Vanquish demo showdown

By Richard Leadbetter Published 2 September, 2010

Platinum targets PS3 as lead platform.

Platinum Games is on a mission with its upcoming shooter, Vanquish. In the wake of the disappointing reception offered to the third-party PS3 conversion of its last title, Bayonetta, the developer has switched to the Sony platform as its lead console.

"The PS3 is kind of like a sports car that's very high-performance and specific in its usage, whereas the 360 is more like a car that everybody's driving. It doesn't have the same range as a sports car, but it has more versatility," producer Atsushi Inaba told VG247 during E3.

"It's about adapting your game to those two sorts of different framework. That's where we're focusing. Fundamentally, the gameplay experience itself is the exact same game."

The recent release of playable demos on both PS3 and Xbox 360 allows us to put Inaba-san's claims to the test, but whether the results of this analysis will remain relevant in the context of the full game remains to seen. The content of the demo is said to be exclusive, and it appears to be very similar indeed to the code seen at E3.

It's not very often that early code is released into the wild as a full-on playable demo, but Vanquish appears to be one of those exceptions, plus the content we're looking at now may not even be in the full game. Assuming that the engine has been locked down, performance analysis of the two respective demos throws up a pretty big discussion point.

Vanquish is v-synced on PS3, so tear graphs apply to 360 only.

The key difference seems to be that the Xbox 360 goes for a conventional capped 30FPS, double-buffer approach (losing v-sync when dropping under the target frame-rate in order to maintain fluidity) whereas the PS3 game employs triple-buffering, effectively ensuring that there is not a single torn frame any time during the gameplay experience.

The Xbox 360 version feels a touch more responsive, but whether this is down to the double-buffering or a slightly higher average frame-rate is something we'll need to take a look at in more depth with the final review code when it appears.

It's also worth pointing that while the tear-graphs in the video suggest that the tearing is a problem on 360, the neutral colour schemes combined with minimal lateral motion make it far less noticeable than you would imagine.

As it is, both demos operate at the same rendering resolution: 1024x720, with 2x multi-sampling anti-aliasing. Aside from minor differences in the shadowing implementation, the rest of the game's many and varied post-processing effects and its object and camera-based motion blur appear to be effectively identical.

With Platinum Games handling both versions of Vanquish, it appears that PS3 owners can breathe easy after the Bayonetta debacle: this demo is excellent fun and technically solid on both platforms. Indeed, it may well be the case that the addition of v-sync could give the PS3 version the edge, though further testing on response and performance in like-for-like situations is clearly warranted. It'll also be interesting to see if the presence of screen-tear on 360 has more of an impact in different environments.

Vanquish launches on 22nd October, and we'll be looking at it in much more depth in the inevitable Face-Off.

Picture of Richard.

About Richard Leadbetter

Rich has been a games journalist since the days of 16-bit and specialises in technical analysis. Commonly known around Eurogamer as the Blacksmith of the Future.

Read more articles from Richard by visiting the Richard Leadbetter archive page.

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Comments (109) Latest comment 1 year ago

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  • beastmaster #1 1 year ago

    Platinum Games is on a mission with it's next game. In the wake of the disappointing reception offered to the 360 version of its last title, Vanquish, the developer has switched to the 360 platform as its lead console.

    But seriously, this is good news for PS3 owners and an example of how it should be done.

  • Charlie_Miso #2 1 year ago

    I never understand these so I usually have to wait for the comments to see who 'wins'.

    So.....????

  • CaptainQuint #3 1 year ago

    Sub HD?

    I kid, I kid...

    Game looks stunning on both platforms. I thought the "sports car" that is the PS3 would be capable of a higher resolution than that though. Turns out it's more of a Toyota Celica than a Ferrari.

  • onyxbox #4 1 year ago

    There was no excuse for what happened with Bayonetta.

  • muscleblade #5 1 year ago

    They should have kept the 360 the lead platform imo.

  • JohnnyWashnGo #6 1 year ago

    The demo was fantastic on the PS3 last night. After the train smash that was Bayonetta, I feared the worst but was pleasantly surprised.

    Also, and this is a biggie for me, it lets me invert x and y axis on the controller. Even better, when I did so in the tutorial, it made some snarky comment about my visual inputs being reversed or something along those lines.

  • ybfelix #7 1 year ago

    I think the HUD color choices of Red/Green is ugly..

  • ybfelix #8 1 year ago

    @JohnnyWashnGo: in the Afro Samurai game, I loved it when you choose "Option" from the title menu, Samuel "Mutherf**kin" Jackson's voice says:"Looking for OPTIONS? You got NONE left, boy! Ahahahaha!".

  • menage #9 1 year ago

    Vanquish was allright, if you look past the generic visuals. I don't think I'll be there for the launch but will pick it up later. Too much spacemarines and metal for me. The trailers do show spectacle but the demo just didn't click in the control dep.. It certainly didn't come as natural as Bayo did.

    Props for the SD mode in there though. Who even thinks of that stuff nowadays.
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 08:52

  • Haerger #10 1 year ago

    "They should have kept the 360 the lead platform imo. "

    Then PS3 version would be worse?

    Stupid statement.

  • Vanmunt #11 1 year ago

    cant wait to read a 3 page face off about how the differences don't really matter when the 360 version will be slightly inferior.. then another 1 week later how platinum could make the 360 version better.

  • T3TSUO #12 1 year ago

    Quote "Game looks stunning on both platforms. I thought the "sports car" that is the PS3 would be capable of a higher resolution than that though. Turns out it's more of a Toyota Celica than a Ferrari. "

    Blame the dev's not the hardware. See Killzone 3D for what a "Ferrari" can do. Plus I'd rather have VSync Enabled than screan tear any day and that costs.

  • funkateer #13 1 year ago

    "Blame the dev's not the hardware."

    Yeah, always blame the devs! What do they know, right?

  • menage #14 1 year ago

    Eurogamer - not talking about the actual games but slagging off someone elses machine of choice, news at eleven.

