday, EA announced Rock Band will make its debut in Europe on 23rd May. Big news. It was also revealed the game will be exclusive to Xbox 360, at least for a few months. Again, big news. But these announcements were almost entirely forgotten as the Internet was too busy going, "WHAT? One HUNDRED and EIGHTY POUNDS?" Or, "Zut ALORS! DEUX-cent QUARANTE EURO?" etc.

So when we sat down for a chat with Rob Kay, design director at Harmonix and lead designer on Rock Band, it was obvious what our first question would be about. And our second, third and the next eight. Read on to see what he had to say.

Perhaps you don't care how much Rock Band costs. Maybe you've already imported it, or are willing to buy it at any price, or suffer from a bizarre medical condition which causes you to excrete gold. In which case, read on anyway - there's some stuff about downloadable tracks, the online Band World Tour patch and sombreros.

Eurogamer: So, details of the European release for Rock Band were announced this morning, and within a few hours there more than a hundred comments on Eurogamer about the price. Not one of those was going, "What marvellous value for money..."

Rob Kay: So not one of them was jumping for joy at the price. I understand that.

Eurogamer: Let's pretend this is Watchdog and I'm Nicky Campbell. We've had dozens of calls and texts, alright comments on the website, and I'd like to put some of them to you. One reader says, "If I wanted to spend EUR 240 I'd buy a real instrument and join a band."

Rob Kay: So they should. Go and do that, yeah... If someone wants to go out and buy a real guitar instead, that's awesome. More power to them.

Eurogamer: How do you respond to this: "I'm sick and tired of these companies screwing Europe over." What about the fact Rock Band will cost twice as much as it will in the US?

'Harmonix's Rob Kay' Screenshot 1

Scowling, spiky accessories - both pretty rock.

Rob Kay: I imagine the things people are probably a bit peeved about are a) the delay, and b) the cost. The two are linked.

We wanted to make sure that when we released Rock Band in the UK, we did it right. There's a few components to that. One is getting lots of UK-centric music on there, and I think we've done a good job of that.

We also wanted to make sure the hardware gave people choices. Something we weren't able to do for the US launch was let people choose how they buy and experience the game. So [in Europe], people can go and spend GBP 50 on the game, and maybe that's all they do - they can use a USB microphone, or the 360 headset, and they can have the whole singing Rock Band experience. Or they can buy the wireless Fender guitar, or just the drum set.

Or, if they want the full-on Rock Band experience, they can buy the instrument bundle. The combined price, if you add all that up and decide you want that full experience, is quite high. It's not something that is normal in videogames. But Rock Band isn't normal in videogames. This is an entirely new thing. What other game comes with three peripherals that are all different? It just makes sense for the experience we're trying to deliver.

I think people might be a little bit put off by the price they have to pay for it. But I firmly believe that if people do [buy it] they'll have an amazing experience they couldn't get anywhere else.

Eurogamer: What about this comment: "You could buy another console for that price." A Wii, for example, which comes with a game. A cynic might suggest you've looked at the Wii and seen that a lot of people are willing to pay GBP 180 for a party game experience, something they'll perhaps only get out every few weeks after a night in the pub. Are you copying that business model?

Rob Kay: That definitely wasn't our process for coming up with a price for Rock Band. Genuinely, there is just choice. All we're trying to do with Rock Band is connect people to music and give them the opportunity to experience it in a totally different way. It's up to people if they want to buy into that... We're not trying to rip anybody off.

These are definitely not excuses so much as contributing reasons - the VAT in the UK, 17.5 per cent, is counted in with the price. In the US, tax isn't added to the price; what you pay at the cash register is more.

It's always annoying you look at the price of consumer electronics in the UK, and you look at the US price, and it's like the dollar and pound signs have been switched. I definitely feel the frustration with that.

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Der_tolle_Emil
09/04/08 @ 13:32
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Eurogamer: Perhaps Eurogamer readers could pop round yours to have a little go and see if it's worth it?

