Cryptic "ready to go" on Champions 360

By Oli Welsh Published 1 September, 2009

MS reluctance on MMOs is "baffling".

Cryptic studios boss Jack Emmert has said that the developer is "ready to go" with a 360 version of its superhero MMO Champions Online, but is having to wait for approval from Microsoft - whose attitude to MMOs on the console he calls "baffling".

Champions Online is released for PC this week, and Cryptic owner Atari told investors to expect a 360 release this year, but Emmert's not so sure.

"I don't know," he told VG247. "Right now we're just talking with Microsoft. Right now the ball is firmly in their court. We're ready to go, but until we get the go ahead from Microsoft, right now we're sort of waiting."

Microsoft has a history of cold feet when it comes to releasing MMOs on its console platforms. It cancelled two projects it was due to publish itself - Level 5's True Fantasy Live Online on Xbox, and Marvel Universe Online, which was to be developed for 360 and PC by Cryptic. Meanwhile, planned 360 versions of third-party games such as Champions, Age of Conan and Realtime Worlds' forthcoming APB have all but disappeared from the radar.

Square Enix - the only company to release an MMO on 360 so far, in the form of Final Fantasy XI - recently admitted that it was in talks to bring follow-up FFXIV to 360 as well as PS3 and PC, but had hit a Microsoft policy roadblock. It's "because 360 has its own policy with Xbox Live that is different from [the] internet", according to producer Hiromichi Tanaka.

"Microsoft's a big company, and they have to work out all the various issues related to MMOs," Emmert said to VG247. "It just takes time for the big beast known as Microsoft to get moving. I really have no explanation other than that, because it's as baffling to developers as it is to everyone else."

Although preferring 360 for its proximity to PC as a development platform, MMO developers may find themselves following Square Enix into Sony's arms instead. With a more open online platform in the form of the subscription-free PlayStation Network, and several PS3 MMOs of its own in the works at Sony Online Entertainment, the Japanese giant seems a more welcoming home for massively multiplayer gaming right now. Cryptic, which also plans a console release for its next game Star Trek Online, advertised for a PS3 programmer last year.

In the meantime, Champions Online is released for PC today in the US, and on Friday in Europe. Look out for more soon, and on the Champions gamepage.

Picture of Oli.

About Oli Welsh

Oli is Eurogamer's acting deputy editor and reviews editor and likes to take things one word at a time. He is among the best dressed people in South London.

Read more articles from Oli by visiting the Oli Welsh archive page.

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Comments (31) Latest comment 2 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • tossetaz #1 2 years ago

    It seems obvious that microsoft can't seem to decide how they wonna finance it, they can't just offer it for free for xbox live gold since an mmo requires much more server-power etc. than a regular multiplayer game. I think they should just make it playable for all xbox live users and then have a standard monthly fee.

  • actionfitz #2 2 years ago

    would be rather Ironic if one of these forthcoming MMO's achieved moderately wow-like success on PS3 after basically being chased away my Microsoft.
    /shrug

    still not convinced how well these sorts of games will work on consoles. tried to play the FF11 demo on xbox, the controls frustrated the hell out of me sorry to say.

    It probably can be done, I'll just have to wait and see.
    Edited by 1 at 01/09/09 @ 10:24

  • Nephirion #3 2 years ago

    I can't imagine raiding for 6 hours using a controller tbh

  • Skurmedel #4 2 years ago

    Crytpic? :)

  • Dizzy #5 2 years ago

    >I can't imagine raiding for 6 hours using a controller tbh

    You are playing the wrong game.

  • Oli Verified Reviews Editor, Eurogamer.net #6 2 years ago

    Aaaa! Cryptic. Cryptic. Cryptic. Crytpic.

    I just cannot stop making that typo, whatever I do. And I never spot it either.

  • zoidberg #7 2 years ago

    Microsoft may not want to "open the gate" to MMOs, because of the added bandwidth and server issues needed. Also, integration with various Dashboard and future updates of the console firmware itself would need "checking" with the MMOs.

    Also, patching MMOs is quite a FREQUENT ordeal, and the Xbox 360 is not a console that gets quick patches up (to fix various issues).

    Finally, if a player is already paying for Xbox Live GOLD (to support servers, bandwidth, and get more services), why in the world would it seem fair to pay for an MMO service too, on TOP of that, since it's for basically the same thing. And I doubt Microsoft would want to share in the GOLD accound "loot" with the developer.

    It's a complicated deal even for us "outsiders". I can only imagine how many OTHER factors there are, ones that we don't know about at all.

