All WOW: Lich King raids defeated

By Oli Welsh Published 17 November, 2008

That didn't take long.

A European World of Warcraft raiding guild has announced that it has killed all of the raid bosses in new expansion Wrath of the Lich King in just under three days.

The guild is a raiding super-group formed from a merger between Nihilum and SK Gaming. It doesn't have an official name yet, going under the temporary moniker TwentyFifthNovember - which is when we'll find out what it's really called.

Nihilum and SK Gaming are the two foremost guilds on the semi-professional WOW raiding scene, with an unbroken string of world-first boss kills between them that goes back two-and-a-half years. While there are no official raiding competitions, leading guilds can expect to earn money from sponsorship deals and promotions.

According to MMO Champion, the guild killed Kel'thuzad of the Naxxramas dungeon, Sartharion of the Obsidian Sanctum, and Malygos of the Eye of Eternity within a few hours of each other on Saturday afternoon.

With Wrath of the Lich King servers opening late on Wednesday night, it only took the guild 68 hours and 30 minutes to get to a stage where it could defeat the hardest boss.

A message from the guild on the TwentyFifthNovember site was critical of how easy it had found the 25-player raids to be.

"This is both a moment of triumph and a cause for concern," said the statement.

"Did Blizzard miscalculate in the tuning of these encounters? Or is this Blizzard folding under the weight of a large casual player base that demands to be on equal footing with end-game raiders?"

The mystery guild will now have to wait until the Ulduar raid is released in the next content update before it can attempt to claim another first.

Thanks to Dizzy of the Eurogamer forum for spotting this. Our Wrath of the Lich King review was published today.

Picture of Oli.

About Oli Welsh

Oli is Eurogamer's acting deputy editor and reviews editor and likes to take things one word at a time. He is among the best dressed people in South London.

Read more articles from Oli by visiting the Oli Welsh archive page.

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Comments (42) Latest comment 3 years ago

Comments threads automatically close after 30 days, but please feel free to continue chatting on the forum!

  • The_Inquisitor #1 3 years ago

    Thank goodness, I was getting worried. We can sleep easy at last...

  • scimitarDT #2 3 years ago

    fucking nerds, get a life!

    I love MMO's (or used to i should say) but these people talk of an 'end-game'. THERE SHOULD BE NO END-GAME ON A MMO!!!!!
    Class + Levels = BROKEN
    it creates a a game you have to 'win' rather than a game you play.

    Time to move on gimps

  • spimmy #3 3 years ago

    alot of these guys in that uber guild did naxx 1.0

    and most of them was in the beta raiding

  • HMAN #4 3 years ago

    Wow. I've been waiting for this news for ages. Thanks EG!

  • Gnort #5 3 years ago

    "Did Blizzard miscalculate in the tuning of these encounters?"

    I don't think any game requires content which is so difficult that it requires a semi-professional organization to deal with it. Most people still play games to have fun, you know.

  • anomagnus #6 3 years ago

    shock horror

    specialists tool themselves up for a particular goal, use every tool in their advantage and achieve goal super fast

    look, i have to make it to my house to work every day

    in theory,i could get a giant dump truck and drive in a straight line through every house over every obstacle in my path

    doesnt mean its a good idea though

  • Canyarion #7 3 years ago

    I think it has to be a miscalculation. You've always needed raiding gear to get further in raid instances.
    Although when I think about it, it might be possible to clear Molten Core with gear you collected in Scholomance etc. But Blackwing Lair has to be a different story. Right?

    By the way, about satisfying the casual gamers: that's why they created 10-man versions of the raid dungeons.
    Edited by 1 at 17/11/08 @ 15:56

  • kangarootoo #8 3 years ago

    "Did Blizzard miscalculate in the tuning of these encounters? Or is this Blizzard folding under the weight of a large casual player base that demands to be on equal footing with end-game raiders?"

    Ummm. No.

    They simply made a game that could be finished by people who still expect to see sunlight more often than twice at Xmas.


    I find it amusingly revealing that they assume "a large casual player base that demands to be on equal footing...". The casual player base probably doesn't give a f*ck about being on an equal footing with "end-game raiders". I doubt the thought even enters their heads as they bash orcs for a handful of hours a week.

  • kangarootoo #9 3 years ago

    "I think it has to be a miscalculation. You've always needed raiding gear to get further in raid instances.
    Although when I think about it, it might be possible to clear Molten Core with gear you collected in Scholomance etc. But Blackwing Lair has to be a different story. Right?"