Nice one. Too bad he doesn't really say anything regarding the price but as a developer I didn't expect that he actually could say something relevant.
soylent_grey
09/04/08 @ 13:36
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Blaming VAT is possibly the worst excuse I have ever heard to justify something's price.
What are we supposed to do, turn around and blame Mr Brown for Rock Band's inflated price?
Fyzzu
09/04/08 @ 13:38
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Decent interview. I'm not going to fly off the handle because I don't blame him personally for the price, and I'm equally unsurprised he's defending it what with being, y'know, a part of the company, but... nice to get some sort of feedback from the devs, at least.

Good read, anyway.
asphaltcowboy
09/04/08 @ 13:39
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So, still a load of crap then :/
OmagnusPrime
09/04/08 @ 13:39
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We wanted to make sure that when we released Rock Band in the UK, we did it right. There's a few components to that. One is getting lots of UK-centric music on there, and I think we've done a good job of that.

Sorry, what? Are we talking about the pitiful four tracks that we're getting for a mere £80?
thefilthandthefury
09/04/08 @ 13:41
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"But I can say for sure, we've tried to set up a situation where people can not feel ripped off playing the game, and actually feel like it's well worth their investment. I'm going to sit here and say I think it's well worth the money. "

A hearty LOL at you sir! Absolute drivel. This interview just made him look like a moron.
stepneg
09/04/08 @ 13:41
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"But I can say for sure, we've tried to set up a situation where people can not feel ripped off playing the game, and actually feel like it's well worth their investment. I'm going to sit here and say I think it's well worth the money."


Well Rob, I'm going to sit here and say that your a CUNT.

It probably is well worth the money and the investment if you live in the US especially when they look at how much we have to pay!
McBradders
09/04/08 @ 13:42
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What do you expect him to say, really?

Jebus.
Prodigy_BE
09/04/08 @ 13:42
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Seriously, they should not do these kind of interviews.
That guy is totally talking out of his ass. Now even more people will let Rock Band pass them by.

And is it just me, or are other people also thinking that shipping this from US to Europe will kost you 100x more than with a regular game. As the gigantic Rock Band box can store about a hundred DVD casings?

If I where him, that would be me excuse :-)
Crovax20
09/04/08 @ 13:42
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Eurogamer, used my line!

I'm really getting sick and tired of all these companies screwing us europeans over. ^^
http://www.eurogamer.net/article_discuss...
Scrumhalf
09/04/08 @ 13:42
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It is not really the dev's place to defend the indefensible as pushed on them by some greed-ridden corporate.

But I really don't buy any of the arguments, I listed yesterday 2 example of other products that are more expensive but in a sensible and expected way for exactly the reasons stated.

I unfortunately will never get the chance to play it at a friends house and see if I like it, because all my friends have more than an ounce of sense so will not be buying it either.

Maybe someone from EA or MTV would like to come and comment from a position of slightly more information?
siksik6
09/04/08 @ 13:43
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four!?! LOL
thefilthandthefury
09/04/08 @ 13:45
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"I unfortunately will never get the chance to play it at a friends house and see if I like it, because all my friends have more than an ounce of sense so will not be buying it either."

Same here. I don't have a single friend who's interested in it now. The backlash yesterday was hard but deserved.
toythatkills
09/04/08 @ 13:45
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"Sorry, what? Are we talking about the pitiful four tracks that we're getting for a mere £80?"

Three, actually. And it's £90 more.

Brilliant.
Diomedes117
09/04/08 @ 13:45
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Nobody from Europe is going to buy Rock Band.
AmpH
09/04/08 @ 13:45
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I just hope nobody will buy this untill the price drops. Otherwise publishers will continue to screw us.
Edited 1 times, most recently on 09/04/08 @ 14:45
AcidSnake
09/04/08 @ 13:46
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Good read...