  • curtlikesmeat #8 2 years ago

    Can't the 360 just connect to someone else's servers and bypass Xbox Live altogether? That would make the status of the Live account irrelevant.

    I assume there's some technical thing in the way since that would be a logical solution. Also the 360 overpriced HDD issue would rear its head again - say hello to your 40gig Age of Conan install!

  • patch #9 2 years ago

    Can't the 360 just connect to someone else's servers and bypass Xbox Live altogether? That would make the status of the Live account irrelevant.

    ^ this. Currently Microsoft does the hosting for the Live platform (hence the £40 annual charge) but with an MMO, chances are the game's publishers would want to host the servers and charge their own fee. It's basically Microsoft trying to protect their Live subscription model. If an MMO publisher can do it's own server hosting, why can't everyone else, making live subscriptions redundant? This could be something to keep an eye on even if you're not interested in the game.

  • Quickstick4 #10 2 years ago

    FFXI only requires a silver account. It doesn't 'use' live! because you still connect straight to Square enixs own servers. Hence you can play with PC, PS2 and PS3 players, and use your account through any of them.

    I think the issue is that M$ probably cant decide weather to make new MMO's on the 360 use Live! and if a PC version is out make it use GFWLive! and probably weighing up the cons/benefits of a Live! only MMO, also it really tries to keep it quiet that you can play with PS3 owners via FFXI - which may be another reason they don't want a platform independent MMO on the 360 again.

    I think FFXI approach is the best but HATE the amount of space it takes up on my hard drive. It uses about 8GB or more, and the updating process takes (for a new player) well over 12 hours (it is 4 years of updates your downloading to be fair)

    EDIT: EA games all use there own servers hence why EA took so long to come to Xbox
    Edited by 1 at 01/09/09 @ 11:31

  • JahB #11 2 years ago

    EA games all use there own servers hence why EA took so long to come to Xbox

    i was thinking about that too, but that's not really a good solution, simply because EA's online service is shit. if i had a cent for every time i couldn't connect to EA servers while i was connected to live, i'd have an alienware pc by now.

    lets' see if cryptic can do better

  • Dizzy #12 2 years ago

    "Can't the 360 just connect to someone else's servers and bypass Xbox Live altogether? That would make the status of the Live account irrelevant. "

    Yes they can do that. This is not a problem actually but the Live account has to be supported, so MMOs will have to link the Live acount to your characters.

    Patch is totally wrong.

    I think it has more to do with the fact that the guidelines are not MMO friendly at the moment (patches needing a long testing process, uptime support, mirroring to servers around the world, integration with Marketplace, etc...) and need updates. It will happen... expect Champions early next year.
    Edited by 2 at 01/09/09 @ 11:46

  • miiiguel #13 2 years ago

    "you can play with PS3 owners via FFXI "

    I think you can't play FFXI on a PS3. And M$ is kinda... so passé.

  • ZuluHero #14 2 years ago

    It would be interesting to see this on the 360 because as it stands (and after playing the beta) my PC just doesnt cut it...

  • Spekingur #15 2 years ago

    The problem is most likely with space (HDD) and possibly client patches which would have to go through MS connections onto your X360. Plus, MS is a big beast and big beasts are sometimes slow to start up - but then again, you won't be able to stop them that easily once they get going.

    Edit: I am also with ZuluHero. My PC doesn't display all the prettiness of Champions on my PC - I get no cell shading effect for example. You can also play the game "easily" with the X360 controller connected to your PC.
    Edited by 1 at 01/09/09 @ 12:25

  • Nephirion #16 2 years ago

    Because the 360 can't do Macros ^^

  • Rubarack #17 2 years ago

    The double charge on Live is likely to cause consternation. People will want to know why they have to pay x a month for Live and another x a month for CO. If it has Silver access Gold players will want discounted access. It's a whole mess to muddle through that's going to be difficult to explain around.

  • DFawkes #18 2 years ago

    You don't need Live Gold for Final Fantasy XI, I'd expect this to work in much the same way.

  • Bumbuliuz #19 2 years ago

    Cant understand Ms reluctance to allow MMOs on the 360. Id gladly pay to play a game like Champions for example.

  • DrDamn #20 2 years ago

    @Miiiguel
    "I think you can't play FFXI on a PS3."

    You can play the PS2 version on one with backwards compatibility.

  • spimmy #21 2 years ago

    its like Cryptic want the game to fail allready huge nerfs on launch day gg

  • hiddenranbir #22 2 years ago

    Maybe MS like the PC as their MMO platform, cause they don't have to deal with anything accept directx.