    If they brought out a pile of shit on both machines people would still argue that their shit was in 3D as well, or that the d-pad for controlling said shit sucked. Glad I have both machines so I don't have to give a damn.

  • dupplawt #15 1 year ago

    The game looks and feels great on the PS3 demo, I haven't played the 360 demo yet but this video shows that both have frame-rate drops, but with so many explosions onscreen it's hard to notice and it doesn't harm the experience.

  • jag10 #16 1 year ago

    played vanquish last night, it was actually pretty good. better than i thought it would be. started of a bit meh but the further on in the demo i got the better it got.

    also who cares about bayonetta when you can play the superior God Of War 3. and the God Of War collection.

  • Deckard1 #17 1 year ago

    are the schools still off? I havent seen this amount of fanboyism in a comment section for a while. Can you's not just, y'know... fuck off or something.

  • menage #18 1 year ago

    jag10

    Stay of that stuff, it's warping your sense of reality.

    GoW is great but combat wise Kratos wouldn't know what hit him.

  • Retro_ #19 1 year ago

    No moaning from me, Played the PS3 version last night and came away very impressed, smooth engine...check, sparkly effects...check, Huge Robots with glowing red bits....check. also not a hint of screen tear when the massive robot was freaking out and I was spinning around on the spot with shed loads of things happening on screen.

    So, Nice and thank you Platinum games for making an effort with the PS3 version.

    As to the muppet who said the 360 should of been the lead platform.... what an idiot, isn't it better to have a 95% and 90% (360) version rather than a 95% and 70% (ps3)

  • lucifon #20 1 year ago

    Sounds like they're both pretty much darn identical. Hats off to Platinum after the issues with Bayonetta.

  • arcam #21 1 year ago

    isn't it better to have a 95% and 90% (360) version rather than a 95% and 70% (ps3)

    Not if you have a 360...

  • ron_aldo #22 1 year ago

    Like Bayonetta I find the visuals too washed-out and grey. Also, I can't tell the difference between the XBox and PS3 versions. Should I go to Specsavers?

  • DiamondIce #23 1 year ago

    Does anybody know if the buttons can be remapped? Some of the button choices felt a bit odd for me.

    This game has caught me by surprise. I liked the boss battle even with its insta-death flame beam-type weapon. The demo was manic fun.

    I will probably opt for the 360 version unless it is a lot worse simply because of the controller.
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 10:42

  • cianchristopher #24 1 year ago

    Uncharted 2, God of War, Killzone 2, blah blah blah blah blah

    Your puny hundreds-and-hundreds of better-looking multiplatform games are no match for my three-or-four better-looking exclusives.

    YOU HEARD ME

  • des #25 1 year ago

    what????game is 30 fps???When did that happen???sub-hd also,lol...pathetic,Platinum games has gone to shit
    Huge downgrade from Bayonetta 720p 60 fps,how is that even possible...your first game is beautiful 60 fps,720p,next game is sub hd,30 fps choppiness...next game will be 480p 15fps.
    Total disappointment.

  • ZizouFC #26 1 year ago

    Finally a multiplat game to buy on PS3!

  • M1chl #27 1 year ago

    I just wondering, why they drop 60FPS and whe they come to sub-HD. Yeah its a lot of things going around, but in Bayonetta its the same, and this game running in 720p/60FPS. Just question, donť want anyone blame for it.

    Anyway gameplay is awesome and I really cant wait for full game, its day 1 for me : )

  • Lee_Morris #28 1 year ago

    To be honest I'm a little disappointed that the game is only 30FPS. I was really looking forward to the game but it just seemed a little clunky. To me it's a game that needs to be 60FPS.

    Maybe it's just that I need to get acclimatised to how through the game as I haven't played a game where you boost like that before.

  • Dizzy #29 1 year ago

    Another way of saying that the engine is inferior to the Bayonetta one. Another lamb on the altar of multiplatform.
    Where did my 60 FPS game go?
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 11:48

  • richarddavies #30 1 year ago

    I played it last night and it ran fine. I don't know what all the fuss is about with this 30fps/60fps shite. As long as it plays well it doesn't matter.

  • Goodfella #31 1 year ago

    F*k me, android123 can always manage to turn something round to try and favour the 360. What a d**khead.

  • Retroid #32 1 year ago

    I'd recommend all those complaining about 'not60fpslol' have a read of DF's articles on LucasArt's Force Unleashed 2 tech demos based on 'upscaling' framerates. As the devs say, a 60fps game has to do far more in far less time and a 30fps game can spend more time on each frame.

    There'll be ~half going on in each of Bayonetta's 1/60 frames than Vanquish and its 1/30. It's a trade-off.

  • sneetch #33 1 year ago

    Good to see the same people posting the same tired PS3LOL/360LOL comments here. Well done lads, the internet needs a sense of tradition and you (the console fanboys on both sides) are providing it!

    Personally, I'll wait for the reviews (and face-off) to see which platform I buy it on but I will be buying it. I like the look of it.

    Oh yeah, PS3/Xbox sucks LOL (delete according to personal preference).

  • irrelevanthuman #34 1 year ago

    Really enjoyed this,seems like there is quite a few combat choices.Considering a purchase now after initial semi-interest.

  • Goodfella #35 1 year ago

    Hmm, -3, does android have 3 accounts?

  • BillyBrush #36 1 year ago

    Very informative, it looks really good (have this on preorder and can't wait to try the demo later).

    Is it poss to work out any tear difference between 720p setting and 1080i/p? some games seem better at 720, some don't, would be cool to know if this changes depending on the console setting.

  • Deckard1 #37 1 year ago

    Theres a hell of a lot more going on then in bayonetta, and the graphics are better overall, thats why it dropped to 30 fps, plus the motion blur covers up for the drop in framerate. Anyways, absolutley loved the demo, day one for me. Shame these kinds of games don't sell very well though.

