Keith Vaz "deeply concerned" by Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3

By Wesley Yin-Poole Published 23 November, 2011

Tom Watson hits back.

Labour MP Keith Vaz has tabled an Early Day Motion in which he expresses concern about Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3.

THERE MAY BE SPOILERS AHEAD.

The EDM (via MCV), proposed on 14th November, says MW3's London Underground sequence rekindles memories of the 7 July London bombings, and claims there is "increasing evidence" of a link between violent crimes and violent video games.

The EDM in full:

"That this House is deeply concerned about the recently released video game Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3, in which players engage in gratuitous acts of violence against members of the public; notes in particular the harrowing scenes in which a London Underground train is bombed by terrorists, bearing a remarkable resemblance to the tragic events of 7 July 2005; further notes that there is increasing evidence of a link between perpetrators of violent crime and violent video games users; and calls on the British Board of Film Classification to take further precautions when allowing a game to be sold."

Fellow Labour MP Tom Watson disagrees with the EDM, however, and has put forward his own response, noting that "the game has an excellent user interface and challenges the gamers' dexterity as well as collaborative skills in an outline setting".

Watson "encourages the BBFC to uphold the opinion of the public that whilst the content of video games may be unsettling or upsetting to some, adults should be free to choose their own entertainment in the absence of legal issues or material which raises a risk or harm".

The BBFC has dismissed comparisons between sequences in Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 and the 2005 London bombings.

The BBFC said the section of the game that sees the player pursuing Russian terrorists through the London Underground is "far removed" from the July 2005 attack that resulted in the death of 52 people.

"Some comparison has been drawn between the action in the game and terrorist attacks on the London Underground in July 2005," the BBFC said. "However, a full examination of the game makes clear that the storyline is far removed from these real events, neither drawing upon nor resembling real terrorist attacks on the Underground.

"Nevertheless the location of the action in familiar London settings, both above and below ground, establishes a context within which the tone and impact of the work may, for some, be more unsettling, and upsetting, than in previous games in the series.

"The BBFC's decision to restrict the game to adults primarily reflects moments of strong violence, but also takes account of these contextual elements."

Modern Warfare 3 attracted controversy for a sequence showing a young girl and her mother being killed in an explosion in Westminster.

Co-developer Sledgehammer Games has defended this, saying the game is not "doing shocks for shock value".

"We wanted to show, certainly in some particular cases, we wanted to show the effect of war," explained creative director Bret Robbins.

"What happens if a modern American city gets attacked? What would that be like, what would you see? If you were walking down the street, what would happen?

"Civilians are part of that, innocent people are part of it unfortunately."

Modern Warfare 3's story takes place around the world, in a fictional World War 3 scenario. The world's most recognised cities are ravaged by terrorist attacks.

"How do you go about blowing up the world?" asked Robbins. "You just come up with scenes and moments that would make sense within the story. So you don't do it just for the sake of blowing everything up, just for the fun of it.

"Does this make sense? Should the characters actually be here at this time? Does this fit the plot? You want it to be exciting, but you also want it to make sense.

"It can't just be gratuitous," he added, "it can't just be fantasy. It needs to be real missions, things that you think could possibly happen, given the extraordinary circumstances that you're creating. So it's always walking that fine line of believability and insanity and crazy action."

Keith Vaz was criticised earlier this year when he tabled an "amateurish" early day motion titled "Video games and young people". It read:

"That this House welcomes the call by Shigero [sic] Miyamoto, creator of Super Mario, for people to drop their joypads and venture out into the sunlight once in a while; recognises that video games have addictive properties; notes that children flourish when they undertake a variety of extra-curricular experience; further notes the current Hungarian EU Presidency priority of protecting minors from harmful audiovisual media content in media legislation; is concerned about the potential impact of violent video games on those under 18; and calls on the Government to ensure the purchase of video games by those under 18 is carefully controlled and that parents are encouraged to limit the amount of time children spend on video games."

Vaz is of course no stranger to video game controversy, and has long been a strong anti-video game campaigner.

He has criticised a number of video games, including Manhunt, Manhunt 2, Bully and Counter-Strike.

But in January Vaz told Eurogamer: "I've never been against games".

"I've been against violent games that are able to fall into the hands of young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing," he said.

Picture of Wesley.

About Wesley Yin-Poole

Wesley is Eurogamer's news editor. He likes news, interviews, and more news. He also likes Street Fighter more than anyone can get him to shut up about it.

Read more articles from Wesley by visiting the Wesley Yin-Poole archive page.

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Comments (141) Latest comment 6 months ago

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  • MENTAL1ST Verified Senior Software Engineer, Picsel UK Ltd. #1 6 months ago

    Disgraced former Europe minister Keith Vaz "deeply concerned" by Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3

  • darkphoenix #2 6 months ago

    ban the sick filth!

  • Arsecake_Baker #3 6 months ago

    I draw your attention to the amendment!

    Amendment 2427A1 - CALL OF DUTY 3

    Session: 2010-12
    Date tabled: 22.11.2011
    Primary sponsor: Watson, Tom
    Sponsors:

    leave out from `House' to end and add `notes that the British Board of Film Classification (BBFC) gave the video game Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 an 18 classification, noting that `the game neither draws upon nor resembles real terrorist attacks on the underground'; further believes that the game has an excellent user interface and challenges the gamers' dexterity as well as collaborative skills in an outline setting; and encourages the BBFC to uphold the opinion of the public that whilst the content of video games may be unsettling or upsetting to some, adults should be free to choose their own entertainment in the absence of legal issues or material which raises a risk or harm.'.

  • desperado67 #4 6 months ago

    Typical toss from a berk of the highest order.

  • StolenGlory #5 6 months ago

    I'm deeply concerned that this cretinous twat is still in office.

  • Machetazo #6 6 months ago

    @darkphoenix I agree. It's shameful that Keith Vaz would pull such a sick stunt as this. HE should be "banned".
    To use those tragic events to further his own agenda, in the way that it appears he has.

