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EVE Online's Player Council: The Big Vote Article

MMO PC Article by Jim Rossignol

13 May, 2008

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We've just entered a two-week voting period in EVE Online, in which every subscriber is being given an opportunity to vote for their choice of representatives from the player-base. This democratic process allows players to decide which of the 31 candidates gets to represent them in the regular Reykjavik summits between developers CCP and the inaugural Council of Stellar Management (CSM). Nine councillors must be chosen.

Players will be deciding who they trust with their voice, and who they think will have the best influence on the issues raised at the talks. That is, of course, if they bother to vote. Just as in the real world, voter ignorance and apathy seems rife, and even the hardest of hardcore players seem indifferent to the entire affair. Has CCP done enough to promote the entire business?

We asked CSM organiser, Petur Oskarsson. "The answer to this is twofold. Those who have dipped their toes in the EVE water are very quick to understand the idea, and see its merits or flaws," he argues. "EVE is a very open game when it comes to content, and you can’t play the game without interacting with another player, it is simply impossible.

"Additionally, the development philosophy for EVE is special. When expansions are released the focus is more on making the game deeper, not broader... Instead of adding new solar systems, things are added that can be done within the existing systems, such as mining a moon, or building a space station. This sounds a lot like our current Earth problem, how we have to use the land we already have, instead of being able to spread out more.

"The potentials (and dangers) are obvious to everybody. Being able to speak directly to the developers regarding the issues and concerns the players have about the game is a very powerful tool, a tool that can be used for both good and bad," Oskarsson warns. "Those who are still EVE virgins have a very difficult time grasping this concept. Both the structure of EVE makes the concept alien, and the thought of people wanting to spend time doing a developer’s job."

'EVE Online's Player Council: The Big Vote' Screenshot 1

So how do you make videogame elections make sense? Through a simple analogy, says Oskarsson. "Relating to the real world in those situations seems to work best - imagine if you were unable to suggest an improvement in your town or city; not that you don’t have any power, but the system that allows you to make a suggestion simply isn’t there. Most people can relate to that."

As it turns out, there are 31 candidates who can relate to that, and want to be the ones making the suggestions. Some of the CSM candidates are new players, and "people's voice" Vox Pop is an account created specifically for the election, but many have a very long track record in EVE Online. Candidate Serenity Steele, for example, was the entrepreneur responsible for the ISS project, in which public money was used to fund some of the first player-built outpost space stations. Whether the long-term failure of the ISS as a neutral money-making enterprise will affect Steele's candidacy is hard to predict.

'EVE Online's Player Council: The Big Vote' Screenshot 2

One personality who is likely to remain popular is Hardin, of the consistently stable and popular Curatores Veritatis Alliance. Hardin has become well-known within the game for running his alliance, and for getting stuck into almost every aspect of the game world, from missions to large-scale player-versus-player combat.

It's that large-scale PVP that Hardin sees as one of the key issues for discussion at the summit: "Certainly lag is one issue that affects most players in some shape or form, and I want CCP to remain focused on tackling it, even if that is at the expense of some new content," he says. "When I first started playing EVE five years ago, a 15 vs 15 fleet fight could result in some serious lag, but today you can have relatively lag-free 100 vs 100 fights. However, as CCP has improved the game, we, the players, keep pushing the boundaries. It's not uncommon for 400 pilots to contest a system, at which point the game degenerates into a slideshow. So CCP has to ensure that its main priority is continuing to optimise and streamline the game to reduce lag - otherwise the game will become a victim of its own success."

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Comments: 1-22 of 22 in total

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Nallen
13/05/08 @ 13:00
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3 year playing vet with multiple accounts here. I don't know anything about any of the candidates other than their forum personas and I wont be voting. I can't help feeling CCP have gone to far to pandering to the forum superstars tbh, they made the game, they know the issues and they should fix them. Now a few people with personal bias will have influence on what the rest of us do? No thanks.
ps3owner
13/05/08 @ 13:05
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haven't played EVE actively, but some other less spectacular MMOG's

http://www.ogame.org for example.