  • mr2ange #38 1 year ago

    @android123

    You really are such a bellend.

  • mr2ange #39 1 year ago

    @menage

    "GoW is great but combat wise Kratos wouldn't know what hit him. "

    So you're saying that Kratos wouldn't even notice a hit from bayonetta right?

    Thought so,

  • FogHeart #40 1 year ago

    Almost two months from release, we get a demo - as a layman I'd like to know: how much engine optimisation is achieved in the last couple of months before release? Or is it considered to be done and dusted?

  • 32768Colours #41 1 year ago

    I'm going to have to try this demo later on to see about the frame tearing. I only own a 360 and tearing is a bit of a pet hate of mine so it's that version or nothing unfortunately. Really like the look of this game though, so hopefully it won't be too frequent/obtrusive to put me off.

    Of course, this is only a demo too, so the final product may well be better still or even patched to address it as it was for Darksiders.

  • vizzini #42 1 year ago

    ron_aldo: Like Bayonetta I find the visuals too washed-out and grey. Also, I can't tell the difference between the XBox and PS3 versions. Should I go to Specsavers?

    The ps3 version has correct gamma in the cut-sequences this time, as well as in-game graphics, but the in game gamma for the 360 is completely a mess as shown in the video and it doesn't look like it is doing the HL2 orange box technique to even get them close.

    As mentioned in the programmer from Lucas Arts Siggraph Tech Demo, the problem is that Microsoft won't allow developers to use a cross platform Api like OpenGl; even though it is used extensively on PS3/Wii/MacOs/Linux and still on PC.

    Instead it sounds like they mandate the use of DirectX 9c; their own closed platform Api, and it is well documented that it doesn't support proper texture gamma correction H/W accelerated and uses an inefficienct OOP model for graphics, when structured design gives better graphics peroformance.

    From my OpenGl programmer point of view, the very existent of DirectX is redundant, which is a problem for Microsoft when the X in DirectX was the reason they called it Xbox.

    If DirectX was discontinued, and OpenGl was used in its place on 360, all these cross-platform games would run faster and look better on both systems in the future. Microsoft's desire to push their own APIs and frameworks is getting in the way of great multi-platform games and efficient PC exclusives(imo).

  • FogHeart #43 1 year ago

    "If DirectX was discontinued...."

    MS have always attempted to create their own systems like this: our implementation of Java, our version of what we think an open document format should be, for example. The problem is that their version is often better - that's a problem because users are attracted to the new MS system and the existing one withers on the vine. But the advantage of the existing version is that it's made to work across all platforms, and MS have no interest - in fact do not want - their version of the system to work on another platform. I recall an article that implementation of an equivalent of DirectX in WINE is held back because the documentation of the API calls was contrary to their findings. But MS don't have to correct their documentation, it's their system after all...

    Fortunately we still have stalwarts who insist on using OpenGL even in Windows games, and even prove that it can be the superior system. God bless Carmack and iD.
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 14:07

  • Feanor #44 1 year ago

    I'll be waiting for the face-off to decide which version to get.

    Thank you for existing, Digital Foundry.

  • smithdown #45 1 year ago

    "Like Bayonetta I find the visuals too washed-out and grey."
    What game were you playing?? Bayonetta was a brilliant explosion of colours! Granted the textures weren't always top notch, but on 360 it was as smooth as silk and brighter than an episode of the Tweenies.
    Tried the Vanquish demo on PS3 last night and again today - surprisingly tough for a demo! It did feel very much 'hardcore' and could be interesting to pick up when it's cheap for a total brainless blast fest. But I can't say it felt as good to play as Bayonetta.

  • Clover4ever #46 1 year ago

    Slowdown + Tearing = no thanks.

    I think I'll get the "cleaner" version this time since there is almost no difference performance wise.




  • Vanmunt #47 1 year ago

    @ Vizzini

    Not sure how long you have been using EG, informed and non biased posts are outlawed..

  • FuzzyDuck #48 1 year ago

    I'm curious to know how many fanbois posting here about which is the better version intend on supporting Platinum's hard work and are actually going to buy the game?

  • Alkeno #49 1 year ago

    vizzini, thinking too much like a programmer and too little like a businessman is not a bad thing, but it won't make you rich :-D

    DirectX should have disappeared by now (or not appeared altogether) but Microsoft is doing the right thing for their business. I don't do graphic programming but from what I've heard DirectX is not that bad actually (maybe not as good as OpenGL but good enough), is well documented and makes life very easy on devs. Microsoft is getting ALL the games for PC and lots on the XBox 360 (except, obviously, other brands' exclusive titles) so they have 0 reasons to switch to OpenGL. In fact, switching would make PS3 ports easier and prettier by default, which is an understandable non-welcome feature in the console business.

    Curious, never thought of it this way: Microsoft gives standard hardware (CPU+GPU architecture) but grabs devs by the balls with software (DirectX). Sony gives stubborn hardware (Cell) but uses standard software (OpenGL).

    By the way, speaking of the game, it does seem like a mayor scope downgrade from Bayonetta. 720p to 1024x768, 60fps to 30fps... They have reduced by 60% the pixel count!!! (55,2 million/s to 22,1 million/s). That is a pretty big cushion for adding new effects and maintain framerate quite solid.
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 16:49

  • cianchristopher #50 1 year ago

    Astro-Creature:"It is, but the game also has to fit on a DVD. Sadly."

    You are such a Sony fanboy! How the hell does the size of the game file affect the resolution it runs at?

    Did using the full 50gb of space afforded to it by the "luxury" of blu-ray stop Metal Gear Solid 4 running at 1024x768? Did it?

    Did having blu-ray disc storage stop the multitude of multiplatform titles that run at a lower resolution on PS3 than their 360 counterparts from having to do so? Did it?

    Jesus, look at GTA IV and Red Dead Redemption! Two massive games, that both fit onto a dvd, and ran at 720p on the Xbox 360 version. Did the blu-ray space afforded to the PS3 version help them in any way?