  • joelstinton #7 6 months ago

    The game as a 18 certificate. With clear and direct rating from the BBFC.
    The action is firmly focussed on chasing and stopping the mercenaries. Some comparison has been drawn between the action in the game and terrorist attacks on the London Underground in July 2005. However, a full examination of the game makes clear that the storyline is far removed from these real events, neither drawing upon nor resembling real terrorist attacks on the Underground. Nevertheless the location of the action in familiar London settings, both above and below ground, establishes a context within which the tone and impact of the work may, for some, be more unsettling, and upsetting, than in previous games in the series. The BBFC’s decision to restrict the game to adults primarily reflects moments of strong violence, but also takes account of these contextual elements.
    From the BBFC

    The BBFC is very good at what it does.

    The fall comes down on the parents or staff members neglectantly buying or selling the game to kids.

    At the end of the day, it Mr Vaz wanting brownie points.

  • arcam #8 6 months ago

    I've never been against games. I've been against violent games that are able to fall into the hands of young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing.

    I know we're all supposed to hate him, but as long as his objections only extend as far as children I'm OK with that. Encouraging people to pay attention to the rules that 18-rated games are not meant for under 18s isn't a bad thing really.

    Though I have to question what more can be done. Shops are generally pretty good about following the age ratings, and if a parent wants to buy their child an 18-rated game then there's not much the government could or should do about that.

  • KungFuSpoon #9 6 months ago

    The so called 'increasing evidence' is purely conjecture based on the fact that criminals commit crime and also own video games. The act of violence in a video game via a control pad is as far removed as watching it in a film, people justify films as art and that because games are interactive they have a far greater effect on people.

    Bad people will do bad things, it's that simple.

  • barkertron #10 6 months ago

    I hate to be championing any member of parliament, generally believing the lot of them to be a wretched cesspool of quasi-humanity barely fit to run a local scrabble club let alone the country, but you've got to hand it to Tom Watson - in the last few years he's repeatedly stuck it to the Murdoch empire, championed a range of level-headed responses to foolish internet legislature and now this too. Good on him.

    Ugh, I feel all dirty now, best go have a shower.

  • Baban_Iesu #11 6 months ago

    Regardless of his position on these matters, it's hard to take a man seriously if his name resembles that of a part of the male member.

    Edit: No love for a dick joke. Got it.
    Edited by Baban_Iesu at 23/11/11 @ 11:19

  • The-Bodybuilder #12 6 months ago

    Anyone actually read through all of that?

  • Buztafen #13 6 months ago

    Christ this guy REALLY has a hard-on for Games and Gamers in general! Was he attacked by stick man as a child?

    Show us where pong touched you on the computer screen Vaz.
    Edited by Buztafen at 23/11/11 @ 16:36

  • Jdm79 #14 6 months ago

    It's just an excuse for MPs to play Call of Duty rather than sort out the economy.

  • TruSmiles #15 6 months ago

    Dear MP's. The UK has much bigger problems than video games right now. Hell, supporting video games may even benefit the economy. The horror!

  • Djimm #16 6 months ago

    I wish this corrupt twunt would stop trying to wreck one of the last high tech indutries this country still plays a major part in. He doesn't give a fuck about the storyline of MW3, he gives a fuck about getting his name and face in the papers.

    For anyone not aware of this bloke's past, read the details here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Vaz#Hinduja_affair

    What's worse - some dumb action blockbuster game or an MP willing to lie to official enquiries?

  • 4gate #17 6 months ago

    The man claimed £75K on a house 12 miles from the £2M mansion he owns, and his constituency voted him back in, consequently I am deeply concerned the voters in his area are all fuckwits.

  • menage #18 6 months ago

    Videogames should stay in the realm of jumping on mushrooms!

  • Machetazo #19 6 months ago

    "It can't just be gratuitous," he added, "it can't just be fantasy. It needs to be real missions, things that you think could possibly happen, given the extraordinary circumstances that you're creating. So it's always walking that fine line of believability and insanity and crazy action."
    It's a close call a couple of times, but by and large the game does stay within those guidelines to its credit.
    I am surprised a little, of a trend that for popular FPS games where the majority of player interest will be in multiplayer, the largest percentage of criticism and scrutiny is levied towards the singleplayer campaign. I suppose "soldier shoots another soldier in squad skirmish" doesn't sell as many copies.
    Edited by Machetazo at 23/11/11 @ 11:13

  • bladerunner99uk #20 6 months ago

    correct me if i'm wrong, but don't the authorities derail the train in the game? The terrorists are just using it as an escape vehicle? No bomb gets set off on the train

  • marmaduke #21 6 months ago

    FYI: Tom Watson was the MP who called James Murdoch a mafia boss.

  • EarlyGrave #22 6 months ago

    As much as I dislike the guy, I do agree with a part of his argument. Many of today's games such as MW3,GTA, Red Dead and LA Noire have some serious adult themes running through them that young minds just cannot understand in the correct context, comparing an old 18 like Carmageddon or Duke Nukem where 18's were slapped on anything with a bit of blood or bad language is completely different to LA Noire's scenes of brutal sex crimes or MW2's infamous No Russian segment.

    However, Vaz has decided it's easier to attempt to blanket ban all violent video games than rather acknowledge the real problem, ignorant parenting. Working in games retail, the amount of parents I come into contact with daily purchasing stacks of 18 rated video games is ridiculous, we operate a policy where we have to tell a parent the content of the game to which the most common reply is 'It's a computer game, how bad can it be?'...... and that's the problem, due to a lack of information, many parents still see video games as something for kids instead of acknowledging that it's grown with the times, not everyone wants to collect gold rings or shimmy down pipes all the time.

