id cautious over Wii U development

By Fred Dutton Published 9 June, 2011

Rage dev in no hurry for next gen to begin.

While Nintendo seems to have persuaded a number of third party developers to bring their titles over to the Wii U next year, it seems FPS veterans id Software won't be among them.

Speaking to Eurogamer backstage at E3 today, the Rage studio's creative director Tim Willits expressed doubt that they'll be a big enough audience for a core shooter on Nintendo's new system.

"The Nintendo market is a tough market for us to get into," he explained. "A lot of first party games, a lot of licensed games – those are the ones that have done the best on that platform. I'd love it if we can get a hardcore FPS community going and build on it, but it's tough.

"I think we should keep our toes where we know best," he added.

Willits also stated that he was in no desperate hurry for Microsoft and Sony to bring their own new systems to market.

"Stability in the consoles is good," he said.

"If they want to stack another year or two on this generation I'd be more than happy. I know somebody is working on it somewhere but I don't want to hear about it.

He explained that now developers had finally got to grips with the two HD platforms, they've been freed up to concentrate on the most important part of the development process: game design. A new generation of consoles would only be disruptive, he argued.

"It allows us to focus on the game. You get a technology locked down then you can focus on the design. If you spend too long working on the tech it's so much more difficult. When you know what the platform does you can focus on what is fun."

He added that the studio's current id Tech 5 set-up is flexible enough carry over into the next generation, whenever it might begin.

Rage roars onto PC, PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 later this year. Take a look at the new trailer below.

Picture of Fred.

About Fred Dutton

Fred Dutton is Eurogamer's US news editor, based in Washington DC.

Read more articles from Fred by visiting the Fred Dutton archive page.

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Comments (37) Latest comment 12 months ago

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  • drumbaby #1 12 months ago

    "Rage dev in no hurry for next gen to begin. "

    Neither are Nintendo. They're finally joining the current gen' but in 2012.

  • BillMurray #2 12 months ago

    Zing!

  • HyperTails #3 12 months ago

    He has a point though. I'm sure if shooters are proved to be successful on the console, they'll develop. But shooters don't fit into the Nintendo audience, so I think he has a right to be skeptical.

  • sfp_noodle #4 12 months ago

    What drumbaby said.

    Only this time I can't see Nintendo getting away with being a generation behind again. Their new gimmick is a controller with a screen plus waggle in HD. That isn't enough. If they're charging $250+ for it and using proprietary Blu-Ray media, widely expected of Nintendo, and doesn't allow playback of movies they're in trouble. Customers will look at it plus the PS3 and think "The PS3 can do everything the Wii-U can, has motion controllers and games for both core and families, can play movies in both DVD and Blu-Ray, has a rental service, proper online play and is $## dollars cheaper. Why should I buy a Wii-U just for a controller with a screen?"

    The Wii ran away this gen because it offered something completely new, but now others have caught on and are even attempting to surpass them with devices such as Kinect. If a controller with a screen is really the only innovation they're offering with their new console then I just can't see Nintendo shifting major numbers. especially if they want to charge more than $250 as expected.

  • fkh #5 12 months ago

    So when the "It is not powerful enough"-excuse cannot be used anymore, it is time to come up with another one...

  • Headless_Monkey_Boy #6 12 months ago

    @HyperTails

    your right, i meaan golden eye was anathema to the fps crowd.

  • HyperTails #7 12 months ago

    @Headless_Monkey_Boy

    Right, ONE game, from the N64 I might add, does not make a genre fit Nintendo's fans. Do you think Homefront, Brink, Crysis, Resistance, Duke Nukem, Doom, etc. would sell on Wii?

  • CallousB #8 12 months ago

    I knew once Nintendo fixed the things devs were moaning about ...the devs would just come up with more excuses for not releasing games.

    I wish certain devs would just have the guts to say you hate Nintendo and move on.....I'd have more respect.

    "We can't compete with first party sales"....well you better fucking hope Nintendo never goes 3rd party then...as if they do you're screwed if you truly believe that.

  • sirBetamax #9 12 months ago

    @Hypertails

    Not exactly one game, the N64 had quite a few good shooters as I recall. Not to mention the follow up to Goldeneye, Perfect Dark had/has a fairly large fanbase.

    The stigma is attached to the Wii more than anything, there is no reason why FPS' couldn't become popular on a Nintendo console again. Really it just requires some devs with balls to try to shift their game on the system. I have no problem imagining the games you mentioned on the system, perhaps the bigger worry is that consumers will just choose to buy the game for a pre-established system anyway even if they have a wiiu. With that said unless the genre gets developers and publishers support then it will never have the chance to tap the fanbase that already exists with the system.