I must agree with Nallen. Some forum trolls are more equal than others... and the once the post the most (even if it's utter shit) get to represent the masses.

not a good system.

the producer of the game should fix the known issues (whatever they are in this case) and that's it. the community will always vote with their feet.
Mr_Brown
13/05/08 @ 13:15
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Not much of a eve player but I am tempted to dip my toe in the water. I think if they are to do this sucessfully, the forums should not even be included and everything should be done through the ingame. Obviously players will use forums for popularitiy, but more incentive should be given to the more sucessful players and guilds in the game. Canditates should really come from the larger guilds and most sucessful players rather than forum trolls, who for the most part, are counter productive to everything bar themselves if Eurogamer forums are anything to go by.
Machiavel
13/05/08 @ 14:15
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/awaits EVE m0t0rb1kes
Snooz
13/05/08 @ 14:19
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Will my klingon skills work with icelandic?
sarkster
13/05/08 @ 14:40
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I knew Hardin from when he was one of the founder members of PIE with me and a few others. Im tempted to reactivate just to vote for him. Hes a top bloke.
13/05/08 @ 15:11
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3 year vet here also.

Had enough of corrupt politics :P
Nallen
13/05/08 @ 15:14
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I think if they are to do this sucessfully, the forums should not even be included and everything should be done through the ingame.

Yes. Big Yes.

I knew Hardin from when he was one of the founder members of PIE with me and a few others. Im tempted to reactivate just to vote for him. Hes a top bloke.

I on the other hand don't know anything about him, and the alliance I'm in have been going on fleet ops with CVA for over a year and working with them from before we even were an alliance. Just goes to show that even the most 'famous' of eve players can be total unknowns for almost everyone. Same goes for Jade, fought wars against him for months, know almost nothing about him.

Here's another thing to consider, these people are big in Eve because of what they've done in the dark underbelly of Eve, 0.0. If memory serves correctly the first QER stated only 9% of the Eve player base actually exists in 0.0, the rest are in empire (secure space). So now the loudest shouters of just 9% decide content changes for the other 91%?

It doesn't work for me, very 95% of the wealth, 5% of the population. There was enough of that with T2 BPO's :)

On the other hand it's those very same people that kick off after every change and it is a rare thing indeed that the screaming gets much done. Perhaps CCP's sole intent is to allow that screaming before changes go in, asses if that very slim change of a change being acted upon exists and then implementing things with the caveat that the screaming should have already been done.

I think there is a place for player driven development in MMO games, it is after all basically a huge ongoing QA process on a regularly patched piece of software. However I think it should be limited to the hard facts, god knows Eve players can be somewhat hardcore with their stats and maths. If a balance issue can be proven then players have every right to shout and be heard. Developers should make a change. However when it comes to opinions of how things should be done I think you're going to far to take the opinion of one as the opinion of many and act on it.
corposant
13/05/08 @ 15:16
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This player representative thing seems like a pretty good idea. I haven't played EVE in a while but I was always impressed with the level of customer service and the attention paid by the devs to comments made by the players. Maybe this will help make for an even better gaming experience. Certainly the comments by some of the candidates in the article are encouraging.

As a an incidental addition, I also knew Hardin of old. Top bloke tbh. Hope he wins.
Hardin
13/05/08 @ 16:10
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First off - Thanks to Jim for the interview opportunity - and nice article. Only one thing - I am not leader of the CVA - just its mouthpiece. The real leader is publicity shy and likes to sit in his bunker stroking his white cat - so it's all good.

Secondly - Thanks for the comments Sarkster and Corposant - Please come back and play EVE again. Corposant you will be pleased to know that your brainchild 'The Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Slaves' is still going strong ;)

Thirdly - to the chap who stated that he has been on ops with CVA and doesn't know me - well I do have two other accounts and my main PvP character is Siobhan. So maybe that rings some bells (or not). I do disagree with your assessment of the 0.0/Empire split. While most characters are based in Empire space - a large percentage of those are owned and operated by 0.0 characters, so the divide is not quite as obvious as the raw numbers portray it.