    Man, that could have been in Italian and it would have made no less an amount of sense to me ;)

    /wonders if Canyarion is playing a cunning type trick with us, and actually knows nothing about WoW at all.

  • berelain #10 3 years ago

    @ ScimiarDT -I agree, the endgame on an MMO is completely overrated in my book. I just don't get the appeal of repeating the same obscenely long gaming sessions in the same dungeons just for a few special items. I mean, seriously, WHAT IS THE POINT?

    I quikcly became disillusioned with WoW when I hit level 60 with my protection spec warrior, and suddenly found that in order to still be considered 'good' by many players I needed to repeat every instance ad infinitum in order to get that EPIC LEWT LOLZ.

    Completely ruined the fun of the game for me.

  • Apologie #11 3 years ago

    WoW is old news, but preferences apart, some WoW players seriously need to get laid, or see the sun, or whatever, i mean, wtf is this???? seriously.

  • optimusprym8 #12 3 years ago

    more girls for us

  • anomagnus #13 3 years ago

    optimusprym8

    not for me

    i dont know what i'm doing wrong, i mean, surely having a level 74 tauren druid is something they want to hear about it!

  • RamblinSydRumpo #14 3 years ago

    @ berelain Why should the opinion of a minority of other players influence how much enjoyment you get from a game? There are enough people playing that you don't need to get stuck in a hardcore guild to have fun. I've never found it difficult to hook with a like-minded group.

  • Canyarion #15 3 years ago

    @kangarootoo

    Are you playing that trick with us?

  • allywidd #16 3 years ago

    well id rather spread the game out over a few months rather than cane it in a few days. as for spending to much time on wow i have no hope lol as the wife starts naggin if she cant play on her character. then i get shoved off to the ps3. lol.

  • Kremlik Verified Co-Founder, Crash To Desktop #17 3 years ago

    I don't class myself as a fan of wow anymore due to the grind killing me but congratz to them..

    What is troubling tho is exactally whats been said WotLK is 'done' for some in under a week for a game that is based around these grand instance encounters there seems to be little on offer yet again you would have tought after TBC blizzard would have added more content via the update this time not what it seems 'content updates later' exactally what happened with TBC..

    Like I've always said Blizzard can hook players in but has no knowleadge in keeping a player 'busy' past the core content, I wouldn't say WoW is dead cuz thats stupid what I will say is that WotLK doesn't seem to have enough then feel like a expantion besides the death knight and a few new feachures this could have easilly been a content update instead

  • MaxiSleep #18 3 years ago

    I dont see how this could be true if this was done on the live servers.

    They would have to level to 80 and gear up and do 3 raids?

    If its true then it is pretty bad since they would only have quest greens at best when they entered the raids.

  • mingster #19 3 years ago

    Having read all the articles about this now i think what they are saying is correct.
    They hadn't levelled up to 80 and had minimal raiding gear.
    Therefore it is a balancing misjudgement by Blizzard.
    basically they now know they have to make the monsters harder.

  • kangarootoo #20 3 years ago

    @berelain

    "I quikcly became disillusioned with WoW when I hit level 60 with my protection spec warrior, and suddenly found that in order to still be considered 'good' by many players I needed to repeat every instance ad infinitum in order to get that EPIC LEWT LOLZ."

    I guess some players want to remain elite, and one way of doing that is shifting the goal posts into a position that most human beings won't WANT to reach (regardless of whether they are able).


    @Canyarion

    "Are you playing that trick with us?"

    I don't think so. Aw, now I am even more confused. Maybe I AM playing a trick on everyone, but I'm so deep undercover I don't even know it.

  • kangarootoo #21 3 years ago

    "Therefore it is a balancing misjudgement by Blizzard.
    basically they now know they have to make the monsters harder."

    Do they really though? I mean, aren't these guys some of the best WoW raiders in the whole world? If so, I don't think they are a safe reference point for game balancing. They are very much what we call in the business "an edge case". What they are capable of within a week or so might take 90% of gamers a couple of months.

    I dunno.

  • pha #22 3 years ago

    WHAT IS THE WORLD COMING TO?

  • loopy #23 3 years ago

    "I dont see how this could be true if this was done on the live servers.

    They would have to level to 80 and gear up and do 3 raids?

    If its true then it is pretty bad since they would only have quest greens at best when they entered the raids."