    Nope! But as always with guys like you, it's "blame the devs". "Look at [insert PS3 exclusive here] for an exampe of the power of the PS3!"

    Never mind the fact that literally hundreds of games look and run better on the Xbox 360, the half-dozen PS3 exclusives (in your eyes) easily trumps that and makes the PS3 the "winner"....

  • Monkeyspoon #51 1 year ago

    Looks like the PS3 version is the one to get. Glad i preordered it at Zavvi for £33 with a special 3d cover.

  • BillyBrush #52 1 year ago


    Monkeyspoon
    02/09/10 @ 17:16
    Looks like the PS3 version is the one to get. Glad i preordered it at Zavvi for £33 with a special 3d cover.


    Unless you play on 360, in which case the 360 version is the one to get :o)

    Seriously though, I've just played the 360 demo, it's gorgeous, fast, smooth, and i didn't notice any tear at all (i suspect this may be because console is set to 720p).

    I really think it's stretching it to try and declare some kind of winner. Read the article provided for you, it would appear that on comparison they're very close to each other, that the 360 ver may be a touch smoother, but the PS3 ver is v-locked so no tearing. In short, it's really close and they're both really good.

    There's clearly a crowd that wants a reversal of bayonetta, but that was never going to happen. This way, everyone wins, and can enjoy the game to it's fullest.

  • T3TSUO #53 1 year ago

    Love this!
    Went to PC World this aft. Had a PS3 3D setup running Motorstorm 3D on a 40" Samsung. My God it was amazing. As amazing as when I first saw Avatar 3D. What really struck me was how smooth it was and yet I couldn't see any loss of detail. Even staff were enthusing how awesome it was. Was something else for sure. Just goes to show how much power that box really has and how dev's will just shove out anything that is "reasonable" after the walk in the park programming on a 360. Bit of patience and skill and we could see a huge leap in gaming. As big as when 3D accelerators first arrived.

    Then I popped in Game. They'd just finished setting up a 360 Kinect cabinet. Had a go as did staff. We all agreed. We felt like right morons waving and flapping our arms about.. Was really poor.
    Thing what Microsoft forget when they rob other's ideas is the Wii is aimed at a younger audience, the 360 is aimed at teens to early twenty. They are not going to touch this at all. Sony have it right by going after the sport and fps market.

    So anybody that says the PS3 is under powered, I'll just point them toward a big 3D setup and let them decide.
    I'm just deciding what to tell the wife when I blow a couple of grand on yet another new TV.
    Edited by 1 at 02/09/10 @ 17:45

  • orangpelupa #54 1 year ago

    argh i wish my xbox not dead. how much GB is this game? will download on my friend ps3 that still on my house while waiting FF XIII arrive tomorow.

    my town is weird, sell ps3 console but NOT sell game disc. This forced me to buy online from store in capital city, maybe will took 1-2 days the ff xiii ordered from the capital city to arrive.

  • Clover4ever #55 1 year ago

    "The ps3 struggles with 360 ports, the 360 handles the ps3 ports effortlessly."

    I guess that explains why Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm 2 is inferior on 360 (or FFXIII).

    Technically this is the first Platinum game on the PS3 and they did a great job. Congrats to them.

  • menage #56 1 year ago

    @mr2ange

    Anyone that thinks that the actual combat in GoW is better than Bayonetta has got a screw loose. You may prefer it, that's anyones right, but better, not a freaking chance.

    Especially 2, GOW1 was great, 2 was a fucking overrated piece of shit (if I wanted to push boxes and pull switches around I would have become a janitor, a bits allright, but that was taking the main game and strectching it out til you got 7 more hours of dullness out if it), GOW 3 was awesome again, Don't know what happened there.

    Edited by 2 at 02/09/10 @ 18:48

  • Goodfella #57 1 year ago

    Well said cianchristopher, they're a potty bunch these ps3 fanboys.

    Wow, irony overload.

    How about just once you don't deliberately avoid what the PS3 has in it's favour (wi-fi, no charge kit needed, browser, lots of great exclusives and not just about 3 as you seem to think, cheap laptop hard drives, free online), or maybe just stop being a total and utter fanboy completely. Both consoles have pros and cons, but you seem to think the PS3 has only cons.

    As for Vanquish, the fact that it was developed on ps3 first and yet the 360 seems to have got a perfect port tells a telling story imo.

    Yes it does, it tells us that both consoles are capable of pretty much equal visual performance and yet you would have us believe the PS3 is a ZX Spectrum by comparison.


    Edited by 3 at 02/09/10 @ 19:00

  • Goodfella #58 1 year ago

    Anyone that thinks that the actual combat in GoW is better than Bayonetta has got a screw loose. You may prefer it, that's anyones right, but better, not a freaking chance.

    Surely it's better if you prefer it? Subjectivity and all that?

  • Hotel_Moscow #59 1 year ago

    wow the amount of fanboyism in these comments is insane

    until a game comes out on 360 that matches the quality of sonys exclusives(uncharted 2 gow3 killzone 2 and 3 infamous 2) it is fact that the ps3 is a more capable machine when a developer codes for it correctly

  • menage #60 1 year ago

    @Goodfella

    Nope, that's where shit always hits the fan. Me liking something better doesn't make it actualy better in the grander scheme of thingl. Thta's where this whole PS3-360-my car is better than your car thing always goes to hell and starts getting ugly, people thinking opinion is fact.

    I hate Halo, but wouldn't call it a bad game, it may even be the best game ever, but I'm not feeling it.
    So I prefer other shooters. But I'm not saying Halo isn't the best shooter or that my preferred shooter is better than Halo, cause I know I'm probably wrong, subjective and biased, or that I just don't get it, and I didn't give it a proper chance

    I was just arguing against someone strolling in saying Bayonetta is crap, and Gow is soooooooo much superior.

    Based on what, gallons of blood? Muscles? That he digs Greek guys?