    I mean seriously, people love shooting stuff. I would be surprised if COD doesn't appear on the wiiu for starters, and wasn't it implied that BF3 may be in the works?

  • Headless_Monkey_Boy #10 12 months ago

    The wii U would, the games would sell on any console that do them "justice", which was the problem with the wii. Because of the lack of HD graphics more publishers shirked from the wii, as graphic fidelity will always be all to most publishers (and many gamers). The fact is these games will play roughly the same on any platform hd capable.

    Whats more i don't think corprate branding goes as deep as you think it does to the majority of gamers. I think that after a year if the console proves capable (and has good online features...:-S ) plenty of gamers will jump ship, through word of mouth and parents buying cos it allows them to watch Corrie without getting into a fight, or the kids leaving the room.

    the wii ended up with a bad image, despite being a very capable console. There's no reason this should carry over to the wii u.
    Eitherway the success of the wii u (as any platform) or its image will be down to what the publishers allow to be released on the system.

  • Les #11 12 months ago

    "I wish certain devs would just have the guts to say you hate Nintendo and move on.....I'd have more respect."

    I don't think it's about hate TBH. With online becoming a bigger and bigger part of the hardcore gamer experience and Nintendo not having served that demographic for the past few years, they're at a serious disadvantage to win the hardcore gamers back over again. It's not just about lots of pixels being pushed around by the hardware anymore. Publishers and developers have to factor that into their decision on whether or not to release a game on the Wii U.

  • Headless_Monkey_Boy #12 12 months ago

    ....

    maybe not homefront.

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  • wez_316 #14 12 months ago

    Surely I'm not the only person that thinks this game looks bog standard.

  • Duke_Red #15 12 months ago

    I don't see what the problem is, the wii u controller is basically the same as the ps3 and xbox 360 with a screen in the middle.

  • gnrlstuart #16 12 months ago

    to be fair, the wii u wont exactly be 'next gen' so to speak, so i think a 2012 release would be a great time to release the thing. as for the 360 and ps3 succesors, i dont think it'll hurt to wait untill 2013. I think Willits was spot on in this interview too; this generation has to be the best in terms of graphical progress in a single generation, plus a longer wait means a smaller price tag to pay for our shiny new PS4's when reach our shelves, as theres no doubt thier price tags would be horrendous if sony were to launch it this year or even the following.

  • Snake_2011 #17 12 months ago

    @CallousB Nintendo games were fun when I was a kid they just do not pull me in any more I want a more adult experience now I for one will not be sucked in again by a gimmick like the last dust collector they sold me. you can neg me all you want that is how I feel so do a lot of others.
    Edited by Snake_2011 at 09/06/11 @ 09:01

  • Machiavellian #18 12 months ago

    I knew once Nintendo fixed the things devs were moaning about ...the devs would just come up with more excuses for not releasing games.

    I wish certain devs would just have the guts to say you hate Nintendo and move on.....I'd have more respect.

    "We can't compete with first party sales"....well you better fucking hope Nintendo never goes 3rd party then...as if they do you're screwed if you truly believe that.

    This is a very narrow point of view, and shows a lack of understanding that taking risk can be costly especially if you do not know your market. Developers know their market and so far, FPS hardcore titles like Rage do not sell well on Nintendo console. People purchase a Nintendo console to play Nintendo games. So trying to compete with Nintendo on their console is risky. You look at the games that have sold very well on the Wii and they are not FPS games like Rage. Time is money and wasting resources for a small market can hurt a company like ID. People forget that cost of development for the current consoles are very high and developers have to be smart how they spend that time.

  • smelly #19 12 months ago

    >They're finally joining the current gen' but in 2012.

    What is it with you trolls? Worried that it might beat your system or something?

    No-one has said ANYTHING about the actual power of the thing yet! Just because some companies are porting 360/ps3 games over doesnt mean its not more powerful....

  • smelly #20 12 months ago

    Quote : "But shooters don't fit into the Nintendo audience, so I think he has a right to be skeptical. "

    Yeah - you're right. Nintendos audience is like me - people who are bored of playing shooting games which all look and play the exact same.

  • Dave52 #21 12 months ago

    That headline suggests that the Wii U is next gen, when in fact the next gen bit is referring to the next Xbox and Playstation machines. Another misleading headline EG...?