Still not going to get it...And I was so looking forward to it...
OmagnusPrime
09/04/08 @ 13:46
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Ellie: Are you genuinely saying you would pay £180 for Rock Band? I'm curious, do you genuinely think that they are right to be asking this amount of money?
Midnight Raven
09/04/08 @ 13:46
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To sum up the pricing discussion: there is absolutely no reason at all why Europeans should have to pay roughly twice as much for the same experience than North Americans. No surprise there, then.
Killerbee
09/04/08 @ 13:47
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Like I said on the news story, it's a little unfair to blame this guy - or indeed Harmonix - for their publisher's pricing decision. I actually think he deserves more respect for doing the interview and talking about his game in the face of some pretty venomous comments on the internet right now.

Personally, I do think £180 is too expensive and I'm pretty sure I won't be buying Rock Star. And each and every gamer can choose in exactly the same way whether they think the experience is worth it or not.

On the plus side, if it is an absolute flop over here at £180, you can bet the price will be cut pretty swiftly, so I think it's in everyone's interests to hold back a little bit longer and see what happens.
hughboy
09/04/08 @ 13:47
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This debacle has encouraged me to make my first ever post. I've read most of the comments on the other news threads about this and completely agree with everyone. Just want to re iterate that the price is simply outrageous. The interview still gives no good reason why the price is so dire.

I hope it bombs, bigstyle.
captainrentboy
09/04/08 @ 13:47
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Right, that's it I'm convinced. I'm buying 8, one for each room in the house.
That might very well have been the lousiest effort at justifying the rediculous price tag possible.
Definitely not convinced.
They're just greedy fucks, hoping to get as much moolah out of early adopters as possible.
myiagros
09/04/08 @ 13:48
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complete lack of question(s) about how come it was released on Xbox 360 and PS3 at the same time in the US but not for Europe.

EG FAIL!!
Dunk360
09/04/08 @ 13:48
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£127 delivered from play.com using the code 'experience08' and ordering through quidco.co.uk

That's not bad IMO. Ordered.
LPXO
09/04/08 @ 13:48
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Absolute
Fucking
Joke

There is no defending that ridiculous price difference
siksik6
09/04/08 @ 13:48
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sorry Harmonix fella. No dice!
morriss
09/04/08 @ 13:48
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What a load of bollocks. It's too much fucking money. No matter what he says, no matter how he spins it, no matter teh aw3somez unique utterly incredible sensational gaming experience it is, it's just a game and it's not worth £180.

Toothball
09/04/08 @ 13:49
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I do like the fact that I won't have to buy the instrument bundle to get the game, as I want to get wireless guitars anyway. Just need word of a solo microphone to complete the set.
AwesomeWells
09/04/08 @ 13:49
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"But I can say for sure, we've tried to set up a situation where people can not feel ripped off playing the game"

In which case matey, you've failed utterly.
Xerx3s
09/04/08 @ 13:50
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"Eurogamer: But we're talking about a price difference of nearly GBP 100. A mark-up of more than 100 per cent. VAT is only 17.5 per cent - how do you explain the rest?

Rob Kay: I can't talk to the explicit pricing..."

*BUZZ* You fail, you are the weakest link. kthxbye.
Beano
09/04/08 @ 13:52
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I was looking forward to getting the full Rock Band package but NO WAY IN HELL I'm paying almost double the US price and 6 month after the US launch. There's no way to defend that inflated price... VAT and taxes??... stop insulting us!

I'm gonna buy the game only for 360 and play it with the GH3 guitar... too bad because the drums gameplay really looked fun.
Progguitarist
09/04/08 @ 13:53
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Theres obviously no way he would come out and admit that its overpriced. If it does sell badly it'll be a very hard slice of humble pie to swallow.
Beano
09/04/08 @ 13:54
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"complete lack of question(s) about how come it was released on Xbox 360 and PS3 at the same time in the US but not for Europe."

I agree... Call him back up, Eurogamer!
myiagros
09/04/08 @ 13:54
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that is probably the worst piece of trash i have ever read on EG!!