    @Moscow

    Don't go pulling in games that are 6 months off. They may just as well be a pile of crap. Let's see a proper open world game which is better on PS3 as well then. Both machines have their strong and weak points.
    Edited by 3 at 02/09/10 @ 19:35

  • Osmond #61 1 year ago

    "@DES "what????game is 30 fps???When did that happen???sub-hd also,lol...pathetic,Platinum games has gone to shit
    Huge downgrade from Bayonetta 720p 60 fps,how is that even possible...your first game is beautiful 60 fps,720p,next game is sub hd,30 fps choppiness...next game will be 480p 15fps.
    Total disappointment. "


    I think its called lowering your standards ,so the title could be equal on the ps3, rather than reap the bad publicity that the superior 360 version of bayonetta brought.

  • NotSoSlim #62 1 year ago

    Always the same fanboy crap....its gotten old real quick. Platinums games first PS3 is a success and the more they use the console the better they will become at using the machine.

    Bayonetta this, Bayonetta that...that games come and gone and while a critical success it did not sell amazingly well. Heres hoping this is different

  • Goodfella #63 1 year ago

    @ menage

    Fair enough, saying one game is much better is pretty silly.

    Thing is though, it's not a fact that the combat in Bayonetta is better than the combat in GoW or vice versa, for a start they are very different games combat wise and that alone makes the 'fact' assumption null and void. I'm not even sure why you think Bayonetta is better as you didn't explain why. Probably preference, which isn't fact.

    Anyway, I'm not arguing over which game is better, both are good. I just don't see the need to even be having this conversation.
    Edited by 3 at 02/09/10 @ 20:48

  • vizzini #64 1 year ago

    Alkeno: thinking too much like a programmer and too little like a businessman is not a bad thing, but it won't make you rich :-D

    DirectX should have disappeared by now (or not appeared altogether) but Microsoft is doing the right thing for their business. I don't do graphic programming but from what I've heard DirectX is not that bad actually (maybe not as good as OpenGL but good enough), is well documented and makes life very easy on devs. Microsoft is getting ALL the games for PC and lots on the XBox 360 (except, obviously, other brands' exclusive titles) so they have 0 reasons to switch to OpenGL. In fact, switching would make PS3 ports easier and prettier by default, which is an understandable non-welcome feature in the console business.

    Have you notice how many people including developers haven't wanted to, or haven't upgraded to Windows Vista/7 from XP? because [they use] DirectX for all 3D Api calls. What about the trend of increasing market share for Apple and Linux distros?

    Do you think a graphics API that is helping reduce Microsoft's market share and resulting in their company value being less than a competitor (Apple) is good business?

    edit mistake: [it uses] to [they use]
    Edited by 1 at 03/09/10 @ 22:08

  • TaniumZX #65 1 year ago

    I`ll probably hook the PS3/360 (both look the same from what I have downloaded) up to my 21" Trinitron if I get this. Might actually improve the experience.

  • Badassbab #66 1 year ago

    Downloaded both and I really can't tell the two apart, it's going to be a close one methinks. Didn't notice any tearing on 360, the only real difference being the default picture settings. 360 looks darker, PS3 looks lighter. Once again will leave to DF to spot the differences.

    Quite pathetic how the fanboys are arguing over it, I suspect they haven't actually played the other version to compare.

  • ParanoidZombie #67 1 year ago

    just played the demo on x360, absolutely mind-blowing, every other TPS looks dull and sluggish by comparison. Stop over-analyzing everything until all joy is gone, this game shows tremendous potential on both platforms and that's all you need to know.

  • irrelevanthuman #68 1 year ago

    Played the demo quite alot today and really loving it more and more-the title page is awesome in itself though,makes me want to re-read rendevouz with rama and watch babylon 5!

  • RKOwned #69 1 year ago

    @Andriod123, Dude, can you just stop please. Your embarassing yourself, really. You dont know what your talking about, no one takes what you say seriously, and all you are is a big fat troll that gets off on bashing PS3 at every chance he can. Seriously, why dont you mention that the PS3 version had no tearing or might actualy get an edge in the final game analysis because slightly lower FPS and negligable, opinon based opinons like it feels less responsive arent as big as the game tearing alot? You wanna know why, because maybe it would kill you a little inside to admit that PS3 dosent get the worse version all the time. you are seriously going to tell me that negligable Framerate dips and a persons opinon that it might be a tad more responsive on 360, which could just be him, is more prevalent and more of a issue then blatant screen tearing?
    Edited by 1 at 03/09/10 @ 00:23

  • Lunastra78 #70 1 year ago

    You just have to admire the stamina of these fanboys, droning on and on about the same crap for 5 years like anybody gives a damn.

    Anyhow... the Vanquish demo is great, I intend a purchase.

  • skyrend #71 1 year ago

    BTW, DF what is the average frame-rate advantage? 0.1? Bias shown as usual.

  • Fur1ousApollo #72 1 year ago

    So basically both platforms get a technically solid game with very little difference between the two.

    Nothing really further to discuss.

  • orangpelupa #73 1 year ago

    noone know how much the demo file size?

  • Quixz #74 1 year ago

    What has happened is the game was 1280 x 720 on the xbox and 1024x720, but to make things fair they have dropped the xbox as well..

  • Der_tolle_Emil #75 1 year ago

    noone know how much the demo file size?

    Downloaded the 360 demo yesterday (which I really enjoyed) and filesize was between 800 and 900mb. No idea how big the demo on PSN is.

    Edit: I just saw that I still had the tab with the xbox live marketplace in my browser - it says there that the demo is 467mb but I could swear it was bigger when I actually downloaded it.
    Edited by 2 at 03/09/10 @ 10:08

  • Goodfella #76 1 year ago

    @ tigerstyle.

    Wow, even bigger irony overload.

  • funkateer #77 1 year ago

    I'm outta here before android123 and tigerstyle start rubbing their xboxes together.

