Sony: Emulating PSone games takes ages
Here's why.
Why isn't your favourite PSone game on the PlayStation Store yet? Emulating old PlayStation games for new PlayStation hardware isn't as easy as everybody thinks.
Crucially, Sony is still "dedicated" to resurrecting the games you want most, pledged PlayStation Store's Ross McGrath on the EU PS blog. But the process can take "several months".
Each PSone revival requires a good original copy of the game (in all languages), legal clearance (checking expired licenses and who owns publishing rights), Store packaging (image, descriptions for all territories), and submission to Sony QA for extensive bug testing.
"There are two major stumbling blocks between submitting a game for emulation and us being able to publish it," illuminated McGrath. "Not getting legal clearance and failing quality assurance (QA)."
Legal clearance can be halted by intricacies such as real-life branding in a game that is now off limits. In some cases, publishers have died like dinosaurs, and who owns the game can be a time-consuming question to answer.
"The other problem is failing QA because of serious bugs, and when I say bugs, I mean giant cockroach-sized uber-bugs," revealed McGrath. "I have seen a lot of PSone QA reports with some weird and wonderful errors: menu screens with upside down text, explosions that kill your character at random after watching a cut-scene, games that continue to slow down the longer you play them, or music that sounds like it's coming from the bottom of a well... the list goes on."
Final Fantasy VII on PS3.
Those bugs can't just be stamped on by the developer, because that developer washed its hands of the game long, long ago. If a serious enough problem is found, the game may have to be pulled entirely.
"If a game fails QA, there are some things that can be done to fix them but, unlike with a PSN title, they can't simply go back to the developer for another round of fixes, so it can get complicated," said McGrath.
But the PSone emulator is constantly improving, "so often serious bugs that prevent games from loading at all are fixed with new versions".
"The million dollar question," McGrath wrote, is why some PSone games are available on the US PlayStation Store but not in Europe. "This usually comes down to either publishing rights or bugs that occur within the emulated PAL version that did not occur within the NTSC emulated version," he revealed.
Sometimes ancient PAL copy-protection fudges things up; other times, the publisher in America turns out to be different to the publisher in Europe, and more negotiating must be done. Even when a licence is renewed, territorial restrictions prevent this applying worldwide.
"We are still dedicated to bringing you as many PSone games as we possibly can," McGrath said.
"There are some PSone titles that we have been seeking legal clearance to publish from as far back as 2007, some of which are still ongoing and some have only just been legally cleared (Wild Arms).
"There are titles which previously failed QA that are bug tested again with every new version of the emulator and they come your way as soon as we can release them.
"We've just sent another round of first-party titles for clearance and emulation to fill in the gaps in the catalogue," he added, confirming one of those as Tombi - "so stop asking!". "We will be going back to publishers and specifically pushing for the most requested and popular titles."
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Comments (76) Latest comment 1 year ago
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I'm not saying there aren't any issues, but if a Square can do it so can others. I've been playing Soul Reaver and the Resident Evil games for well over a year now thanks to the US store. They obviously don't have any bugs if they've been released over there and in Japan so its more laziness than anything else.
Edit - Shit phone keyboard spelling!
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In fact pretty much the entire PS1 back catalogue is available for download from various places, and I'm yet to hear of a single instance of any converted disc not working exactly as it should do.
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Mainly, because PC emulators have been able to run pretty much every single PSone game for YEARS - and the PC Emulation community comprises of volunteer individuals who do it all in their own free time, not paid engineers working for the company that produced the hardware they're based on in the first place. Whats more, PC emulators manage to work on all kinds of hardware configurations - including, now, on mobile devices like Android. Sony only has to make them work ON ONE HARDWARE SETUP, and with the PS3's processing power it can probably do the whole rendering and emulation work on one of its cores alone.
Try again, Sony.
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Still does this mean as Capcom still around and hold copyrights, that RE PS1 series bring only available in Japan and US regions and not Europe is down to only bugs as the culprit?
Why not allow gamers the options to buy into other regions more easily?
It's not illegal after all, as you would be able to buy PS games in US or Japan and bring it home, custom taxes aside, and the issue of playing imported games bring solved by PS3 being able to play all regions other than BD/DVD.
With NGP and cross over with Android phones, Sony better damn up their ante with European PS1 library on PSN and upcoming Android mobile store.
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Tomba/Tombi coming to PSN is great news though, it's a great game that was cruelly overlooked at the time of it's original release.
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Read the article please. It's a pretty good and candid response to the issue from someone in the know about the non-technical difficulties they're facing.
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Also Dino Crisis.
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Anyway, getting a US account and store credit (via ebay) isn't that difficult if you are really desperate to play this stuff.