    Rather than trying to ban these games outright, Vaz would spend his time better informing and raising awareness for parents of these games so they actually know what they're buying for their demon offspring, because 9 times out of 10, they don;t know anything about the game or they're buying the game just to gain some sort of peace and quiet rather than actually doing any real parenting. The amount of badly scribbled Christmas lists I've been handed this week that have all had MW3 at the top but the parents don't know anything about it is crazy.

    Stop trying to ban our passion and do some real work Vaz !

  • President_Weasel #23 6 months ago

    "I know we're all supposed to hate him, but as long as his objections only extend as far as children I'm OK with that."

    Except that quote of his is mendacious, self-serving, bullshit. He has constantly attacked games as an easy target for scaremongering in an attempt to get votes. It's illegal to sell an '18' game like this one to children, so if Vaz really gave a toss about children he'd be pushing for campaigns to properly educate the public about games and to educate parents about what an 18 rating means and how game ratings are equivalent to film ratings.

    Instead he spends his time drumming up fear of games so he can crusade against them. A few decades ago he'd have been campaigning against rock and roll music, and a couple of decades later he'd have been marching alongside Mary Whitehouse in an effort to ensure nothing interesting was ever shown on the telly.

    In fact (well, according to Wikipedia), in 1989 Keith Vaz led a march of thousands of muslims in Leicester calling for the Satanic Verses to be banned.

    He keeps trying to link Manhunt to the murder of a 14 year old boy despite the police denying there was any link, and only the victim owning a copy. He tried to link the terrible shooting in Malmo to Counterstrike.

    He's a book-burning, games-hating, almost-certainly-corrupt, lying scumbag who was once suspended from the House of Commons for making false allegations to police, and has been investigated several times for being suspiciously helpful to several very rich individuals.

  • Scurrminator #24 6 months ago

    It's stupid to link the two.
    People who commit crime usually do play games - as do most young people.
    They all own a TV too...and maybe a phone. Do they cause violence too!? Auto correct can be quite annoying!

  • arcam #25 6 months ago

    @President_Weasel

    You're right, and me saying "I'm OK with that" is perhaps overstating it. Some of his his actions are at best self-serving, and at worst corrupt.

    I've no problem at looking at why so many adult games are being played by children, but his statements are so wrapped up in politics, self-interest and bullshit that he is totally unsuited for that job.
    Edited by arcam at 23/11/11 @ 11:38

  • JahB #26 6 months ago

    "We wanted to show, certainly in some particular cases, we wanted to show the effect of war," explained creative director Bret Robbins. What happens if a modern American city gets attacked?"

    So why exactly does the game feature british civilians being blown up, but not a single american civilian? Apparently shock value is ok as long as it's russians (mw2) or europeans...

    Bret Robbins and Keith Vaz, both twats.

  • FireMonkey #27 6 months ago

    "increasing evidence of a link between perpetrators of violent crime and violent video games users"

    True. Perpetrators of violent crime are more likely to play violent video games.

  • Bilstar #28 6 months ago

    Hmmm, so Mr Vaz is clearly a Battlefield man. Fanboy.

  • Bobbus74 #29 6 months ago

    Who honestly gives a shit what a corrupt politician has to say about gaming? Keith Vaz has been linked to numerous scandals including cash for passports and piss-taking expenses claims. The bloke is a complete prick.

  • verynaughtyboy #30 6 months ago

    Yeah, that's it Keith! The motivation for these terrorists isn't to do with fundamentalism, it isn't to do with an extreme interpretation of their Holy Book and it certainly isn't anything to do with Western interference in middle-eastern political affairs... everone has just played too much COD.

    Fact... there was no war, crime or terrorism before video games!
    Edited by verynaughtyboy at 23/11/11 @ 11:57

  • nuanimal #31 6 months ago

    Correlation does not always equal causality. I'm not smart/arrogant enough to say whether games do/don't increase violent behaviours, but I would like to say...

    A long time ago doctors were puzzled as to why children where dying of polio more so in Summer than in any other time of year. Probably because it's highly contagious and kids would be out and about. But one of the genuine ideas behind it was Ice Cream. Ice cream made you more likely to contract polio.

    Which made sense since all the kids pretty much had ice cream in Summer, right?

  • dfernand #32 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz is a war hero and he obviously prefers Battlefield 3, that means he isn't getting bribed by the video games companies but would like to be and is bitter about it. Poor Keith go back to your office and dream up some other waste of time, you waste of time.

  • king26 #33 6 months ago

    I'm deeply concerned that anyone is foolish enough to part with their cash for this drivel in favour over Battlefield 3!

  • spaceburge #34 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz is an ignorant fucktard. I don't hear him bitching about the film industry or music lyrics. You can't point your finger at one sector of the entertainment world.

    Hopefully he'll be walking around Leicester one day and I can tell him what everyone here thinks of him.

  • Wizard83 #35 6 months ago

    COD does like to shock for the sake of it though.

    Its not some deep and meaning exploration into the use of violence as a tool for change or power or what war means for humanity or any of that shit

    its a balls to the wall guns, explosions and violence playground and its fun and it can be fun without us having to watch families getting blown up or airports shot up.

    Its not an issue for bloody MPs but i think its a trend that should stop. we know what all this shit looks like we saw it on 9/11 and 7/7 we dont need to play in it too.

    i bet i get slaughtered for this!

  • mossychops001 #36 6 months ago

    Post deleted at 11:49:27 04-05-2012

  • Lukus #37 6 months ago

    Keith V-for Vendetta (against Violent Videogames)-az.

    Useless one-trick-pony MP.

  • Jay-ITFC #38 6 months ago

    What the hell is the point of this after 7m odd copies have been sold!? Bit late to start getting "deeply concerned" me thinks...

  • TeaFiend #39 6 months ago

    I am deeply concerned that the ability to crash cars in racing games is a direct reference to the death of Princess Diana as she died in a car crash that involved cars.

  • Liquidoodle #40 6 months ago

    Is there anyway that we can get this guy kicked out? Like starting a petition or something, I don't want this idiot in our government. Tom however I will stand and applaud, a politician with sense it seems!