  • Goodfella #78 1 year ago

    @ tigerstyle

    I own both but I don't cream myself over either, they both provide entertainment, the PS3 more so as I prefer the exclusives. There's something seriously wrong with you though, 'vastly this and vastly that'? it goes way beyond fanboyism.
    Edited by 1 at 03/09/10 @ 11:44

  • Badassbab #79 1 year ago

    PS3 fanboys need to stop blaming devs for inferior versions of multiplatform games and 360 fanboys need to accept the best looking PS3 exclusives look noticably better than anything on the 360.

  • OrangesJoel #80 1 year ago

    I got the demo for the PS3 since my woefully tiny old 360 HDD is full to bursting.

    It's great to see a multiplatform game perform so well on the format, and even better to see a multiplatform game perform so similarly across both. But I think I'm still going to be getting the 360 version for reasons Platinum are virtually powerless to deal with: the DualShock 3's shoulder buttons are horrendous, and this is a game which relies heavily on them.

  • HokutoNoKen #81 1 year ago

    Some info about the resolution and the framebuffer:

    Bayonetta frame buffer data:

    1280x720 no AA = 7,03125 Mb so it fits the Xbox 360 10 Mb eDRAM so no tiling is required, this works well with 60fps.

    Vanquish frame buffer data:

    1024x720 with 2xAA = 11,25 Mb so it doesn't fit the 10Mb eDRAM and this will cause a problem especially as the game it quite graphics intensive so even if this game had been lead on 360 we wouldn't have seen 60 fps with current graphics.

    / Ken

  • HokutoNoKen #82 1 year ago

    Xbox 360 doesn't support tripple buffering due the 10Mb eDRAM. It only supports dubbelbuffering, to compensate for this they have too turn of v-sync to be able to keep up the frame rate. If they don't the frame rate will most like drop down to 15 fps or worse. This is not a sign of superiority as many people says "360 GPU is far superior "

    Anybody that has a PC can test and see what the effect is when turning off v-sync when it comes to responsitivity. The responsitivity will always become better when you turn off v-sync and v-sync on will most likely introduce some lag.The only reason Richard mentions the responsitibity here is to not make the 360 version sound so bad. Anybody that have played the PS3 version knows how good it feels.

    / Ken

  • Quixz #83 1 year ago

    @HokutoNoKen

    Can you please explain why the PS3 is also running at a shameful resolution of 1024x720 and also can you explain why games like Forza run @720p with 4AA?

  • menage #84 1 year ago

    @Goodfella

    I agree, I just can't stand obvious no claims like this game suck buy the other game cause that one rules type of comment.

    As for why it's better at combat, well, the whole game revolves around it, it has tons more combo potential, God of War tries to be something different I admit, but without specialising it will never reach the hights of Ninja Gaiden, Bayo or DMC. Like Games TM said, it's like comparing underground boxing with shaolin kung fu. More brawn maybe, certainly less technique. I'm still discovering new combo's even now.

    God of War is gerat for busting heads though, I just could live without the crate pulling.
    Edited by 1 at 03/09/10 @ 18:15

  • HokutoNoKen #85 1 year ago

    @Quixz

    You should really ask the developers about that. We know at least that they are striving for platform parity but here is something for you to think about.

    1024x720 with 2xAA > 1280x720 with 0xAA as a frame buffer, so maybe its not so shameful. But lets say that you would rather run the game with this config. 1280x720 with 2xAA = 14Mb thats quite a leap. Its twice as much compared to 1280x720 no AA = 7Mb.

    Forza Motorsport 3 runs with this config 1280x720 (2xAA in-game, 4xAA replay & vehicle select) Source Beyond3D.

    From Richard Leadbetter article Tech Evolution: Forza Motorsport 3:

    "It also does this while maintaining a full, native 720p resolution and also 2x multi-sampling anti-aliasing.

    To achieve this, there have been some sacrifices made. As we've noted many times previously, one of the great strengths of the Xbox 360 architecture is its ultra-fast 10MB of eDRAM connected directly to the Xenos graphics chip. Unfortunately, 10MB is not enough to contain a native 720p framebuffer with 2xMSAA, so instead each frame is cut down into two chunks, called tiles. Performance is impacted where objects occupy both tiles, as effectively they need to be drawn twice."

    They had to make some sacrifices such as number of cars on screen and the number of polygons used on each car and so on.

    / Ken
    Edited by 1 at 03/09/10 @ 18:34

  • jag10 #86 1 year ago

    http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=KzqJswRGc8o

  • Badassbab #87 1 year ago

    @post 100

    Uh-oh...

    http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=KG2lof9pWL8

  • flanker22 #88 1 year ago

    hmm, just noticed that the analog qte is a 360 analog stick on both platforms (concaved) typically most games do make an adjustment for this seemingly small detail.

  • womble #89 1 year ago

    Checked out the demo on the 360, on a 720p projector.

    There is precisely ZERO tearing on my screen.

    Not sure about the game though. Halo Reach is out in 2 weeks, so I can't see myself buying this game until it's a $20 bargain bin job.

  • vizzini #90 1 year ago

    Checked out the demo on the 360, on a 720p projector.

    There is precisely ZERO tearing on my screen

    I'm not a gold member, so I can't check the 360 demo until its available on silver. But on screens that have lag in the display circuitry, or the picture is undergoing minification/downscaling internally on the projector eg from 720p down to a native 800x600 tearing wouldn't necessarily be visible because of the extra signal processing.

  • Loghorn #91 1 year ago

    Gosh, Sony fanboys are pathetic these days.

    @Clover4ever: The reason why FFXIII was inferior on the 360 was because that Square did a rush job on it.

    @android at comment #58 & @Goodfella at comment #64: That's what I've been saying all along. Both 360 & PS3 are very equal to one another in specs, but yet, the PS3 fanboys are too dumb to always believe anything of what Sony tells them. It's the developers that put more time & money into the games which look great, not by the so-called "power of the cell" nonsense or by hardware alone.