  • Lemming81 #23 2 years ago

    I can tell you right now why MS are so squemish about MMOs on their console - relinquishing control.

    MMOs would use a service and client completely independent of XBL for them to work properly. And MS doesn't like that. It comes down to greed, frankly. They don't merely want a slice of the pie of retail sales, they want a slice of the subscriptions as well.

    They think they are thinking long-term by considering subscription percentage if an MMO takes off on their console, but they aren't. Their messing around on this issue when Sony have an open-door policy is going to be the 360's death-knell if the right game comes along..



    On a slightly different note, the MMO that wins will be the one that has a packaged-edition that comes with a keyboard/trackball combination peripherel. If it was bluetooth as well, then it would be fucking mint on a PS3 MMO.
    Edited by 1 at 01/09/09 @ 16:39

  • Vistrix #24 2 years ago

    Why dont MMO companies learn?

    The better platform for MMOs is the PS3 - with full keyboard / mouse support & 100% support for custom content, its far suited for the MMO genre than the 360.

    Sony's policy on cross network support (PC/ PS3 communication) is also a big plus.

  • craziii #25 2 years ago

    mmos will have their own community, which will eat away xbox live's.

    that is why! get it people? ms isn't about to throw away their premium service.

    I also agree that patching is another huge issue.

    both of these stop mmos dead.

  • Lukey__b #26 2 years ago

    They're just thinking very hard about it.

    Obviously they would love MMOs to take off on the 360, tons of people sign up and pay for live and also pay for the subsciption. That would be their favoured outcome.

    Orrrr...... they can drop the neccesity for live for that game, and, as people have previously said, that opens up the possibility of people questioning the need for paying for live at all. "PS3 players don't pay.... PC doesnt pay....." Sommin along those lines.

    Personally I would be very releuctant to shell out 3 subscription fees to play one game. ISP - Live - Game subsciption. Even though I can understand why you would need to.

  • Connobi #27 2 years ago

    "Finally, if a player is already paying for Xbox Live GOLD (to support servers, bandwidth, and get more services), why in the world would it seem fair to pay for an MMO service too, on TOP of that, since it's for basically the same thing. And I doubt Microsoft would want to share in the GOLD account "loot" with the developer. "

    I still find it hard to believe that people still have this argument. Subscription fees for MMOs are nothing to do with XBL. You'll have to pay them regardless. Whether you play on PS2, PS3, 360 or PC. Its just that MS has the best online console functionality. Thats why you play for the seemless integration of games, in game cha etc. PS3? Sorry, your preaching to the converted. I would happily pay the XBL gold & have all the perks therein, & pay the MMO fee to PLAY the MMO, which pays for its upkeep etc. And you'd be able to play your MMO even if you were a silver member.

    If MS are having second thoughts about anything, its profit. Why let a game come to your console that will keep you customer base occupied for months, or even years, & possibly affect the sales of other games? Think about it. It'll be better for them financially to stop this coming to 360, & they'll spare themselves a lot of headaches too!

  • Connobi #28 2 years ago

    Plus if MS can't get their act together with a heavy hitter big name brand like Marvel, what hope have cryptic got with their bunch of marvel/dc wannabes?

    "Shane Kim, the head of Microsoft Games Studios, stated in an interview that the cancellation was primarily due to the competitive market for subscription-based MMOs, and that while one current MMO was successful, "everything else wouldn’t meet our level or definition of commercial success".

    Greed. Sorry MS, the only thing that'll be bigger than WOW will be WOW2. So either make a decision from the word go to come up with a good, appealing MMO thats fun to play like WOW, or stop getting peoples hopes up!!!

  • Trafford #29 2 years ago

    Keep this up Microsoft!
    I going to go running to Sony for a slimline PS3 and DCU Online

  • Dafridge #30 2 years ago

    but silver members are not supposed to be able to play with other players online...which is why Msoft are reluctant because it goes against the pricing policy. They have tried to add lots of other incentives to the gold experience but the core of it is you pay to play other people, if you allow other companies to add their pricing models will the XBL charge remain valid.

  • pinochet_cz #31 2 years ago

    Xbox 360 was never a mmo platform. I remember discussions before 360 launch and MS always put that straight. It appears that MS can't handle this. In terms of scalability, MS own systems aren't best ones (I can't recall MMO running on Windows servers), so they decided to run most of multiplayer experience as peer to peer.
    It was bad decision from beginning, but I understand why they don't want live-internet connections.