And finally - if you are interested in the EVE CSM elections check out my blog http://www.hardinfaq.blogspot.com as it links some of the other campaign resources and info...

Edited 1 times, most recently on 13/05/08 @ 17:13
El_MUERkO
13/05/08 @ 16:20
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i voted for the chin thou i think the council is a bit of a waste of time, curious to see how many goons get on
Hardin
13/05/08 @ 16:35
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Well this was the extremely cynical - but funny - view of Sarmaul on the Scrapheap forums:

CSM: The greatest achievement of CCP's existence: reducing the amount of complaints levelled at the game & company by turning the most vocal forum whores against each other, while getting everyone else to participate.
SerenitySteele
13/05/08 @ 17:00
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Hi Jim,

How's your book coming along?

Thanks for the mention in your article :)

I'd like to add that since the ISS IPO Projects ended, I been running a regular newsletter Outpost Alert! to 4500 subscribers, the most popular EVE Alliance Rankings and published a CCP licenced EVE Strategic Map Book (ships this week).

/Serenity
Edited 2 times, most recently on 13/05/08 @ 18:02
Jade_Constantine
13/05/08 @ 17:51
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Interesting article, thanks for that. If anyone would like a little more detail on my personal CSM platform feel free to come and have a read on the official Eve forums at:

http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard....

Or my CSM blog:

http://www.jericho-fraction.net/wordpress/

The election still has 6 days to run so please get out and vote and maybe just maybe we can stop the big alliance fat-cats dominating the show and voting more defensive powers for their Outposts and Towers! :)

Xeaon
13/05/08 @ 18:08
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Maybe one of you could get POS and other such boring shite removed from eve \o/
Hardin
13/05/08 @ 18:12
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Edited: No need to bring EVE political arguments here. I am sure Eurogamer readers are bored enough of politicians without myself and Jade fighting it out here too!
Edited 3 times, most recently on 13/05/08 @ 19:27
13/05/08 @ 18:57
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I have a question.

How many peeps did CCP insta-ban for downloading the leaked eve code?
Jade_Constantine
13/05/08 @ 19:04
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>>Maybe one of you could get POS and other such boring shite removed from eve \o/

Well, the main thing is getting POS removed from the Sovereignty System. I'd be very happy to see POS returned to their roots as purely economic platforms used by moon-miners and researchers.

I don't think POS are a good basis for territorial warfare though - we do need Eve to return to a more honest model of warfare where territorial ownership is about player on player fleet action - not player vs Structure grindfests with gangs of ships shooting POS shields for hour after tedious hour and feeling their sense of wonder and space operatics evaporating in a puff of dull mediocrity.
ilmaestro
13/05/08 @ 19:20
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Every day I'm tempted to stat playing EVE, I'm not sure if this makes me more likely or less likely, but it sounds like a fairly cool idea, if handled sensitively by CCP.
Xeaon
13/05/08 @ 19:47
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"Well, the main thing is getting POS removed from the Sovereignty System. I'd be very happy to see POS returned to their roots as purely economic platforms used by moon-miners and researchers.

I don't think POS are a good basis for territorial warfare though - we do need Eve to return to a more honest model of warfare where territorial ownership is about player on player fleet action - not player vs Structure grindfests with gangs of ships shooting POS shields for hour after tedious hour and feeling their sense of wonder and space operatics evaporating in a puff of dull mediocrity. "


That would be superb if the game could return to actual fleet vs fleet combat, but I think sadly it's too far gone now for it to return to how it was. There would have to be a major shift in attitudes in how things were done atleast. God I miss the old days of eve heh.
Nookyalar
13/05/08 @ 21:41
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*Yawn* As soon as I finish my 5 jumps to get some minerals, I'm going to vote forzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz *snore*
3william56
14/05/08 @ 04:12
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Taking this all a wee bit seriously, no?
/runs for mayor of Liberty City

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