Dragon Age 2 dialogue choice simplified
Three icons: good, nasty, "badass".
BioWare has whittled Dragon Age 2 conversation choices down to three.
"Good" responses will be earmarked with an olive branch, "nasty" answers by a Greek comedy mask and "badass" by a red fist, according to IGN.
Also, at key points during dialogue there will sometimes appear an option to allow a companion to handle a situation in a cinematic way. An example given was a group of orcs being literally sliced to pieces during a cut-scene by either Hawke or the female companion - whoever you opted for.
Real-time combat will also apparently catch the eye, as limbs fly and torsos are severed. And looks are a large part of what BioWare wanted to address with Dragon Age 2, particularly the console versions. IGN - seeing the game at Comic-Con - described a "subtle, comic-book look" that made the game stand out.
BioWare announced a March 2011 date for Dragon Age 2 earlier this month. With it came the promise of "introducing a more dynamic combat system, improving the graphics and telling the most important story in a world".
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Comments (87) Latest comment 2 years ago
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But deliberately dumbing it down to just three responses and then, in case the options weren't dumb enough, adding pictures too just in case you couldn't work it out? What exactly was wrong with the conversation system in Dragon Age?
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Oh, wait.
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I really hope that choices like this remain intact alongside these changes...
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Ridiculous. Nobody at BioWare knows what on earth they are doing anymore, or they're simply content with reducing all their games to the same level of lower intelligence as ME.
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Not imidiatly a bad thing. Depends on if they can deliver on that deeper more foccused story.
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The Witcher and the otherwise lacklustre Alpha Protocol (and let's not even talk about Planescape: Torment) handled this a lot better than Bioware ever did, but I agree in so far as Dragon Age was a step in the right direction for Bioware. Shame it sounds like it only lasted for a single game.
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Absolutely see what you mean, and I wouldn't even say that three options as such aren't enough, it's the clear-cut "bad, nasty, badass" approach that doesn't sound like it leaves a lot of room for a bit of subtlety.
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Personally, I think Bioware have completely gone adrift of their gaming roots. I've no interest at all now in what they do.
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[link url=http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/3209421&lf=8
]http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/...[/link]
apparently, those sentences about orcs or imps and "not being nerdy enough to know the difference" imply more than simply lack of knowledge by IGN's writer, the guy saw one example of conversation and thought that was it!!
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In practice this made fuck all difference, you'd still go through all the dialogue options available and you had no control over what subject you asked about... unless you chose the fifth option, which would cause a tiny window to pop up and list all available topics. You know, so you were in control of your character and all...
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Expected more from Bioware, but eh, what you gonna do?
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Nice journalism EG, and great job news editor guy.
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Nice forum'ing, Nanocrystal.
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That said I am prepared to eat my words, I don't think I've played a Bioware game I haven't been completely absorbed in.
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Bioware are a shadow of their former selves.
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I can't really say I agree. As much as I loved Baldur's Gate 1+2 a decade ago, and to a slightly lesser extent NWN and KoTOR, I had a hard time really liking Dragon Age (PC version), while I consider Mass Effect 2 the best RPG I've played since Planescape: Torment (and thus really my second favourite RPG ever). And ME1 - despite some clunky game mechanics and the dreadful Mako and bland planet exploration - was also better than DA
The game mechanics in Dragon Age just felt a bit slow and outdated, and dialogue and story lacking in pace and "cinematic" feel. I spent around 20 hours with DA
I guess I'm just not really one for a semi-nostalgic game experience.
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Making it more accessible for the masses, that's what it's all down to.
People who bought Dragon Age 1 : 850,000 (just making these numbers up, for the example)
People who bought Mass Effect 2 : 720,000
People who bought Mass Effect 2 BUT NOT Dragon Age : 230,000
People who could potentially buy Dragon Age 2 therefore : 850,000 + 230,000 = 1,080,000.
Conclusion : Make Dragon Age 2 more like Mass Effect 2.
Everybody wins! (* for a given value of everybody, i.e : shareholders)
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Since normal dialogue choices become simpler, they should compensate with unique dialogue lines that pop up depending on your skills, or your knowledge about environment, about people, about the lore, about secondary puzzles and stories discovered, all these things could create non-linearity and further choices.
But HAH, they will never do that.
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@beemoh
"Don't put yourself down like that."
I laughed ;p
I went into Dragon Age with relatively low expectations but it struck me as being BioWare returning pretty much to their roots. The dialogue was one of its strongest suits. Mostly because there's a lot of it, and the written text-only options that you get for the player character are usually pretty witty and give you enough scope to mould your character with. Or at least, the sense that you've got a wide range to choose from. They also designed it so that you would pick a particular flavour dialogue choice (snobby, dickish, heroic, self-sacrificing, etc), and then the rest of the conversation would bend off largely down that route. I was pleasantly surprised that they had recorded so many different responses which fit exactly to the tune of the dialogue you chose.
Basically the conversations in the game felt both intuitive and naturally flowing, rather than in Mass Effect where you drill them for information, and then hit the paragon or badass button. In Dragon Age they felt like conversations with a bit of breadth to them. The trees actually branch off to a point where you can't just go back and ask them the same series of questions slightly differently because ITS A GAME, which I liked.
Anyway, hoping this has indeed been blown out of proportion; wouldn't be the first time IGN flubbed their lines but poor show for EG to running with it.
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there were rarely any clear cut good or bad choices.
i'l reseve judgement till i've tried it, or at least seen it, for myself, but it sounds like they've oversimplified it.
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*gags*
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Already you have people moaning, without even having access to any facts. Most rpgs, if they allow variable responses, basically cluster around three options similar to this anyway. DA
Ironically, the internet has seemed to dumb down any sort of reasoned argument beyond immediate knee jerk reactions, false anger and over the top hysteria. As we know, there are only two responses on the forums. Instant rage, and unwavering support.