  • CamberGreber #22 12 months ago

    No offense...... This is such BS.

    The next gen architecture is gonna be based on DirectX11 and the Gpu made my.... You guessed it Nvidia and ATI.

    Deveolpers have countless exsperience working on these two platforms.

    The Next Gen will be alot easier to adjust to than the change from Ps2 to 360.
    And ID knows this they just dont want to increase Production Costs.

  • smelly #23 12 months ago

    >That headline suggests that the Wii U is next gen

    It is. It's the next generation on from the current generation - therefor next gen.

    If you're referring to how much power it does or doesnt have.. Maybe you're a developer who has access to the devkit and knows exactly what the performance is? If so, please - do share...

  • Eraser #24 12 months ago

    Hmm, maybe id Software's own games don't have a good chance of succeeding on a Nintendo console, but what about id Tech 5 itself? Wouldn't it good for them to port that to Wii U as well? Other developers might be interested in making games with it that will succeed on that platform. Then again, Zenimax/Bethesda has already said the engine will be used by their own studios only, which is a big shame IMO. id Tech 5 should go head on with UE3.

  • makeamazing #25 12 months ago

    I know people say "Why shouldnt these types of games sell on the WiiU", but personally i see two issues here:

    1. Many who want/need the latest games have already got a PS3/Xbox (those core gamers that go out day 1 and buy a game). It takes time to take advantage of a system, so it will be at least 1.5 years to 2 years before Wii-U can begin to match the current benefits of current gen hardware (I mean the system doesnt sound like its going to be released for at least a year yet). The first batch of games will be games already released on Xbox/PS3, these will not sell in big numbers as those people who really want it, will have already got it. Same problem as ME2 on the PS3, games like AC it will be more expensive on the Wii-U than a year old copy.

    2. Though Nintendo gamers do and can like different consoles, I think the core of Nintendo users dont care for AAA games such as AC etc, because if they did they would already have a HD console and would get the games day 1. I mean when you see a full priced 2D platformer selling by the millions, you know its not the same audience as the HD consoles.

    I do hope the next gen starts in the next 18 months with PS4/Xbox because i do love graphics etc, and would to see better open world games.

  • MiY4MOTO #26 12 months ago

    "Rage dev in no hurry for next gen to begin."

    I can't say I'm surprised and I'll be pleased if someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but Id haven't actually released anything THIS generation yet have they?

    I'd be amazed if they wanted to have to start re-developing Rage for a new range of hardware just yet... It would be Duke Nukem all over again!

  • Ranger101 #27 12 months ago

    @Miyamoto - idTech5 has to be downscaled to work on current gen consoles!

    And no one can accuse John Carmack and friends of being Nintendo haters - their first ever big break came from writing a direct port of Super Mario Bros on the PC. Something not previously possible until John Carmack invented the technique of Adaptive Tile Refresh.

  • RobTheBuilder #28 12 months ago

    Good idea ID. Don't demonstrate the capabilities of the system for FPS games, leave it to shitty developers to give the system a reputation for casual games, then bitch about and refuse to support the next system because there 'is no audience'.

  • Sid-Nice #29 12 months ago

    We don't even know if the Wii U will have the power to match the current generation of consoles. Will the Wii U have enough power for tearing, button lag, frame rate issues and more importantly "Will it have enough power for the RROD?"

  • Stuz359 #30 12 months ago

    They will probably make a version, they won't be able to resist. Once the 360/PS3/PC versions are complete, how long would it actually take them to port the title over? Six Months? The Wii U's architecture is very similar to the 360 after all.

  • asphaltcowboy #31 12 months ago

    "Willits also stated that he was in no desperate hurry for Microsoft and Sony to bring their own new systems to market."

    Amen!

  • kitsuneyo #32 12 months ago

    I'm a Nintendo fan and I'm not very interested in Rage or Doom. I was in the 90s, but not now.
    Edited by kitsuneyo at 09/06/11 @ 10:28

  • Mr.Spo #33 12 months ago

    Clearly with so little known about WiiU right now, it's far too soon to make a judgement like this. Rather than dismissing the machine, and deciding from the off it's too difficult to compete on a Nintendo format, why not get in touch with Nintendo and ask for more details? Why not produce a WiiU version of whatever their next PS3/360 title is, and then see if there's no room for a core FPS on a Nintendo system?