    Actually it is true.

    The high level epic raid gear they had from end game TBC raiding (Sunwell / Black Temple raid instances) would certainly be enough to see them through the first raid dungeon quite easily. I'd imagine they picked up a few other bits and pieces along the way too that would have helped enormously.

    "Do they really though? I mean, aren't these guys some of the best WoW raiders in the whole world? If so, I don't think they are a safe reference point for game balancing. They are very much what we call in the business "an edge case". What they are capable of within a week or so might take 90% of gamers a couple of months.

    I dunno. "

    This is in fact the case. Well put. :)
    Edited by 1 at 17/11/08 @ 16:44

  • kangarootoo #24 3 years ago

    "I'd imagine they picked up a few other bits and pieces along the way too that would have helped enormously."

    Something like this you mean?

    http://ww w.defensetech.org/images/combat...

  • ZeroAX #25 3 years ago

    quoted from some friend's of mine blog:

    "As most of the WoW players know, a French guy who plays a warlock named Nymh reached lvl 80 27 hours after the european servers went online. That is ok, he became famous, you can see his name in the general chat of all the servers but is it actually worth it? Playing so many hours just to be on the lonely top? WoW is an mmorpg and the game is based on the players and their interactions. No matter how fast you level to 80, you will have to wait for the other players in order to join a party for an instance or enter a battleground. Apart from that, I believe that WoW is a game best played with your friends. When I play alone for too long I get bored. When you are with your friends and even better, with your real life friends, WoW gets so much better! I won't say that Nymh did a mistake, he was playing his game anyway, but I can't see a real point in making so much effort just to be the world's first lvl 80, even if it sounds nice... "
    (blog over here http://blog gers-of-warcraft.blogspot.com/ )


    I believe he does a good job of describing the joy of wow. All this rushing to do everything in the game is really sad. It's a big fantasy world. Why not take your time and enjoy it? The people in this guild really should loosen up and enjoy the game. Quest, do some pvp, and some fun 5 man dungeons, making jokes with your party



    Edited by 2 at 17/11/08 @ 16:57

  • loopy #26 3 years ago

    "Something like this you mean?

    http://ww w.defensetech.org/images/combat...

    Maybe! :D
    Edited by 1 at 17/11/08 @ 17:03

  • loopy #27 3 years ago

    "I believe he does a good job of describing the joy of wow. All this rushing to do everything in the game is really sad. It's a big fantasy world. Why not take your time and enjoy it? The people in this guild really should loosen up and enjoy the game. Quest, do some pvp, and some fun 5 man dungeons, making jokes with your party"

    I can't speak for the guy who levelled to 80 in 27 hours, I can only guess he did it for the (relative) fame that it would bring, but with the raiding people this article is about I think you miss the point; they get payed to be the best at what they do, therefore they're going to burn through everything as quickly as they humanly can, or they would no longer be the best at it.

    Once they've cleared out all the instance content and geared themselves up in the best available stuff, I'm quite sure you'll see them turn their attention to PvP'ing and such like, and probably leveling some alts for fun.
    Edited by 1 at 17/11/08 @ 17:02

  • Velios #28 3 years ago

    All WoW players are dicks. This article proves it.

  • Velios #29 3 years ago

    Further more, how can one be "Semi Professional" at WoW - unless they mean the semi-profession of sitting about for literally days and days in shitty undies, ignoring your family & friends, eating take away pizza (and building furniture from said pizza boxes)


  • Waldo #30 3 years ago

    "How do you kill...that which has no life?"

  • ZeroAX #31 3 years ago

    I don't know if they get payed enough to actually spend such a large amount of time doing it. Until an official PvE tournament comes out, there's no real reason to melt on your pc like this

  • curtlikesmeat #32 3 years ago

    lol at the fact that I'm installing it as I read that.

    Whatever they get enjoyment from is fine by me, I'd rather go through it slowly than blow through it in a few days....

  • Red-Moose #33 3 years ago

    I've spent all my time playing warcraft and have uber powerful characters after 7000hrs of play. This game is too easy.

  • JohnnyFireBlade #34 3 years ago

    scimitarDT: fucking nerds, get a life!

    What he said, but without the swearing, 'cos that's just crude. ;)

    The aforementioned players can now remove their thick-rimmed, bottle bottom glasses, rub their eyes, blinking as the sunlight shines through the window as their mothers have finally drawn their curtains.