  • RodHull #41 6 months ago

    I am deeply concerned that the passport I paid Keith Vaz good money for still hasn't been delivered.

  • agparrot #42 6 months ago

    I'm pretty sure Activision can afford a brown envelope stuffed with cash to shut Keith Vaz up, I hear that is how he usually does business.

    There was that time he sacked the police officer who was investigating him, too!

    I'm all for a debate about why and how children play 18-rated games, however.

  • GundamJehutyKai #43 6 months ago

    I think the only thing we should be surprised about from this is that it took him this long! I mean, MW3 has been out for a few weeks already. I expected him to kick up a fuss and spouting his self serving nonsense BEFORE release day!

  • kangarootoo #44 6 months ago

    I was deeply concerned by Keith Vaz's hijacking of Damilola Taylor's funeral for his own public profile. Maybe I should have motioned the house or something.

  • Bonders99 #45 6 months ago

    Ahh.. Keith Vaz... aka legal looter, associated with the Hinduja brothers on shady deals..expense scammer... he has room to talk.

    Just one word for the likes of him.....Thief

  • krakead #46 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz is a rampant self-publicist and full of shit. As for the 'increasing evidence' - correlation does not equal causation. It makes about as much sense as saying that the July 11th bombers has kettles in their kitchens, as did many other terrorists, therefore kettle-owning leads to terrorism.

  • bigtechno #47 6 months ago

    The children, the children what about the children

  • kangarootoo #48 6 months ago

    @arcam

    I think the issue with any "I'm ok with that so long as..." statement kind of requires as its foundation that the "as long as" caveat is firmly applied.

    In this case, it simply isn't. I am totally with you on what he says are his principles. The problem is that he doesn't apply his stated principles truthfully and honestly.

  • Zomoniac #49 6 months ago

    What I don't get:

    Selling alcohol or tobacco you expect is being bought on behalf of a minor is a criminal offence. Selling an 18-rated game you know full well is for a minor is fine, as long as the money is handed to you by an adult.

    Why?

  • nobloodyname #50 6 months ago

    @4gate As one of his constituents - and one who opposed him - I can tell you his re-election had little do with his often despicable behaviour and everything to do with the ethnic make-up of the constituency, regrettably.
    Edited by nobloodyname at 23/11/11 @ 12:50

  • CaptainTrips #51 6 months ago

    Tom Watson for Prime Minister!

  • secombe #52 6 months ago

    What really needs to happen is an advertising campaign aimed at parents pointing out that 18 rated games carry that certificate for a reason. The 'it's just a game' attitude doesn't really work now we have near photo realistic graphics wrapped around some very adult themes. I'm fairly confident mostparents would not buy their 12 year old an 18 rated DVD they knew to include graphic sex and/or violence, but for some reason a video game doesn't warrant a second thought.

    To their credit I've recently noticed staff in my local Game trying to stress to mothers clearly buying an inappropriate game for their kid that the content is very graphic etc. I'd be interested to know if they have a policy on this or if it's just well intentioned individual staff trying to do 'the right thing'.

  • scuffpuppies #53 6 months ago

    Picking a fight and pissing off "Gamers" isn't a particularly smart thing to do Mr Vaz. We're no longer the geeky minority, but the vocal and passionate majority. The film, television, and music industry can only dream of sales numbers attributed to "video games".

    If you wish to continue using your government office for personal and financial gain, you'd be advised to think twice before opening your bigoted mouth.

  • DwarfyP #54 6 months ago

    "I've been against violent games that are able to fall into the hands of young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing," he said.

    Thats why we have the BBFC and eventually PEGI being a legal rating.

  • Ironic_War_Criminal #55 6 months ago

    @scuffpuppies

    e're no longer the geeky minority, but the vocal and passionate majority. The film, television, and music industry can only dream of sales numbers attributed to "video games".

    The ones who get up in arms about his grandstanding are still the geeky minority. The rest just do the correct thing and ignore his blatant petty publicity stunts.

    Don't feed the troll.

    @secombe

    What really needs to happen is an advertising campaign aimed at parents pointing out that 18 rated games carry that certificate for a reason. The 'it's just a game' attitude doesn't really work now we have near photo realistic graphics wrapped around some very adult themes. I'm fairly confident mostparents would not buy their 12 year old an 18 rated DVD they knew to include graphic sex and/or violence, but for some reason a video game doesn't warrant a second thought.

    This would be a perfect campaign for the "Gamers Voice" group, especially if they had the endorsement of the BBFC and PEGI. Unfortunately they are just a pile of simpering ineffective nerds at the minute who would rather go for soft targets like malfunctioning servers instead of actual issues.
    Edited by Ironic_War_Criminal at 23/11/11 @ 13:05

  • kirankara #56 6 months ago

    I actually hate politicians. the hypocisy about morality that emanates from.them makes them despicable.
    as gamers, we've been concerned about call of duty games for years, but for different reasons altogether lol
    point blank, children below certain ages shouldn't be.accessing these games. its little different to violent films, which also.require parents to do their jobs, and use.discretion to stop underage kids.accessing this material. bet the moral objections of politicians doesn't stop them creaming off billions in tax from alcohol, tobacco or.violent games or films

  • guernican #57 6 months ago

    "I've been against violent games that are able to fall into the hands of young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing," he said.

    If they don't understand it, surely there's no problem? I'd be more worried if my 6-year-old really got the blood and gore, really understood and revelled in the slaughter.

    Well, I don't have a 6-year-old and I am being flippant. But can't we jsut ban Keith Vaz?

  • Flipper79 #58 6 months ago

    If you want to see outwardly aggressive behavior - baiting, demeaning and bullying along with aggressive body language - watch what the MP's get upto in the commons.

    Aggression is an inevitable condition of all people, it's how people temper that aggression that really matters. The majority of people probably find violent games actually have quite a cathartic property, helping them de-stress and relax by attaching any issues they have to something meaningless that they can destroy without consequence, which is a perfectly healthy way of dealing with things.