What the options are called is meaningless. Lets see what the actual content is first.
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Dialogue in DA
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Arcanum had complex choices. I think Bioware are way too up themselves.
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This piss poor dialogue system results in a very one dimensional player character and a very stale almost spectator-like experience for me as a player. Dragon Age with its non-retarded dialogue system allows me to play my characters properly, please Bioware I implore you, don't take that away from me.
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Nintendo have already done the opposite of that, warning braindead fucktards off games that would be too hard on their poor little brains, like Zelda and Another Code, with the phrase "A basic grasp of English is required to enjoy this game" or some such.
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"We put up to 5 choice options and 5 investigate options per dialog node. There is also a difference between choices (where you are actually deciding something) and giving you the opportunity to express yourself in different ways (which I think is quite cool, but not something I believe we have released any details on yet)."
"I'm not really sure where the "there are only three options for dialog" impression they got came from. Perhaps it was when I showed one half of the dialog wheel with three options...which, you know, leaves another half open for...you know...other....options. *Shrug*
Also probably worth noting that we're not locked into specific icons per place in the wheel. Oh no. We have -much- more flexibility than that."
"I imagine that's the only dialogue he saw? The demo is pretty action-packed and there's only the one conversation-- which, yes, has three options in it. As has been said elsewhere in this thread, however, that's not all we're limited to.
The personality options (which the article mis-characterizes, I'm afraid-- they may have been more his impression of the lines he saw rather than our explanation of them) have a bit more complexity as to what they affect. That's probably part of a larger conversation, however, so we'll talk about it at length later."
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Major facepalm bioware MAJOR
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If your character is fully voiced - as the case is with ME (one of its really strong points if you pick FemShep and happen to be a Jennifer Hale fan, the male voice actor was decent in ME2, but Shepard remains a woman for me) - I would hate having my full lines of dialogue written as the traditional RPG text choices. Once I've read a line I instantly become too impatient to listen to it spoken afterwards, no matter how fantastic the voice actor may be.
But assuming DA2 maintains the ability for players to pick from a multitude of character types and races, I assume it may stick to text dialogue for the protagonist?
That was one of the several things I had a hard time with in DA
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What happened to EG's site? When did piss poor reporting like this article become the norm, and when did people stop thinking? I've read in multiple sources, including this site itself, that the dialogue option tree is more sophisticated than what has been posted here, and i said people should wait until we have more info, and still you have idiots posting over the top rubbish about Bioware and the game itself, all in the hope of getting some plus points on their rating.
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Funny and sad. Seem some people have about as much attention span as the IGN writer who wrote that nonsense. DA2 will have up to 5 dialogue choices and up to 5 investigate options to go with that. Some will be hard choices, others will be a means to express yourself.
Also, EG, in your rush to report this in glee, you selected the PS2 icon instead of PC. It's not coming out for the PS2.
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Still more worried than excited, tbh.
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The true old school (PC) RPG experience is still very much available on the market, but you'll have to search out smaller studios such as Piranha ("Gothic", "Risen"
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BioWare has confirmed (in the GI article) that combat will remain largely untouched. The few changes it will have, however, will encourage an even more strategic approach to a battle.
Sure, it might be nothing but hype-speak, but so long as BioWare doesn't say they have streamlined combat to be more fast-paced and accessible, which they haven't yet, you don't need to worry.
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ThereIsaidit.
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Thanks.
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[link url=http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/3209421&lf=8
]http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/...[/link]
From that link:
Mike Laidlaw (BioWare)
"I'm not really sure where the "there are only three options for dialog" impression they got came from. Perhaps it was when I showed one half of the dialog wheel with three options...which, you know, leaves another half open for...you know...other....options. *Shrug*
Also probably worth noting that we're not locked into specific icons per place in the wheel. Oh no. We have -much- more flexibility than that. We're like gymnasts."
Personally I quite like the idea of an icon that shows the tone of my question or response. If I'm playing a good guy and I have nice and nasty versions of "Yes, I'll do it" at least I'll know which is which rather than the current system where, for example, a click on what I think is a seemingly harmless enquiry after someones mother turns out to be an accusation of murder or something.
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2)that sucks
3)f*k U biobtichs
edit: wait... @salaminzer, thanks for giving us the whole story, yay bioware, boo IGN!
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[nasty] Bioware really thinks that we are so dumb that we can't know if a sentence is offensive or good natured, they are even adding icons for dumbing it more!
[badass] Fuck the dialogues, Im here to kick arses.
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:/
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New Eurogamer, could you stop sucking so much, please?
(Edited typos)
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*No need to stroll down nostalgia lane though; Dragon Age is a more recent example..
I don't see how eliminating every slightly ambiguous dialogue choice, sticking some helpful little diagrams on the side, and colour-coding the whole thing is in any way a step forward.
One one level, it's admirably honest. On another, it's like BioWare decided that its target demographic consists entirely of 4-year olds and lobotomized slugs.
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"This is precisely the dialogue system that made Mass Effect very difficult to play properly. In role playing games I actually like to play a role, I cannot do that properly if I'm asked to portray a mood rather than give a proper response. Obsidian's Alpha Protocol is the same, I want my character to be sarcastic but practical, but as I don't know what I'm going to say until after I've said it this is all but impossible.
This piss poor dialogue system results in a very one dimensional player character and a very stale almost spectator-like experience for me as a player. Dragon Age with its non-retarded dialogue system allows me to play my characters properly, please Bioware I implore you, don't take that away from me.
Edited 1 times, most recently on 23/07/10 @ 21:51 "