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"Still does this mean as Capcom still around and hold copyrights, that RE PS1 series bring only available in Japan and US regions and not Europe is down to only bugs as the culprit? "
Main issue with Resident Evil 1 and 2 and Dino Crisis 1 and 2 is the fact Virgin Interactive published them in Europe and not Capcom (and Virgin Interactive have gone bankrupt) so bit of a issue there with legal rights etc and Resident Evil 3 was Eidos now Square Enix so I guess that'd be more easy to get it from them.
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It's not the readers fault though. Seriously, with such a sensationalist (not to mention deceiving) title as this:
Sony: Emulating PSone games takes ages
What did you expect?
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Not even close. Compatibility is lower than just about any free PC based emulator.
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Compared with Microsoft's superb Marketplace, which manages simultaneous releases for pretty much every game, the PS Store is a mess not to mention overpriced when comparing games that are available on both the Xbox 360 and PS3.
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If you have the original discs, then most of them can (not all though). You can even use remote play via the PSP, though the lack of L2 and R2 will be an issue.
Regarding the Resi games and Dino Crisis, they were published by Virgin Interactive in Europe so that's a legal minefield of it's own. That's been sorted now though and Ross has said in the comments that internally, they have an estimated time of arrival.
@ emulators
If you read the post carefully it says LEGAL issues. Emulators may be able to play the games without a problem, but if the game has an item, song or voice actor's work (I believe) that is not licensed for a re-release, then the release is blocked until either the problem is resolved or the release is cancelled. If Sony decided, "sod it, let's put everything up", think about the legal challenges they face along with the potential for publishers turning their backs on Sony for doing something like that.
It was a fine post and I actually want to hear more about the "cockroach" sized bugs.
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No need to BS us. It's down to finding and negotiating with license holders which is difficult which was mentioned. At least it's easy to get on the US and Japanese PSN. Einhander and G-Darius rock.
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Plus - they helped kill Sega off, otherwise they'd be the ones to call.
Geddit!?
/coat
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Explain to me, EXPLAIN TO ME! The Athore Coments al totol lies!
i'm just trying to make a point here, Blaaaaaam this piece of crap!
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That is only true to some extent. One must be perfectly aware what they are doing and often use a so called "pops plugin" for games to work properly, or even to start at all. Examples of games that require this plugin: Chrono Cross, Resident Evil 2 and many others.
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/ strokes PSP Resi games
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@thewool
Tell me about it, I've been waiting for Wild Arms since 2007. But that wait is nearly over! Overjoyed to see that mentioned in this post.
@Darren
This post was all about why there are more games PSOne games on the US store compared to the Euro store. Didn't you read any of it?
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Fallout 3 (and to a lesser extent New Vegas) does this and crashes and has many more pretty nasty bugs besides, yet it was decided that it was okay to be released on the platform. Of course, that might be because it was (supposed to be) AAA and you can't block it and hand MS an exclusive like that.
Also, PAL vs NTSC is irrelevant in the HD era, the standards are the same now so why not release NTSC versions in all territories where you can get the license? I appreciate that it's a complicated process but isn't it possibly a little less complicated than you yourselves are making it?
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I downloaded it on another account, and 100% it - so I know there's no issues. Not only that, but the US store has it
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Original Source
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Wait, Fallout3 was on the PS1?
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You'd think it was as easy as that, but speeding up the loading will mean speeding up the entire game engine. Then everything will be unreliable, looking wierd and too fast, with animations and sound glitching up.
Making it load faster will require re-coding the entire game, not just emulating it.
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"I have seen a lot of PSone QA reports with some weird and wonderful errors: menu screens with upside down text, explosions that kill your character at random after watching a cut-scene, games that continue to slow down the longer you play them, or music that sounds like it's coming from the bottom of a well... the list goes on."
Really? I've converted and played a shitload of PSOne games and found 90% of the time if there are issues they are the game either not loading or crashing/freezing at certain points and this can often be fixed by simply using a different pops version, using a different GameID, using a lower compression level for the EBOOT or re-ripping the ISO with different software. I've occasionally seen other glitches but nothing like Ross describes. Why don't you tell us what games they are matey so that someone who owns an original copy and a CFW-enabled PSP can see if it works?
Or maybe Sony should just take a look at this: <a>http://www.gamerspress.com/index.php?tit...</a>
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Somehow I expect Sony's QA's testing and acceptance criteria is a lot more stringent than yours. Probably most games more or less work but that doesn't mean they're of sufficient quality to be sold, or that the rights to the titles are adequately resolved.
Do you really think Sony would sit on titles rather than make money by selling them if they could?
In fact pretty much the entire PS1 back catalogue is available for download from various places, and I'm yet to hear of a single instance of any converted disc not working exactly as it should do.
Well I suggest you lend Sony your vast experience in the matter.