    Others may find the material actually causes issues for them. That's not to say the game is to blame, only that they have an underlying condition that effects their perception of such things and something else, which would be considered totally mundane to most, could equally trigger that same behaviour. But games are easy to blame simply because they're symbolic of an entire generation that clearly seperates that section of society from an older generation.

    My point is, anything can be blamed for causing an unreasonable, abnormal response because that's exactly what an unreasonable, abnormal response is. If you take away what causes that response, the likelihood is, something else will do exactly the same thing because they simply have a propensity for that kind of behaviour.

  • glaeken #59 6 months ago

    I'm deeply concerned how Vaz seems to be popping up now far too much. Sky news seem to be getting quotes from him on everything and anything. This needs to stop now. Some sort of petition may be in order. The keep Keith Vaz in obscurity petition.

    His Wiki page certainly makes interesting reading.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Vaz

    It’s a tale of corruption, false statements and incompetence
    Edited by glaeken at 23/11/11 @ 13:18

  • benjerry #60 6 months ago

    The funny thing is that, unless my memory decieves me, there is no subway bombing in MW3, just a wildly implausible chase sequence where the SAS chase down a subway train that´s used as transportation by the bad dudes...

  • Quint2020 #61 6 months ago

    Somebody call the Daily Mail quick, this is the story of the year!

  • Ryze #62 6 months ago

    If Keith Vaz would only focus his attention on making sure that Children aren't purchased these games by their parents - he'd get much more respect.

    THIS is the real issue. I'm sick of hearing about 11 and 12 year olds being bought 15 and 18 rated games. People mention/brag about it - even on TV, without any repercussions.

    There's more scaremongering regarding Licence fee dodging, than there is regarding purchasing unsuitable content for minors. If a few huge fines were handed out, and publicised by these MPs, then we would be getting somewhere.

    Just complaining about the content in an 18 rated game is absolute nonsense, and further still, he's just giving them free advertising.

    Push to punish irresponsible parents!

  • Cheeseasaurus #63 6 months ago

    I feel too many of these anti-video games folk are judging the book by its cover. Remember the Mass Effect sex scene? One blogger claimed it was nothing short of a rape simulator and after he saw the scene in question was forced into a ridiculous climb down.

    In summation: Play the game, or at least see the "offending" material in context before you judge it. A trailer is not representative of the game.

  • danjfor #64 6 months ago

    Agree with Wizard83.

    Call of Duty's definitely gone a place. The games are getting nakedly, shamelessly exploitative. Black Ops and MW3 especially are packed with bits that're there for no other reason than to get you going "Cor, fucking hell, look at 'em just gunning civvies down like it was nothing!" Not that you there's no place to depict terrorist atrocities in games, but Call of Duty's just trying to excite you; the series has literally has nothing to say. Of course they've been inspired by real terrorist events, that's the whole thing they're doing; just enough of the type of horror you've seen on the news to make you think "whoa, this is some real shit!", but with nice smooth level design to make you feel like you just can sort the world's problems out one bullet at a time.

    And this is the single most popular series on the go today.

  • Sodding_Gamer #65 6 months ago

    GTFO you twat.

  • MattEdWithCheese #66 6 months ago

    Edited by MattEdWithCheese at 23/11/11 @ 19:02

  • chubster2010 #67 6 months ago

    "I've been against violent games that are able to fall into the hands of young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing,"
    Erm...what are the implications? Are videogame character's real?!?!

    Eep!

  • Turrican_Freak #68 6 months ago

    "young people who are perhaps not able to understand the implications of what they're doing," No implications. It's just a video game.

  • pigsy2400 #69 6 months ago

    why when I saw ''THERE MAY BE SPOILERS AHEAD'' my head thought of this,.

    There may be SPOLIERS ahead
    But while there's COD and Noobs and a frag dance
    Let's face the Russians and dance

    Before the modders have fled,
    Before they ask us to pay the GOLD bill and while we still have the chance
    Let's face the Russians and dance

    Soon we'll be without the SAS, humming a different tune and then
    There may be Ammo clips to shed
    But while there's Warfare and a frag dance
    Let's face the Russians and dance!!

  • brseg #70 6 months ago

    Those scenes in MW3 are slightly bad taste, imo, but its an 18-rated game, and we have free speech (hopefully). MPs should be spending their time saving the country from economic collapse, and doing stuff to make people's lives bearable. Just saying...

  • Sodding_Gamer #71 6 months ago

    Tom Watson has blatantly prestiged.

  • Uncompetative #72 6 months ago

    Hey Vaz, do something to stop knife crime and I'll be happy to go outside again!

  • DarthMartious #73 6 months ago

    Every political generation has a Keith Vaz. He's simply the latest in a long line of indefatigable dolts who take it upon themselves to espouse nonsense about a subject they know very little about and conflate all manner of issues into one gigantic mess of an unevidenced argument which has no merit whatsoever.

  • MaybeLater #74 6 months ago

    Criminals are more likely to play games because; a. Gaming is a relatively cheap past-time and b. The shameful administration Vaz was a part of led us into a recession the result of which was No Jobs- More Crime.

    Mumsnet rule the world and Kieth Vaz is their Avatar. Stop typing ladies and pay some attention to those Kiddies.

  • Cobalt_Jackal #75 6 months ago

    @4gate Well its not just the voters in his area who are fuckwits. I mean in general the voting public as a whole are pretty stupid/are fuckwits as you put it.

  • darkmorgado #76 6 months ago

    What is this increasing evidence of which he speaks?

    Last I checked there was no evidence at all, just empty speculation with no actual substance.

  • pigsy2400 #77 6 months ago

    Well I have been in prison for many years, watched too much Tom & Jerry growing up and decided to drop a piano on my grandmothers head!

    I was just too impressionable!!