  • hiruu #35 3 years ago

    I don't have a problem with them beating hte game that fast, but it's hardly blizzard's fault...these guys haven't done much explore and expierencing the lore, so if you want to speed demon thru the game, that's your prerogative, just don't blame blizzard.

  • sneetch #36 3 years ago

    "Did Blizzard miscalculate in the tuning of these encounters? Or is this Blizzard folding under the weight of a large casual player base that demands to be on equal footing with end-game raiders?"

    Or... maybe Blizzard has finally made these end game raids more skill-based and less kit-based? In which case I wouldn't be surprised that a highly drilled top raiding would rip through them. I personally am a little relieved to see this, it means "regular" raiding guilds will finally be able to progress through the game without spending every waking moment clearing through trash. I'm sure they'll add a heroic mode to the raids for the hardcore.

    @kangarootoo
    17-Nov-08 16:34:52
    "Do they really though? I mean, aren't these guys some of the best WoW raiders in the whole world? If so, I don't think they are a safe reference point for game balancing. They are very much what we call in the business "an edge case". What they are capable of within a week or so might take 90% of gamers a couple of months."

    Yep, or a year. As it says in the article: "Nihilum and SK Gaming are the two foremost guilds on the semi-professional WOW raiding scene, with an unbroken string of world-first boss kills between them that goes back two-and-a-half years."

    Were I Blizzard I certainly wouldn't balance it based on them.

    As for their kit, c'mon, these guys didn't just wander into this, this wasn't a happy accident, I'd imagine they ran instances to level up which got them decent kit and, if they were, then I'm sure they were exalted with quite a few of the new factions and so probably had at least some 80 epics and a ton of 80 blues before they hit the first raid. These guys wouldn't have left that to chance.

    I wonder how much sleep they've had since launch?

  • Shrike #37 3 years ago

    I used to have a RL friend who was in Nihilum. I played WoW at the time but didn't raid, because I didn't have the time. I would go around to his house to watch him do the dungeons I would never get to see. That probably makes me a massive loser, but also highlights the problem with the game that Blizzard seems to have addressed.

    That said, I can sympathise with the raiders somewhat. For the hardcore, impossible dungeons are the game, and there's little else worth concerning themselves with. As much as you can be derogatory about that, it remains the case that a game enjoyed by a large number of people, albeit a minority, has been overwritten. For the better? not for them, clearly.

  • Canyarion #38 3 years ago

    I still stand by the "10-man for casuals, 25-man for hardcores" thingy.
    Come on, Blizzard has made 2 versions of every raid instance!! The 25-mans should be very hard, to keep entertaining the hardcore raiders.

  • kangarootoo #39 3 years ago

    @Velios

    Somebody is protesting too much.

    I guess it must make for a rare treat when you can find people to mock as less cool then yourself. Well if talking down others instead of improving yourself is what works for you, then you knock yourself out.

  • sneetch #40 3 years ago

    @Canyarion
    "I still stand by the "10-man for casuals, 25-man for hardcores" thingy.
    Come on, Blizzard has made 2 versions of every raid instance!! The 25-mans should be very hard, to keep entertaining the hardcore raiders."

    Maybe the 25 mans are a lot harder, you can't tell anything by this. These guys are the top raiding guild in Europe, possibly the world, they got 10 levels and defeated all raids in less than a week, they're hardly a good yardstick to measure anything by.

    The vast majority of "hardcore" raiders could still be challenged by these raids, just not these particular 25 mutants. ;)

  • actionfitz #41 3 years ago

    "is this Blizzard folding under the weight of a large casual player base that demands to be on equal footing with end-game raiders?"

    get a life you ass.
    that large casual player base have as much a right to be entertained by this game as you. The fact remains that huge amounts of people never even had a hope of seeing the inside of any of the 25 man raid dungeons in TBC. Not all of us can afford the time to play this game at the 'semi-professional' (lol wtf etc) level. we have jobs, wives, families and a healthy connection to the real world.
    The changes will make blizzard even more money. The majority of players will be hugely entertained. Maybe the top 5% of asshats in the game atm will leave for a 'hardcore' mmo.
    Its all win-win to me :)

  • SpyroViper #42 3 years ago

    Wow. These people can now go and get a social life, a job and actually move out of their parent's house before the age of 40! Plus spend some quality time with PEOPLE and not weirdos you met on the net and decided to M43E 4 GV!lDZ0Rs.. Sad sad loners.