What a crap interview by both parties involved.
If your gonna spend the entire interview asking basically one question, make sure your asking someone who is able or willing to answer.
afghan_jones
09/04/08 @ 13:54
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hope this fails. its all sorts of wrong.

cunts.
tomb85
09/04/08 @ 13:55
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Just to rub salt into the wound they're essentially saying you'll have to buy the innevitable sequel in order to play the online world tour mode which the dev says himself was intended to be one of the key focuses of the game. So it's missing a core component, has a grand total of 4 uk specific tracks, we'll pay double the money for our downloadable tracks as MS points handily ignore exchange rate differences AND it costs more than a new console- SOLD!

/gets chequebook out
nickthegun
09/04/08 @ 13:55
#37
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The 'genuinely great experience' line could be trotted out if they had it up for £1000.

Its a good game and a shit load of money, you cant really get around that, especially when the forced bundle in the US might have been annoying to some, but was actually within the grasp of the average person.
TONYgr
09/04/08 @ 13:56
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FRAK YOU MAN.YOU TALK ABOUT CHOICE BUT YOU DONT GIVE ME THE CHOICE TO BUY THE THING WITH THE GAME AND THE INSTRUMENTS IN ONE BUNDLE IN A MORE REASONABLE PRICE.GET THE FRAK OUT OF HERE!
MikeN
09/04/08 @ 13:57
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"Count me in. I'd pay GBP 180 to play the drums to Better Best Forgotten any day".

So this article is basically damage-control by HMX & EG rather than getting some proper answers to the ridiculous pricing of the game in Europe?
4thVariety
09/04/08 @ 13:59
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100% pure hubris and ignorance. I just use one of my many choices and do not buy the game for that price. It's not like Europeans earn twice the money of Americans so there is an experience Harmonix can keep for themselves.
TheDudesRug
09/04/08 @ 14:00
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The guy doesn't even realise he's having the piss ripped out of him all the way through the interview.
Stu
09/04/08 @ 14:00
#42
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Thanks EG, an interesting article and good to get a response so quickly.

Anyway, I'm buying - I've been waiting ages for this, and the idea of me and three mates playing together is just too wonderful a prospect to shun. Plus the play.com deal is a bit better. Plus I crap gold.
Les
09/04/08 @ 14:01
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"We also wanted to make sure the hardware gave people choices."

So that's why it's a timed 360 exclusive... :P
phatb0y
09/04/08 @ 14:01
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Just a game.

And not one worth £180.

Trying to go down the modular route is bollocks too. Who on earth would want this without all of the instruments?

Its like selling a Ferrari and saying the badge and engine note are optional extras.
JonFE
09/04/08 @ 14:01
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This whole debate would never even existed if the so-called "instrument edition" actually included the game itself at the same price...
barabbas
09/04/08 @ 14:03
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Even though I know the developers have very little say on the pricing of the game, and he really had no other option than to defend the pricing, Rob Kay still came across as a total asshole in that interview. He didn't really answer any questions.

I wonder what Microsoft is thinking about EA completely fucking up their timed exclusive with this ridiculous pricing.
shamblemonkee
09/04/08 @ 14:03
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Colour me unswayed.
OllyJ
09/04/08 @ 14:04
#48
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I have in facte just bought a Ibanez RG 321MH for £180 inc postage.

that was my Rock Band cash.

cheers
Lebowski
09/04/08 @ 14:04
#49
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Blaming the VAT? Get real! And if Rock Band really is a long-lasting game then why don't you make a slight return, or even a loss on the instruments, safe in the knowledge that the ever expanding DLC tracks will bring in the coins and profit?

Or can we expect Rock Band 2 in the (U.S.) shops by Xmas and Joe Europe will be footing the bill?

Jog on, and well done again for getting into bed with EA.
MightyMouse
09/04/08 @ 14:04
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@MikeN

Even as a huge fan of Steps, I'd suggest that line was sarcasm. He wasn't really going to say anything more about the price so there was no point in haranguing him over it. As it was the interview told us that we'll probably have to buy another iteration of rock band in some form or another to get a lot of the core features, so it did give information.

P.S. I'm not a huge fan of Steps.

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