  • coolbritannia #78 6 months ago

    I remember 7/7. I was on the underground when that pick up truck started trading fire with the terrorists in the train in that wide open bit of the underground you can drive through. Was a crazy day, especially when the train broke up into pieces and rolled and rolled through the station.

    Exactly how it happened.

    /Looks forward to the murdering a Brazilian whilst playing an unaccountable MET officer minigame.

  • JohnnyHeaven #79 6 months ago

    a damn shame that a game with such a mediocre story gets this much attention from non gaming communities.

    christ, it's not as if there some negative commentary hidden in the subtext of it all. just that explosions are cool.

  • Jonesy81 #80 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz is a cock and unfortunately my local MP, no chance of getting him out around here.

  • darkmorgado #81 6 months ago

    @Cobalt_Jackal And none are more stupid than you.

  • chibber23 #82 6 months ago

    So Mr Vaz is concerned that an 18 rated game contains mature content?

    Well Mr Vaz, I'm concerned that you are still allowed to run for public office after:

    - You have tried to censor free speach by calling for the banning of games and books while living in a tollarent, open society.

    - You suggested the army was at fault for an IRA bombing of an army recruitment office in Leicester.

    - You failed to declare payments of £4,500 from solicitor Sarosh Zaiwalla and were then accused of blocking investigations into eighteen other allegations of un-disclosed payments.

    - You used your position as an MP to quickly obtain passports for the Hindujas while they made payments to your wife, with whom you colluded to conceal information about a possible financial relationship with the Hinduja family

    - You were suspended from the house of commons when you made "recklessly ... damaging allegation against Miss Eggington [A police woman] to the Commissioner, which was not true, and which could have intimidated Miss Eggington or undermined her credibility" that led to an old woman who gave 34 years service to the police force being questioned by the police over criminal accusations.

    - You failed to register other employment while working in the commons

    - You failed to register donations while in the commons

    - You tried to block the extradition of Nadhmi Auchi to France on fraud charges that eventually ended up with Mr Auchi being convicted for a $504 million corruption scandal.

    - You were outed by the Telegraph as voting for 42 day detention without charge in exchange for 'rewards' that apparantly included honours

    - You failed to declare a conflict of interest when you applied parliamentry pressure on the police to stop an investigation into complaints regarding the conduct of Shahrokh Mireskandari's (a personal friend of yours) legal firm

    - You claimed £173,937 in expenses 2008/09 with 70% being staffing costs in a building you own and classified as your 2nd home

    - You claimed £23,831 in 2008/09 in second home allowances while living in your primary address 45 mins from parliament

    Perhaps you should focus a little less on what we do legally in our spare time and take a closer at your own personal conduct.
    Edited by chibber23 at 23/11/11 @ 16:16

  • Ptarmigandalf #83 6 months ago

    There's increasing evidence that Keith Vaz is an imbecile.

  • Bluetooth #84 6 months ago

    SPOILER - skip this bit if you haven't played it



    When coming out of the underground, where the policeman has bunched up all the civvies, the game lets you knife one of them without repercussions - including the copper :)

  • Seoh #85 6 months ago

    Is it possible Keith Vaz is an internet Troll but in real life?

  • Madder-Max #86 6 months ago

    keith Vadge more like (vagina)

  • Madder-Max #87 6 months ago

    there was a bloke called Keith
    Who thought he'd have a punt
    At knocking video games
    Because he is a c**t

  • uninspiredcup #88 6 months ago

    Contraversy. Sales! Sales! Sales! Blow up a stupiud kid, earn more money.

  • koga-dave #89 6 months ago

    @desperado67 well said mate

  • Mayhem64 #90 6 months ago

    @DwarfyP - which means jack all because parents buy the games for their kids to shut their whining up. I know, more than one mate comments their kids want the games but they refuse to buy such titles for them. Cue massive complaints.

    In fact one of them checked out the gamertags of his lad's school friends (all aged 10 or 11) and found a slew of 18 rated shooters listed in the gamer history for them. What's a parent supposed to do when pressured like that, and that your kid is likely to just play them around their friends' houses instead?

  • ThadiusCole #91 6 months ago

    Vaz is the same kind of guy who would be campaigning against rock music in the fifties for its evil influence on children. Just another of the narrow minded ilk who want everyone to live in their version of society. No thanks Vaz, but thanks for offering.

  • super_monty #92 6 months ago

    This was the same guy who made up a game 'rape' sequence so he would be noticed.

    More dangerous things to ban before COD:
    1) All religion
    2) Capitalism
    3) Private companies running utility and essential public services.(water, transport)
    4) Energy price fixing
    5) MP in the Masons
    6) The house of Lords
    7) Chavs
    8) False asylum seekers
    9) Corporate fascism


    Feel free to add to the list

  • potter73 #93 6 months ago

    Here we go again, Mr Vaz is a class A bellend. He has a habit of making these sorts of knee jerk reactions without really doing any research (as a side note, he also made some sweeping comments about current state of UKBA recently...which has pissed off a number of civil servants) He is the sort of politician that will try to further his career by spouting the sort of BS he thinks the electorate want to hear.

    I also decided to re-watch the pathetic Alan Titchmarsh debate (just to piss myself off even more).

    At the end of the day , 18 Certificate games (as with films) are FOR ADULTS. Poor parenting ultimately is too blame for letting these games fall into the hands of minors.

    Some people argue that Video games are more dangerous because they are interactive. Fine, if that's the argument you're going to follow, then why not ban the following

    - Boxing (pretty interactive and the sole aim it to score more points than your opponent....head shots being the highest scoring target)
    - Any form of marshall art
    - Paintballing (pretty intereactive, people going around shooting each other)

    For every 1 gamer who claims to be affected by violent video games I'm fairly sure you can found thousands that are not.

    Just as for every 1 alcholic there are thousands that are not.




    Dear Mr Vaz,

    Until you have definitive proof that video games are corrupting, stop vomitting your baseless comments and thoughts into the world. Stop using a handful of individuals to justify you groundless comments.