    Nintendo have been rolling out the red carpet for third parties, leaving the 3DS launch window clear of big Nintendo titles to encourage third parties to release their titles, yet some still refuse to jump on board and take a crack at it. They've created a system that looks to be at least on par with current HD machines, they're talking about having an online experience that rivals Xbox Live and PSN (granted we need to see more, but surely interested third parties could make inquiries of Nintendo?), they have a controller that encourages both traditional, dual stick controls and less conventional methods, and they even had the head of EA appear at their conference to declare that every major EA franchise would come to WiiU. For me, the message from Nintendo was clear. If EA, a company that supports every platform with quality content, believes there is money to be made and software to be sold on WiiU, then other third parties should head there too.

    But no, apparently it's too tough to compete against Nintendo, or against licensed games, so we may as well not try. So long as that attitude prevails, it really will be the case that only Nintendo software sells on Nintendo systems. Nothing ventured, nothing gained, id Software. I only hope others don't share your outlook--the more markets third parties cater to successfully, the better off the games industry is. The more people that keep the blinkers on and refuse to put in the effort, the worse off developers, publishers and players will be.

  • Headless_Monkey_Boy #34 12 months ago

    @makeamazing

    I have to say i hope the nextgen doesn't start for well over 18 months, it takes so much time and resourses to make an aaa title these days that publishers are very narrow minded as to what they'll sell (and on what platform...*cough*) so much that despite the millions gone into these games with hd textures and dx 9 shader tech that there still seems to be little content. Half the games still use very limited colour palletes resulting in either dreary grey or pooey brown landscapes.

    And the gameplay in most of these games has taken ages to get anywhere interesting, or do anything new.
    If you bring out next gen consoles now (i think its dx11, already well over a year old) it'll just restart the cycle of tedious clonealikes pushing the graphics for the sake of the game. As gamer thats what i care about the most.

    just my opinion

  • 32768Colours #35 12 months ago

    Why do so many people presume the Wii U is only as powerful as the 360 or PS3? We probably haven't even seen stuff running on the finished sku yet. The Wii was almost a cost-saving exercise from Nintendo for falling behind Sony in the home console market. Now they're way out in front, I see no reason why they can't return to making a generational leap forward like they always did in the past.

    Porting current gen games to Wii U may give an insight into its minimum specs, but doesn't tell us what it can do when its maxed out. It just tells us that some developers are porting existing games. That could just as easily be laziness as a lack of hardware grunt. I wouldn't rely on Nintendo to illustrate graphical prowess either, given their penchant for (no less exceptional) cartoon-like artwork.

    I'm not defending Nintendo though. In many ways these assumptions have been brought upon themselves; their announcement was rather premature given the lack of details and content on display, the 360/PS3 footage inferring comparable power.

    They also have a long history of making silly design decisions such as using cartridges on the N64, offering no backlight on the original GBA and eschewing DVD playback entirely. I therefore fully expect there to be aspects of the Wii U which make us all ask "Why did they do that?!".

    The point I'm making is, Nintendo may only just catching up with this generation in terms of going HD, but in terms of raw processing power, nobody other than those with the dev kits (assuming the dev kits are even finalised yet) know just how powerful Wii U is. If it is only as powerful as the 360 or PS3, I see no technical reason why idTech 5 can't be implemented. Its probably because it'd cost them a fortune to adapt it more than any issues with "the market" for shooters on a Nintendo console. Hell, the market for Wii U hasn't even been adequately defined yet. Perhaps if that was his argument I could sympathise a little more, because I know I for one have no idea whether Wii U suits my gaming habits yet.
    Edited by 32768Colours at 09/06/11 @ 13:39

  • BonzoBanana #36 12 months ago

    Surely the reason Nintendo haven't announced the specification of the wii u console hardware is because its not that good same was true of the wii. However the gamecube specification was widely reported and it was brilliant for its time. If you have developed a console with cheap dated technology you are going to keep it under wraps. Also the console isn't very big and realistically it can't be too powerful as it would have a cooling issue. They have stated a 45nm fabrication process for the chipset which is same as the 360 slim and revised ps3 slim. Both factors together make it sound like the hardware will not be super powerful at best a little bit better than current more likely a little bit worse.

  • TonyHarrison #37 12 months ago

    This is just so bloody stupid. In order to build an audience for any specific genre on a specific console, you have to release games from said genre onto said console.

    People aren't just going to go there in the hope of getting something.

    So in other words, to steal a quote from a terrible movie... "If you build it, they will come."

    Put your games on the console and see what happens before making stupid excuses.
    Edited by TonyHarrison at 09/06/11 @ 17:05