  • Loghorn #92 1 year ago

    @Umbriel: No, I think YOU need to wake up. Did I ever say that I was disappointed on the 360's graphics? No, I didn't. Plus disc space has absolutely NOTHING to do with quality, & Blu-Ray doesn't help with quality in graphics, just gives it more space. If you honestly think & believe those things, then I just got to laugh at you. And the 360 is very well capable of having the same greater graphics like the PS3.

    You're just being another blind individual here. Just like I said earlier, PS3 fanboys like you are too dumb to always believe of what Sony tells you.

    Oh, & even IF the 360 never matches the PS3 in exclusives when it comes to graphics, they're are much more fun than almost every PS3 exclusive out there in the book. Such as Halo 3. People are still playing it to this day. Not to mention that most people play multiplats more so than exclusives. Plus PC games (like Crysis, which is a '07 game) outsmarts all of those PS3 exclusives in graphics, anyways.

  • Loghorn #93 1 year ago

    @Umbriel: Wait a minute...how am I wrong for saying that developers put money & time into making games look great? How do you think that developers make better graphics? You are seriously delusional. Plus you can't magically make games better just by simply more space. Even some games that are on both 360 with multiple discs & PS3 with a single Blu-Ray disc happens to look &/or run better on 360, so I don't want to hear that garbage. Plus Halo, Forza, & Gears are cheap games? What are you on? And I got to laugh at those that minused me. That just proves that PS3 fanboys are over the top.

    And read "Heyyou27's" 1st post in this thread here talking about differences between the 360 & PS3. They're exactly the same in power & in specs & you would be really blind not to think that.

    http://ww w.tomshardware.com/forum/100393...

  • Loghorn #94 1 year ago

    I never said that the textures, sounds, animations, etc. of games like Uncharted 2, etc. would fit on 2 DVD's, etc.

    Gosh, would somebody explain it to Umbriel of what I'm talking about here, please? I'm not going to sound like a broken record repeating myself.

  • vizzini #95 1 year ago

    Loghorn let me explain it to you; the Cell is made up of a 3.2Ghz PPU core with 2 hardware threads. Otherwise referred to in the server market as a 2-way CPU, which can operate up to ~60% of its theoretical performance. The Cell is a Heterogeneous CPU design that has a further 7 SPU cores inside (6 of which are usable as the 7th is for XMB background tasks like PlayTV) and the 8th is disabled for fabrication efficiency.

    Each of the 6 usable cores is also clocking at 3.2GHz and can run independent of the PPU or each other, and have their own 256KB low latency memory allowing them to facilitate highly parallel vectorize-able tasks at near theoretical performance eg greater than 85% efficiency if used correctly, which nicely explains why Sony Move use only a small amount of system resources and is low latency.

    Comparing this to the Xenon's homogeneous design, it has 3 independent PPU cores clocking at 3.2Ghz with 2 hardware threads per core. Resulting in each core operating up to ~60% of the theoretical performance per core; like the one in the Cell.

    So for the Xenon you've got

    PPU * 60% + PPU * 60% + PPU * 60%

    And for the Cell you've got

    PPU * 60% +
    SPU * 85% + SPU * 85% + SPU * 85% + SPU * 85% + SPU * 85% + SPU * 85%

    Just from visual inspection they don't look equal. The 360 Xenon might run rings around the Cell for Spreadsheets, Word processing and multi-core general purpose tasks, but for highly parallel, vectorize-able tasks like game graphics, physics, audio, networking, game input, the 6 SPU cores in the Cell are not matched at all by the Xenos' two extra PPU cores, and even many general purpose tasks can be reworked to utilise the Cell's performance if the software designer has the time and desire to do so.

    producer Atsushi Inaba comment to VG247: The PS3 is kind of like a sports car that's very high-performance and specific in its usage, whereas the 360 is more like a car that everybody's driving. It doesn't have the same range as a sports car, but it has more versatility
    Edited by 1 at 06/09/10 @ 10:36

  • Darren #96 1 year ago

    I didn't like Bayonetta at all so I couldn't honestly say I was excited about this game. However I played it on both the 360 and PS3 and admit that despite its initial similarity to Gears of War (and, indeed, just about any other futuristic third-person shooter for that matter), it was a lot of fun and I really enjoyed it. The over-the-top action and effects and the ridiculous boost/slide action made it a real hoot to play and I welcomed the Easy mode's auto-lock on.

    As for the differences, I thought the 360 version looked a bit better personally, a little less jaggy looking and I never noticed any screen tearing either so it surprised me that this article mentions it had it (I'm usually very sensitive to it and spot it no matter how slight). I did notice the 360 version suffers from some very occasional split-second micro-stuttering though which I never noticed in the PS3 build.

    Seems like a good game. I may even consider buying it depending on how it fares review wise.

  • TAPNGO #97 1 year ago

    is Umbriel semitope's twin brother????

  • xenoss #98 1 year ago

    This still sucks for PS3.

    I am convinced that cross platform games will ALWAYS favor the 360. We have half a decade of history to go by and it doesn't look like it changed at all. Multi playform games just runs better on 360. Period.

    Either 360 is the lead platform and thus is better, or we have a case like this where PS3 is lead, and it doesn't matter. When games are kept to this "range", the 360 reigns.

    To use the article's example of cars, multiplatform games is a race between lower class cars. It is 360's native playground. PS3 is a higher class racing car in a race that is not native to it. It needed to be tuned down to a point where it is qualified to compete in this race class. And after tuning it down, it loses the race anyway. It just wasn't meant to run like this.

    PS3 will always lose this sort of multiplatform race. And since 360 is the more popular console (because people are stupid, like Loghorn), this will always be the way things are.

    360 is the lower common denominator, and the more popular choice. Developers have overwhelming incentives to build for 360, or at least to include it. Everything you make for the 360 CAN be run on the PS3; the reverse is not true. Games that use more of PS3's hardware power cannot be run on a 360.