    Yours sincerely

    A 30+ year old gamer.

    PS : I enjoy FPS and games such as GTA
    PPS : I also used to play the Ian Livingstone game books back in the '80s
    PPPS: I've never committed a crime, never beaten/murdered/raped anyone
    PPPPS: I hold down a good job, am married and have a nice house
    Edited by potter73 at 23/11/11 @ 16:10

  • darkmorgado #94 6 months ago

    @super_monty

    I would like to add the Daily Mail to that list.

  • Ironic_War_Criminal #95 6 months ago

    @super_monty

    OK

    10) Idiotic conspiracy theory commenters

    The world will be a better place, for sure.

  • RevanNL #96 6 months ago

    New York also gets blown to hell and I haven't heard a single Republican complain about it. As was the case when Washington DC went up in flames in MW2. And I also haven't heard a single French politician complain about the destruction of the Eiffeltower in MW3.

    There are bigger problems in the world right now, maybe he should look into that

  • jstar #97 6 months ago

    This man literally has the best gay porn name ever.

  • Madder-Max #98 6 months ago

    how can we link this thread to Google searches on Keith Vaz? We did it years ago with the London Taekwondo Champion thread (now deleted)

  • FenderMaster #99 6 months ago

    It's okay to portray acts of terrorism in a videogame, just as long as they don't show it in a digital recreation of your own country.

  • Widge #100 6 months ago

    Interesting that it is only CERTAIN games that get scrutiny, COD being one and already GTA5 is attracting concern. This when the likes of Nukem, Bulletstorm and Saints Row happily trololol their way around without any disturbance.

  • TRUTH #101 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz stole from us the Tax payer over £30,000 - and Labour did shit!...He got away and now tells us his concerns on Videogames!!!!

    Everyone should twitter that this man is thief and has not even bothered to apologise.

  • TRUTH #102 6 months ago

    Keep chatting, facebooking, twittering, msging about Keith Vaz thieving and I'm sure the attention will turn on him instead of MW.

  • dirtysteve #103 6 months ago

    And where is the 'increasing evidence' Keith?

    Nice sensationalist touch calling gamers 'users' though, maybe he should get job with the Sun.

    how did this man get re-elected? Surely this tactic of using moral campaigns to cover his inadequacies doesn't still work!?!

  • hanook #104 6 months ago

    steak of nonsense

  • StooMonster #105 6 months ago

    I remain "deeply concerned" by Keith Vaz.

  • Spong #106 6 months ago

    So, it's decided then, Keith Vaz is a cunt. That's the general flavour I'm getting from the comments in here anyway. That and the fact the guy really is a cunt.

  • StooMonster #107 6 months ago

    @FireMonkey Perpetrators of violent crime are more likely to play violent video games.

    Your first lesson in statistics tells you correlation does not imply causation (unless you are a self-promoting MP or a Daily Mail "journalist";).

  • GuyNoir #108 6 months ago

    @MattEdWithCheese


    Don't worry, gentlemen. It's cabaret time. I shall begin my performance as emperor of the world with the execution of <s>Danger Mouse</s> Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3.

  • Pickster #109 6 months ago

    Arn't there more important things to be worried about than an underground train being bombed in a video game.

    Honestly, it's a joke. If the game was rated PG then sure complaints should be made. The the fact of the matter is, it's rated 18.

    I'm fed up with the hobby that resonates with me the most being undermined all the time.

    We should go after the people who fish too. No? I mean, animal cruelty. What is fishing teaching all the youngsters about how we treat animals and by association.*

    *No I don't really believe that.

  • Cobalt_Jackal #110 6 months ago

    @super_monty

    I have many more too add.

    (BTW these aren't set in any real personnel specific order. More so as they entered my mind).

    10) The entire political establishment (who are all corrupt corporate whores, who happen to be millionares too. Are MPs are out of touch with reality, because of their obscene wealth/privilege they are disconnected from the consequences of their horrible, abhorrent, evil policies attacking the poor, disabled, the young/youth and elderly of society. They cannot relate/empathise with the struggle and increasing hardship of many Britons, since they've never experienced it.

    There not for the people, by the people, of the people. Goverment are a front... puppets of their coporate masters. MPs/Lords simply there to defend and further advance private interests/their own self-serving interests as well. This at the expense of us... the people. The hell with us, society be damned, is the attitude of political establishment, their corporate masters & the global elites. Their damn scum the lot of them. They need to be gotten rid of).
    (And Keith Vaz is a fitting/perfect example of all that above). But anyway as i was saying...

    11) Neo-Liberalism (or Neo Con. There both the same).
    12) Corporatocracy
    13) The parasitical elites & their families
    14) MIC (Military Industrial Complex)
    15) Sham Democracy
    16) The increasingly facist, authoritarion police state that is 21st century Britian
    17) The right wing media
    18) Zionism
    19) Freidman economics
    20) 1% Hoarding of all the wealth

    P.S. BTW good to see someone who shares my views here on EG. (I assume your a Progressive Leftist like me (well thats how i see myself). Although some would say in my case i'm a slightly "Radical" Progressive Leftist XD, but Progressive Leftist all the same).

    Oh and im sorry if i've gone a bit off topic, i just had to get that off chest. It just makes me so angry at whats gone on and continues to go on. And with reguards to Keith Vaz, i'd of thought he'd have far more imporatant things to be getting it on with/worrying about than "violence" in video games. Seriously what a idiot he is.
    Edited by Cobalt_Jackal at 24/11/11 @ 10:45

  • Cobalt_Jackal #111 6 months ago

    @darkmorgado HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! DM your a funny, funny man. Although if i were you i wouldn't give up the day job.

  • Shikasama #112 6 months ago

    @Mayhem64 What's a parent supposed to do when pressured like that

    Grow some fucking balls and realise being a responsible parent comes before pandering to spoilt first world kids who don't know better.

    That'd be my guess.