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"Nobody wants the PAL versions though. Why lumber us with inferior PAL versions when the NTSC versions are superior and easy to convert? "
Because not everyone in Europe speaks English (or Japanese), hence the guy in the article saying he has to get a "good copy" from Europe that has all the language support.
And Europe is a legal minefiled compared to US and Japan where they only have 1 country to deal with. Look at ANY company what wants to sell music in Europe... one store for each country to get around all those licencing issues.
Woe betide any game that has licenced music in it.
In the "not very legal but often overlooked" world of PC emulators and downloaded ISO's that keep the retro-scene alive such issues are not there
When Sony want to charge you and make money - the problems arise. Where does that money go?
My personal feeling - any game that can be classed as "abadonware" i.e. publisher disappeared or the game has not been actively sold in 15 years old should become effectively "free". And I mean FREE!
I know the game I co-developed on the Amiga in the 80s should be given away - life moves on, the publisher went bust over a decade ago, I don't care now despite giving up 2 years of my life for it! I am wiser now, learnt from it and if someone else gets a bit of fun out of my efforts after all these years that warm sense of self satisfaction if reward enough. But it is not up to me... its up to the publisher... who does not exist... circle, rinse, repeat...
I know i would probably feel differenmt if someone was MAKING MONEY off my efforts but free is fine.
And that is what Sony's problem is.
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Why not put the emu back in the hardware, as you did going from PS1 to PS2, you f*ckers?!
Why be so greedy, in keeping the emulator to yourselves, and charging customers TWICE for something they already OWN?!
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They're not. Sony could have just kept backwards compatability, but they didn't because instead they thought it better to fleece people by making them pay again for stuff they already own. See also: HD "remakes" of old PS2 games.
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Well it is running on different hardware. That's like bitching about Peep Show being sold on dvd when I've already RECORDED IT OFF THE FUCKING TELLY YOU BASTARDS.
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So... keep asking, otherwise how will you know which are the most requested titles?
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I'm not sure why there is an emulation problem? Unless the PS1 compatibility is not 100%.
EDIT: It would be nice to know what games have been rejected due to bugs with no way to fix.
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You already own HD versions of PS2 games?
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Because it's Sony who stop people from converting their own discs themselves?
I've personally converted more than three times as many PS1 games to run on PSP as Sony have made available to PAL users in all the years since the machine came out, and I'm just some idiot who knows nothing about anything.
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wut. The emu is in the hardware. Stick your PSOne CD in your PS3 and enjoy.
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Yes, but I actually BOUGHT my PS1 and PSP games and now they're saying I have to buy them again (for the PS1) and I can't even bring them with me to the NGP (for the PSP's UMD).
They either offer emulation in the hardware, in full, or they don't have any backwards compatibility. I appreciate new gamers have come along since the launch of the PS1, but not allowing existing owners to continue to enjoy their back catalogue (that they've already purchased) is damn unfair and greedy of Sony.
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Why all this faffing around with a software emu and a crap one at that ("Sony QA extensive bug testing"
Why be so greedy by withdrawing the emulator from the public domain and making only available, per game, that you have to buy once more?!
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Why would Sony hold PSOne games back, on which they make a decent PROFIT by the way, for reasons other than those mentioned? You think it's some grand anti-EU conspiracy? Or do you think that just maybe it's not quite as simple as it is with your ILLEGAL emulation on your PC or hacked PSP?
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Er, no. If Sony chose to allow it there would be no legal issues whatsoever. The fact that they don't is why people complain about their piss-poor efforts at making the games available - they can't be arsed, but they also prevent people from transferring their own LEGALLY-OWNED games to the portable format.
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He does an utterly thankless job at times, but still manages to stay polite and professional (at least in text, I bet he screams at his monitor sometimes!) in the face of hundreds of whining bastards.
Yes things could always be better, but I appreciate these moments of honesty the Playstation Blog sometimes dishes up.
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I've been liking the blog a bit more since Ross took over. Mike was pleasant enough, but Ross seems more direct with his answers. He doesn't shy away from pointing the finger at publishers when people complain about pricing and release schedules for example, and seems to admit it when a problem comes up more often. Doesn't always change the situation, but having a clearer idea of what's happening is a lot more encouraging than keeping quiet. Here's to more of that sort of thing!
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Pretty please?
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Would be a shame if we weren't allowed them for legal reasons!
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Wipeout 2097 is probably a music licensing nightmare, what with that Firestarter track in it, and a few others.
Personally I'm not holding my breath.
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No no no, ask Bethesda, you release it, with a promise to fix it later. Then shout "Suckers" as you disappear in to the distance, and do nothing about it.
//sarcasm
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Oh, Klonoa: Door to Phantomile would be very nice too.
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