    360 fanboys love to call bullshit but I forgive them for their stupidity and ignorance (even as the cry and call people names). But 360 is a half-decade old PC with not even 1 gig ram to speak of.

    I am not a PS3 fanboy. I am a PC gamer. And as a PC gamer, a 5 year old PC is a joke. And it amazes me that games are being made for it still. What PC gamers called this sort of low end old ass PC? We call it a piece of shit. One that is infamous for breaking down into RROD? We don't have a name for that. That's a new kind of low. One that ALSO requires you to pay overpriced service for multiplayer games? That is yet another level of stupid that we haven't encounter.

    For this moronic situation to have happened and continuing to occur, MS's marketing and stupidity of the 360 fanboys are the fuel. And I love it. This sort of counter-logic irrational shit is like a miracle. You don't know how it can happen, you can't explain it, logic tells you it is impossible. And yet there it is, right in front of you. An impossibility occuring right there in front of you and cannot be denied.

  • Loghorn #99 1 year ago

    @xenoss: Don't call me stupid just because I like a certain product & that I play it more than the other product. The only time that my PS3 gets more play is exclusives & Blu-Ray.

    Blame Sony for making the PS3 very expensive at the beginning & giving Microsoft a lot of power towards gamers. And to say that PS3 games can't be run on the 360 is really obnoxious. MGS 4 is at sub HD at 1024 x 576, in which Kojima said that it can't run on the 360. I just have to laugh. Plus at the beginning, Sony said that games like Assassin's Creed 1 & Virtua Fighter 5 couldn't run on the 360 perfectly. Look what happened there. They happened to look & perform better on the 360, even though they were either ported from PS3, or have been developed first on PS3, or both. Plus the PS3 doesn't even use 1 gig of RAM, either.

    Boy, I just love how Sony is pulling the wool over your eyes, as well as other posters like Umbriel. The same company that you're praising is the same company that promises "Toy Story" graphics, etc. on the PS2 (even though that's a great system, regardless because of great games), & you guys just keep on taking it. I just love it. And if anything, you're the dumb ones for always believing everything that they say.

  • jag10 #100 1 year ago

    i'll post it again just in case you missed it:

    http://www .youtube.com/watch?v=KzqJswRGc8o

  • womble #101 1 year ago

    Sony fanboys, please, just STFU.

    I like Uncharted 2 as much as anyone, but if you can't see value in games like Reach, that's your own problem. Get over you stupid little hangups, buy another console, stop your whining.

  • RKOwned #102 1 year ago

    @android 123: you realize taht people have been pirating 360 games for quite a while now, dont you? Last time I checked that didnt kill the 360. I think your overreacting and are just grasping at straws to try and bash SONY and the PS3.

  • Badassbab #103 1 year ago

    Amazing comments from the fanboys. Damn I've run out of popcorn.

  • Badassbab #104 1 year ago

    Problem with PS3 exclusives is sure they look amazing but they are very advanced engines to program on and no other games use them and the releases are few and far between. Look at bloody GT5 for example. Most games just use easy peasy middleware engines like UE and they still look good and can be upgraded to look better.

  • IvorB #105 1 year ago

    "The PS3 is kind of like a sports car that's very high-performance and specific in its usage, whereas the 360 is more like a car that everybody's driving. It doesn't have the same range as a sports car, but it has more versatility,"
    LOL! Guess I'm glad I'm driving the sports car... :-)

  • Loghorn #106 1 year ago

    @Umbriel: Mickey Mouse world, my foot. It's rendered at 1024x768, and as a result, the game suffers from aliasing issues. There are also low resolution textures strewn everywhere, and shadows are especially awful in many spots, so that's why they done that. Plus doesn't that mess up the resolution when viewing it on a HDTV? Just because it's re-upscaled doesn't mean that you get that full experience of real HD. I know what I'm talking about. Go crawl back to where you came from.

    Plus that page that you showed me doesn't even work.

  • setsuvalentine #107 1 year ago

    @Vizinni and Umbriel
    Actually i don't care about wich one is powerful but you guys are forgetting few thing on the config of both plateforms...
    You only talk about the CPU wich gives the ps3 the advantage in here, but you both seem to forget about the 360 GPU with unified pipelines(making a bandwith to about256BG/s)+ additionnal EdRam running at way more operations per clockcicle than the RSX AND its 512 RAM wich compensates the advantage taken by the Cell. Actualy the cell in the ps3 config can only be used for 40% of it's potential, blocked by the lack of Bandwith and Ram of the PS3's hardware.
    That's why now everything for graphics are being processed by the Cell SPU, as the post processes are taken by the RSX. This is the way they found to compensate the ps3 problems, but to do that they had to make PS3 dedicated Engines wich does not really exists for x360(except for Forza games and MAYBE Alan Wake but i'm not sure that it is dedicated, think it is more like a Remedy 's own engine for every plateform).
    So to be sure of what you said, that the 360 could never run games like the PS3 first party AAA games, there should have REAL 360 first party AAA games with dedicated engines, AND the same time of prog than any AAA PS3 game.from 2 to 6 years...
    If a hardware is much more powerful than another, no need of optimisation or tweaking...If you need some to compare to another, it means the differences are not that big.
    A harware is not about only a CPU.Be aware of that.
    And for the comparison Inaba made it is a little awkard. I would'nt say the 360 is a casual car but more like a good Hummer or a Jeep, able to go fast and handle many situations, as the PS3 is more like a Sportscar. If not the difference would be more visible.

  • Loghorn #108 1 year ago

    @setsuvalentine: Sorry that I'm late on this, but thank you for showing those nimrods of what I'm talking about. I swear, PS3 fanboys just gets dumber & dumber these days.

  • nova82 #109 1 year ago

    @beastmaster

    "Platinum Games is on a mission with it's next game. In the wake of the disappointing reception offered to the 360 version of its last title, Vanquish, the developer has switched to the 360 platform as its lead console."

    talking out of your a**,are you?