  • Cobalt_Jackal #113 6 months ago

    @gotyourmoney

    I made a slight error there, i'd mean't to type 18 not 17 with reguards to Zionism. Sorry my bad.
    Edited by Cobalt_Jackal at 23/11/11 @ 19:39

  • blasphemous #114 6 months ago

    Inbetween expediting passports for mates and fiddling expenses, I'm surprised he has time for this.

  • StooMonster #115 6 months ago

    @Cobalt_Jackal i'm a slightly "Radical" Progressive Leftist XD, but Progressive Leftist all the same

    Are you Rick from The Young Ones?

  • Churst #116 6 months ago

    This game is barely violent... Have you seen the things people have been doing to companions in Skyrim?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S42NgHsmbbw

  • alcides #117 6 months ago

    I think MW3, a 2011 game, prompted terrorists to bomb the Underground in 2005, derp.

  • effinjamie #118 6 months ago

    I'm looking at the cover now, has an 18 certificate on it, end of conversation.

  • inutaihanyou #119 6 months ago

    @JahB

    "So why exactly does the game feature british civilians being blown up, but not a single american civilian? Apparently shock value is ok as long as it's russians (mw2) or europeans...

    Bret Robbins and Keith Vaz, both twats. "

    actually the civilian in London IS American, they were tourists apparently.

  • bemani247 #120 6 months ago

    what next? Lemmings responsible for the Welsh mine tragedy or F1 2011 responsible for Lewis Hamilton's recent collisions with Fillipe Massa?

  • svenjl #121 6 months ago

    I wouldn't want kids below a certain age playing games like MW3 due to the violent content, but that goes for HEAPS of games, technically speaking :-) I just finished the campaign, which I thought was fantastic except for a rather uninspired last 45 minutes or so. In fact, the most disturbing violence occured during that period imo. Otherwise it was equal opportunity, with Berlin, Paris, London and New York all copping a fearful hammering. Do we think Germans, French or British will now be huddled under their sheets at night remembering WWII as a result of MW3 associated psychological trauma?

  • TonyCB #122 6 months ago

    Frankly this speaks of two men both using the press to make a name for themselves. As someone who grew up in Tom Watson's constituency, the whole global exposure of the NoW thing has gone to his head.

    they should both be ashamed

  • Blacklodge #123 6 months ago

    Kieth vaz is a tool, but a relatively harmless if uninformed and misguided one. Ed Vaizey however is a dangerous and destructive force against the games and animation industries. Do not let this inane rambling detract from the damage the government to the future of our creative industries.

  • Ironic_War_Criminal #124 6 months ago

    @TonyCB

    That's their job. They are politicians, they are in the press constantly. I don't see any reason for either of them to be ashamed.

  • Donaldthescotishtwin #125 6 months ago

    As if they care,all for reputation so they can eventually run for prime mister.

  • BeachGaara #126 6 months ago

    Hey Vaz. Fuck off.

  • BeachGaara #127 6 months ago

    @arcam Then maybe he should be against shitty parents instead of violent videogames.

    Owait, that's not politically safe.

  • irrational-gaz #128 6 months ago

    Another month another MP making an unsubstantiated claim about the link between games and violent crime, how is this news worthy? It's so common place it's akin to a forecast of rain here in Scotland being hailed as breaking news

  • Skyclad #129 6 months ago

    So, it is absolutely fine if New York or Paris are destroyed by terrorists - but if it is London, we should ban it? Interesting idea ...

  • Bonders99 #130 6 months ago

    Post deleted at 09:51:00 12-12-2011

  • elstoof #131 6 months ago

    Keith's just worried that any bad advert for London will make it harder to sell on his hooky passports.

  • Boomalla #132 6 months ago

    Keith Vaz is a plum, nuff said.

  • Madder-Max #133 6 months ago

    result! 4th down the first page of google on a 'keith vaz' search

  • canoot #134 6 months ago

    @StolenGlory made me laugh that, cheers.

  • TonyCB #135 6 months ago

    @Ironic_War_Criminal I'm afraid it is not their job to get press constantly for no good reason. that's why i suggest they should be ashamed

  • DiscoVietnam #136 6 months ago

    I heard Marilyn Manson played Wolfenstein and gave Hitler the idea for World War II.

  • President_Weasel #137 6 months ago

    Tom Watson's been defending games and promoting the games industry (and attending games industry/MPs meet-em-ups) since before it was cool.
    He was against Murdoch and his empire of scum journalism and political pressure well before it made any kind of career sense to be.

    It's entirely possible he identified "relatively principled politician" as an under-occupied niche and is acting sane and decent in order to get votes (he is an MP, after all), but it's also possible he's an MP with actual principles. Either way the result is the same.

    I strongly approve of him.

  • TRUTH #138 6 months ago

    Vaz is a THIEF!

  • kwarive #139 6 months ago

    Its a funny thing but until I played MW3 and read Keith Vaz's motion I had no desire at all to do anything violent. Afterwards however I can't stop thinking about kidnapping him and selling him to eastern european terrorists or rogue american generals.

    THEN I played MW3 backwards and the game tells you to do all of those things!

    I've called the police but they won't do anything!

    Help! Please help!

  • Trigg3rHippie #140 6 months ago

    ...and the MW3 sales go up. Mission accomplished.

  • GamesInc_India #141 6 months ago

    How is Modern Warfare 3 any different from a Hollywood Movie? Is Keith Vaz putting motions forward against them?

    The issue is that video games are easy scapegoats and Mr Vaz (among others) seem them as easy vote winners. He should not forget that they, as are movies, are a form of entertainment and should be judged as such. Games are just a projection (exaggerated and imaginative) of storywriters, and they are using the real world to feed into this world they created.

    But I guess it's too much asking politicians to actually analyze issues properly, and not go for vote winners.

    I blogged about this recently (and i'm not sure if I'm allowed to post blogs here so apologies to the moderator if this isn't allowed).